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Invisiblekaiowas
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interview with O.G's and their philosophy
    #2608176 - 04/27/04 09:18 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

that's right!!  there's a philosophy out there that has been seriously over-looked by those that don't experience what these brave soldiers and commanders have endured over their experience on this planet.  this isn't a philosophy that is based on writings, but rather a profound understanding of the everyday experience of their life. It brings back the rawness of life that was seen thousands of years ago before the govt has a control over ideas.  this is not for you to judge this as a right or wrong philosophy, it's just one that many might not have been exposed to and it can give a perspective shift.  I'm not asking you to understand, agree or disagree, but rather just know.

here's the main illusion...the police are in total control.  see what these curagous individuals have seen, and you will be thinking just slightly different. there are many misconceptions between what happens and heresay.

this wasn't a regular interview of me with a pencil and paper with my legs crossed asking this person certain questions.  this was a real-life interview based on experience.  being a driver...sitting on the block smoking and enjoying the space. hearing of their war stories and how they felt. they didn't mind me being white at all...race doesn't really matter.  I don't officially belong to their armie and therefore I'm seen as one of the many civilians. part of it is experience...all that matters is that I don't say what they do is right or wrong, aka I don't judge them. 

it's not like I'm an expert, I'm not trying to portray that at all, but I feel that I can put down enough to give jsut a diffenet perspective on what's happening in some parts of america.

it's not like I adopted thier lingo or dress, I didn't have to, remember..I'm a civilian.  they don't do things becuse they think its cool, it's a war, they are an armie, and just like any army, they have codes to differentiate themselves

this a war that has been raging on for a good 40 years now, and has claimed tens of thousands of lives. these are armies in control of territories that is mentally mapped out (in grids) in the mind of every soldier there. it's very in depth. there is a code that is followed that is unwritten, it's just known, based on respect.  no kidnapping, unless someone did it first then the OGs will figure out the retaliation methods.  no killing civilians, though sometimes they will get caught in the crossfire, and again, this happens in EVERY war since the dawn of time.  there are zones dictated by graffitti and soldiers patrolling the area, and fighting happens in either in free zones, or if there is an attack to claim territory.  again...warfare!


the thing about california which is different from most states is that cities are connected.  I live in pittsburg, which connects into concord, which connects to oakland, and all the way down to LA where most of this shit originated. in turn I can go north to antioch, up to stockton and good ol sac, where the fighting as taken a fierce turn.  no I'm not talking about the dumb east side west crap that is portrayed on the news or in music. if it's one thing that I know annoys these soldiers a lot, it is the viewpoint of the civilians through rap music, a looking cool "bling bling" mentality.  if soldiers wanted to rap, they would have started with that and not chosen the career as a soldier.  yeah there are a few, but it's just a side project, nothing more. 

people flash colors of representing, and now when I see a fake or a wannabe, I can just laugh because they have no idea of an actual full scale war. actually, if you know how a soldier dresses, a wannabe is easy to spot. the colors are just flags, that's all, as any army would have.  I hope you will start to see the mentality of the guerilla warfare in the states.

I remember I asked the question once, why not talk about it?  i was shot with tons of looks because of the naive question. they knew I didn't really understand, but now I have a much better understanding, though I don't fully understand yet.  I probably never will either.. 

the title of OG (original gangster) is far from a title that is given.  it is earned, even moreso it has to be experienced. firstly, you have to realize, this is a career.  based on respect through action and a tenacity that is rarely seen in american society.  firstly, you have to be able to live to at least 25 to be an OG, and that's a lot!  in the course of their careers, they will be shot, stolen many things, stabbed, and put in numerous hours of pacing the block and keeping alert.  my main buddy has developed what they call the thousand yard stare and it's kinda creepy at first, but it's because I didn't understand how intense this is. the other thing is the name you have.  the name has to be established first off all so others know who you are,  and furthermore...your name has to be synonomous with the gang or territory you are affiliated with. 

