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I seriously don't get it.
    #26011093 -

Soaking WBS 24hours
PC'ing 2 hours at 19psi (I'm at 10k feet)
knocking jars In SAB from Agar that looks great.

Green mold

Same methods
syringe Knock inside SAB

Green mold (yes I know this isn't the proper way to do things)

previous to my move my grows were great.  never short of 5 bulk tubs maybe 1 out of a group would go bad.

in the last year now I've only been able to get 2 tubs to grow out of probably 50+ that I've attempted.

everyone say's... its your seed its your seed.. well what do I try now??  cause I've tried everything that has been suggested to me on the forums.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011102 -

Are you making at least one transfer from agar?


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.-Non sibi sed patriae-.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: MechaLegend]
    #26011137 -

Multispore or LC?


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Question everything, it's very responsive.
culture storage

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011141 -

I'm guessing your increased pressure isn't enough to compensate for the change in altitude. Easiest test I can think of is running a few jars without inoculating them and seeing if they still trich out.

How many transfers are you doing prior to inoculating your grain?

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Psilo_citizen]
    #26011143 -

Pics of agar and grain would help. You could always do mini monos to diversify your risk.


--------------------
"That you are hereβ€”that life exists, and identity;
That the powerful play goes on, and you will contribute a verse.”
― Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass
:acidfire::tmckenna:

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Psilo_citizen] * 2
    #26011145 -

Psilo_citizen said:
I'm guessing your increased pressure isn't enough to compensate for the change in altitude. Easiest test I can think of is running a few jars without inoculating them and seeing if they still trich out.

How many transfers are you doing prior to inoculating your grain?


"Easiest test I can think of is running a few jars without inoculating them and seeing if they still trich out.":rollsafe:


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Question everything, it's very responsive.
culture storage

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: MechaLegend]
    #26011155 -

MechaLegend said:
Are you making at least one transfer from agar?



agar is 3 if not 4 transfers before applying to grains


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011165 -

Actually alot of people will drip to grain after one transfer I have even dropped wiped plates to grain after I transfer a wedge ..


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Psilo_citizen]
    #26011171 -

i should know what this means but i get lost in all the abbreviations for things on the forum...


I adjusted my PC pressure accord to a couple of people on the forums who helped me do the math.  i've even tried going up to 2.5 hours and same result
as far as letting jars sit without anything. i've done this and nothing happens. jars just sit and seed dries out.

here are my last couple of agar pics.  they sat a little longer than i wanted them too cause i had to go out of town but this is after the 4th transfer.






My agar grows great most of the time. I'm using Pasty Whites agar tek with glass ball jars.  i usually knock 5 to 10 and end up with 2-3 that look good then i transfer 3-4 times depending from the "good" looking myc.  all the growth is "crawly" and clean no "rings" or anything.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011178 -

Are those your transfer wedges ? If so those are huge Haha.. we shoot for a wedge the size of a grain of rice


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Boogieman47]
    #26011185 -

ya its hard to do small ones with teh ball mini jars cause of how deep they are.  does that matter though?  if im transferring until i see clean growth wouldn't that be the same?


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011189 -

Small transfers, mean less area for a contam spore to stick on.

I dont like that growth either. Anything that doesn't follow the regular mycelium organization is a red flag.


--------------------
"That you are hereβ€”that life exists, and identity;
That the powerful play goes on, and you will contribute a verse.”
― Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass
:acidfire::tmckenna:

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011191 -

and 2ndly when this all worked great for me (before i moved) i did straightening syringe knocks.  never did agar till now and never had any MAJOR issues... this on the other hand is insane.  it seems not matter what i do i get mold.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011198 -

It's just your technique .. you need to work on your transfers stop using ball jars to do agar .. if you have pasty plates use those and make smaller transfers ..

If you use spore solution on agar use one or 2 drops on a plate .. but only one in each spot


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Boogieman47]
    #26011210 -

What's your SAB design like? What's your personal technique, what steps you take to open your ball agar jars and slice the wedge and inoculate the next plate? You wear gloves? Use ISO? Got a torch? What's the size of SAB? HAve a proper scalpel?



Have you run any controls where you don't touch them whatsoever after a PC cycle to see if your jars are still contaminating (if those contaminate, could help pointing towards issue during sterilization like maybe PC isn't reaching the proper PSI, nd issues are unrelated to your incoculant)


Depth of agar plate shouldn't really make much difference in the size of the wedge you can cut. Sure the depth/thickness of it will always be the thickness of the plate but you can even do some slight scalpel moves and slice only the top half of the agar plate wedge off, leaving half the thickness behind. Aim for a grain of rice sized or smaller as mentioned earlier.


With smaller wedges taken from leading edges that you can visually inspect and know have healthy mycelium, you are more likely to be transferring just mycelium and leaving the nasties behind. That's what you want. I wouldn't give up on agar just cause you're having issues, it might seem cumbersome or tricky or a pain in the ass but you need to improve technique and agar will make you very happy. Saves a lot of hassle and money being able to do agar right.

Those plates do look funky to me, but there is good growth there. Try to grab a small ass wedge and make transfer but I would also get some spores germinating on agar again if I were you, just in case you can't get that cleaned up

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Nichrome]
    #26011215 -

Nichrome said:
Psilo_citizen said:
I'm guessing your increased pressure isn't enough to compensate for the change in altitude. Easiest test I can think of is running a few jars without inoculating them and seeing if they still trich out.

How many transfers are you doing prior to inoculating your grain?


"Easiest test I can think of is running a few jars without inoculating them and seeing if they still trich out.":rollsafe:



Didn't see this post. Yes. Controls are your friend OP.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #26011218 -

I just meant try not to transfer the entire donor plate Haha.. well put sh4dows


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011223 -

Im with those saying it's your agar technique. Those jars don't look like anything id even consider putting to grain. Switch to containers that are easier for you to work with(mini rounds and pp5 deli cups are the most popular as far as im concerned) and take MUCH smaller transfers earlier on.


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"I members.... do you members"
Memberberries circa 2016


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Psilo_citizen]
    #26011230 -

Actual petri dishes are cheap. I got 500 for around 80 bucks.


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Question everything, it's very responsive.
culture storage

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #26011490 -

sh4d0ws said:
What's your SAB design like? What's your personal technique, what steps you take to open your ball agar jars and slice the wedge and inoculate the next plate? You wear gloves? Use ISO? Got a torch? What's the size of SAB? HAve a proper scalpel?



Have you run any controls where you don't touch them whatsoever after a PC cycle to see if your jars are still contaminating (if those contaminate, could help pointing towards issue during sterilization like maybe PC isn't reaching the proper PSI, nd issues are unrelated to your incoculant)


Depth of agar plate shouldn't really make much difference in the size of the wedge you can cut. Sure the depth/thickness of it will always be the thickness of the plate but you can even do some slight scalpel moves and slice only the top half of the agar plate wedge off, leaving half the thickness behind. Aim for a grain of rice sized or smaller as mentioned earlier.


With smaller wedges taken from leading edges that you can visually inspect and know have healthy mycelium, you are more likely to be transferring just mycelium and leaving the nasties behind. That's what you want. I wouldn't give up on agar just cause you're having issues, it might seem cumbersome or tricky or a pain in the ass but you need to improve technique and agar will make you very happy. Saves a lot of hassle and money being able to do agar right.

Those plates do look funky to me, but there is good growth there. Try to grab a small ass wedge and make transfer but I would also get some spores germinating on agar again if I were you, just in case you can't get that cleaned up


OK so as stated in the first thing i posted.  this is NOT my first rodeo. I've been at this for over 5 years now and have had VERY successful grows...
SO,
gloves, SAB (big tub with holes cut Bodhi's tek), torch, exacto knife, yes i use the torch on every scalpel between anything im working with along with wiping it with alcohol after torched and letting git sit in alcohol after using it (watch bodhi's videos)

transfers are simple, put 4 jars into sab, loosen lids but not remove, open agar cut wedges.  remove wedge (after torch and alcohol wipe) then lift lid and drop wedge in. 

i got better grows knocking straight from syringes in ALL my previous grows up until now.

so what changed?

the altitude. i went from 5 to 10k feet.  so i have to adjust my PC temp to make up the difference.
Is 19psi for 2 hours not long enough?  according to a few mathematicians on here that's what i should be doing.  if anyone thinks im not going long enough then please break out the math and let me know im open to ANY suggestions.

I knocked with staring syringes the last go around alone side my Agar and got the same result, i did this just to try it out cause i was so successful with it previously.

what im not understanding about the agar is that what im transferring looks great.  has the crawly growth etc.. even these looked like that before becoming overgrown after sitting too long.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions] * 1
    #26011525 -

You shouldn't wipe your exacto after flaming it.

The torch sterilizes it. No need for wipe.


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JJ

Draw unto others as they have been drawn to you.... WSP

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011530 -

:whathesaid: Cool the blade in the adjacent agar before cutting the wedge.

You may have a higher spore load in the new space and the nasty could be crashing the party during inoculation. You could try making some grain petri’s with about 1/4 inch of grains in the bottom of wide mouth pints or pint ziplocks. Drop a wedge/ms solution in the middle and let it grow out without shaking. If satellite growth pops up anywhere else, you’ll know the contam is coming in when you are introducing the myc.


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LAGM 2.022

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: ttching8475]
    #26011562 -

and another thing.  I tried to do a tek exactly how a close friend is doing it (he came an helped) we did it step by step exactly the same wya he does it and did it 3 days before me.  he got 7 successful tubs and I got mold in jars.

AND he knocks straight from syringes. no agar.  so this is all very confusing to me.  I can't seem to find anyone to give me definitive answers. only guesses and opinions and even after doing what the opinions and guess are I get the same result... can my ENTIRE room be contaminated? (no one answered that)


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011564 -

No it's the way you are doing things ... those plates you have are funky but you also are using a huge wedge to transfer.. we dont know how your grain prep is .. if you're using a still air box flow hood .. how you sterilize your tools ect.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Boogieman47]
    #26011571 -

Boogieman47 said:
No it's the way you are doing things ... those plates you have are funky but you also are using a huge wedge to transfer.. we dont know how your grain prep is .. if you're using a still air box flow hood .. how you sterilize your tools ect.


I covered all this already.... read the thread


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011578 -

Try doing agar with something other than mason jars for starters.


--------------------
Everything you need in one spot.

My Q&A thread. Ask me questions here rather than in Private Message
Bod's chat thread

5g a day keeps the 5g away

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011581 -

Only thing I can tell you is get you agar looking cleaner ... be extra clean and sterile .. things will get better .. if you want to use straight spores to grain no one is stopping you ... at all


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26011612 -

bodhisatta said:
Try doing agar with something other than mason jars for starters.


They’re not pint jars Bod.  I’m using pasty whites agar Tek. But instead of the plastic small containers I use the ball glass version. Same size etc just glass instead of plastic.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011617 -

Take a pic of what they look like cause they shouldn't be that hard to cut a piece of rice out of the agar


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011635 -

If you wipe with alcohol AFTER torching it, it's sanitised, not sterilised

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: UncleHoyphae]
    #26011648 -

I thought your cultures looked a bit iffy....could just be the size and placement of the xfers but could definitely look more uniform.  As mentioned, try grabbing smaller samples and place them in the center of the receiving plate.  Also, what’s the filter setup on your spawn jars?


