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van hatton
Still a noob


Registered: 11/23/14
Posts: 5,619
Loc: Michigan
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Do i need to vent my PC.
#26106875 - 07/13/19 10:53 PM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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If your able to reach sterilization temps (250°f) without venting would you consider that fine.
Or does it have to be just steam.
-------------------- If I ever give out misinformation please inform me so I can have the correct information.
Tmethyl said:
Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked a monotub that wasn't pinning fast enough. The force of the kick rearranged the genetics of the mushrooms, we now call them Penis Envy.
Caps McGee said:
Fun part is figuring out what works best for you
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Failboat
Free man

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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: van hatton] 1
#26106907 - 07/13/19 11:18 PM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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You must vent.
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van hatton
Still a noob


Registered: 11/23/14
Posts: 5,619
Loc: Michigan
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Failboat]
#26106916 - 07/13/19 11:27 PM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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But why if I'm hitting temps
-------------------- If I ever give out misinformation please inform me so I can have the correct information.
Tmethyl said:
Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked a monotub that wasn't pinning fast enough. The force of the kick rearranged the genetics of the mushrooms, we now call them Penis Envy.
Caps McGee said:
Fun part is figuring out what works best for you
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JohnRainy
Stranger

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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: van hatton]
#26106964 - 07/14/19 12:29 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Water vapour transfers heat more than atmosphere
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Creep
Traveler


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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: JohnRainy]
#26107052 - 07/14/19 02:05 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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The theory behind venting is if there are air pockets in your PC they will be cool spots and although your PC gauge will read correct pressure/temp, you run the risk of having non sterilised areas in your material. I'm not 100% convinced that a few air pockets would make a difference but I vent anyway because then I'm sure it's even heat. Venting takes ten minutes so 🤷♂️
-------------------- No man is an island, entire of itself; every man is a piece of the continent, a part of the main. If a clod be washed away by the sea, Europe is the less, as well as if a promontory were, as well as if a manor of thy friend's or of thine own were: any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bells tolls; it tolls for thee."
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bodhisatta 
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Registered: 04/30/13
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Loc: Milky way
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Creep] 1
#26107277 - 07/14/19 07:06 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Temperature doesn't do the sterilization, energy does. Air has dramatically less energy than steam of the same temperature.
Try cooking a turkey at 250F in an oven. Then put the same size turkey in a pressure cooker at 250F One will take all day one will take under an hour
A 225-250F meat smoker takes an hour a pound to smoke a pork shoulder.
Van, my pressure cooker tek has way too much info about why.
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Subfinder
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: bodhisatta] 1
#26107284 - 07/14/19 07:13 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Put your hand in a 250° oven, see how long you can keep it there. Put it in 250° steam, you'll be burned severely in seconds.
Fucking molecules
Edited by Subfinder (07/14/19 07:15 AM)
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mushboy
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Subfinder]
#26107307 - 07/14/19 07:40 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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i like that example. time for a cool story
before my mother gave me my aa915 for xmas she gave me the manual first. she made me read that shit for hours (she thought i was going to blow up the house)
anyway i vented from day1. i can honestly with no bullshit say that since i first used my AA(15yrs ago) ive NEVER had any jars outright mold. never an entire batch. never multiple jars. only time uninoculated jars mold i could always tell it was filter failure or something obvious like forgetting to put the lids on
i believe the reason i rarely if ever see mold in my sterilized jars is because i always vent
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Chwyn
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: mushboy]
#26107349 - 07/14/19 08:14 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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as soon as my cooker gets upto 15 psi I take the weight off and let it depressurize to 5 psi then I let it go back to 15 psi for 1hr - 1.5hr. my grains look like they were vacuum sealed when they come out. Solved my bacteria issues I had when I was first starting. Commercial growers vent as well to remove air from the substrate blocks/around the blocks to make them heat up faster.
Edited by Chwyn (07/14/19 08:14 AM)
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Soccrates
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Chwyn]
#26107463 - 07/14/19 09:29 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Isn't there risk of deforming the pressure cooker if you depressurize like that?
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Soccrates]
#26107485 - 07/14/19 09:39 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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No, how would it deform.
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van hatton
Still a noob