my house is luckily outside any war zone (that is to say not that my neighborhood doesn't have it's weekly gun-fights) and is thus a great spot for a place to rest. I live in what will begin as "white suburbs" but I have seen a few soldiers (like 5-6) come to my house and go, not anymore though as the house next-door was raided and beign watched by the police. again, my house is safe as I know a couple of people and again, I'm a civilian.  I have nothing to do with their war and they know this.

don't ask me how the war started because I have no idea.  I just know that the law will NEVER stop it, it'll only stop when the gangs decide enough is enough.  until then the war will rage on.  and raged it has!  I rememeber I drove this OG to a place for a "small" meeting.  I never went inside (he just needed a ride) but i did ask, how many poeple are there?  to which he replied, around 70!  :eek:

yes, big meetings consist of hundreds or even thousands of people.

I'm sure many of you remember the LA riots!  let me tell you what that was REALLY about.  The OG (this is what I refer to my buddy as) was down there at the time in the middle of a huge meeting when the news came on. a lady stood there infront of K-mart (which has guns and is right next to a huge gun shop) and she said that there were NO police around.  :shake:  the riot wasn't for that faggot rodney King at all, it was about the majority of police being mentally swept up in a scandal, and thus they were going for deperately need supplies.  what most of us saw were dope fiends and street dwellers who just went nuts.  dope fiends aren't really respeted as they have lost respect for themselves. it's making money off of others for the war.  after all, a dope fiend can get a TV, but most of the people who robbed those places didn't rob it for themselves.  how could they when they don't have a home for it,  no..it was so thye can get drugs...plain and simple.  I mean seriously, if you are in a full mentality of there being a war, and are mostly flat broke, if the police are slipping, time to take action.  the media falsely protrayed it as a civil rights issue, and for some parts it was.  but most of the rioting there were for supplies.

this is what I mean by control of ideas.  The war wages harder today, and will keep going on for some time.

the soldier of war has many tasks.  performing tasks as stealing cars, slangin (making and selling drugs), going on a coo, and recruiting.  it's about the name, the respect, the block, and the loot.  pledging their lives till the ultimate destruction of their enemies.  don't try to understand it, just know what is happening under the belley of America.  it's a scare that is concealed, but it is so huge, that maybe someday people will start to take notice. 

the idealogy goes back (as many of these intelligent folks read Sun Tzu's "the Art of war"  let's take a couple of ideas from there.

"The skillful leader subdues the enemy's troops without any fighting; he captures their cities without laying siege to them; he overthrows their kingdom without lengthy operations in the field. With his forces intact he disputes the mastery of the empire, and thus, without losing a man, his triumph is complete. "

"It is the rule in war: If our forces are ten to the enemy's one, to surround him; if five to one, to attack him; if twice as numerous, to divide our army into two, one to meet the enemy in front, and one to fall upon his rear; if he replies to the frontal attack. he may be crushed from behind; if to the reaward attack, he may be crushed in front.

If equally matched. we can offer battle; if slightly inferior in numbers, we can avoid the enemy; if quite unequal in every way, we can flee from him. Though an obstinate fight may be made by a small force, in the end it must be captured by the larger force."

"He will win who knows when to fight and hen not to fight.

He will win who knows how to handle both superior and inferior forces.

He will win whose army is animated by the same spirit throughout all its ranks.

He will win who, prepared himself, waits to take the enemy unprepared.

He will win who has military capacity and is not interfered with by the sovereign."

this is just a slice of the mentality, but it's something to be learned.

I'm going to take a break for now as I will add more later.


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: kaiowas]
    #2608194 - 04/27/04 09:24 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

oh...and if you wander why the law hasn't done anything major, it's because that these rivals don't take it to the courts, it's between them and only them, not the civilians.


part of being an OG is serving time in camp without being a snitch, on either side. remember the importance and emphasis they put on their names and thus the ideas and respect involved with their army.

once the law got involved and it just intensified the war. bringing it in the court doesn't work, this is lawlessness. to them it's beyond law.


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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OfflineMixomatosis
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: kaiowas]
    #2608220 - 04/27/04 09:29 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

good writing man, interesting stuff.


