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Offlinesillypsilocybe
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What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? * 1
    #25939081 - 04/16/19 11:07 PM (5 years, 8 months ago)

Hey guys and gals. I've been trying to find some information on SABs and Gloveboxes and the differences between the two, and a lot of information seems to date back to a few years back, but from what I've gathered--

Gloveboxes are a no-no because the use of them kicks up air currents in the box

Still air boxes are better because they don't kick up air currents (and I've seen SABs with giant arm holes cut into the sides).. TF?!?


My question though is this- I've seen videos of people using SABs with giant arm holes in them, and obviously, air and contaminates are flowing through, into the box while the user is trying to perform sterile work (MS to agar, G2G, etc), so why is it that SABs work?

I understand that Laminar Flow Hoods are the way to go, but apparently people are able to get away with using SABs instead with minimal failures, so why do SABs work so well when they're clearly not sealed off??

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OfflineSFS96
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: sillypsilocybe] * 1
    #25939096 - 04/16/19 11:13 PM (5 years, 8 months ago)

SABs aren’t supposed to be sterile, there actually really dirty but the way it works is u spray a little water on the walls and it makes the contamination stick to the walls of the SAB so u can do your thing:thumbup: here’s bods Tek https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23990888#23990888


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InvisibleMunchauzen
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: sillypsilocybe] * 2
    #25939097 - 04/16/19 11:13 PM (5 years, 8 months ago)

Its a still air box, not a sterile air box. Still air allows for sterile work inside the box. Large arm holes minimize turbulence when entering and exiting the box.

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Offlinesillypsilocybe
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: SFS96]
    #25939101 - 04/16/19 11:16 PM (5 years, 8 months ago)

Thanks for the response SFS, but I guess my question is more in regards to the giant arm homes that I've seen cut into the sides of SABs. Even in Bod's videos, he's reaching inside the SAB with only gloves on, and yet there's clearly gotta be contaminates flowing into the box from the giant arm holes that he's cut into the sides.

So is the user hoping that they spray the sides and bottom with soapy water, that everything that's going to drift into the SAB from the giant arm holes are going to stick to the sides and bottom, and not drift and land into open petri dishes, or open grain jars??

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OfflinePsilosopherr
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: sillypsilocybe] * 1
    #25939105 - 04/16/19 11:18 PM (5 years, 8 months ago)

We're talking about things we can't see, nobody knows how it works, we know only that it does work.

But I say that in jest and am merely posting to follow the thread

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OfflineSFS96
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #25939115 - 04/16/19 11:25 PM (5 years, 8 months ago)

This Tek goes into more detail https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/20048771#20048771
I don’t know if it will answer your question but maybe:shrug: lol
U also put the SAB in a small room and turn off anything creating circulation so you shouldn’t be kicking up mich air

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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: sillypsilocybe]
    #25939226 - 04/17/19 02:15 AM (5 years, 8 months ago)

I think the idea is that when u are finishing putting your arms into the holes of a SAB, the air settles and becomes a Still Air Box at that point (since u will not need to take your arms out of the box while u do your clean work).

Gloveboxes were decommissioned because they were awkward to use. U can still technically use a glovebox but its "outdated" since a Still Air Box does the same thing, only much more practical for arm-motion work.

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OfflineSFS96
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #25939231 - 04/17/19 02:23 AM (5 years, 8 months ago)

That’s not the case because you torch your scalpel outside of the SAB after every agar transfer. Also when I pore agar I pull my arms out and wait for the dishes cool off before preceding so your arms aren’t in the SAB at all times.


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Invisiblestubb
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: SFS96] * 1
    #25939243 - 04/17/19 02:36 AM (5 years, 8 months ago)

My understanding is that in a still air box, the air is still and gravity pulls airborne microbes down.  In a glovebox you create pressure differentials when you move your arms that blow microbes all over the place.

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OfflineKizzle
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: stubb]
    #25939772 - 04/17/19 11:32 AM (5 years, 8 months ago)

The most important function is it puts a barrier between you and your work. Your skin, hair, and clothes are the main source of contaminants. It doesn't need to be a perfect barrier to make a difference.


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InvisibleMad Season
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: sillypsilocybe]
    #25939794 - 04/17/19 11:44 AM (5 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

sillypsilocybe said:
Thanks for the response SFS, but I guess my question is more in regards to the giant arm homes that I've seen cut into the sides of SABs. Even in Bod's videos, he's reaching inside the SAB with only gloves on, and yet there's clearly gotta be contaminates flowing into the box from the giant arm holes that he's cut into the sides.

So is the user hoping that they spray the sides and bottom with soapy water, that everything that's going to drift into the SAB from the giant arm holes are going to stick to the sides and bottom, and not drift and land into open petri dishes, or open grain jars??



If the room itself is still, which is a big thing for all SAB teks, then there will be barely any contams going into it. Gravity will surely let contams settle down. In an ideal environment, there's like barely anything going in via arm holes. The majority of contams come from the user, as Kizzle said in the last comment.

With this in mind, we know that the most contams will be coming from us. Thus, we want to limit the amount of contams coming off of us. Small armholes will create a piston effect as your arms move in and out. This will create massive airflow around your dirty af arms. It's for this reason larger armholes work better. As said earlier, your arms are constantly going in and out of the box. The less shit coming off of them, the better.

All you gotta do is shroomery search "piston effect" and you'll get the answers you want.


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Offlineverum subsequentis
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: Mad Season]
    #25939801 - 04/17/19 11:49 AM (5 years, 8 months ago)

I'm mainly just hopping in to save this thread to show a friend but....

Gravity and air currents. That's my answer.

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InvisibleSmartattack
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: verum subsequentis]
    #25940033 - 04/17/19 02:03 PM (5 years, 8 months ago)

You could blow a big bong hit into one or Chuck a cloud from your vape into it and see how the air reacts to your arm movements vs how it acts in front of you on your couch in the middle of an open room. Maybe a good video demo idea.


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InvisiblemushboyMDiscord
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: Smartattack]
    #25940035 - 04/17/19 02:05 PM (5 years, 8 months ago)

a fun thread with lots of why SABs work talk:deal:

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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: What's the science behind the functionality of the SAB?? [Re: sillypsilocybe] * 1
    #25940140 - 04/17/19 03:19 PM (5 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

sillypsilocybe said:
Thanks for the response SFS, but I guess my question is more in regards to the giant arm homes that I've seen cut into the sides of SABs. Even in Bod's videos, he's reaching inside the SAB with only gloves on, and yet there's clearly gotta be contaminates flowing into the box from the giant arm holes that he's cut into the sides.

So is the user hoping that they spray the sides and bottom with soapy water, that everything that's going to drift into the SAB from the giant arm holes are going to stick to the sides and bottom, and not drift and land into open petri dishes, or open grain jars??



There's stuff going in. When those particles hit the relatively still and turbulence free air they fall downwards as gravity has more of an affect on particles not kept aloft by air currents.

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