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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: ShroomerInTheRye]
    #26653757 - 05/06/20 07:57 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

That's true too...


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: Enlil]
    #26653771 - 05/06/20 08:04 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
It doesn't anymore than Pelosi ripping trumps speech took away his ability to speak freely. All I can delete is a copy of your post.  You still posted it.



Trump had NO SPEECH censored/taken away when Pelosi ripped up his papers.  He got the word out, everybody saw it, and everybody can still see it.


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I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

Edited by Falcon91Wolvrn03 (05/06/20 08:29 PM)

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Offlinemeltdowner
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #26653773 - 05/06/20 08:06 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
I also said:

Quote:

Enlil said:
If anyone wants to read your post, the Shroomery copies that post off of the hard drive and sends it to that person.  That's Shroomery's speech as well as yours. 




Quote:


Every time your post is sent to someone, Shroomery actively has to republish it.  That is speech. 




Quote:

(speaking of people distributing flyers written by Tony Alamo) The people doing that were using their first amendment right to free speech to distribute content written by Tony Alamo. 

That's no different from what this site does with your posts.  It distributes those posts as an expression of its right to free speech.




Quote:

Enlil said:
So, do you or do you not agree that Shroomery distributing your posts is an exercise of Shroomery's right to free speech?




Quote:

Enlil said:
I disagree, but look at it this way. your post, and 100 people read it,  shroomery just used its freedom of speech 100 times.




And many other things that made it clear that republishing your content is the site's speech.




1) Shroomery is nothing more than a computer, owned my someone else, that allows to share their thoughts.

2) You do not "publish" anything, shroomery is a forum.

3) Shroomery is not an entity, it has no thoughts, it's a website that shares other people's thoughts.

You are not a website, Enlil, no matter how hard you try you'll always be human.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: meltdowner] * 1
    #26653781 - 05/06/20 08:11 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

You should look up words before you try to use them or criticize how others use them.


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Offlinemeltdowner
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: ShroomerInTheRye]
    #26653783 - 05/06/20 08:11 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

ShroomerInTheRye said:
It doesn't though because the right of free speech is not afforded to you by a website.  It is afforded to you by the government.  You can't lose what you didn't have in the first place.




A website hosted in America under the laws of that government... duh.


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Offlinemeltdowner
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: Enlil]
    #26653784 - 05/06/20 08:12 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
You should look up words before you try to use them or criticize how others use them.




I'm not criticizing you, I'm just showing you that you are wrong.  Take your own advice.


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InvisibleShroomerInTheRye
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: meltdowner]
    #26653790 - 05/06/20 08:13 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

:picard:

The Shroomery isn't the government, they are a private actor.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: meltdowner]
    #26653797 - 05/06/20 08:17 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

I'm not.  Every time a post is sent to your computer by this site, that's called publishing.


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Offlinemeltdowner
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: ShroomerInTheRye]
    #26653823 - 05/06/20 08:34 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
I'm not.  Every time a post is sent to your computer by this site, that's called publishing.




No, no it is not.
Quote:

ShroomerInTheRye said:
:picard:

The Shroomery isn't the government, they are a private actor.




Yes a private actor who resides in the USA which has to obey American laws.


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InvisibleShroomerInTheRye
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: meltdowner]
    #26653854 - 05/06/20 08:47 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Nowhere in the first Amendment does it say the Shroomery provides free speech.  All it says is the government can't censor you or your beliefs.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: Enlil]
    #26653882 - 05/06/20 09:03 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
No one said anything about assault, and you're already not allowed in many places based on beliefs.  That has nothing to do with speech though.

If I came by your house and dropped off 1000 flyers for an "ovidhunter is a fag" rally, should you be forced to go hand those out to people?  If you don't hand them out, you're censoring me, right?  If you throw those flyers away instead of handing them out, you've just silenced me, right?

That's your basic argument.






This reply is risky in that I know there are multiple more pages of posts ITT so this may have been covered but many bars, etc. already disallow hats, bandannas, leathers w/ patches, or anything that could be construed as gang colors.  I don't see why MAGA colors would be any different under the law.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: ballsalsa] * 1
    #26653889 - 05/06/20 09:06 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

Yes,  bars can ban people from wearing whatever.


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InvisibleballsalsaMDiscord
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 2
    #26653898 - 05/06/20 09:15 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Right, but you consistently ignored that removing my speach takes away from MY ability to speak freely.  I believe MagicMush is saying it was never mine to begin with (I don't know if that's true or not, but IF true, then I wouldn't be losing my ability to speak freely).




The speech is yours right up until you post it.  When you post it, you are essentially giving that speech away to the site to do with as it pleases.  Because the message board has the specific function of conveying speech users have an expectation that their speech will be published faithfully and accurately and this is most often in the best interest of the site as well.  Sometimes the interests of the site as a whole outweigh the value of publishing every single post accurately in perpetuity.  Some posts, as an example, break site rules in such a way as to legally jeopardize the very existence of the shroomery.  Obviously, the mods and admins have a duty to censor such speech.