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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: Mixomatosis]
    #2608887 - 04/27/04 11:24 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

This is really interesting material, probably the most interesting I've seen here in a long time.


I am completely interested in this way of life, because I've never had to experience any sort of warfare.

Externally, my life has been plain and simple. My battle place has been internal.

So external struggle really sparks interest in me, because it is so foreign to me.

Driving through the really bad ghetto of Atlanta introduced me to a whole new world, and that was all within 20 minutes.





Please, keep on writing. Its things like this that opens a persons mind. I especially like how you remained unbias in your article, that is a very nice twist that I dont often see in people's writings.

You are neither attacking nor defending, blaming nor whining about others blaming you. You are simply showing things as you see them, really well-done.

This has been a good step back from the trendy, repitious, often dog-biting-his-own-tail conversations on Religion, Spirituality, and Aliens we see all too often here.

Please, continue.


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: tekramrepus]
    #2613098 - 04/28/04 09:59 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

continuing on....the age to start gathering citizens for gangs is around 11-13, though some are known. many are like my buddy who were born into it. it's how they were raised as it was their only surroundings they were exposed to. fatherless, motherless, too many live with grandparents, or worse are shifted around from foster home to foster home. this is an environment that breathes violence and drug abuse. a breeding ground for souls without a chance given to them...therefore they take what they can, leave the worthless to die or be left with nothing. besides, when you are seemingly born with nothing, you really don't have much to stand for with regards to morals and laws.

many times, a soldier's fellow members is the only real family they have...and many are ready to die for the cause without question. thje cause is all they see worth in their world. most get disinterested in the life of education, and it's not really hard to see why. that's life...live by the gun, you die by the gun.

OG was born in a family that sold crack, crank, coke, PCP, H, X and so on. he started drinking at the age of 11 and it hasn't stopped there since. last graduation was from 6th grade, he can't even read most of the signs on the street. he knows the names because he has patrolled the area enough. Banging hard for over 2/3 of the length of california (but it doesn't stop there). it's funny to note nebraska is the state that is gonna be the hot seat soon.

the inititation methods are different for damn near every sectioned off block. at 11, OG was given the first assignment to go on a coo, where he murdered his first two people. after all, he needed to establish the name of him and his section. this was back in 1980s in the nortorious south central of LA. bodies left in the rivers, alleys, or on the streets, it didn't matter. as long as the point was taken that they are not going to fucked around with.

It's interesting to note how much commotion can be caused over one hamburger stand, but lets just say over a hundred people have died over one hamburger stand in south central. it was part of the territory, and the stand was the marking place for those who owned it.

helping his mother who was an OG herself make drugs to pay for the A.P.T.'s (apartments). him and his friends used the local LIQ (liquor store) as a place for meetings and as a safe haven to slang. they paid the store owner and of course was granted money, immunity and protection to theft and raids. This is no different than what the US does to shut countries up. or jsut as companies pay off other companies for their "reasons" these soldiers know it, they see it, and say fuck it. besides, that's how they have seen their elders have...and so it's really easy to start seeing why this war continues. they don't mess with places that slanging is done because a real battle and real respect is found when done head to head, man to man. if you are outnumbered, you don't lose face by running away, but you will lose face if you don't try to retaliate later on. if you are caught slipping on your patrol, that's their fault, they should know that a war is going. it's a fire that provides its own fuel.

soldiers pay attention to everything from the type of car with certain rims belongs to what people, to their phone numbers and addresses. family members are identified as well as so things like kinnapping doesn't really happen.

everything else from running into homes shooting people, to beating a 13 year old kid nearly to death in an alleyway. age doesn't matter, what you have done while you are here to help the cause is what matters. again this a war...and jail is boot-camp. testing your limits of your non snitching ability will provide you with more recognition, reputation, and respect. always having their strap, it's about thinking, and not just that, but doing. send someone in a pine box, and creating funerals, and making loot...the fire keeps on burning.

more to come...


