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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26125236 -

In some states, people are held for months without being charged.


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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Enlil]
    #26125239 -

Not true, it's illegal.  I believe you are thinking without trial or conviction.  Which is totally legal.  I believe that fast and speedy trial is up to 1.5 years.

So it's legal to sit in jail for that long, without bond, waiting for trial.


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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26125242 -

Sorry, you're wrong.  In New Jersey, a person can wait for months in jail while the state works to indict him/her.  It's very common, in fact.


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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Enlil]
    #26125245 -

It's against the federal constitution.  Any cases to prove this?  Evidence or just hear say?


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In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26125249 -

Thousands of cases, dude.  I was originally licensed in New Jersey.  It was standard practice to hold a person who couldn't make bail while they wait for indictment.  If the indictment took longer than 6 months, a judge would consider releasing the defendant.

Also, there is no hard line on "speedy trial" as to the federal constitution. Some states do have hard lines, though.

Besides, you're the one that made the claim that a person couldn't be held more than 48 hours without charges.  YOU have the burden of supporting that claim with evidence.  I think you might be thinking of a Gerstein hearing within 48 hours, but maybe you have some law I don't know.



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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Enlil]
    #26125272 -

Indictment isn't the same as a charge.  They must charge you within so long of being in jail.  A short time, matter of days.

Indictments take time and are for felonies.  A charge is only an official acknowledgment of a crime.

Charges can change while in jail and all through the stages of the legal process.


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In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26125275 -

Again, you're wrong.  An indictment IS a charge.  Some states can charge you without an indictment.  Some cannot.  In New Jersey, all felony charges must be brought by indictment.  If you're arrested in New Jersey, a prosecutor will fill out an "accusation" which informs you of the charges he intends to seek from the grand jury.  Those charges are not brought until the grand jury indicts.  That can take months.


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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Enlil]
    #26125287 -

I don't think you understand and your hostility does not indicate understanding.

Indictment is a FORMAL charge for the legal proceedings forthcoming for a felony.  A booking charge is completely different.

They must have a booking charge within so many days of being in jail.  Really hours.

They cannot by law just hold people without a booking charge.  Totally different than a felony indictment.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26125289 -

https://www.brevardcountyduilawyer.net/what-it-means-to-be-indicted-vs-charged/

What It Means to be Indicted Vs Charged
Posted on July 7, 2017 by admin

Indicted Vs Charged

Do you know the difference between being indicted vs charged?

Knowing the definition of each and hiring a knowledgeable and aggressive attorney could mean the difference between probation or incarceration and being charged with a felony or a misdemeanor.



In this article, we’ll discuss the differences between being indicted vs charged. We’ll touch on the ins and outs of each procedure so you’ll be more prepared to handle this situation.



Charged



Let’s begin our discussion with the ins and outs of charges.



A criminal charge refers to a formal allegation that someone committed one or more criminal offenses. Charges range from a misdemeanor to a felony offense or violation.



After you’re charged, you may undergo arrest on a warrant. However, you can experience arrest without a warrant.



In this scenario, the decision to charge you depends on evidence in a charging affidavit presented to your State Attorney’s Office. The police offer who arrests you presents the charging affidavit.



During and After Arrest



At the time of arrest, you’re read your Miranda rights. These include the right to remain silent, to an attorney, to the presence of that attorney during questioning, and for an attorney appointment if you cannot afford to call on your own.



Your attorney can attend all major points of your case.



After the arrest, authorities at a police station will take your photograph and fingerprints. They’ll conduct any other booking proceedings. You’ll remain in custody until a court hearing within the next 24 hours.



For a less serious crime, release without bail is possible. Another option is release on your own obligation or ROR for short.



Can’t afford bail? The prosecutor must file formal charges against you within 30 days. If not, you’re released on ROR. This deadline can increase by 10 days if the state files an extension.



If you’re eligible for a bond, you can pay the bond or use a bail bondsman. Most bail bondsmen require 10% of the bond and proof of collateral. Once you post bond, you’re released.



At this point, make sure to find a dedicated attorney to represent you.



After you’re charged, your attorney can file a written plea on your behalf. If you choose to plead not guilty, a judge sets a trial court date. Make sure to hire a thorough and aggressive attorney to represent your case along the way.



Indictments



An indictment refers to an accusation of a committed felony. Indictments serve as an alternative to a trial court complaint. An arrest is not necessary for an indictment.



An indictment results from sworn testimony by one or more witnesses. As such, indictments carry a lot of weight in a court setting. Both the state and federal court systems use indictments.



A defendant can waive an indictment. Defendants refuse indictments if they intend on forming a plea bargain with the prosecution.



Obtaining An Indictment



Obtaining an indictment requires the involvement of a grand jury. A prosecutor presents his or her case against a suspected criminal to the grand jury.



A grand jury consists of 16 to 23 local citizens. Citizens swear into a grand jury every 18 months or so.



Compared to a trial jury, a grand jury must sit for a longer time. No judge rules over a grand jury trial. The grand jury acts as an extension of the prosecutor and hearsonly the prosecutor’s testimony.



Indictments prove easy to obtain for this reason. However, this is not always the case.