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πŸ…‚πŸ„ΈπŸ„ΆπŸ„ΌπŸ„°


Helpful Threads
stonesun
Mycolorado’s Tamp Fruit Project
Tampanensis Grow with Mycolorado
bw86's Jalisco Grow

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Mycolorado]
    #26011669 -

EDIT: Apparently I missed the whole 2nd page of the conversation...  :foreheadslap:  My bad, Ignore

Quote:
wiping it with alcohol after torched


This is bad, you just unsterilized your sterile blade by sanitizing it. Look up the difference between sterile and sanitize. And because you use such large pieces of agar, even though it looks clean, it might be hiding contams in the disorganized growth. Use smaller wedges and wait for clean and organized growth to be sure.


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First Grow

Edited by Raccoon (05/24/19 08:08 PM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Raccoon]
    #26011679 -

Raccoon said:
EDIT: Apparently I missed the whole 2nd page of the conversation...  :foreheadslap:  My bad, Ignore

Quote:
wiping it with alcohol after torched


This is bad, you just unsterilized your sterile blade by sanitizing it. Look up the difference between sterile and sanitize. And because you use such large pieces of agar, even though it looks clean, it might be hiding contams in the disorganized growth. Use smaller wedges and wait for clean and organized growth to be sure.


Ok that makes sense.  I honestly didn’t know that (lesson learned) I’ll be knocking new agar tonight and I’ll start a new thread for a step by step for people to watch.

Can anyone tell me if PC’ing at 19PSI for 2hours is enough for sterilization at 10k feet?

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011699 -

10kVisions said:
bodhisatta said:
Try doing agar with something other than mason jars for starters.


They’re not pint jars Bod.  I’m using pasty whites agar Tek. But instead of the plastic small containers I use the ball glass version. Same size etc just glass instead of plastic.


yea I know.

19 for 2 should be just fine at 10k


--------------------
Everything you need in one spot.

My Q&A thread. Ask me questions here rather than in Private Message
Bod's chat thread

5g a day keeps the 5g away

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26011843 -

bodhisatta said:
10kVisions said:
bodhisatta said:
Try doing agar with something other than mason jars for starters.


They’re not pint jars Bod.  I’m using pasty whites agar Tek. But instead of the plastic small containers I use the ball glass version. Same size etc just glass instead of plastic.


yea I know.

19 for 2 should be just fine at 10k



Thanks.  Let me ask you this.  How would I reheat an agar bottle with no microwave?  Most people make a bottle, sterilize it and then pour each Petri dish then to re heat they use a microwave. I don’t have a microwave.  I do pasty whites tek because I can make the jars and then sterilize them


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26011860 -

10kVisions said:
bodhisatta said:
10kVisions said:
bodhisatta said:
Try doing agar with something other than mason jars for starters.


They’re not pint jars Bod.  I’m using pasty whites agar Tek. But instead of the plastic small containers I use the ball glass version. Same size etc just glass instead of plastic.


yea I know.

19 for 2 should be just fine at 10k



Thanks.  Let me ask you this.  How would I reheat an agar bottle with no microwave?  Most people make a bottle, sterilize it and then pour each Petri dish then to re heat they use a microwave. I don’t have a microwave.  I do pasty whites tek because I can make the jars and then sterilize them


Hot water bath on the stove

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: UncleHoyphae]
    #26011899 -

UncleHoyphae said:
Hot water bath on the stove



thats what i was thinking, guess i just need confirmation. thanks


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions] * 1
    #26011941 -

I also agree that you need to be making small transfers. You can pick up a small wedge really easy, just stab it at a 45 degree angle and lift straight up. Like this:


When you are putting it into the receiving plate, cut into the fresh agar and cut through it. This will get the wedge to slide off. Like this:

It's actually stupid easy when you get used to it.

Can I ask if you have pics of the spawn jars before going into tubs?


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contam and car window art
How to shroomery like a pro! (Seriously, everyone read this!)
Improve your sterile techniques! (A comprehensive guide to agar)
Links upon links of literally EVERYTHING UP TO DATE

AMU Q&A
No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Mad Season]
    #26012220 -

do not wipe scalpel with alcohol after torching.

torch->cut wedge->transfer->wipe scalpel alcohol-> repeat

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Mycolorado]
    #26012294 -

:whathesaid:
Mycolorado said:
what’s the filter setup on your spawn jars?



--------------------
πŸ…‚πŸ„ΈπŸ„ΆπŸ„ΌπŸ„°


Helpful Threads
stonesun
Mycolorado’s Tamp Fruit Project
Tampanensis Grow with Mycolorado
bw86's Jalisco Grow

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26012467 -

10kVisions said:
bodhisatta said:
10kVisions said:
bodhisatta said:
Try doing agar with something other than mason jars for starters.


They’re not pint jars Bod.  I’m using pasty whites agar Tek. But instead of the plastic small containers I use the ball glass version. Same size etc just glass instead of plastic.


yea I know.

19 for 2 should be just fine at 10k



Thanks.  Let me ask you this.  How would I reheat an agar bottle with no microwave?  Most people make a bottle, sterilize it and then pour each Petri dish then to re heat they use a microwave. I don’t have a microwave.  I do pasty whites tek because I can make the jars and then sterilize them


Make agar plates the same day you sterilize the agar :shrug: I've melted agar with the microwave at home probably three times ever. I almost always just make plates right after sterilizing the agar so it never has to get re melted.


--------------------
Everything you need in one spot.

My Q&A thread. Ask me questions here rather than in Private Message
Bod's chat thread

5g a day keeps the 5g away

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26012562 -

Quote:
Make agar plates the same day you sterilize the agar :shrug: I've melted agar with the microwave at home probably three times ever. I almost always just make plates right after sterilizing the agar so it never has to get re melted.


ya that's basically what im doing, i make the agar. put into plate, PC the plates.


OK so im going to try something suggested here

i have a bathroom thats barely used in the house so today i'm going to make 4 half full WBS jars.  2 i'll use Poly Fill on and 2 i'll use Micropore tape on.

afer i PC them i'll put 2 of them in the room i built and 2 of them in the Bathroom both temps will be between 68 and 72ΒΊ

i'm going to let them sit un opened un touched and see if anything grows.
does anyone have an idea of how long i'll need to wait before i start to see something?  not that im in a hurry i just like to let things sit un disturbed and check when its needed.

im deteremined to figure this out cause something is definitely going on.

while that is happening im knocking about 20 new plates today in the room i built under a SAB with alcohol cleaned surfaces etc. i'll post a photo of the setup once i get started.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26012566 -

Im suggesting using normal petri dishes to make your time with agar as easy as possible. Do agar in Tupperware once you build skill and dexterity


--------------------
Everything you need in one spot.

My Q&A thread. Ask me questions here rather than in Private Message
Bod's chat thread

5g a day keeps the 5g away

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26012573 -

bodhisatta said:
Im suggesting using normal petri dishes to make your time with agar as easy as possible. Do agar in Tupperware once you build skill and dexterity


ya i got that, the jars aren't plastic Tupperware.  i used his tek but changed that to the glass versions of those same size Tupperware simply cause i know it will be cleaner.  i've had great success with my last 2 agar grows but i think my problem was my wedge cuts where big and i was transferring contams without knowing it.  i'll be ordering Petri dishes this week as well only cause they also just seem easier to work with in general.

i am super curious if there is more than just this as a problem too.  so i'd like to try some stuff suggested on here and see if i can find anything outside of the agar thats causing more issues.

thanks for the advice.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26012580 -

Look at the josex poke method. But im like mad season i just do small transfers


--------------------
Everything you need in one spot.

My Q&A thread. Ask me questions here rather than in Private Message
Bod's chat thread

5g a day keeps the 5g away

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26012664 -

bodhisatta said:
Look at the josex poke method. But im like mad season i just do small transfers


that is an interesting take but i feel i like your tek best honestly. its been the easiest to grasp for me.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26012914 -

OK so here is pics from today.

in the bucket I put 3 jars of WBS.  filled with hot water and straied out all the floaters, then refilled with hot water and will let sit for 24 hours. The purpose here is to test the PC Time and air quality issue.  I will take this seed, make 4 1/2 full jars, 2 with poly fill and 2 with Micropore tape.  Then I will PC them at 19psi for 2 Hours.  when done, I will place one of each jar type in 2 different ares.  1 will be in the room I built specifically for doing this, the other will be in a bathroom that doesn't get used much and will be easy to maintain a good temp in.  None of the jars will be opened, or knocked in anyway. this is PLAIN WBS to see if anything grows that could be considered contams that way I can narrow down my issues.






AGAR:

my tools:


My SAB setup.  I use a plastic bag (new) that I spray with alcohol, then I spray the inside of the SAB with alcohol and place on top of the bag and let sit for 10 min or so.


My Agar out of the PC.  this sat in this room in a box (sealed) over night to cool down to room temp.  room temp is 71ΒΊ


procedure: (gloves warn at ALL times)

heat syringe, cool down with a couple drops into SAB.  then 2 drops into agar, replacing lid when done.
pick up looper, heat red hot, open agar lid, cool looper in agar then spread drops into z formation and close lid this time screwing lid down and placing jar aside (still in SAB)

done and on the shelf



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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26012951 -

Your transfers are waaay to big. How do you hold the plates? They should start upside down but you have to twist off the top making those dumb *redacted other sites name* jars bad for agar. Read through the threads at that fail ass site, lots of "awesome ideas" and "facts" thrown around with no evidence or grow pictures and 90% of threads are open ended due to failure, the OP never reports back. The guy that runs that place uses a tub with a 5 dollar fan and 12 dollar filter as a flow hood, he believes this works.

TLDR-pasty plates work because they are plastic. Look up *Tiger Drop* watch the videos and grow some healthy samples.

**No one ever asked, how long are you PC'ing the agar? If LME agar I would suggest 45 minutes at 19psi at your altitude instead of the standard 25 @ 15.


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

Edited by Professor X (05/25/19 03:41 PM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26013015 -

One piece of mp tape on those lids is a fail.  If your spawn jar lids are set up the same way, they’re no good either.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Mycolorado]
    #26013080 -

Mycolorado said:
One piece of mp tape on those lids is a fail.  If your spawn jar lids are set up the same way, they’re no good either.


True. Micropore has huge un-micro pores. I wouldn't trust it, but I hear it works for other peeps with more layers on grain jars...


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First Grow

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Raccoon]
    #26013097 -

What kind of substraight are u using? U said ur friend had 7 good grows and u just got mold when u did it the exact same way. Maybe your sub is too wet :shrug: That can cause mold as well. But I also agree mold normally means u didn't have clean spawn to begin with. Just something to think about.


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The thing about deceit is, you don't know your being deceived...

The only thing I am sure about is that I know nothing - socrates

Believe nothing you hear and half of what u see.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Raccoon]
    #26013099 -

I use single layer over 1/4" holes, never been a problem. I've never had a failure due to filters. I 100% assure you OP has trich hiding on his agar.


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26013111 -

What's the pore size on micropore tape? They don't say because it's not actually a micropore. See this thread. Seems like luck no contams get in. OP, I'd use more layers or a SFD just until you figure out your issue. Then you can go back to micropore tape to see if it contams again.