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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OfflineSource
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: kaiowas]
    #2614345 - 04/29/04 02:51 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Awesome, Kaiowas, awesome!


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OfflineDankBluntZ
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: kaiowas]
    #2623800 - 05/01/04 12:57 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Very interesting.


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: kaiowas]
    #2633848 - 05/03/04 09:18 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

one of the main misconceptions among civilians between the gang wars is that there's a blood vs. crips war. while this may be the case in some areas (and was the case in the late 70s early 80s) here's a fact that any OG (original gangsta) will tell you (he's a crip btw)

the number one kller of crips is crips.

especially in LA, madness has ensued between the different ideologies between the different sects of gangs on different streets. it has turned to a point that each block is segregated and yet the armies seem to flourish with no problem. as territories begin to be established certain property soon got in the way. one territory had a gun shop OG told me and that was the cause of the massacre of over 100 people within a little over 2 weeks time. tons of missing people, broken up families, and brothers and sisters of soldiers who swore their revenge. remember...there are no victims.

this is beyond race or status...it is about respect and honor. it's about being placed in a system where a chance that society gives is so small that it is more of an advantage to take what you can, when you can. i remember when OG was first explaining this all to me, I was beyond shocked, again, I didn't understand, but this was only the beginning. In the late 80s early 90s the great spy war ensued. Recrutement came up big time as sides were taking soldiers from other sides. Making spies, everyone was being a snitch, this lead to the war between the crips. Money the one spy made for one bloc, was now being given to another block. Their information, their guns, their influence was changing constantly. It was hard to establish a leader, and that made it harder for the trust factor. This lead to many fights between the crip army, and hurt their cause quite a bit.

I can?t say for bloods, and reall I can?t even say for half of the crip army, all I know is what OG?s and his friends (3 of which are also OG?s) have explained to me off and on since I?ve known them.

in the mid-90s, the OG's from the early 80s era started to come up from LA to the bay area (where I live). this was all new territory, territory that was fought over for a long time. thus the illegal arms race began. OG told me how words cannot describe how busy the armies have gotten, especially in the east coast now. he doesn't even KNOW what's going on over there. now that the war has brodened, a new breed has come risen from the ashes to take their piece of the pie. With more weapons, was more violence, think of grand theft auto, and that?s what south central was like for a good 4 years. People running into other spies?s house, and murdering their family. Taking their stuff and splitting. This is why the number of troops got so big in the first place. After all, whoever has the most weapons, can get the most recruits. Again..fueling the fire.

OG got tired ofthis shit, as not many were down really for the actual cause. Thus he amd many like him came up to the bay area to start anew. Thus a new breed of thinking was born. this is the individual hussler, and as you can see this as an OG evolution from the gang warfare from the 80s. this evolution was brought on mainly by the law. We have a three strikes thing here in california set up by former Gov Pete Wilson. This law made it hard for the soldiers to see jail as a boot camp, and more as of actual jail. Three times and you are permenantly stuck in jail, and as you noticed how strong the war?s been going on, the prisons have been filling up fast. Just to note, california has a prison population of over 700,000. That?s more that many European countries.

in the bay area the invidual hussler has hit the streets hard, claiming their own turf (not literally). When the OG?s came up from LA and down from Sacramento, they founded a different mode of thinking here in the bay. Basically, not many people (except the posers) cared about gang?s, the territory, and the on-going war up here in the bay. The individual hussler cares only about his/her pockets and not many others. This will be in the range from selling drugs, to stealing, pimping, to getting over on other people as much as possible.

One would think that this may be a breath of fresh air, but instead this has turned into a nightmare. With the rising of the individual hussler, the level of respect has droppped immensly.honor here has left the room, only money matters now. Living day to day off of your own bread. Sure they have their friends but their friends weren?t with them like before. This has resulted in the kidnapping of children and family members, and other crimes.