Registered: 11/23/14
Posts: 5,619
Loc: Michigan
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Soccrates]
#26107488 - 07/14/19 09:41 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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If we're using displacement of air in a PC. It should all eventually vent thru the rocker like usual during cycle.
This reminds me of when I first started and never vented 
Imo PC's are faulty in how they vent we can hardly every get all the air out. A gravity system with the vent on top.
I understand that a transfer of heat will be more substantial with just pure steam.
-------------------- If I ever give out misinformation please inform me so I can have the correct information.
Tmethyl said:
Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked a monotub that wasn't pinning fast enough. The force of the kick rearranged the genetics of the mushrooms, we now call them Penis Envy.
Caps McGee said:
Fun part is figuring out what works best for you
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,916
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: van hatton] 1
#26107498 - 07/14/19 09:44 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Entrapped air is the number one cause of failed sterilization in industry
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van hatton
Still a noob


Registered: 11/23/14
Posts: 5,619
Loc: Michigan
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: bodhisatta]
#26107502 - 07/14/19 09:46 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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I should also add.
I do vent every single time.
When I first started for 2 years I never vented.
I kinda wanna get those sterilization strips and just try it. See why I was able to do it with such success 8 years ago
-------------------- If I ever give out misinformation please inform me so I can have the correct information.
Tmethyl said:
Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked a monotub that wasn't pinning fast enough. The force of the kick rearranged the genetics of the mushrooms, we now call them Penis Envy.
Caps McGee said:
Fun part is figuring out what works best for you
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,916
Loc: Milky way
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: van hatton]
#26107517 - 07/14/19 09:51 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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The strips respond to temperature. They're used to indicate something has been through processing so it doesn't get processed twice. They do not indicate if sterilization is successful at all.
There are autoclave spore strips. They are impregnated with endospores and are stuck in a load. They require a special incubator and media. You take the strip out and incubate them if anything grows then the cycle was invalid. They're expensive and so is the equipment to grow them
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van hatton
Still a noob


Registered: 11/23/14
Posts: 5,619
Loc: Michigan
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: bodhisatta]
#26107525 - 07/14/19 09:59 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Yes they do respond to temps and if the energy transfer was insufficient like you guys are saying the middle of my jars will never hit 250.
-------------------- If I ever give out misinformation please inform me so I can have the correct information.
Tmethyl said:
Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked a monotub that wasn't pinning fast enough. The force of the kick rearranged the genetics of the mushrooms, we now call them Penis Envy.
Caps McGee said:
Fun part is figuring out what works best for you
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Soccrates
Stranger
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: bodhisatta]
#26107593 - 07/14/19 10:37 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
bodhisatta said: No, how would it deform.
Hot pressurized metal rapidly changing temp and pressure. To be clear, i was talktalking about letting it get to pressure then pulling the stopper
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SadTurkey
ayy


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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Soccrates]
#26107624 - 07/14/19 10:56 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Soccrates said: Hot pressurized metal rapidly changing temp and pressure. To be clear, i was talktalking about letting it get to pressure then pulling the stopper
When you pull the stopper you release pressure. Since the cooker can withstand the high pressure it contained before, it will also be able to withstand the lower pressure.
Also, the pressure cooker and the contents have enough heat capacity that the temperature diminishes quite slowly, so no problem there either. I wouldn't throw a boiling pressure cooker in a cold bath (for various reasons), but other than that you'll be fine.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Soccrates]
#26107628 - 07/14/19 11:00 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Soccrates said:
Quote:
bodhisatta said: No, how would it deform.
Hot pressurized metal rapidly changing temp and pressure. To be clear, i was talktalking about letting it get to pressure then pulling the stopper
If 15psi cant deform it how would rapidly venting to 5 psi hurt. Its still under positive pressure so it wont crunch. And it wont bend outwards more than it would at 15psi
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Soccrates
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: bodhisatta]
#26107642 - 07/14/19 11:07 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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I thought I read many cautions against doing that. It makes sense to me. It's gonna cool as it vents, and temperature differential is bad for metal. I mean I've done it...but that doesn't make it a good idea. I do a lot of stupid shit.
I'll take your word for it.
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SadTurkey
ayy


