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Offlinelollerskeeball
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Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures
    #25649833 - 12/01/18 03:23 AM (4 months, 15 days ago)

I just posted this to my journal, but then thought this could either help someone else, or perhaps I've made a mistake here and someone could point that out?

I've not had a ton of grows, but each time the conversions and mixtures have gotten to my head. I'm not a smart man, but I know what mixing is... So I tried my best to simplify it before I go to fruiting this time.

I fully intend to use this formula for mixing my substrate in a few days so if you think this is wonky as hell, please let me know.




This formula is for Coir/Verm substrates and is based around Damion5050's Coir Tek.

In the original tek a 15 quart substrate is the end result, not including water. Water adds up to 50% of the bulk substrate that is not spawn. Well, roughly. The tek shows 4QT of water, but the general consensus on the site seems to be that the mixture is a bit too dry, so people have said to add an extra quart to it when following the tek.

So Damion5050's community-modified mixture would be:

5QT Spawn, 8QT Coir, 2QT Verm, & 5QT Water for a total of 15QT of Substrate (20 if leaving the water out bothers you). Remember, the water is not included in the substrate ratio, which happens to be 1:2 in this case. It should also be noted that the non-spawn substrate is at a 4:1 coir to verm ratio.



To begin, breaking down this recipe can help simplify the mixture for different ratios. If we know how much spawn we have to work with and the ratio we want to use, we can plug in a few variables to find the rest of the mixture if we know how the recipe works.

Substrate - Spawn = Bulk Substrate

Bulk Substrate ÷ 5 = Verm

So then Bulk Substrate - Verm = Coir

and Water = Bulk Substrate ÷ 2

on line 2, we divide by 5 because, for a 4:1 ratio, there are 5 total parts and doing so will give us the amount of a single part, which is our vermiculite amount.

On line 4 we used the rule of thumb gleaned from Damoin5050's tek and the community effort, again that the water amount should be about 5QT for a total end result of a 15QT substrate. This ends up being 50% of the non-spawn bulk substrate amount.

But, we should take care to note that we can't make the connection between the spawn being 5QT in Damion's and the water also being 5QT, because Spawn ≠ Water. The water amount must be half of the non-spawn substrate, because the spawn:sub ratio will change the amount of water needed and we want the water to match that required by our coir/verm.



Knowing all of this info gives us the power to do a couple of things. We can calculate a mixture for any spawn amount, so long as we can decide on what we want our ratio to be. Or, we could also find out the required spawn amount by knowing how much end substrate we want and then picking a spawn to substrate ratio.

In both cases, we need the ratio. To illustrate how this works, let's calculate for Damion's.

We want to make a 1:2 ratio with 5QT of spawn.

So, we work out our end Substrate from the ratio by multiplying, because 1:2 is one unit of 5 against two units of 5, in this case, making 5x3=15.

This number scales depending on the ratio:

1:1 is Spawn x2
1:2 is Spawn x3
1:3 is Spawn x4
1:4 is Spawn x5

If we wanted to make Damion's tek a 1:3 mixture based off of the spawn amount, it would go as follows

5QT spawn X4 = 20QT substrate
20QT substrate - 5QT spawn = 15QT bulk substrate
15QT bulk substrate ÷ 2 = 7.5QT Water
15QT bulk substrate ÷ 5 = 3QT verm
15QT bulk substrate - 3QT verm = 12QT Coir

This results in a larger substrate recipe than the original, because our concern was with spawn and not substrate volume.



BUT, the fun isn't over because the ending substrate would be the same total amount as the original if we were to make Damion's tek a 1:3 ratio, instead based off of the amount of substrate we needed.

If we knew that we needed 15QT of substrate at a 1:3 ratio, we would plug them in as follows:

15Qt substrate ÷4 (because our ratio) = 3.75QT of spawn
15 substrate - 3.75 spawn = 11.25QT non-spawn sub
11.25 non-spawn sub ÷ 5 = 2.25QT verm
11.25 non-spawn sub - 2.25 verm = 9QT coir
since 11.25 + 2.25 = 13.5, and 13.5÷2= 6.75, we need 6.75QT of water


This is great, because you can easily find the ideal substrate amount for any sized tub once you actually get the holes drilled. Fill it up with water to the desired substrate level, measure the amount. That's how much substrate you need overall. From there you can find the spawn amount for a specific tub with your favorite ratio and it all falls into place without having to scale Damion's down.

I can just easily know that I have 3QT of spawn and that I want a 1:3 ratio.
3x4=12Qt substrate
12-3=9Qt non-spawn substrate
9÷5=1.8Qt verm
9-1.8=7.2Qt coir
with 9÷2=4.5Qt water



So, let me know what you think. I know mixing substrates doesn't have to be oh-so exact outside of field capacity and spawn to substrate ratio, but I just like to take out the guess work as much as possible, personally. Hope this is in some way helpful.


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Offlinekaizen_path
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: lollerskeeball]
    #25711774 - 12/30/18 03:22 PM (3 months, 17 days ago)

Thanks for sharing.  :takingnotes:


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Offlinelollerskeeball
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: kaizen_path]
    #25731148 - 01/08/19 09:06 AM (3 months, 8 days ago)

Quote:

kaizen_path said:
Thanks for sharing.  :takingnotes:





No problem! I'm about to harvest the first flush on a 1:4 I put together with this and things have been going well so far on the moisture content front.


