Amanita86 said:

Hey man, what you’re describing is exactly what I was getting when having pretty severe alcohol withdrawls (it was bad I was having seizures).  Even the timeline matches up.  I’d get all my fuckery during the waking up process.  I don’t think that was because it was the longest period between drinks I think it was because of the actual process of my brain waking up.  Some sort of switch it was making from sleep to awake.

Looking at what goes on there it’s deregulated gaba so I thought I’d throw out there that you may have damaged or severely thrown the balance of all that out of wack.  I know absolutely nothing about the inner workings of 4-ho-dmt.  As far as kratom, when I take too much I get the shakes pretty bad so I’ve suspected for awhile now that it may play with gaba somehow but I haven’t looked it up, I just try not to take so much.

I’ve tried a few things that affect gaba when it wasn’t balanced but everything I came up with always eventually caused more problems than it helped so I’m out of ideas on that one.  So, that may give you an idea of where to look, but as far as a fix a doctor will know better.

For what it’s worth though I feel your pain man(I think).  I’ve not met too many people who can grasp what it’s like going through all that and what comes with it etc.  Keep us posted on how things are going and if I come across anything I’ll let you know..

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Hey,

Thanks for the nice reply : )

Yeah I agree, it's probably due to the stages of sleep rather than the duration of abstinence.
I'm glad you're better now though.


Yeah, GABA seems to suppress seizures and the lack of it (due to downregulating your GABA receptors by taking a GABAergic drug and then rapidly stopping) seems to cause seizures and a lot of nasty shit.

I have not noticed any help or hindrance caused by alcohol, however I did take 600mg of gabapentin and that seemed to diminish the sleep problems.

4-HO-MET is seemingly just a pure serotonergic psychedelic just like most tryptamines, but no one really knows, they can just guess, I guess.
I may be wrong, there may have been scientific studies into the receptors affected by 4-HO-MET, but I doubt it.

It's also worth noting that I had taken some kratom 1 or 2 hours before taking the psychedelic.

I've done plenty of research into the possible conflict between psychedelics and kratom, and I came to the conclusion that the worst outcome is that the kratom will dull the trip slightly.

Sure enough, I have taken shrooms on kratom in the past and, although the visuals were unchanged, the lovely familiar shroom headspace was all but gone.


Ahh yes the hideous kratom overdose.
I used to love white and green kratom but lately I've been finding it just stimulates me too much so I prefer reds now, even in the morning.

In the case of taking too much, especially a white strain, it seems to cause pretty violent shaking (not so much violent, but severe, I'd say), dizziness, dysphoria and just a yucky feeling.
Kind of like the feeling I got when I made tobacco tea
Personally I suspect these effects might have something to do with the serotonin effects of kratom, as I've found antidepressants and serotonergics like kanna also give me that "washed-out" feeling.
Kind of like the colour has faded or has been taken out of everything (metaphorically).

You probably know exactly what I mean, that's what's awesome about people like us having such conversations, we always know what eachother is talking about :P


Anyway sorry I got carried away there (just took some kratom, go figure)


It's unfortunate that GABA drugs are some of the most dangerous out there
I don't have any benzos on hand unfortunately, or perhaps it's a good thing as they might help a lot and I might be tempted to keep using them.

If I had access to unlimited amounts of gabapentin I would probably take it, but then again even before these sleep problems I still wouldn't say no to gabapentin, it's a lovely anxiolytic (and I've tried almost every drug that might help anxiety, gabapentin is the only non-opioid that I don't hate)


I have been off of morphine for about 50 days, taking only kratom, so obviously my opiate tolerance should be at zero by now, and the acute withdrawal stage should be well and truly done.

That in mind, I took around 50mg of morphine (in the form of poppy tea) a few days ago (just for scientific purposes, of course, wink wink), and as I said in the first post, it cured the sleep problems entirely.
I took that dose three days in a row (I had officially run out of pods but I managed to find 30g by sieving the little pieces of pod out of the trash bags of seeds I have lol) and for those three days I was free of sleep paralysis or anything nasty.


I also think it's a little bit psychosomatic, as sometimes the paralysis occurs within seconds of my thinking "oh, I haven't had any paralysis yet tonight..."