You can choose to waive your right to a criminal case before a grand jury. This results in a case comprising information.



In other cases, the government may decide to not prosecute an individual, even if a prosecutor obtains an indictment.



The Work Of A Grand Jury



The grand jury evaluates the evidence brought against an individual by the prosecutor. They decide if there is enough probable cause to charge the alleged criminal.



The prosecutor presents witnesses to support his or her claim. The grand jury directly questions these witnesses during a hearing.



A suspect can testify at a grand jury hearing, although they cannot call their own witnesses or question any other witnesses.



A grand jury can request additional witnesses or evidence. Grand jury deliberations happen in private.



If a grand jury approves the indictment, the case can move on to a court trial. An indictment does not prove a suspect guilty or not guilty.



The indictment lists all charges brought against someone. It provides a brief statement that includes a description of evidence, and the logistics of the alleged crime. This includes the alleged how, when and where of the crime.



If the grand jury decides there is not enough probable cause, the prosecution cannot move on to court unless more evidence arises.



After An Indictment



If a prosecutor procures an indictment, an arrest warrant may surface. If you’re aware of the warrant, you can post bail if a bond exists. Once arrested, the prosecution brings the case to court.



We refer to this procedure as an arraignment. An arraignment serves as a hearing presided over by a judge. It lets the defendant know the charges brought against him.



The defendant can make a plea bargain or proceed to a trial by jury.



Taking The Fifth Amendment



Sometimes, individuals refuse to testify. They may believe that doing so incriminates them.



If this is the case, the individual remains silent by “pleading the fifth.”



The prosecution may choose to grant immunity to an individual so that they testify.



Understanding Indicted Vs Charged



When it comes to being indicted vs charged, understanding the difference is crucial to understanding the process you may undergo at some time in your life.



Now that you know the difference, you can better prepare yourself for any future proceedings by seeking out a criminal defense lawyer you can trust.



At the law office of Gutin & Wolverton, our lawyers offer quality services in criminal law, family law, DUI defense, and personal injury. If you’d like to learn more about how we can help you at every stage of the process, contact us today.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26125399 -

Morel Guy said:
I don't think you understand and your hostility does not indicate understanding.

Indictment is a FORMAL charge for the legal proceedings forthcoming for a felony.  A booking charge is completely different.

They must have a booking charge within so many days of being in jail.  Really hours.

They cannot by law just hold people without a booking charge.  Totally different than a felony indictment.



There's no hostility.  Why would you take it so personally?  The copypasta you posted isn't based on New Jersey law.  There is no such thing as a misdemeanor in New Jersey.

Police can't bring charges, and there's no requirement under the constitution that you be charged within 48 hours.  There is a requirement that a probable cause determination be made within 48 hours, however.


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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Enlil]
    #26125425 -

There are minor crimes in all states.  Ot's not that all laws are felonies.  Whtever classification your state uses.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26125441 -



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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26125452 -

Where is your legal authority for this.  You've posted blogs.  Where is the case law?


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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Enlil]
    #26125460 -

I don't know what you are refuting.  Fact is it's entirely the norm what I'm saying.  I've had numerious charges and convictions thus very familiar.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26125472 -

There are many misconceptions that have become mainstream belief.  That doesn't make them true. For instance, many people believe that miranda rights must be read to a suspect when he/she is arrested, but this is clearly false. 

I'm simply asking you to support your claim with legal authority, preferably federal authority, since you claim it's a right founded on the U.S. Constitution.  SCOTUS authority would be optimum.


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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Enlil]
    #26125491 -

Read the link.

I know they don't have to read you your rights.  I was told that by a lawyer.

They only have so long to detain you without some sort of crime to book you under.  Then again, they shoot kids and get a paid vacation.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26125499 -

Booking is different from charging.  Cops book a suspect.  Prosecutors and/or grand juries charge a defendant.


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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Enlil]
    #26125511 -

You'll never know other than a letter.  Here in court you get arraigned.  That is when charged.  So arraignment has to happen within so many hours.  Usually the next morning or first thing Monday.


I don't even think the prosecutor is there for arraignment.  Maybe they watch it on video or someone from that office.  They get a dozen or so of those daily.  Heavy on weekends and holidays.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Morel Guy]
    #26125516 -

sounds anecdotal to me


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Re: Fixing the police 👮 [Re: Enlil]
    #26125526 -

No when you go to jail or not it goes like this

You go to jail. 

You get booked, charges are filed

You wait until video arraignment when charges are declared to YOU.

You bond out or not

OR you get a letter in the mail that says you've got a court date and have not been arrested.  Either way the first time you see a judge is the official charge...at arraignment.

The booking Jailer can also tell you your charges as they are at that time.

A lot depends on how nice you are as well.  Jail staff will or can give courtesy if you are not a jerk.

Anyhow after arraignment if it's a felony you bond out or wait to get bond (own recognized or 10%).

It's usually a matter of a month or more for indictment.  That's only a bump in the road for a felony.  It means there is enough evidence for a serious crime.

Then there are hearings where either side tries to get what they want and to avoid trial.  Neither side want trial usually.

Sooner or later you have a day where you plead guilty or go to trial.


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"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found

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