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InvisiblebodhisattaM
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: lollerskeeball]
    #25731163 - 01/08/19 09:17 AM (3 months, 8 days ago)

I didn't read it but it should take two sentences to make a formula for substrate mixtures

Mix spawn with equal to 4x more substrate. Make it 2-6 inches thick. It's not rocket science you shouldn't even need to bother doing math at all period. Use a brick of coir 4-7 jars of spawn and put it in a tub


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OfflineAphonic
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: lollerskeeball]
    #25936493 - 04/15/19 03:56 PM (4 days, 5 hours ago)

Very helpful for people that don't use the "standard" sized brick of coir or use a different size tub to where the "standard" sized brick of coir could be too little or too much. In my case, I have a much larger brick of coir then 650g, I also use different size tubs then the techs use so to break the formula apart for my needs before I begin keeps from wasting time and product.


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OfflineLeon Sabanna
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: Aphonic]
    #25936551 - 04/15/19 04:28 PM (4 days, 4 hours ago)

That is SO overly complicated! By the time it would take to read, take notes, and study all that you could of mixed up, colonized, and harvested 10 tubs.
Seriously how hard is it to figure out a basic 1:1 to 1:4 spawn to coir ratio?
This hobby isn’t that difficult.


--------------------
“You don’t have a soul, you are a sole. You have a body.”
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OfflineEl ChupacabraS
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: Aphonic]
    #25936564 - 04/15/19 04:44 PM (4 days, 4 hours ago)

Quote:

Aphonic said:
Very helpful for people that don't use the "standard" sized brick of coir or use a different size tub to where the "standard" sized brick of coir could be too little or too much. In my case, I have a much larger brick of coir then 650g, I also use different size tubs then the techs use so to break the formula apart for my needs before I begin keeps from wasting time and product.




You could just use a prybar to break up a bigger block and weigh out approximately 650g of coir instead of hunting down appropriate tubs for different amounts of sub.
There are also substrate calculators like this http://substratecalculator.weebly.com/
I have no clue how well those calculators work. I always did like bod said.


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InvisiblebodhisattaM
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: El Chupacabra]
    #25936574 - 04/15/19 04:49 PM (4 days, 4 hours ago)

I use cross multiplication for anything different than 650g of coir :shrug:


--------------------
Everything you need in one spot.

My Q&A thread. Ask me questions here rather than in Private Message
Bod's chat thread
First rule of mushroom cultivation. Get high on your own supply.


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OfflineAphonic
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: bodhisatta]
    #25936662 - 04/15/19 05:39 PM (4 days, 3 hours ago)

I dont search for particular size tubs...i get what i get, I use math to get the right ratios for the size I have on hand. 650g may be not enough or too much for mine.


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InvisiblebodhisattaM
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: Aphonic]
    #25936677 - 04/15/19 05:50 PM (4 days, 3 hours ago)

as long as your substrate depth is between an inch and six inches you'll be fine


--------------------
Everything you need in one spot.

My Q&A thread. Ask me questions here rather than in Private Message
Bod's chat thread
First rule of mushroom cultivation. Get high on your own supply.


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OfflineEl ChupacabraS
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: Aphonic]
    #25936684 - 04/15/19 05:56 PM (4 days, 3 hours ago)

Quote:

Aphonic said:
I dont search for particular size tubs...i get what i get, I use math to get the right ratios for the size I have on hand. 650g may be not enough or too much for mine.



My bad I misunderstood you Aphonic

Nothing to see here move along


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InvisibleAlchemycologist
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: El Chupacabra]
    #25937026 - 04/15/19 08:52 PM (4 days, 7 minutes ago)

If you have too much coir just leave it in the bucket or put it in a bag or dry it out and store it or something.

You're making the easiest part of this whole process a pain in the dick.


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OfflineEl ChupacabraS
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: Alchemycologist]
    #25937560 - 04/16/19 06:36 AM (3 days, 14 hours ago)

Multiplication shouldn't be that hard:shrug:
If it is, I linked a tool. If that's still hard then I guess it's not the easiest part for some people.


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Onlinemushboy
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: lollerskeeball]
    #25937781 - 04/16/19 09:54 AM (3 days, 11 hours ago)

Quote:

lollerskeeball said:
The water amount must be half of the non-spawn substrate, because the spawn:sub ratio will change the amount of water needed and we want the water to match that required by our coir/verm.





:confused:

this is confusing me. you should not make the connection about 5qts spawn and 5qts water because their is no connection.

spawn has nothing to do with how you prep bulk sub. its always prepped the exact same always. has nothing to do with the amount of spawn being used.


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Offlinetripdawg420
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Re: Calculating Bulk Substrate Mixtures [Re: mushboy]
    #25937883 - 04/16/19 11:20 AM (3 days, 9 hours ago)

:zombie3:


--------------------
HUSTLER
How U Survive This Life Everyday Resourcefully
epic GT mono tub
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/17277772

wbs tek
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/11525679
coir tek
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/11917410
results :thumbup:


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