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First Grow

Edited by Raccoon (05/25/19 05:40 PM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26013116 -

Like a lot of your advice on here, that’s shit. :shrug:  β€œMicropore” simply means you can’t see the pores with the naked eye.  3M makes no claim of it stopping microbes or other small particles.  If you’re going to try to use it as an effective filter, multiple layers should be used.  A single piece is no good.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Mycolorado]
    #26013120 -

The pores in micropore tape are bigger than cube spores which are pretty big


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26013166 -

I'm really sorry, you guys are right, it must be his shitty filters that are wrecking everything he does for the last 7 attempts and not his culture that he has transferred 4 times in massive chunks from mush zombie jar to mush zombie jar. That has to be the culprit, damn micropore tape.

I use polyfil low loft batting for all of my filters by the way. I have used micropore in the past with no issues simply to debunk the myth that contaminants are sneaky little ninjas. It's an effective filter, I found that multiple layers restrict ge and cause slow progress. This is once again only my experience, maybe you have actual mutant ninja mold where you live.


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26013179 -

I have to tell you, I love how every time I share what works for me I am accused of giving bad advice.

Here's some good advice, any advice given with the attitude that it is the only way it works is bad advice, period.

Sad thing is you guys know where he got that info and are still debating easy bs being the issue. Pastys are plastic.


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

Edited by Professor X (05/25/19 06:22 PM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26013190 -

stonesun said:
Well I didn't measure the the pore sizes,
instead took a piece of tape and mounted it on a slide.
Hydrated some P. cubensis spores and with an inoculation loop
mounted them on the tape.
The gaps are huge comparing to cubensis spores, which are ~12-17Β΅m.
I circled the fibers with individual spores sticked to them.
Sorry for the kinda crappy images, didn't put a whole lotta effort in it...

100X


400X


400X



https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/13642707/fpart/1/vc/1


--------------------
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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26013200 -

Micropore tape pores are bigger than most contams. Make your own judgment on what to use. It seems obvious to me, given that the pores are bigger than mold spores, to choose to just use a superior filter. Why not? It's probably not his issue, but fuck it, eliminate one more variable.


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First Grow

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26013205 -

Also on that same thread he shows toilet paper. Not much better, you should just use toilet paper, OP.

stonesun said:
P. cubensis spores on TP.......:rofldrunk:

40X


100X


400X




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First Grow

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X] * 2
    #26013210 -

That’s bc 9/10 times the advice you give is terrible.  You’ve posted literally ONE picture of your grows and it’s a bunch of shitty cakes iirc....actually, here’s the one pic you’ve posted in your time here:
...bunch of shitty cakes and what appear to be contaminated and ill-performing subs, yet you say you’re getting six flushes.  :facepalm:  Around here one has to put up or shut up.  Stonesun’s pic says it all.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Mycolorado]
    #26013305 -

Mycolorado said:
That’s bc 9/10 times the advice you give is terrible.  You’ve posted literally ONE picture of your grows and it’s a bunch of shitty cakes iirc....actually, here’s the one pic you’ve posted in your time here:
...bunch of shitty cakes and what appear to be contaminated and ill-performing subs, yet you say you’re getting six flushes.  :facepalm:  Around here one has to put up or shut up.  Stonesun’s pic says it all.


He will never post his results.


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.-Non sibi sed patriae-.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: MechaLegend]
    #26013339 -

Hey 10kVisions,Get rid of the microspore tape.
Replace it with masking tape.
Back off the lids a quarter turn on your pc cycle.
Tighten the lids as soon as the pressure is back to zero and cooled down some..

Also make sure your spawn and sub is not to wet.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X] * 1
    #26013356 -

Professor X said:
I use single layer over 1/4" holes, never been a problem. I've never had a failure due to filters. I 100% assure you OP has trich hiding on his agar.



:doublefacepalm:


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #26013417 -

[flash=,]http:/[/flash]There's a picture of a contaminated sub with bacterial spawn. Spit out 2 ounces dry 7 days after spawning. Alas it was bad spawn from popcorn. Multi spore injection.

2 quarts of spawn


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

Edited by Professor X (05/25/19 09:57 PM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26013700 -

what i love the most is how many people chimed in after my photos without reading the previous posts at all... so to al of you asking about things i already answered... please read the thread so i don't have to repeat myself.

... man you people love to argue. 

i've ALWAYS used MP tape. i used Polyfil the first 2 times i did this 6 years ago at my old house 5k feet below where i live now.  never had an issue with MP tape... so what changed there?  did the altitude affect it some how?  do you have an educated response other than just talking a bunch of shit? lol.  i do see the science side of it etc so thanks to those how chimed with that.

i appreciate those of you who have educated ideas to help and aren't just saying what im doing is "shit" or "fail" etc.  I've had grows... many many many grows... many with very very little to no issues as well. and ALL of them i never used agar.  SO... that being said. now that I'm running into problem after problem... I'm trying everything under the sun to figure out what is going on.  I'm open to try everything that will help narrow my issues down and get me to the bottom again.

p.s. my buddy who taught me uses MP tape.  Syringe knocks straight to WBS, PC'ing (at 9k alt) at 15 PSI for 2 hours.  his last grow yielded 14lbs.  so i have a very hard time listening to people who say these things are a "fail" ... as bodhi and many others on here have stated there's more than one way to skin a cat and some things work for people quite well that don't work for others.  obviously my previous methods aren't working for some random reason so I'm here trying to post and show what I'm doing in order to have the community try and help me narrow it down.

my interest is simply getting my grows back to how they were.  thanks to everyone who is trying to help.  i will make more agar tomorrow and PC it using polyfil. then i will  knock it and set it next to the ones i did today.  that way i can rule out the MP tape issue.


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Edited by 10kVisions (05/26/19 03:15 AM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26013704 -

micelio said:
Hey 10kVisions,Get rid of the microspore tape.
Replace it with masking tape.
Back off the lids a quarter turn on your pc cycle.
Tighten the lids as soon as the pressure is back to zero and cooled down some..

Also make sure your spawn and sub is not to wet.


thanks for the response.  can i ask why masking tape vs. micropore?

my sub straight is never too wet.  at this alt.  its more about how to keep it wet vs it drying out.  we have no oxygen.  Up here keeping this from being dried out is a challenge all in itself.  this is also why i use Bodhi's Unmodified tek. it REALLY helps keep that little extra moisture inside the tub i need fro this altitude.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Raccoon]
    #26013706 -

Raccoon said:
Micropore tape pores are bigger than most contams. Make your own judgment on what to use. It seems obvious to me, given that the pores are bigger than mold spores, to choose to just use a superior filter. Why not? It's probably not his issue, but fuck it, eliminate one more variable.



this is good advice and thanks for the follow up with the photos. as i stated i never had any issued with MP tape previously but honestly i don't even care i just want to fix the problems lol.  like i said I'm going to do a new set of agar tomorrow with polyfil and see if that changes things.
thanks for the response.
cheers


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions] * 2
    #26013766 -

Just because something wasn't a problem before doesnt mean it can not be a problem now.

Mp by itself is a shit filter. Period. So is masking tape(lolwut) If I were having contamination issues first thing I'd do is check my filters, my inoculate, then my grain prep. That's why people said to try a different filter/use agar ect..

If you MUST USE MP TAPE as a filter use 3 or 4 layers.

I've used tyvek and 2 layers of mp tape for years but just mp tape is asking for trouble.

Edit: do you vent your PC? Your sab holes are kinda small fyi. Syringe to grains is like wacking it too playboy. Worked for lots if us when we were younger but now we need that hardcore fart porn to achieve desired results(agar)


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:hypnotoad:
Making Liquid Culture :  Go insane with LC
Mushboy likes these teks : Making shroom tea
Dank Education

Edited by mushboy (05/26/19 05:38 AM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: mushboy]
    #26013823 -

mushboy said:
Just because something wasn't a problem before doesnt mean it can not be a problem now.




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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: bodhisatta]
    #26014012 -

If he had 7 rounds of grain go to the deadly ninja contaminants it would make him the unluckiest son of a gun on this board.


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26014022 -

Nah, it would likely mean he’s doing something wrong. :shrug:  Like using one layer of mp tape allowing mold spores or fragments to get into his cultures, contaminating his scalpel blade by wiping it after flaming or inadvertently introducing contaminants when transferring through poor technique in some way that hasn’t yet been mentioned.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: mushboy]
    #26014097 -

mushboy said:
Just because something wasn't a problem before doesnt mean it can not be a problem now.

Mp by itself is a shit filter. Period. So is masking tape(lolwut) If I were having contamination issues first thing I'd do is check my filters, my inoculate, then my grain prep. That's why people said to try a different filter/use agar ect..

If you MUST USE MP TAPE as a filter use 3 or 4 layers.

I've used tyvek and 2 layers of mp tape for years but just mp tape is asking for trouble.

Edit: do you vent your PC? Your sab holes are kinda small fyi. Syringe to grains is like wacking it too playboy. Worked for lots if us when we were younger but now we need that hardcore fart porn to achieve desired results(agar)



I 100% agree.  thats why I'm sitting here saying tell me what to do ill try anything lol!  nice porn analogy btw ha!  I have a ton of polyfill i can use so I'm going to do another round and try that now.  i follow Bodhi's teks to the letter on PC'ing (purging etc) and using the unmodified tek but the ONLY thing I'm doing different is using the MP Tape and now that we are all discussing it, its definitely pointing that direction 100%.  so, lets do another round and see how this goes.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26014108 -

:rockon:
Post results mang


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:hypnotoad:
Making Liquid Culture :  Go insane with LC
Mushboy likes these teks : Making shroom tea
Dank Education

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26014113 -

Professor X said:
If he had 7 rounds of grain go to the deadly ninja contaminants it would make him the unluckiest son of a gun on this board.


actually i've had more than that lol.  i moved up to the new house in august almost 2 years ago now and have had only 2 tubs (10 jars) grow out of probably 1000 jars i've attempted.  hence why my profile says "annoyed"


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Edited by 10kVisions (05/26/19 10:42 AM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26014154 -

Have you done drop plates in your home? Sounds like an extreme spore load. Excuse me if it's extremely hard to believe that mp tape is giving you a 0.1% success rate. If that is the case it's probably an environmental issue.


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26014166 -

Professor X said:
Have you done drop plates in your home? Sounds like an extreme spore load. Excuse me if it's extremely hard to believe that mp tape is giving you a 0.1% success rate. If that is the case it's probably an environmental issue.



no, ash this time I'm setting up jars that will be un touched with both MP tape and polyfil and I'm going to let them sit in different rooms (one of each) at the same temp and just let them sit un knocked etc and see if anything gows on its own.  again eliminating the possible issues of contained area in general, MP tape issues etc.  I'm also doing new agar as we speak with poly fill to set next to the ones i did yesterday using the EXACT same technics to see what happens too


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26014223 -

I hear you. I have a MP taped popcorn control jar from 3/20, still smells like, well, corn. Popcorn contaminates the fastest too, mess one up and it's 37 colors in 3 days.


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26014239 -

so another thing i would like to point out is that the Pasty White tek for agar calls for MP tape.  hence why i was using it.  following his tek exactly and just adjusting the PC pressure for my alt.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26014264 -

I poke a hole in both sides with a scalpel and cover with mp tape. It's nearly impossible for mold to fall into a tiny hole in a vertical surface.

