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Anonymous #1

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    #26140890 - 08/18/19 03:44 AM (4 years, 8 months ago)

.

Edited by Anonymous (12/27/21 12:21 PM)

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OnlineKryptos
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Registered: 11/01/14
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Re: Seeds of Catha edulis and their legal status, federal and state, and comparing other plants [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #26140899 - 08/18/19 04:06 AM (4 years, 8 months ago)

You're right, it is ambiguous.

Personally, I'd err on the side of caution, because the potential presence of schedule 1 narcotics under the Controlled Substance Act leads to people in possession getting fucked.

I am not a lawyer, but I am a chemist, and if a lawyer or a prosecutor asked me if "seed [is] a plant material from which cathinone can be derived", in this case, I would say yes. In a technical matter, at least. If I was an "expert" in a court case I may argue otherwise. But I like drugs. If I manage to show up as an "expert" in your court case, I'm either getting paid or recently received a traumatic brain injury that stopped me from getting out of jury duty.

The bit about cannabis you mention is both irrelevant and very telling. Cannabis is illegal, plant-wise (by plant name, not chemical name). As are any extracts. Any part of the cannabis plant will fuck you over, no seeds, stems, sticks, or sticky-icky-icky involved.

Under the CSA, I would strongly advise against importation or use of khat or any part of the plant for any purpose. Your interest, or lack thereof, does not matter, legally speaking.

Be careful.

Edited by Kryptos (08/18/19 04:16 AM)

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Anonymous #1

. [Re: Kryptos]
    #26140908 - 08/18/19 04:29 AM (4 years, 8 months ago)

.

Edited by Anonymous (12/27/21 12:20 PM)

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InvisibleHobbyist
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Registered: 08/15/10
Posts: 805
Re: Seeds of Catha edulis and their legal status, federal and state, and comparing other plants [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #26140934 - 08/18/19 05:20 AM (4 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

LifeUnderAwno said:
That’s basically what I assumed... oh well. It is unfortunate to not be able to have a plant for ornamental purposes.

The federal laws are a mess, frankly.

Mescaline and dmt plants are fine ornamentals for everyone because some groups claim legal right to the plant containers for religious purposes. 

Cannabis and thc are illegal, except when less than 0.3% thc and grown by license only, but not for religious purposes.

Ephedra and ephedrine is fine except when sold as a supplement.

LSA containing seeds are fine because it’s Schedule III and a common ornamental, not for religious purposes even though there is a history at the southern border. 

Psilocybes are illegal, but not their spores, and illegal for religious purposes, but decriminalized for personal use in two or three localities.

Kratom is legal except in a few states, and a few states have overturned their kratom
Bans in favor of consumer protection laws. The seeds dont contain any mitragynine, so if a state law does not list the seeds, they are in the same boat (minus Fed law) as Catha!

Cocaine and coca are illegal but methamphetamine is Schedule II because 5mg doses are prescribed as a children’s medication...

Opium is schedule i, poppy straw/mowed poppy is illegal, but morphine and codeine are schedule ii/iii, and lower when combined with antiinflammatory tar poison, but whole poppy pods and the flower itself are legal for ornamental use, except when intended for consumption. I’d love to be in a religion of Morpheus...

Arguably they all have a potential medical use.

Talk about a fucking shitshow! Chemist or lawyer, criminal or grandma gardener, who could wrap their head around this and justify any of it? I have never seen the law on plant containers and their substances laid out — i assume because it is entirely impossible and is utterly reserved for the judgement of an actual court judge.

In my state a few years ago, a clever politician tried to get phenethylamime put in Schedule I.

I laughed for days. You can take yourSELF to jail, bucko!




What an interesting collection of information.


--------------------
Everything i say is completely hypothetical...


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OnlineKryptos
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Re: Seeds of Catha edulis and their legal status, federal and state, and comparing other plants [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #26140942 - 08/18/19 05:28 AM (4 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

LifeUnderAwno said:
That’s basically what I assumed... oh well. It is unfortunate to not be able to have a plant for ornamental purposes.

The federal laws are a mess, frankly.

Mescaline and dmt plants are fine ornamentals for everyone because some groups claim legal right to the plant containers for religious purposes. 

Cannabis and thc are illegal, except when less than 0.3% thc and grown by license only, but not for religious purposes.

Ephedra and ephedrine is fine except when sold as a supplement.

LSA containing seeds are fine because it’s Schedule III and a common ornamental, not for religious purposes even though there is a history at the southern border. 

Psilocybes are illegal, but not their spores, and illegal for religious purposes, but decriminalized for personal use in two or three localities.

Kratom is legal except in a few states, and a few states have overturned their kratom
Bans in favor of consumer protection laws. The seeds dont contain any mitragynine, so if a state law does not list the seeds, they are in the same boat (minus Fed law) as Catha!

Cocaine and coca are illegal but methamphetamine is Schedule II because 5mg doses are prescribed as a children’s medication...

Opium is schedule i, poppy straw/mowed poppy is illegal, but morphine and codeine are schedule ii/iii, and lower when combined with antiinflammatory tar poison, but whole poppy pods and the flower itself are legal for ornamental use, except when intended for consumption. I’d love to be in a religion of Morpheus...

Arguably they all have a potential medical use.

Talk about a fucking shitshow! Chemist or lawyer, criminal or grandma gardener, who could wrap their head around this and justify any of it? I have never seen the law on plant containers and their substances laid out — i assume because it is entirely impossible and is utterly reserved for the judgement of an actual court judge.

In my state a few years ago, a clever politician tried to get phenethylamime put in Schedule I.

I laughed for days. You can take yourSELF to jail, bucko!




Quit thinking bout the law, start thinking about yourself. That's my advice.

If you want to be a martyr for the cause, more power to ya.

If you've got enough brain cells to do something other than martyrdom, well...

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Anonymous #1

. [Re: Kryptos]
    #26140990 - 08/18/19 06:49 AM (4 years, 8 months ago)

.

Edited by Anonymous (12/27/21 12:18 PM)

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