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InvisibleMagicMush123
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #26653914 - 05/06/20 09:27 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

Or maybe think of the shroomery as a magazine and you're the author. Fal is the author and the shroomery is the publisher.  When you submit an article to a magazine it gets proof read and published, and your article is in their magazine. Its your words but their magazine. They make sure to credit the author for the reader knows who actually spoke it. Since a magazine's publishing is their words if they didn't credit the original speaker they'd get sued for plagiarism or whatever.
Just as when you post the shroomery has to actively publish your words for the reader can see it. They just automated the process due to the sheer volume of posts and decide to edit posts after they're published after someone reports the content.
Its the same as with an article in a magazine. You author a post and the shroomery published it under your account for people know that you personally said it. Its a fucked up situation where your words are really your words but at the same time they are not because they(the website) are the ones who actually did the leg work for someone can see the picture you posted of yourself or whatever was on your mind. Which is why Facebook etc, wrote in your agreement that whatever you post belongs to them. Thats why you cant permanently delete your pics. They keep every picture you posted in their database because once you post it, they re-post it for you under your account and they now own it. Which why i dont use any of those sites, i don't agree with how they'll use my information

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InvisibleMagicMush123
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #26653924 - 05/06/20 09:37 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

But fal has important point tho enlil. If the government orders lockdown and all online platforms are private so therefore are censored, and you're unable to go on public property to exercise your right to free speech to get your message out. What possible avenue could you take? How could you exercise that right if say, you thought the lockdown was unjustified and you thought it should be rescinded, but you couldn't pass your message a long online or in public through actual speech?

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InvisibleMagicMush123
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: ballsalsa]
    #26653929 - 05/06/20 09:40 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Quote:

Enlil said:
No one said anything about assault, and you're already not allowed in many places based on beliefs.  That has nothing to do with speech though.

If I came by your house and dropped off 1000 flyers for an "ovidhunter is a fag" rally, should you be forced to go hand those out to people?  If you don't hand them out, you're censoring me, right?  If you throw those flyers away instead of handing them out, you've just silenced me, right?

That's your basic argument.






This reply is risky in that I know there are multiple more pages of posts ITT so this may have been covered but many bars, etc. already disallow hats, bandannas, leathers w/ patches, or anything that could be construed as gang colors.  I don't see why MAGA colors would be any different under the law.



There was a bar that banned maga gear, and correct me if im wrong but im pretty sure a judge upheld that

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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: MagicMush123] * 1
    #26654022 - 05/06/20 10:49 PM (4 years, 12 days ago)

Quote:

MagicMush123 said:
But fal has important point tho enlil. If the government orders lockdown and all online platforms are private so therefore are censored, and you're unable to go on public property to exercise your right to free speech to get your message out. What possible avenue could you take? How could you exercise that right if say, you thought the lockdown was unjustified and you thought it should be rescinded, but you couldn't pass your message a long online or in public through actual speech?




So make a website.  Or find a website that will allow your speech.  Or put a sign on your house. 

How does an inmate in jail exercise his right to free speech?  The government can't abridge speech (with some exceptions), but that doesn't mean the government can't take other actions for other reasons that may indeed have an affect on speech.  Same for religion.  The government can't prohibit your religion, but if your religion includes human sacrifice, and murder is illegal, sorry, bro...you aren't going to be practicing that ritual.

Besides, and this is an important piece that a lot of people on this site seem to miss about ALL of the rights in the bill of rights, even if an activity is constitutionally protected.  The government can still pass laws that infringe on those rights if there is a compelling government interest and the law is narrowly tailored to that interest.


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OfflineBrian Jones
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: Enlil]
    #26784785 - 06/26/20 01:28 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/newreply.php?Cat=0&Board=14&Number=26654022&page=0&what=showflat&fpart=52&vc=1&replystamp=1593199338

Remington is filing for bankruptcy for the second time in two years, and get this, they are negotiating in hopes of being taken over by The Navajo Nation.

John Wayne is rolling around in his grave.


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Offlinekoods
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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: meltdowner]
    #26785013 - 06/26/20 02:59 PM (3 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

meltdowner said:
Quote:

ShroomerInTheRye said:
It doesn't though because the right of free speech is not afforded to you by a website.  It is afforded to you by the government.  You can't lose what you didn't have in the first place.




A website hosted in America under the laws of that government... duh.




The government cannot infringe on the free speech rights of a website, including the right to limit speech of its users. Those are the laws governing America.


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Re: The second amendment is not compatible with the Democratic party. [Re: koods]
    #26791840 - 06/29/20 10:57 AM (3 years, 10 months ago)



And people wonder why gun rights are slowly getting chipped away.


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