Sometimes I wonder when the last time the mods went through the sticky teks. "Follow the goddamn tek", "I did", "not that tek, the other one next to it", "StoOpeD nO0bS cNt FoLloW TeKS"


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26014288 -

Professor X said:
Have you done drop plates in your home? Sounds like an extreme spore load. Excuse me if it's extremely hard to believe that mp tape is giving you a 0.1% success rate. If that is the case it's probably an environmental issue.


My 2 cents..
The problem is you'll not visually seeing Trichoderma until It pops up it's ugly head from deep down in your sub...
What I was trying to say earlier is you don't need filters in your jelly jars. You can cover your 1/4" hole on top of your plastic lid with masking tape. Then back off the lid a quarter turn for the pc cycle to equalize the pressure. Tighten the lids after pc run is finish and dishes are still warm. It doesn't get simpler than that. Or you can use your micropore tape for the pc cycle and cover the microspore tape with masking tape. The masking tape is to keep the unwanted green out..
There's plenty of air in your jelly jars, you don't need gas exchange..
Also you may want to consider bringing in some new spore print from a outside source.. I too used micropore tape until I notice mold under the filter hole. More than once..


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26014295 -

ya Im at such a loss at this point that im trying literally anything that might give me results.  no hate, no "UGH WHY" or anything... give me advice, I'll give it a shot lol. I love doing this but man is it frustrating when you run into problems as big as mine.  im really hoping it turns out to be something simple like MP Tape and I can just smack myself and get going again.

and now boys and girls, our best friend! Patience


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions] * 4
    #26014296 -

Step 1: dont listen to prof x
Step 2: change filters
Step 3: review sterile tek
Step 4: grow shrooms.

Easy


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:hypnotoad:
Making Liquid Culture :  Go insane with LC
Mushboy likes these teks : Making shroom tea
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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: mushboy] * 1
    #26014307 -

mushboy said:
Step 1: dont listen to prof x
Step 2: change filters
Step 3: review sterile tek
Step 4: grow shrooms.

Easy


lol nice.

1. thats between you guys
2. working on that as we speak
3. reviewed and following closely
4. fingers crossed!
cheers


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26014685 -

Hey..!
My fingers are also cross for you.. I know the feeling...

There's not many places in the US. where you can live at 10,000 ft.

John Holliday started Aloha Medicinals in Carson City Nv. because of the 6,000 ft. altitude that has ideal climate conditions for growing mushrooms.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26015337 -

10kVisions said:
so another thing i would like to point out is that the Pasty White tek for agar calls for MP tape.  hence why i was using it.  following his tek exactly and just adjusting the PC pressure for my alt.


Pasty plates have an entire sheet of paper towel folded up and placed over the top. Its not mp by itself.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: JHOVA]
    #26016456 -

JHOVA said:
10kVisions said:
so another thing i would like to point out is that the Pasty White tek for agar calls for MP tape.  hence why i was using it.  following his tek exactly and just adjusting the PC pressure for my alt.


Pasty plates have an entire sheet of paper towel folded up and placed over the top. Its not mp by itself.


ya I noticed that.  I always assumed he removed it but upon looking over his tek again I saw that he never removes it.  Once again pointing out the teh MP Tape is becoming more and more likely my issue.

appreciate the input.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26016486 -

UPDATE:


The Agar Setup  and PC.


Purging


PC Temp



Jars PC'd at 19psi for 2 Hours. Plain, no knock.  we'll see if anything grows


Agar using Polyfil instead of MP Tape.  PC'd 19psi for 45 min.  knocked with BHT exactly teh same way I did the set with MP Tape on them.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26016847 -

Good luck, brotha.


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First Grow

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Raccoon]
    #26017170 -

Raccoon said:
Good luck, brotha.


LOL!  thanks!


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26025610 -

UPDATE:

WBS Plain (no knock) jars
so far the jars aren't growing anything both PT and Polyfil jars look the same. so thats good news.  at least i know the PC'ing is doing its job.

Agar
The Polyfil jars are developing faster than the PT jars are for sure. i've seen the same ammout of growth that took 5 days in the PT jars happen in only 2 days in the Poly jars.  agar is the same... technic, PC all that is exactly the same.
Here are the Agar Photos so far.



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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26025671 -

take a pic like this inside your sab. its easier if you have the lid on a cookie rack upside down.


i cant tell if you have contams or not from the pics. :cookiemonster:


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: JHOVA]
    #26025682 -

JHOVA said:
take a pic like this inside your sab. its easier if you have the lid on a cookie rack upside down.


i cant tell if you have contams or not from the pics. :cookiemonster:


good call i'll work on that tomorrow


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions] * 1
    #26026799 -

Those look so fuckin sketch. Doesn't even look like cube myc to me..


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Mad Season]
    #26026804 -

Sure doesn't look like cube myc. It looks like trichoderma. What are you inoculating with? Might want to start completely fresh, new prints.

By the way, waaay too much agar in those dishes. Just barely cover the bottom.

Cube mycelium doesn't grow all weird on agar like that it grows in circle like formations.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions] * 2
    #26026852 -

10kVisions said:
UPDATE:

WBS Plain (no knock) jars
so far the jars aren't growing anything both PT and Polyfil jars look the same. so thats good news.  at least i know the PC'ing is doing its job.

Agar
The Polyfil jars are developing faster than the PT jars are for sure. i've seen the same ammout of growth that took 5 days in the PT jars happen in only 2 days in the Poly jars.  agar is the same... technic, PC all that is exactly the same.
Here are the Agar Photos so far.




I assume These pics are growth for three to four days.
To me It looks like bacteria on green agar.. It's hard to tell for sure what I'm looking at.  Just my 2 cents..

:shrug:


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio] * 1
    #26026906 -

Yeah that is bacteria. There's also molds in there too. Look at pic 3. Sterile tek is obviously lacking here.


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contam and car window art
How to shroomery like a pro! (Seriously, everyone read this!)
Improve your sterile techniques! (A comprehensive guide to agar)
Links upon links of literally EVERYTHING UP TO DATE

AMU Q&A
No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Mad Season]
    #26026963 -

Its too fast to have that much growth. Mycelium grows kinda slow from a tiny wedge.


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πŸ…ƒ πŸ„΄ πŸ„° πŸ„Ό    πŸ„² πŸ„» πŸ„Έ πŸ„½ πŸ„Ά πŸ…† πŸ… πŸ„° πŸ„Ώ

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Mad Season]
    #26026986 -

Good eye on pic. 3 Mad season..
Pic. 1&2 has poly fill filter. Pic. 3&4 Micropore tape.
On pic. 3 the mold spores fell right through the Micropore tape as if it was the Grand Canyon.. If people are going to use Micropore tape on their dishes, I suggest to put each dish into a zip lock sandwich bag while they're hot right out of the pc.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26027111 -

The mold is coming from technique or filters/ innoculant, molds die even at pasteurizing temps.


--------------------
It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor

I'M A MEMBER FIRST, TC WHEN NEEDED AND MOD WHEN I HAVE TO BE !!!

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: cronicr]
    #26027202 -

10kvissions:
It's possible that your poly fill filter and the Micropore tape acted like a wick giving the bacteria a path to contaminate your agar while it was wet/damp from the pc. cycle.
That's why I like synthetic filter disc. cut in quarter size and silicone onto the plastic lids..


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26027220 -

I tried glass jar petri dishes, they are bad. However if you are getting that amount of contamination you may want to look at the innoculant. Are you getting syringes from your buddy, a sponsor, a random vendor? If that's happening from a print I must ask if you are using a utility knife smothered dumpster juice to make transfers. You are certainly dealing with sneaky ninjas or you are doing something completely wrong. Or using syringes full of trichoderma. Or your PC is broken. Have you tried making control blank plates?


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26027224 -

How would a broken PC effect trich problems lol


--------------------
It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor

I'M A MEMBER FIRST, TC WHEN NEEDED AND MOD WHEN I HAVE TO BE !!!

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: cronicr]
    #26027247 -

10kvission said:
UPDATE:

WBS Plain (no knock) jars
so far the jars aren't growing anything both PT and Polyfil jars look the same. so thats good news.  at least i know the PC'ing is doing its job.

Agar
The Polyfil jars are developing faster than the PT jars are for sure. i've seen the same ammout of growth that took 5 days in the PT jars happen in only 2 days in the Poly jars.  agar is the same... technic, PC all that is exactly the same.
Here are the Agar Photos so far.
-------------------------------------------
He did not inoculate those plates...
I assume the dishes where pull out of the pc. and place on a shelf for three to four days.. Now I wonder how did that much bacteria get in every plate?
He did say he was going to do a test run and compare the two different filter types.
Maybe I'm reading it wrong and he did inoculated those dish.


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Edited by micelio (06/01/19 02:15 PM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26031323 -

Professor X said:
Sure doesn't look like cube myc. It looks like trichoderma. What are you inoculating with? Might want to start completely fresh, new prints.

By the way, waaay too much agar in those dishes. Just barely cover the bottom.



that is just covering the bottom.  the jars dome up on the bottom so im just covering enough to cover the middle (top of dome) which means the edges are going to look more full.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26031328 -

micelio said:
10kvission said:
UPDATE:

WBS Plain (no knock) jars
so far the jars aren't growing anything both PT and Polyfil jars look the same. so thats good news.  at least i know the PC'ing is doing its job.

Agar
The Polyfil jars are developing faster than the PT jars are for sure. i've seen the same ammout of growth that took 5 days in the PT jars happen in only 2 days in the Poly jars.  agar is the same... technic, PC all that is exactly the same.
Here are the Agar Photos so far.
-------------------------------------------
He did not inoculate those plates...
I assume the dishes where pull out of the pc. and place on a shelf for three to four days.. Now I wonder how did that much bacteria get in every plate?
He did say he was going to do a test run and compare the two different filter types.
Maybe I'm reading it wrong and he did inoculated those dish.


yes your reading it wrong.  i inoculated all the plates.  i did NOT inoculate the jars.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26031345 -

everyone has such contradicting opinions and this is the issue with this forum.  according to most my step by step process (following pasty white) is perfect.  heat, PC times (adjusted for altitude etc) sterile environments etc... now suddenly after everyone has said "that looks right" "thats teh correct way to do it" now suddenly its wrong.  and this would be another reason for this post.  i really don't get it.

i have myc growth on 2 of the jars.  little hair like growth that is very uniform and nice looking.  both jars have the polyfill.  the PT jars all have the "circle of death" as i like to put it.  its obviously mold.

how is my technic wrong?
i PC for 45 min at 19psi (correct according to quite a few on here including bodhi)
my jars come out and go straight to my SAB siting overnight to cool.
i then use a syringe knock into each jar heating between each pour in each jar, using 2 drops.
use a Loop tool to spread that is soaked in alcohol and also heated between each jar.
lid goes back on and stays in SAB until all jars are complete.
jars then sit on a shelf at a steady 71ΒΊ.  so where did i go wrong?
gloves, warn
arm sleeves, warn
the only thing missing would be a painters mask but my SAB holes are small enough that that shouldn't be an issue.

for the record. the syringes i get from "ralph" for those of you who know then you know he's a trusted source.  I've had syringes from 4 different places and no luck with anything thus far (in  the new house)

the new images in my signature are from my old grows.  forgot i took them.. but its just also nice to have proof that I've done this with NO issues in the past.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26031368 -

I noticed you left some uninoculated grain jars out as a test. Did you leave an uninoculated agar plate as a test? That'd rule out agar prep. Your technique is sounding pretty good. If that truly is sound, then it could be the spore syringe?