Don?t think the gang war is over?in the early 2000, Oakland and Sac has now become notorius for it?s gang activity. While many of the OG?s sit there plotting and recruiting, others have been sitting here in the valley, making their own loot trying to live their own lives and forgetting the past. Too bad, as many like my friend have been recognized, and have been called upon yet again. Since housing went up here so much, (1 bedroom apt costs anywhere from 900-2400 a month!) they can either help the cause?or wither on the street and die off one by one. This is a sad state of affairs and it doesn?t look like it?s going to let up anytime soon.





This is the last of entries on this thread. I hope that those who have read will will find a newfound respect for these people and the lives they lead. Many have seen friends and loveones die, as they have also prtaken of those crimes. This is indeed a way of thinking that really hasn?t been exposed to the population, and I think that this is wrong. We need to see what?s really going on in the underbelly of america. She tries to hide that scar, but it?s there?it?s there.


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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OfflineSource
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: kaiowas]
    #2635194 - 05/04/04 01:51 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Thanks kaiowas!

I really enjoyed reading those posts. It certainly has opened my eyes into a whole world I didn't even notice before.


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OfflineDankBluntZ
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: kaiowas]
    #2636379 - 05/04/04 11:40 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Thanks for sharing. :laugh:


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: DankBluntZ]
    #2636420 - 05/04/04 12:10 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

np! I hope you guys/gals enjoyed reading it as much as I enjoyed sharing it with you.


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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OfflineSpecialEd
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: kaiowas]
    #2636466 - 05/04/04 12:32 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Why try and romanticize a group of organized killers? I bet if they really wanted to end their social strife they could.


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OfflineDankBluntZ
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: SpecialEd]
    #2636508 - 05/04/04 01:08 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

It's not about romanticizing it's about having a better understanding of what goes through some of these people's minds. It's interesting to read about which I'm sure is why Kaiowas chose to post.


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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: SpecialEd]
    #2636592 - 05/04/04 01:40 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

as I stated in my post, they will end it when they decide enough is enough.

I just thought it was a perspective many don't see, and that the more you see and know, the better of an understanding you might get.

many of these kids were born into it, and no, I'm not giving this as an excuse of some sort.

jsut think about it though, when you grow up, and all you see is drugs, guns and poverty, then you can plainly see how these kids grew up has an effect. when you are a kid, of course you don't want to go to school, but at that same token, when your parents don't give a shit about that, then they lose interest fast. when your parents are just into making drugs and selling guns, then of course the child is going to learn and observe its surroundings! they fall behind real quick, and by the 6th grade hearing "hey you want to come over and make some REAL money.."

again this isn't making excuses...this is just plain reality. again...just a hint of understanding.


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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OfflineSpecialEd
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Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: kaiowas]
    #2638228 - 05/04/04 08:44 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

It sounds like you don't really view these people with respect since you don't expect them to think for themselves. Just because you grow up in such an environment doesn't mean you can't realize it's fucking stupid.

I dislike their perspective like I dislike any killers perspective, regardless of how novel suburbanites find it.


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Invisiblekaiowas
mndfrayze'speppet urme
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Registered: 07/14/03
Posts: 5,498
Loc: oz
Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: SpecialEd]
    #2638299 - 05/04/04 09:06 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

I'm glad you disagree, but again I wasn't asking for agreement or disagreement, as I stated in the first paragraph of my first post

" I'm not asking you to understand, agree or disagree, but rather just know."

so...what's your point?? you disagree....great...now what?


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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OfflineSpecialEd
+ one

Registered: 01/30/03
Posts: 6,220
Loc: : Gringo
Last seen: 1 year, 11 months
Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: kaiowas]
    #2642169 - 05/05/04 05:32 PM (12 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

so...what's your point?? you disagree....great...now what?




A good start:

Stop giving people like this a platform!


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Invisiblekaiowas
mndfrayze'speppet urme
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Registered: 07/14/03
Posts: 5,498
Loc: oz
Re: interview with O.G's and their philosophy [Re: SpecialEd]
    #2644644 - 05/06/04 10:23 AM (12 years, 10 months ago)

maybe you should actually  read what I typed.


and if you did, your comprehension skills need improving.  :rockon:


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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