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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Soccrates]
#26107695 - 07/14/19 11:33 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Soccrates said: I thought I read many cautions against doing that. It makes sense to me. It's gonna cool as it vents, and temperature differential is bad for metal.
Again, the temperature differential isn't as big as you think. When you remove the stopper, the cooker doesn't go to 0 psi and 100 degrees C in one millisecond. When the pressure drops, the boiling point of water lowers too. Which means the water starts boiling more vigorously. Since the vent only allows so much steam to escape, the pressure doesn't drop to 0 psi in one go (the thing would basically explode), but it gradually diminishes. Since the evaporation of water requires energy, the system loses heat as it is losing pressure.
This basically means that during the whole time the pressure cooker is venting, the pressure slowly drops 0 psi over ambient pressure and the temperature slowly drops from 121 degrees C to 100 degrees C (or 8014 billabongs in retard units). A temperature drop of just 21 degrees in let's say 30 seconds is nothing.
In fact, I just did a quick calculation and if your PC is 0,5 meter high it'd only contract 0.12 millimeters over its entire length while it's venting.
In short, don't worry about it.
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Soccrates
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: SadTurkey]
#26107718 - 07/14/19 11:41 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Works for me. Like I said, I've done it. But I always thought it was bad practice. Much like my open air ms>grain inoculation( pretty successfully, I might add)
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Creep
Traveler


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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: SadTurkey]
#26107732 - 07/14/19 11:48 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
SadTurkey said:
(or 8014 billabongs in retard units).
🤣🤣👍👍
-------------------- No man is an island, entire of itself; every man is a piece of the continent, a part of the main. If a clod be washed away by the sea, Europe is the less, as well as if a promontory were, as well as if a manor of thy friend's or of thine own were: any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bells tolls; it tolls for thee."
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Big Jon
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Creep]
#28846863 - 07/11/24 03:39 PM (6 months, 3 days ago) |
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I was wondering if ALL pressure cookers must be vented. All the research I’ve done talks about “presto 23 qt” and I have a different PC.
I can post pics of the PC if needed.
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Pennock
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Big Jon] 1
#28846864 - 07/11/24 03:40 PM (6 months, 3 days ago) |
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You gotta vent any PC. Presto 23qt is just a very common first PC.
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fiddle_head
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Big Jon]
#28847518 - 07/12/24 12:38 AM (6 months, 2 days ago) |
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Quote:
Big Jon said: I was wondering if ALL pressure cookers must be vented. All the research I’ve done talks about “presto 23 qt” and I have a different PC.
I can post pics of the PC if needed.
What is the volume of your vessel. What brand and model. Do you have an instruction manual?
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Big Jon
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Let me know if you need more pics/info. The instruction manual does not have much info other than this, though!
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fiddle_head
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: van hatton] 1
#28850311 - 07/13/24 07:28 AM (6 months, 1 day ago) |
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That’s a multi cooker, more like an IP than anything. Kind of a crappy middle ground. It’s not a PC. You need an actual pressure canner for grains. (Some exceptions)
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Big Jon
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: fiddle_head]
#28852887 - 07/14/24 02:10 AM (6 months, 21 hours ago) |
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What’s the difference? This doesn’t reach the correct temperatures?
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Big Jon
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Big Jon]
#28853762 - 07/14/24 01:28 PM (6 months, 10 hours ago) |
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Edited by Big Jon (07/18/24 11:40 PM)
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Big Jon
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: fiddle_head]
#28853767 - 07/14/24 01:30 PM (6 months, 10 hours ago) |
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Quote:
fiddle_head said: That’s a multi cooker, more like an IP than anything. Kind of a crappy middle ground. It’s not a PC. You need an actual pressure canner for grains. (Some exceptions)
It says on the instructions that you should never release steam when canning…I am assuming these directions must be ignored when sterilizing, and it is OK to release steam for 10 min
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fiddle_head
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: van hatton]
#28853768 - 07/14/24 01:30 PM (6 months, 10 hours ago) |
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what psi does it go to
whats the specs?
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PBJ710
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: fiddle_head]
#28854260 - 07/14/24 05:28 PM (6 months, 6 hours ago) |
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The high pressure setting on that one is 15psi which will work, but the prices on it seem significantly higher than a presto 16 and on par with a Presto 23qt which will do alot more jars at once.
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cronicr