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First Grow

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Raccoon]
    #26031377 -


These are the 2 i think have "good" spots in them.  am i wrong?  won't i be able to transfer this away from the bad.  isn't that the point of agar?

the rest all look like shit.  they smell like dirty feet too.  never smelt that before. i have now tossed all jars except the 2 i think are worth keeping.



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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26031389 -

Try to transfer. It looks pretty bad though... Good luck.

One thing I just thought of, you're using too much solution. Don't squirt directly into the jar. Flame the needle and inoculation loop, squirt some on the sab floor to cool the needle, squirt some on the loop to cool the loop, then squirt a bit more to load the loop with less than one drop, streak the plate, call it a day. You'll have much less bacteria and myc, which will be easier to separate.


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First Grow

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions] * 1
    #26031390 -

I wouldn't trust those. Doesn't look like myc to me. Obviously there's tons of bacteria too. You need better innoculant man. Hella dirty.


--------------------
contam and car window art
How to shroomery like a pro! (Seriously, everyone read this!)
Improve your sterile techniques! (A comprehensive guide to agar)
Links upon links of literally EVERYTHING UP TO DATE

AMU Q&A
No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Mad Season]
    #26031397 -

Raccoon said:
Try to transfer. It looks pretty bad though... Good luck.

One thing I just thought of, you're using too much solution. Don't squirt directly into the jar. Flame the needle and inoculation loop, squirt some on the sab floor to cool the needle, squirt some on the loop to cool the loop, then squirt a bit more to load the loop with less than one drop, streak the plate, call it a day. You'll have much less bacteria and myc, which will be easier to separate.


ok thats interesting.  haven't read that technic.  i am heating both loop and needle and i am squirting out a few drop into the sab to cool the needle but all teh teks say place a drop or 2 onto the agar and to use the loop (after cooling in agar) to spread those drops.

Mad Season said:
I wouldn't trust those. Doesn't look like myc to me. Obviously there's tons of bacteria too. You need better innoculant man. Hella dirty.


so what does it look like?  not the huge gross whit shit but the light uniformed growth coming of the edge.  what would it be?


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26031428 -

:shrug: just really wispy looking. Not what I'd desire at all. The first pic might be alright, but again it's still pretty wispy, but that 2nd one is :thumbdown:

Have you seen my hidden contams thread? At the end of the op, I talk about what is desirable when selecting grain inoc.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22020260

I just know you'll have a much easier time with cleaner spores. Get a print. Fuck syringes when it comes to agar. Just my opinion.


--------------------
contam and car window art
How to shroomery like a pro! (Seriously, everyone read this!)
Improve your sterile techniques! (A comprehensive guide to agar)
Links upon links of literally EVERYTHING UP TO DATE

AMU Q&A
No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

Edited by Mad Season (06/03/19 11:12 PM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26031429 -

Apparently, for everyone else you don't need much to get tons of colonies. My experience, however, I got only like 7 myc colonies on 20 plates or so using this technique :shrug: That's enough for me, but I'm curious on why I have such low germination rate...


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First Grow

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Raccoon]
    #26031467 -

you need a print and make yourself an inoculation loop with a vape coil. if you wanna try again with a dirty syringe try the brf puck method for getting away from bacteria.

you might wanna try the marketplace for a print. good luck.


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πŸ…ƒ πŸ„΄ πŸ„° πŸ„Ό    πŸ„² πŸ„» πŸ„Έ πŸ„½ πŸ„Ά πŸ…† πŸ… πŸ„° πŸ„Ώ

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: JHOVA]
    #26031478 -

What I suggested: get some new spores. Spore prints. Not spore syringes.

I live in a house that full of mode spores.
This is how I keep my prints lc. and tools clean. 24 7..

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26018520#26018520


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26031487 -

Mad Season said:
:shrug: just really wispy looking. Not what I'd desire at all. The first pic might be alright, but again it's still pretty wispy, but that 2nd one is :thumbdown:

Have you seen my hidden contams thread? At the end of the op, I talk about what is desirable when selecting grain inoc.
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/22020260

I just know you'll have a much easier time with cleaner spores. Get a print. Fuck syringes when it comes to agar. Just my opinion.


thanks for the link i'll get on that reading first thing tomorrow.

Raccoon said:
Apparently, for everyone else you don't need much to get tons of colonies. My experience, however, I got only like 7 myc colonies on 20 plates or so using this technique :shrug: That's enough for me, but I'm curious on why I have such low germination rate...


making new agar plates first thing in the morning i have 4 more syringes 2 types each and i'll try your Tek with the new agar plates.

micelio said:
What I suggested: get some new spores. Spore prints. Not spore syringes.

I live in a house that full of mode spores.
This is how I keep my prints lc. and tools clean. 24 7..

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26018520#26018520


im all about getting spore prints not syringes.  how can i go about this?


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26031494 -

If you live in Ca. you would have to go out of state. or Idaho or Georgia..

I have a Shroomery sponsor I order from.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26031497 -

See C10 agar thread for a good way to streak and increase chances of separating from contams. Scroll way down, it's very thorough.

The cleanup method Jhova mentioned seems interesting too. If streaking in agar doesn't work, I'd totally try that. And in the meantime, good luck getting spores. I'd send you some, but my situation makes it difficult...

JHOVA said:
if you wanna try again with a dirty syringe try the brf puck method for getting away from bacteria.




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First Grow

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Raccoon]
    #26031522 -

I just read through the entire thread start to finish.
So it looks like the bacteria is following your streak pattern to me this means poor sterile technique, dirty inoculation loop or else contaminated innoculant.
Try it like this.
Wipe jar and lid with iso.
Wipe syringe with iso.
Flame syringe needle.
Lift one corner of the lid but don't take it all the way off squirt in one drop 2 tops under the lifted corner of lid without touching the needle to lid or jar edge. Don't even bother squirting out a drop to cool the syringe first. Replace lid and leave it don't use a loop.
Report back with the results if you do it this way and you still get a plate full of bacteria it's either plate preparation which I doubt this is it or it's the innoculant. If you want to rule out plate prep do a 2nd plate from the same batch and leave it untouched if it doesn't contam it's your innoculant.
At least in my head this would narrow it down through process of elimination.
Let us know how it goes and good luck.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26031554 -

have you been using the same source to dye that agar green all this time? Maybe it's your contamination source.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: JustAMushroom]
    #26031558 -

I just read through the entire thread start to finish.
So it looks like the bacteria is following your streak pattern to me this means poor sterile technique, dirty inoculation loop or else contaminated innoculant.
Try it like this.
Wipe jar and lid with iso.
Wipe syringe with iso.
Flame syringe needle.
Lift one corner of the lid but don't take it all the way off squirt in one drop 2 tops under the lifted corner of lid without touching the needle to lid or jar edge. Don't even bother squirting out a drop to cool the syringe first. Replace lid and leave it don't use a loop.
Report back with the results if you do it this way and you still get a plate full of bacteria it's either plate preparation which I doubt this is it or it's the innoculant. If you want to rule out plate prep do a 2nd plate from the same batch and leave it untouched if it doesn't contam it's your innoculant.
At least in my head this would narrow it down through process of elimination.
Let us know how it goes and good luck.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: gizmo1]
    #26031560 -

Sorry I double posted checked back in it said I hadn't added my reply so I sent my reply lol.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: gizmo1]
    #26031604 -

gizmo1 said:
I just read through the entire thread start to finish.
So it looks like the bacteria is following your streak pattern to me this means poor sterile technique, dirty inoculation loop or else contaminated innoculant.
Try it like this.
Wipe jar and lid with iso.
Wipe syringe with iso.
Flame syringe needle.
Lift one corner of the lid but don't take it all the way off squirt in one drop 2 tops under the lifted corner of lid without touching the needle to lid or jar edge. Don't even bother squirting out a drop to cool the syringe first. Replace lid and leave it don't use a loop.
Report back with the results if you do it this way and you still get a plate full of bacteria it's either plate preparation which I doubt this is it or it's the innoculant. If you want to rule out plate prep do a 2nd plate from the same batch and leave it untouched if it doesn't contam it's your innoculant.
At least in my head this would narrow it down through process of elimination.
Let us know how it goes and good luck.


since im doing 15 new agar plates in teh morning i'll add this to the list of things to do.  1 knocked with just teh syringe and 1 untouched.  see what happens.

im also going to use a new syringe i haven't opened yet.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26032541 -



ok so I didn't notice this before someone started to talk about my innoculant being the issue. the 2 syringes on the left are 2 years old and the 3 on the right are 3 months old.  all of them have been sitting in the same ziplock bag in my grow room un disturbed (the 3 on the right came with 2 more iv'e been using this whole time)

SO... why are they so brown?  do syringes go bad?  were they simply bad to begin with?  how do you know when you order them if they're bad right away?


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26032658 -

I think I read that excessive clumping of spores that wont break apart could be a sign of a contam syringe and also the spores germinating in the syringe could be a sign of contamination.
From the looks of it the ones pictured to the right are just really dark syringes like overly dark, but your right the color does look a little off. Ive heard of certain vendors putting charcoal and other stuff to dye the syringe and make it look like it had more spores but this could be a rumor.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26032662 -

You could've had bad syringes from the start but what most likely happened is they went bad during storage. You want to store spore solution in the fridge so if there is a mold spore or bacteria spore in that syringe it won't germinate in the water and mess the entire syringe up because it's too cold for them to germinate and get a foothold in the solution. You basically have trich lcs there now with some cube spores mixed in. Had you kept them in the fridge the original contaminant spore mightve only messed up one or two inoculation points. I hope you made some prints from previous grows because that's your best bet now. If not it's time to aquire some more spores. Also it's best to keep spores refrigerated because they start to lose viability a lot faster at room temp even if they're in print form. Hope this helps :pm: me if you need some spores and I'll send you a print or two
Edit: the 3 syringes on the right don't look right. They're too brown. Are they a red or rust spore strain? If not they should have a purple hue if anything. You didn't get those from a guy on Reddit did you? Once traded with a guy there and he sent 4 contaminated syringes. Looked like he tried making spore syringes with LC water. Dark colored like that and lots of mycelium floating around with the clumped spores. I could see bacteria also causing that. Possibly some mushroom spores germinated then the bacteria started multiplying and the myc started "pissing" to try and fight it off. :shrug:


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Trade List

Edited by KapnDank (06/04/19 03:30 PM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: KapnDank]
    #26032675 -

gizmo1 said:
I think I read that excessive clumping of spores that wont break apart could be a sign of a contam syringe and also the spores germinating in the syringe could be a sign of contamination.
From the looks of it the ones pictured to the right are just really dark syringes like overly dark, but your right the color does look a little off. Ive heard of certain vendors putting charcoal and other stuff to dye the syringe and make it look like it had more spores but this could be a rumor.


ya they clump but they break up super easy too so i know they're good. I've read about the excessive clumping as well but these aren't like that so thats good.

