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Anonymous

tilt?
    #2612055 - 04/28/04 05:21 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

i...
if i had to pick, i think i would probably be more described as
Users may choose only one (23 total votes)
more of a libertarian
-
15 65%
more of a socialist
-
5 22%
other (specify)
-
3 13%
Votes accepted from (04/28/04 02:00 AM) to (04/29/04 06:20 PM)
You must vote before you can view the results of this poll.


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Anonymous

Re: tilt? [Re: ]
    #2612064 - 04/28/04 05:22 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

the poll is intended to gauge the sentiments of only our more frequent visitors, so it will end tomorrow evening.


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: tilt? [Re: ]
    #2612139 - 04/28/04 05:37 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Interesting that you had libertarian and socialist on there instead of the usual liberal or conservative.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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Anonymous

Re: tilt? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2612568 - 04/28/04 07:37 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

yeah. collectivism comes in different flavors depending on which purpose the rulers will "guide" society towards. these days, it's usually either socialist or fascist. liberalism only comes in one.

i would have said liberalism vs. collectivism, but the word 'liberalism' might confuse people and every collectivist i've ran into on the board is a socialist anyway.

hence, libertarian vs. socialist... the two opposing ideologies we mainly see represented here.


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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Registered: 11/02/03
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Re: tilt? [Re: ]
    #2612601 - 04/28/04 07:46 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I think those are two extremes, there is alot of ground between the two.


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1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."


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Anonymous

Re: tilt? [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2612638 - 04/28/04 07:57 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

indeed, but i think that most fall on either side. on this board (and everywhere else), we've got mainly two types of political thought.

one holds that the government, like anyone else, may only use force defensively. it says that the only legitimate role of the state is to keep the peace and nothing more.

the other believes that the government should solve the problems of society whenever force may appear to facilitate doing so. because there are many different ideas about what 'problems' the state should solve (everything from 'obscenity' and homosexuality to poverty and AIDS), there are all kinds of collectivists, but most of ours are socialists.

there are positions in between, but people do generally fall more to one side or the other.


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OfflineTao
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Re: tilt? [Re: ]
    #2612694 - 04/28/04 08:06 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

It seems like this issue comes up a lot. I'm very libertarian on personal issues and pretty socialist on economic ones.


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Magash's Grain Tek  + Tub-in-Tub Incubator + Magash's PMP + SBP Tek + Dunking = Practically all a newbie grower needs :thumbup:


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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Re: tilt? [Re: ]
    #2612705 - 04/28/04 08:08 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I for one think that to achieve the greatest general good (liberty, safety, prosperity) you have to balance liberalism and socialism.

The government should regulate some things or society can go to crap; liberty can be lost by exploitation and fear, citizens can have shitty lives because the government does too little to protect them, but on the other hand I think the government must respect individual liberties and freedoms and not try to force collectivist policies on the people. Government should not be soley responsible for society, though it should help out when it can. Most decisions should be up to the people unless they endanger others or themselves. (Notice I said 'endanger' and not harm. Under libertarian philosophy the government only has jurisdiction over crimes that have taken place, rather than potential ones.)

That's why I am this board's only centrist/conservative.


--------------------
1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: tilt? [Re: Tao]
    #2612713 - 04/28/04 08:09 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Most socialists I've met tend to be pretty libertarian on social issues, with a few exceptions like gun control. To find people who are authoritarian on both personal and economic issues, I think you'd have to start looking at people like communists and fascists.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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OfflineTao
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Re: tilt? [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2612727 - 04/28/04 08:11 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

That's why I am this board's only centrist/conservative.




i dont know about that. i think i might be close to your views.


--------------------
Magash's Grain Tek  + Tub-in-Tub Incubator + Magash's PMP + SBP Tek + Dunking = Practically all a newbie grower needs :thumbup:


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: tilt? [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #2612732 - 04/28/04 08:13 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Did you by chance have a previous account on here? You seem so familiar...


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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OfflineDivided_Sky
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Registered: 11/02/03
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Re: tilt? [Re: Tao]
    #2612743 - 04/28/04 08:14 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

TaoTeChing said:
Quote:

That's why I am this board's only centrist/conservative.




i dont know about that. i think i might be close to your views.





That would be interesting, considering we both have the Tao and Washington State in our profiles.


--------------------
1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."


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Anonymous

Re: tilt? [Re: Tao]
    #2612758 - 04/28/04 08:17 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

It seems like this issue comes up a lot. I'm very libertarian on personal issues and pretty socialist on economic ones.

this would make you a socialist; like most of the socialists here, one who would permit people to exercise their rights as long as they weren't employing themselves in a productive manner or exchanging goods and\or services, but a socialist nonetheless.


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: tilt? [Re: ]
    #2612766 - 04/28/04 08:20 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I remember we had a discussion a while back about what a neocon is, and I was just thinking that a neocon is sort of like the opposite of a socialist: authoritarian on personal issues, while libertarian on economic ones.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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OfflineTao
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Re: tilt? [Re: ]
    #2612791 - 04/28/04 08:27 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Well if thats what you meant, the poll should have been "Economically, i'm more of a..."


--------------------
Magash's Grain Tek  + Tub-in-Tub Incubator + Magash's PMP + SBP Tek + Dunking = Practically all a newbie grower needs :thumbup:


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Anonymous

Re: tilt? [Re: silversoul7]
    #2612838 - 04/28/04 08:37 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

it looks to me like what makes one a 'neocon' is more about foreign policy than domestic. insofar as they require individuals to further their neocon fantasies, through stuff like higher 'defense' spending and possible military draft, they too are collectivists.


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Offlinephi1618
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Re: tilt? [Re: ]
    #2613458 - 04/28/04 11:22 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I replied 'more of a libertarian'.

However, I am not a libertarian. I believe there are situations where the government should interfere in the economy. Specifically, I believe that it is necessary to regulate the commons, such as the electromagnetic spectrum and the environment. Natural monopolies require regulation as well, and anti-trust actions are an important role of government. The government has more roles I consider valid than I will list here. So, I do have strong socialist tendencies.

However, I think the government does way too much. I oppose subsidies and tariffs except as a tool of foreign policy, I think the tax code should be simplified (though I support progressive taxes), I oppose the drug war, oppose the DMCA, believe copyright should be weakened and the patent system overhauled. So, libertarian.


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Anonymous

Re: tilt? [Re: ]
    #2618490 - 04/29/04 10:16 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

results are in!


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