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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Big Jon]
#28855081 - 07/14/24 09:48 PM (6 months, 1 hour ago) |
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Quote:
Big Jon said:
Quote:
fiddle_head said: That’s a multi cooker, more like an IP than anything. Kind of a crappy middle ground. It’s not a PC. You need an actual pressure canner for grains. (Some exceptions)
It says on the instructions that you should never release steam when canning…I am assuming these directions must be ignored when sterilizing, and it is OK to release steam for 10 min
U dont vent after it's pressurized, you vent it before.
-------------------- It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
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Edited by cronicr (07/15/24 07:35 AM)
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fiddle_head
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: van hatton]
#28855150 - 07/14/24 11:47 PM (5 months, 30 days ago) |
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Bring to temp and then vent. Then bring to pressure and run cycle. This will allow trapped pockets of latent gas to escape allowing the void inside the vessel to fill with pure steam. This is what actually kills the bioload in your grains because it transfers heat and allows the steam to penetrate everything inside the pressure cooker.
I am not certain how the model you have is rated or whether it is sufficient for certain grains but as a general rule, if you don’t have a proper pressure cooker, it’s best to stick to pf tek and agar. An instapot will sterilize some agar or lc media nicely.
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Big Jon
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: fiddle_head]
#28855285 - 07/15/24 05:36 AM (5 months, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
fiddle_head said: An instapot will sterilize some agar or lc media nicely.
Yeah but I think it caramelized my last LC honey jars now that I look back on it and the PC I posted didn’t
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fiddle_head
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Big Jon]
#28855313 - 07/15/24 06:05 AM (5 months, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
Big Jon said:
Quote:
fiddle_head said: An instapot will sterilize some agar or lc media nicely.
Yeah but I think it caramelized my last LC honey jars now that I look back on it and the PC I posted didn’t
Did you use a LME with a low lovibond rating (2 or less) and a cheesecloth or coffee filter to sieve the sediment out?
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SirPsycho
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Big Jon] 1
#28855325 - 07/15/24 06:24 AM (5 months, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
Big Jon said:
Quote:
fiddle_head said: An instapot will sterilize some agar or lc media nicely.
Yeah but I think it caramelized my last LC honey jars now that I look back on it and the PC I posted didn’t
PC doesn't get hot enough to caramelize sugars other than fructose. Malt is maltose
Nvm I can't read, you're using honey. Definitely could have caramelized
--------------------
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Edited by SirPsycho (07/15/24 06:25 AM)
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Big Jon
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: fiddle_head]
#28856071 - 07/15/24 12:47 PM (5 months, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
fiddle_head said:
Quote:
Big Jon said:
Quote:
fiddle_head said: An instapot will sterilize some agar or lc media nicely.
Did you use a LME with a low lovibond rating (2 or less) and a cheesecloth or coffee filter to sieve the sediment out?
Not sure what a LME (ir a lovibond rating) is…
I have since switched to malt extract due to the risk of caramelization of the honey..
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Big Jon
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Big Jon]
#28870736 - 07/19/24 12:01 AM (5 months, 26 days ago) |
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Also, this PC did not come with any weights. Am I going to have to order them?
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Big Jon
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Big Jon]
#28870738 - 07/19/24 12:03 AM (5 months, 26 days ago) |
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Would weights fit on this vent hole on the handle?
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DERRAYLD
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Big Jon]
#28870754 - 07/19/24 12:29 AM (5 months, 26 days ago) |
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LME is light malt extract.
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DERRAYLD
Constructus



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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: Big Jon]
#28870758 - 07/19/24 12:34 AM (5 months, 26 days ago) |
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Quote:
Big Jon said: Also, this PC did not come with any weights. Am I going to have to order them?
That pc doesn't work.with weights, it's made to reach specific pressure and cannot be adjusted.
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Big Jon
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Re: Do i need to vent my PC. [Re: DERRAYLD] 1
#28872084 - 07/19/24 04:10 PM (5 months, 26 days ago) |
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Quote:
DERRAYLD said:
Quote:
Big Jon said: Also, this PC did not come with any weights. Am I going to have to order them?
That pc doesn't work.with weights, it's made to reach specific pressure and cannot be adjusted.
Ok so I should set it to the vent setting for 10 minutes after I hear steam, set it to setting 2 (15 psi) for 2 hours and hope for the best?
Edited by Big Jon (07/19/24 04:11 PM)
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