KapnDank said:
You could've had bad syringes from the start but what most likely happened is they went bad during storage. You want to store spore solution in the fridge so if there is a mold spore or bacteria spore in that syringe it won't germinate in the water and mess the entire syringe up because it's too cold for them to germinate and get a foothold in the solution. You basically have trich lcs there now with some cube spores mixed in. Had you kept them in the fridge the original contaminant spore mightve only messed up one or two inoculation points. I hope you made some prints from previous grows because that's your best bet now. If not it's time to aquire some more spores. Also it's best to keep spores refrigerated because they start to lose viability a lot faster at room temp even if they're in print form. Hope this helps :pm: me if you need some spores and I'll send you a print or two


ya i'll need to invest in a fridge i can store shit in cause my fridge in the kitchen won't work for the sake of friends and fam that like to stop by and will see things they're not supposed to see lol.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26032687 -

Then you want to start keeping prints and making the syringes only as you need them(allow them to sit 3 days in solution before use so the spores can rehydrate it increases germination rates.  you could also start growing oysters, reishi, shiitake or whatever edible you might dig and label the spore syringes as them. Example oyster 3015 is actually GT. Blue oyster is actually B+ etc. Grow the edibles on your countertop in bags and they shouldn't question it


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Trade List

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: KapnDank]
    #26032769 -

KapnDank said:
Then you want to start keeping prints and making the syringes only as you need them(allow them to sit 3 days in solution before use so the spores can rehydrate it increases germination rates.  you could also start growing oysters, reishi, shiitake or whatever edible you might dig and label the spore syringes as them. Example oyster 3015 is actually GT. Blue oyster is actually B+ etc. Grow the edibles on your countertop in bags and they shouldn't question it


Amycel 3015
They're sure beautiful to grow and the taste is out of this world.





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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: KapnDank]
    #26032784 -

Hey there, read the whole thread. Just went through something similar when I moved, my contam rate went up about 40% from nothing I did. I had to do a ton of sterile technique improvement. Here's a list of what I changed. For me, it was improving on a lot of little things. Watching Bod's SAB videos were super helpful in making sure I'm doing things right.

Though... honestly I see bacteria growing like crazy and I'm going to say that it seems like it's your syringes :shrug: I just gave away all my prints or I'd offer to send you one as well. I've stopped using syringes as much as possible at this point because of shit like that. Good luck :thumbup:


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My Shoebox Factory Beginner's Tek | Shoebox Assembly Tek | Methodology/teks I use | How I Store Bulk Items

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: ShaperDreaming]
    #26032873 -

I read your list of improvement.
They're all great things to work on.
I live in a area where there's allot of dust and mold in the air so I have to keep everything in plastic bags.
This is one of my newest idea for keeping things clean..

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26018520#26018520


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26033424 -

Stop fucking with syringes


--------------------
It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor

I'M A MEMBER FIRST, TC WHEN NEEDED AND MOD WHEN I HAVE TO BE !!!

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26033470 -

You don't need to hydrate with a syringe before going to agar dish.

Just scrape some spores off the print onto a fresh agar plate..
You don't want a dried up dish.., obviously..
Give it a little time to grow out.. Do a few transfers to isolate and narrow the culture down..
A TC could explain allot better than I can..


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26033663 -

micelio said:
You don't need to hydrate with a syringe before going to agar dish.

Just scrape some spores off the print onto a fresh agar plate..
You don't want a dried up dish.., obviously..
Give it a little time to grow out.. Do a few transfers to isolate and narrow the culture down..
A TC could explain allot better than I can..


Sorry should've mentioned that. If you already work with agar there's no reason to make a syringe. It's easier to get it to sector on the agar so you can isolate strong mycelium and hoping a good substrain of the strain you're working with.

I talked to op in a message. He was only fucking with syringes because the vendor he chose was out of prints at the time. Go easy on him lol


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Trade List

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: KapnDank]
    #26034111 -

Seeing those dishes with the tops off... Bad syringes. You should remove the vendors name, spores are for microscopy purposes. Email them and tell them your "slide syringes" appear to contain bacillus spp. rather than the anticipated fungal species. Out of the last dozen syringes I bought one was bacterial and one had Trichoderma spores mixed in. 10 were perfect. It's always great to streak a plate, transfer samples then chop the rest of that puppy up and make some MS spawn, you can only do that with a clean syringe. Dumb luck I guess.


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26034220 -

I know you're probably frustrated and toure willing to do anything to find the fix but using a different syringe isn't going to narrow down the issue whether it works or not. You still won't know if it's bad innoculant or your technique. That's why you keep everything the same, but put controls in place.

Good luck bud

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: sillypsilocybe] * 1
    #26034402 -

thanks for all the continued opinions and help everyone.  i have made new plates using ALL syinges i have (6 total).
from each syringe i did:
1 drop plate
1 Z spread plate

then i also have to agar plates that i didn't knock
1 remained sealed with poly fill
1 i opened inside the SAB for 3 seconds and then closed it again
i figured i would do this as a control for the agar.

i'll keep evyeone posted on the process here.

on a side note, i have ordered new syringes from 2 new vendors and will see how they look when get them. (everyone was out of spore prints)

thanks again
10k


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26034461 -

Just a suggestion 10k..

Order yourself some synthetic jar filter disc. cut them down to the size of a quarter. I think you should get a dozen out of every jar disc.
Silicon them to your lids. You won't have to mess with poly fill or Micro tape. They'll last for years without touching them. Use clear silicon..

They don't cost much and you get allot out of one disc..
Poly fill can wick bacteria into your jar when wet or damp..

filter disc can be use for your grain jars and agar dish..


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26034478 -

10kVisions said:
thanks for all the continued opinions and help everyone.  i have made new plates using ALL syinges i have (6 total).
from each syringe i did:
1 drop plate
1 Z spread plate

then i also have to agar plates that i didn't knock
1 remained sealed with poly fill
1 i opened inside the SAB for 3 seconds and then closed it again
i figured i would do this as a control for the agar.

i'll keep evyeone posted on the process here.

on a side note, i have ordered new syringes from 2 new vendors and will see how they look when get them. (everyone was out of spore prints)

thanks again
10k


Nobody is out of prints lol I have looked at most major vendors


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It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor

I'M A MEMBER FIRST, TC WHEN NEEDED AND MOD WHEN I HAVE TO BE !!!

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: cronicr]
    #26034554 -

cronicr said:
10kVisions said:
thanks for all the continued opinions and help everyone.  i have made new plates using ALL syinges i have (6 total).
from each syringe i did:
1 drop plate
1 Z spread plate

then i also have to agar plates that i didn't knock
1 remained sealed with poly fill
1 i opened inside the SAB for 3 seconds and then closed it again
i figured i would do this as a control for the agar.

i'll keep evyeone posted on the process here.

on a side note, i have ordered new syringes from 2 new vendors and will see how they look when get them. (everyone was out of spore prints)

thanks again
10k


Nobody is out of prints lol I have looked at most major vendors


well the 2 I just tried to order from were out of what I wanted to buy acording to when I attempted to check out and its said "the strains are currently out of stock".


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26034561 -

micelio said:
Just a suggestion 10k..

Order yourself some synthetic jar filter disc. cut them down to the size of a quarter. I think you should get a dozen out of every jar disc.
Silicon them to your lids. You won't have to mess with poly fill or Micro tape. They'll last for years without touching them. Use clear silicon..

They don't cost much and you get allot out of one disc..
Poly fill can wick bacteria into your jar when wet or damp..

filter disc can be use for your grain jars and agar dish..


those look interesting! I'll need to read up on them more.
thanks!


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26034572 -

All of those agar plates look completely unsalvageable to me.

Yes... people around here love to argue. Take what you will from it and do what you can not to take it personally. Everyone is arguing from their own point of experience, what worked for them, but as you can see from your own experience, the same tek might not always work for everyone. Do your best to forget what you know worked before, because obviously something is going wrong here, and until you can isolate it... nothing you're doing works.

Unless you're licking the agar plates before inoculating them, my best guess is that you have contaminated syringes. If not, then something in your inoculation process must be to blame (Innoc loop, dirty gloves, bad SAB tek like irratic movements or hovering over open containers, etc).

Along with getting some prints/changing your spore source, you might try deep cleaning your space, then going heavy with the lysol over everything. Some people have reported that this helped them a lot, but it's not a cure-all.

Also, bacteria seems to spread much more slowly over BRF pucks, so you might try those over agar and see if you can get a clean transfer from there when the myc outruns the contams.


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Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them more. --Oscar Wilde

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26034596 -

10kVisions said:
from each syringe i did:
1 drop plate
1 Z spread plate

then i also have to agar plates that i didn't knock
1 remained sealed with poly fill
1 i opened inside the SAB for 3 seconds and then closed it again
i figured i would do this as a control for the agar.


I think you'll find your culpret with this methodology. Good work on isolating your issues.

Also, can I recommend looking at the market place for prints? You could even likely get one free with a giveaway of some kind. I've ordered from a shop once since I joined the forums here because the community is amazing :lol: Hell, normally I'd offer to send one out to you, but I did a giveaway last month that cleaned me out of prints complete.


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My Shoebox Factory Beginner's Tek | Shoebox Assembly Tek | Methodology/teks I use | How I Store Bulk Items

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26034628 -

I have a print I can send you from my PF Classic clone grow

PM if you want.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #26034643 -

hexkrak said:
All of those agar plates look completely unsalvageable to me.

Yes... people around here love to argue. Take what you will from it and do what you can not to take it personally. Everyone is arguing from their own point of experience, what worked for them, but as you can see from your own experience, the same tek might not always work for everyone. Do your best to forget what you know worked before, because obviously something is going wrong here, and until you can isolate it... nothing you're doing works.

Unless you're licking the agar plates before inoculating them, my best guess is that you have contaminated syringes. If not, then something in your inoculation process must be to blame (Innoc loop, dirty gloves, bad SAB tek like irratic movements or hovering over open containers, etc).

Along with getting some prints/changing your spore source, you might try deep cleaning your space, then going heavy with the lysol over everything. Some people have reported that this helped them a lot, but it's not a cure-all.

Also, bacteria seems to spread much more slowly over BRF pucks, so you might try those over agar and see if you can get a clean transfer from there when the myc outruns the contams.


I definitely agree on the arguing.  I try to let it make me laugh cause there's absolutely no point in me getting in the middle.  my time here is spent trying to have the people much more knowledgable than me show me ways to figure out what exactly is going on with my situation.  Most signs now seem to point to my syringes being bad from the get go (no thanks to.... ehm lol).  my latest tests will surely narrow these issues out and I have new syringes from 2 different sources coming along with a couple of prints from some amazingly generous people on here so I'll be doing the same tests when that all arrives.  I hope to be back on track soon, cause this has been extremely frustrating.
appreciate the feedback.

ShaperDreaming said:
10kVisions said:
from each syringe i did:
1 drop plate
1 Z spread plate

then i also have to agar plates that i didn't knock
1 remained sealed with poly fill
1 i opened inside the SAB for 3 seconds and then closed it again
i figured i would do this as a control for the agar.