Thank you my friend.
Yeah, I don't want to sound like a baby so I tend to downplay it a bit, even to myself, but the whole bad trip was far more traumatic than I had ever imagined the worst trip could be.

The memory of it is actually even scarier now that some time has passed.
I hate to say it as it sounds cliched but I feel violated. Lol.
It's like that "rapey" feeling some people report during trips; I didn't understand it until now.

I remember being grabbed and manhandled by lots of invisible hands; It was very personal and invasive somehow; And then I was actually manhandled out of my friend's flatmate's room, so that didn't help.
When he was pushing me out of his room I literally clung on to the doorframe with both hands, I only remembered that recently.


And I remember a hallucination of a person who looked like A but wasn't (A was at the other side of the room saying the same things over and over).
The hallucination was unbearably ugly in some manner, not in appearance but the whole thing.
He sort of represented the worst of humanity.
He was aggressive, impatient, intolerant, ignorant, etc, and the conversations I had with this hallucination are how I got this impression of his personality.


And then there was the bit when I walked out of A's flat.

I have to emphasise how the whole thing was characterized by a lot of physical pain; Being manhandled by demons, being pushed out of the room, smashing glass in my hands, punching solid objects, etc.

I remember, as I said in the trip report, there was a point where I felt like I was being tortured in some hideous manner only possible in Hell.
With metal objects shoved in various places, metal hooks stuck in my body, horrible things stuck down my throat, blood everywhere, a horrible ripping pain.

And I was sort of aware at this time, so I was like, shit, this is real, I've ended up in Hell for all my bad deeds, and this is it, there's no bargaining out of it, I'm stuck here in unimaginable pain forever.

I felt so helpless, I couldn't move, etc, I thought this was gonna be it for eternity.


Also another thing is that the places I went to were not nice; And the trip just emphasised it, but that part was real.

Everything was metal and concrete.
It was dark, and cold, and everywhere was dark, doors were locked shut, no one helped me, they just walked around, all hard concrete surfaces, I don't remember seeing a single tree.

And this was the way it was in the city, I've always disliked that sort of urban Hell but this just showed me how awful it is.

I can't help but wonder if, had I seen a single tree to remind me I wasn't in Hell, that I would be in a totally different place right now :P



From a psychological perspective (and I'm no expert in psychology), I'd say part of the sleep problems stem from my new found fear of death or similar states.

When I woke up in hospital I was infinitely relieved to be alive, and I was suddenly terrified of death, or anything that might cause loss of ego.

I guess I'm like one of those people who take a psychedelic and their ego comes back stronger than ever, haha.

Either way, I feel a lot lighter as a result of it, I guess you could call it an afterglow, the joy of simply being alive is still present after the trip.


And sleep is another form of losing the ego, so maybe I'm subconsciously just trying too hard to hang on. IDK.

Anyway this is what kratom does, makes me type endless nonsense


Thanks again for replying; Any suggestions are much appreciated, and so too is the feeling of having someone to relate to.

Take care.

PoisonousLookalike said:

Nor am I withdrawing from anything. I quit a daily morphine habit (also about a month ago) and switched to kratom, but I don't think that is relevant as opiate withdrawals don't cause this kind of shit as far as I know, and anyway, the withdrawals are long gone.

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TekLogiX said:

PoisonousLookalike said:

Nor am I withdrawing from anything. I quit a daily morphine habit (also about a month ago) and switched to kratom, but I don't think that is relevant as opiate withdrawals don't cause this kind of shit as far as I know, and anyway, the withdrawals are long gone.

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I quit Kratom cold turkey 3 weeks ago, after a multi-year moderate daily habit.  The withdrawals from Kratom are no joke, don't let anyone tell you differently either.  It's not like coffee, blah blah...  You've simply just delayed the morphine withdrawal by using another opiate...Kratom.  You will have to pay the piper when you stop Kratom.  It's doable and not too terrible, I've had experience with various opiates going back over a decade. 

I too bought into the BS about Kratom being a safe alternative, etc.  It's propaganda I hate to say.  Hell, back in 2012 I sold hundreds of kilos of the stuff and believed it was harmless as well.  It's lowered my testerstone, made my hair thin drastically, killed my sex drive and killed my emotions.

Tread carefully friend

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