I think you'll find your culpret with this methodology. Good work on isolating your issues.

Also, can I recommend looking at the market place for prints? You could even likely get one free with a giveaway of some kind. I've ordered from a shop once since I joined the forums here because the community is amazing :lol: Hell, normally I'd offer to send one out to you, but I did a giveaway last month that cleaned me out of prints complete.


got on the market place and posted what im looking for thanks for also suggesting it.  I actually never looked around cause ive been dealing with so many issues that that's been my sole focus. 
thank your for complimenting my methodology.  im taking this 10x farther than I would have on my own and its because of the good people on here legitimately trying to help me. 
appreciate the kind words
cheers!


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions] * 2
    #26034858 -

For reals tho.. the people saying to review sterile tek.. the dude has the same type of bacteria in literally every plate. If this was sterile tek, he'd have a whole array of contams, not the same contam in tons of plates.. This is clearly an innoculant problem. Notice the people saying to get a proper print are all people with experience. If you don't want this shit to happen again, please get a print. Unlike a syringe that shakes everything up together, a print won't have things mixed around, and you can actually get clean spores swiped on a plate.

In the meantime, let's see how multiple syringes with control dishes work. This will once and for all lay this shit to rest, and you can finally have the first part down.. clean innoculant.


--------------------
contam and car window art
How to shroomery like a pro! (Seriously, everyone read this!)
Improve your sterile techniques! (A comprehensive guide to agar)
Links upon links of literally EVERYTHING UP TO DATE

AMU Q&A
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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Mad Season]
    #26034928 -

Mad Season said:
For reals tho.. the people saying to review sterile tek.. the dude has the same type of bacteria in literally every plate. If this was sterile tek, he'd have a whole array of contams, not the same contam in tons of plates.. This is clearly an innoculant problem. Notice the people saying to get a proper print are all people with experience. If you don't want this shit to happen again, please get a print. Unlike a syringe that shakes everything up together, a print won't have things mixed around, and you can actually get clean spores swiped on a plate.

In the meantime, let's see how multiple syringes with control dishes work. This will once and for all lay this shit to rest, and you can finally have the first part down.. clean innoculant.


100% agree.  my hope is to nail the damn coffin shut on this shit lol.  i got a couple of cool people sending prints my way and from here out im learning how to make my own cause im over the syringe thing... thanks for the help, Mad.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26035089 -

hey make yourself a good inoculation loop from vape coil via bods tek.


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πŸ…ƒ πŸ„΄ πŸ„° πŸ„Ό    πŸ„² πŸ„» πŸ„Έ πŸ„½ πŸ„Ά πŸ…† πŸ… πŸ„° πŸ„Ώ

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: JHOVA]
    #26035898 -

JHOVA said:
hey make yourself a good inoculation loop from vape coil via bods tek.


I made mine out of dab tools lol. Drilled a 1/16th hole in the round end. I don't even use them with syringes anymore, I just push a drop to the end then streak, I usually don't even leave the water behind.


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: Professor X]
    #26036353 -

Mad Season said:
the dude has the same type of bacteria in literally every plate. If this was sterile tek, he'd have a whole array of contams, not the same contam in tons of plates.. This is clearly an innoculant problem.


100% agree with this. Also, it'll be good to know for the OP's peace of mind that it's not the technique when those test trays turn up good work.

Professor X said:
JHOVA said:
hey make yourself a good inoculation loop from vape coil via bods tek.


I made mine out of dab tools lol. Drilled a 1/16th hole in the round end. I don't even use them with syringes anymore, I just push a drop to the end then streak, I usually don't even leave the water behind.


Ya'll, I always see people saying do this or that. Seriously, an inoculation loop from amazon with 50 replacement heads is only $10. That's $0.20 per session if you don't reuse the heads. Makes no sense to not just buy them to me :shrug:


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My Shoebox Factory Beginner's Tek | Shoebox Assembly Tek | Methodology/teks I use | How I Store Bulk Items

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: ShaperDreaming]
    #26036424 -

I made that for $2 from a local cigarette store. Amazon can suck it.


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πŸ…ƒ πŸ„΄ πŸ„° πŸ„Ό    πŸ„² πŸ„» πŸ„Έ πŸ„½ πŸ„Ά πŸ…† πŸ… πŸ„° πŸ„Ώ

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: ShaperDreaming] * 2
    #26036433 -

ShaperDreaming said:
Mad Season said:
the dude has the same type of bacteria in literally every plate. If this was sterile tek, he'd have a whole array of contams, not the same contam in tons of plates.. This is clearly an innoculant problem.


100% agree with this. Also, it'll be good to know for the OP's peace of mind that it's not the technique when those test trays turn up good work.

Professor X said:
JHOVA said:
hey make yourself a good inoculation loop from vape coil via bods tek.


I made mine out of dab tools lol. Drilled a 1/16th hole in the round end. I don't even use them with syringes anymore, I just push a drop to the end then streak, I usually don't even leave the water behind.


Ya'll, I always see people saying do this or that. Seriously, an inoculation loop from amazon with 50 replacement heads is only $10. That's $0.20 per session if you don't reuse the heads. Makes no sense to not just buy them to me :shrug:


I was going to stay out of It, but I couldn't resist.
I tell you how fast and easy it is to make one,
A Twist tie on a loaf of bread or use in produce like celery, have a wire that runs down the center. Peal the wire off the paper/plastic and wrap the wire around a pencil to take the shape of a loop.
Fasten the loop to what ever you want for a small handle.
Remember It probably be in your hands for less than a minute.. No need to make a big deal out of It.. I been making my own for a few years now,and they work just find..
It's the same dia. and alloy as one you would buy..

:cookiemonster:


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26036444 -

My buddy gave me a fistfull of those dab tools he got on dhgate for 9 cents each. I spent about 2 minutes drilling a bunch of holes. I have a whole pile of loops so I can streak and set aside. Can't beat free.


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My no pour Petri TEK - https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27252059/page/1

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26036452 -

micelio said:
A Twist tie on a loaf of bread


... I can't remember the last time I saw a twist tie on one of these :frown: They're all those shitty plastic clips these days. (Also I'm fucking weird and make my own bread, so I don't pay a lot of attention to that stuff)

But! That's kinda a great idea.

Anyways, whatever ya'll want. I've only gone through 3 inoculation loops in the past 6 months since I got it (I replace when they melt... or just kinda fail when flame sterlizing. Melt isn't a good enough word, maybe pop?).

Fine fine fine fine. Ya'll make them at home. Normally I don't pony up cash for anything, but these were so cheap :lol: Seemed silly to go to a vape store, get an extra handle, twist tie that shit etc. :shrug: Ignore my comments :crazy2:

I've never done dabs :frown:


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My Shoebox Factory Beginner's Tek | Shoebox Assembly Tek | Methodology/teks I use | How I Store Bulk Items

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: ShaperDreaming]
    #26036687 -

ShaperDreaming said:
micelio said:
A Twist tie on a loaf of bread


... I can't remember the last time I saw a twist tie on one of these :frown: They're all those shitty plastic clips these days. (Also I'm fucking weird and make my own bread, so I don't pay a lot of attention to that stuff)

But! That's kinda a great idea.

Anyways, whatever ya'll want. I've only gone through 3 inoculation loops in the past 6 months since I got it (I replace when they melt... or just kinda fail when flame sterlizing. Melt isn't a good enough word, maybe pop?).

Fine fine fine fine. Ya'll make them at home. Normally I don't pony up cash for anything, but these were so cheap :lol: Seemed silly to go to a vape store, get an extra handle, twist tie that shit etc. :shrug: Ignore my comments :crazy2:

I've never done dabs :frown:


I feel ya man. Personally I love the loop I bought. Came with a bunch of nichrome wire replacements. The way it screws down on the wire makes replacing the wire easy AF! Idk I guess I like it for the same reason I built a flow hood. I just don't like my equipment fighting me lol


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Trade List

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: KapnDank]
    #26038376 -

KapnDank said:
ShaperDreaming said:
micelio said:
A Twist tie on a loaf of bread


... I can't remember the last time I saw a twist tie on one of these :frown: They're all those shitty plastic clips these days. (Also I'm fucking weird and make my own bread, so I don't pay a lot of attention to that stuff)

But! That's kinda a great idea.

Anyways, whatever ya'll want. I've only gone through 3 inoculation loops in the past 6 months since I got it (I replace when they melt... or just kinda fail when flame sterlizing. Melt isn't a good enough word, maybe pop?).

Fine fine fine fine. Ya'll make them at home. Normally I don't pony up cash for anything, but these were so cheap :lol: Seemed silly to go to a vape store, get an extra handle, twist tie that shit etc. :shrug: Ignore my comments :crazy2:

I've never done dabs :frown:


I feel ya man. Personally I love the loop I bought. Came with a bunch of nichrome wire replacements. The way it screws down on the wire makes replacing the wire easy AF! Idk I guess I like it for the same reason I built a flow hood. I just don't like my equipment fighting me lol


im all abou just buying them shits if I can. I always end up fucking shit up when I try to make it. and im with some of the others. I can't tell ya the last time I bought bread with a twist tie on it.  I also shop at organic markets so that might have something to do with it lol.

OK SO UPDATE!

A couple of the "Z" spread plates are showing the same contams again but not all, so maybe there's hope for 1 or 2 of the syringes!? we'll see in another few days.

on the flip side though, one of my "control" plates is showing signs of growth (pic below).  as you can see the one on the left that I did NOT open is fine... noting seems to be affecting it.  BUT the one on the right (if you recall) I opened it for about 3 seconds inside the SAB and then closed it and its showing growth signs.  thoughts?


SAB Tek
Large clear plastic tub, with holes cut on 1 side.
I lay down a fresh black trash back on the table adn spray it with 70% alcohol then I spray the inside of the SAB adn place it on the table and let both sit for around 5 min.  after that I bring in all of my plates etc and wipe them all down inside the SAB with alcohol and begin the process.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26038515 -

IME a damp towel works great for a SAB bottom as it will trap contams that fall instead of letting them blow back into the air.

Slow deliberate movements are important. The more jerking around the more air blows.

Leaving the sides of the SAB damp that you're not looking through also can help grab floating contams.

It sounds like you might have a really high spore load in your house.


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Always forgive your enemies; nothing annoys them more. --Oscar Wilde

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: hexkrak]
    #26038520 -

I agree on the wet towel..


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26038548 -

I also agree with the wet towel. I used to lay one down soaked with 10% bleach solution. If the spore load is high in your house it wouldn't hurt to get some Ozium, not Lysol you want something with Triethylene Glycol(TEG),  and spray around your work area to kill some of the spores floating around. Make sure there's no moving air in the room. Fans, air conditioner, hyperactive cat:lol:, etc


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Trade List

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: KapnDank] * 1
    #26038669 -

That's not a great sign that your "3 second rule" plate is growing things. That means you're getting contam in your SAB.

I don't know about a towel, but a wire rack seems like a better idea. If your contam falls to the ground and gets locked into a wet towel, then anything that touches that is contamiated. If you use one put a wire rack (for like cooling cookies) over it. Keep your shit away from contam.


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My Shoebox Factory Beginner's Tek | Shoebox Assembly Tek | Methodology/teks I use | How I Store Bulk Items

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: ShaperDreaming]
    #26038691 -

Why not both

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: gizmo1]
    #26038711 -



I use a towel and a cookie rack.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: JHOVA]
    #26038717 -

I need to make my arm holes bigger. Small ones cause contam problems.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: gizmo1]
    #26038743 -

gizmo1 said:
I need to make my arm holes bigger. Small ones cause contam problems.


Same.

Also, I was trying to recommend both, but don't use a wet towel myself.


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My Shoebox Factory Beginner's Tek | Shoebox Assembly Tek | Methodology/teks I use | How I Store Bulk Items

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: ShaperDreaming]
    #26038877 -

hominy, coffee, tomato, and paint cans should do the trick. whatever is available.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: JHOVA]
    #26038886 -

Seems like big metal cans are getting more and more rare everyone is going to plastic. I cut mine with a wood burner and cutting tip but ive also used a dremel harbor freight sells a nifty little dremel type tool you can catch on sale for like 8 bucks.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: gizmo1]
    #26038987 -

big lots or mexican/ethnic market has em 100%


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: JHOVA]
    #26039140 -

I recently had three excellent-looking oat jars with vigorous, healthy growth.  I decided to use each of them for G2G.  One by one, on separate days and using my SAB, I dumped a parent into three receiving jars for a total of nine receiving jars.

Every. Single. One. Contaminated.

I thought what the hell could have happened?  I kept going over my technique to try to identify what could have possible resulted in such a catastrophic fucking failure.  Nothing ever stood out to me, so I chalked it up to terrible luck, or the polyfill lids, or some kind of sneaky mold that didn't reveal itself until late in the game. 

The thing is that I always leave just a little bit of oat in the parent jar when doing G2Gs in order to see if anything funky grows out.  Nothing ever did in any of the parent jars in this case - so I knew it had to be something that I did during the G2G transfer.

Well, while getting ready to do some agar work yesterday I began pulling all of my gear out of my tub.  I use pieces of a cut-up t-shirt to dip into 70% alcohol and wipe down equipment, jars, etc., and when I'm finished with them I cram them into a plastic petri dish sleeve to keep them clean.  Well, this time, when I pulled that bag out, I immediately smelled mold.  I reached in, pulled out the damp t-shirt scraps, and recognized little green dots of mold covering them.

Turns out that the one thing I thought was clean (because it was soaked in alcohol when in use) and that was being rubbed all over my jars and tools had actually become a fucking contam nightmare.

This is all to say that when it comes to a reoccurring contam problem, it is necessary to examine every minute detail of the process - or perhaps to even start completely from scratch.  In my case, if the damp rag-in-a-bag hadn't started to show little dots of mold, who knows how much longer I would have continued to rub mold all over everything before recognizing the source of the problem.

Good luck!

Edited by teaker (06/07/19 09:10 PM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: teaker]
    #26039180 -

Did you purge all the air out of your pressure cooker. I always go 15 min. from the time I see steam and hear the water at a rapid boil.
I also always go 2 hours on my steam cycle for grain jars..
Air in the pc acts as a insulator.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: KapnDank]
    #26040142 -

KapnDank said:
I also agree with the wet towel. I used to lay one down soaked with 10% bleach solution. If the spore load is high in your house it wouldn't hurt to get some Ozium, not Lysol you want something with Triethylene Glycol(TEG),  and spray around your work area to kill some of the spores floating around. Make sure there's no moving air in the room. Fans, air conditioner, hyperactive cat:lol:, etc


thanks everyone.  regardless of peoples Tek's allot of them aren't very thorough about the setup... just what to use and how to use it.
the room I'm in i buit, its dead.  4 walls and ceiling. no fans no windows etc.  one door in and out so threre is virtually NO air movement in it.  i have another control idea to do inside the sab.

So:
After i knocked all the individual syringe jars and when i was done with those and they were no longer in the SAB i took out one of my contaminated agar jars and did the transfer into another clean agar.  THEN i opened the untouched agar jar and closed it.  im 99% sure the contams i have inside the control jar came from the contaminated jar i had opened.
another idea to test that i to take 2 more control jars and reset the SAB (alcohol etc) then open them inside without anything else and see if the growth happens again.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26040428 -

Hey..!
You can run a steam cleaner in the room you where describing for 12 hours and problem solved..


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26040439 -

micelio said:
Hey..!
You can run a steam cleaner in the room you where describing for 12 hours and problem solved..


steam cleaner for what?  theres no carpet or anything.  linoleum floors....


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26040560 -

10kVisions said:
micelio said:
Hey..!
You can run a steam cleaner in the room you where describing for 12 hours and problem solved..


steam cleaner for what?  theres no carpet or anything.  linoleum floors....


I'm not talking about a carpet cleaner..Ha..
A steam generator It put out actual steam.. From what I understand is mushroom farms with contamination problem run the steam generators in their grow area. I imagine all tool and equipment rental would rent one.
They use steam cleaners like a pressure washer to clean parts and engines that all greasy..
I myself wouldn't hesitate to use one to kill all contaminants in every nook and cranny.. What you do is fill the room with steam for a period of time.. Sometime you just have to start over from the ground up and try not to let the mold spores and bacteria get out of hand..


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26040635 -

micelio said:
10kVisions said:
micelio said:
Hey..!
You can run a steam cleaner in the room you where describing for 12 hours and problem solved..


steam cleaner for what?  theres no carpet or anything.  linoleum floors....


I'm not talking about a carpet cleaner..Ha..
A steam generator It put out actual steam.. From what I understand is mushroom farms with contamination problem run the steam generators in their grow area. I imagine all tool and equipment rental would rent one.
They use steam cleaners like a pressure washer to clean parts and engines that all greasy..
I myself wouldn't hesitate to use one to kill all contaminants in every nook and cranny.. What you do is fill the room with steam for a period of time.. Sometime you just have to start over from the ground up and try not to let the mold spores and bacteria get out of hand..


This sounds like it would cause mold hot moist air and all. You sure you arent thinking of a fog machine ive heard the fog solution is a disinfectant and I think someone here had a tek for building a fpg machine for growing.

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: gizmo1]
    #26040685 -

Perhaps a fog machine using TEG?:shrug:


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: KapnDank]
    #26040698 -

KapnDank said:
Perhaps a fog machine using TEG?:shrug:


Im not sure what that is did a quick search on the web couldnt find much about it but I found some links that led me to dissinfectant  foggers whos going to order and try them out OP? Lol

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: gizmo1]
    #26040728 -

I'll try this again. If 10k has no windows one door and the room is seal up good with no air draft and If you could pump straight steam into the room for 12 hours there will be nothing living in that room. You can make a generator out of a fifty gallon drum and a big propane burner under the drum.
Drake89 TC. Has a edible mushroom farm. He has one room that he loads up with racks of bags for growing edibles. He pipes in the steam for twelve or more hours to sterilize the bags of sawdust.. It's one atmosphere sterilizing.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26041030 -

Is it likely that the room is set up to handle excessive moisture like chemlite sheeting overtop of mold resistive coating overtop of green mold resitant sheetrock? Take a bathroom coated in sheet rock for instance over time the excessive amounts of steam will cause mold growth. In all my years in construction I have never demolitioned a room exposed to constant steam that didnt have mold growth even if it wasnt visible. Ever torn out a shower kit or tile in a bathroom?

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: gizmo1]
    #26041033 -

Wtf is demolitioned I hope thats a real word lol.
Edit: ignore what im saying mold on the wall doesnt matter when it comes to what your talking about. It also wont benefeit op as soon as steam stops being pumped into room its no longer sterile no point in arguing that lol.

Edited by gizmo1 (06/09/19 12:14 AM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: gizmo1]
    #26042630 -

gizmo1 said:
KapnDank said:
Perhaps a fog machine using TEG?:shrug:


Im not sure what that is did a quick search on the web couldnt find much about it but I found some links that led me to dissinfectant  foggers whos going to order and try them out OP? Lol


Its the active ingredient in Ozium air sanitaizer. Apparently back before hepa technology labs used to use it with a lamp that would cause it to evaporate into the air(don't quote me on that just something I remember reading a while back) Once in the air it kills spores very effectively. Some people even do g2g open air after spraying the work area well with ozium. I don't recommend it but some people have decent success doing so. I imagine they already have a low spore load in their homes


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: KapnDank]
    #26055687 -

UPDATE

OK so here we have transfers coming from the jars that had even the slightest bit of what we could consider "good" growth.  I know my pieces are still a little big but it was proving very difficult for me to get a tiny chunk out o those deep jars of mine, as you can see I've now ordered Pitri's and my world got 10x easier.  plus the photos look better lol

   

   



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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26055701 -

Seriously...:thumbup:


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26055707 -

thanks!  been a long road... still going.  have new Cams Pitril's going now too.  probably 30ish agar plates all going at the same time but its really teaching me allot and I can't thank everyone on here enough for the help.  im now think gin about doing a Tek myself all about the process of elimination when your having a bad time at this lol.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26055714 -

10kVisions said:
thanks!  been a long road... still going.  have new Cams Pitril's going now too.  probably 30ish agar plates all going at the same time but its really teaching me allot and I can't thank everyone on here enough for the help.  im now think gin about doing a Tek myself all about the process of elimination when your having a bad time at this lol.



You can do a Tek on what not to do...LoL.

:lol:


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26055716 -

micelio said:
10kVisions said:
thanks!  been a long road... still going.  have new Cams Pitril's going now too.  probably 30ish agar plates all going at the same time but its really teaching me allot and I can't thank everyone on here enough for the help.  im now think gin about doing a Tek myself all about the process of elimination when your having a bad time at this lol.



You can do a Tek on what not to do...LoL.

:lol:


Exactly!!!! LOL!


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26083506 -

UPDATE:

Ok so here are the latest.  i have a TON of plates going but thought i would just post the Brazilian for now.  i personally think they all look good but would love the opinions of everyone on here who's been following my thread.  Some are obviously awesome but look like they might have "weak" spots.  some are just full of fluffy white but don't have the string like hair type growth.

1. Can you tell me the differences?
2. which ones would you use?
3. would you transfer again or would you run with these cultures?

thanks ahead of time!
cheers
10k

1.     2.     3.     4.     5.     6.     7.
8.


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: 10kVisions]
    #26083918 -

Plates 6,7, and 8 have good looking growth around 6oclock position. More like 4oclock through 8 o'clock. I would either go with (transfer from) plate 6 at the 5 o'clock position or plate 7 at 6 o'clock position. Thats where your most aggressive rhizo growth is anyways


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Edited by KapnDank (07/01/19 10:39 AM)

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: KapnDank]
    #26083928 -

i prefer rhizo ropey growth to tomentose most times. The last 3 plates should get one more transfer.


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πŸ…ƒ πŸ„΄ πŸ„° πŸ„Ό    πŸ„² πŸ„» πŸ„Έ πŸ„½ πŸ„Ά πŸ…† πŸ… πŸ„° πŸ„Ώ

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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: JHOVA]
    #26084079 -

I agree with the two above:

One more transfer

The Rhizomorphic on 6,7,8..

Looking good...:thumbup:


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Re: I seriously don't get it. [Re: micelio]
    #26084117 -

Reading this thread has been an adventure. Really happy to see that healthy growth on those last 3 plates!

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