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Re: Astronomy [Re: chibiabos]
    #25932935 -

chibiabos said:
I'm really not sure why you're worrying about the standard model either.


so no link then?


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evil always wins, good can only do good, evil will lie and cheat until it fools good into doing evil

freedom is the ability to take wrong action, right actions are constrained by nature

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Re: Astronomy [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #25932938 -

LogicaL Chaos said:
If LIGO isn't recording Gravity Waves, then how do scientists record Gravitation?


they dont, its all inferred


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evil always wins, good can only do good, evil will lie and cheat until it fools good into doing evil

freedom is the ability to take wrong action, right actions are constrained by nature

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Re: Astronomy [Re: killingravensun]
    #25932947 -

Lots of science comes from indirect evidence. Just look at studies on particle physics. Doesn't mean its useless because its indirect evidence.

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Re: Astronomy [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #25933804 -

LogicaL Chaos said:
Lots of science comes from indirect evidence. Just look at studies on particle physics. Doesn't mean its useless because its indirect evidence.


wrong, lots of opinion comes from indirect evidence, and yes particle physics is mostly opinion about observed results, those opinions are often wrong but that wont stop the stupid scientists, as long as they keep getting paid for no results they will continue


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evil always wins, good can only do good, evil will lie and cheat until it fools good into doing evil

freedom is the ability to take wrong action, right actions are constrained by nature

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Re: Astronomy [Re: killingravensun]
    #25934258 -

I'm guessing that you didn't do too well in math and physics?


Good introduction to philosophy of science, by the way:

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Re: Astronomy [Re: chibiabos]
    #25934842 -

chibiabos said:
I'm guessing that you didn't do too well in math and physics?



well then you are as dumb as you seem


--------------------
evil always wins, good can only do good, evil will lie and cheat until it fools good into doing evil

freedom is the ability to take wrong action, right actions are constrained by nature

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Re: Astronomy [Re: killingravensun] * 1
    #25935160 -

Watch the personalisms, please.


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Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici

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Re: Astronomy [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #25939174 -

Eddie Bravo said Space is Fake. It's just a bunch of lights when you look into it...

:trolldance:

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Re: Astronomy [Re: Magicman69]
    #25942418 -



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evil always wins, good can only do good, evil will lie and cheat until it fools good into doing evil

freedom is the ability to take wrong action, right actions are constrained by nature

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Re: Astronomy [Re: killingravensun]
    #25944106 -



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evil always wins, good can only do good, evil will lie and cheat until it fools good into doing evil

freedom is the ability to take wrong action, right actions are constrained by nature

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Re: Astronomy [Re: killingravensun] * 1
    #25959063 -

killingravensun said:
chibiabos said:
The idea of a black hole results pretty directly from general relativity.  The prediction dates back to way before there was any evidence for them and the concept follows pretty easily from the observations that provided the motivation to develop theories special and general relativity in the first place.


so what? because someones pet theory is popular but has no evidence we should just whistle and move on? thats not how science works

as for evidence, wrong, there is no evidence for black holes, inference is not evidence, its conjecture



What exactly are you calling evidence? What could be, in your terms, called evidence?

I don't know which proves of general relativity you don't consider as evidences: Mercury's orbit precision, decreasing of the period in binary pulsars, gravitational lensing (which perfectly fits with so many other observations in astronomy), gravitational redshift...

But still we atu ally DO either have evidences for black holes, since quasars, blazars and radio galaxies were detected. Gas orbiting galaxies centers with huge velocities and emission in X allows us to estimate the mass in the centers: thousands of millions of solar masses concentrated in a place smaller than the solar system.

And recently happened that when you register the emissions of that centers with resolution enough, you obtain something which is exactly predicted by general relativity models. The fact that we just perceive visible light with our eyes is only related to the maximum solar emission is on that side of the electromagnetic spectrum. Visible light has nothing special, any other EM emission is as relevant, including XRay, Gamma, Micro or IR.

About the data processing, maybe you should read a little bit about how they took  three different teams isolated from each other with different algorithms which reconstructed three similar and consistent images. Specially when you could recognize the same elements in each of them as in the final one.

Well, we have a "pretty" solid theory being the only one that explains and gives a model for so many empiric observations. We have empiric evidences that in the center of galaxies there actually ARE a huge mass concentrated into a ridiculous space. We have LIGO giving consistent with the theory proofs. And we have emissions from the place which gave a consistent image of how that place should look like if it where an BH predicted by the theory. I really would like you to explain what do you call an "evidence"...

Maybe you should to study what the people who is making real science studied and consider the facts that they did for reaching conclusions. Specially when you are probably sending your posts from a computer/phone made by using the knowledge which that community gave us, and when it seems to work. Do you think there is an "evidence" for it? Or maybe do you have ever seen an electromagnetic modulated wave by yourself?

I don't think that we have to trust in everything that modern science does. However, we have access to knowledge enough to contrast the real information, with real arguments. I just thought that you weren't giving the kind of arguments that someone who spent dozens of hours studying the topic would give.

That would be my last message about the topic.
Sincerely,
J.

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Re: Astronomy [Re: josevzs]
    #25965080 -

Im curious how much our knowledge is going to improve in the next 50 years and what changes it will makes to society


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"When a man is denied the right to live the life he believes in, he has no choice but to become an outlaw." - Nelson Mandela

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Re: Astronomy [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #26017128 -

Watch NASA's Unexplained Files and just learned about "Fast Radio Bursts": https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2019/01/09/fast-radio-bursts-more-bizarre-signals-detected-outer-space/2526767002/

Unreal. Wonder whats causing these fast, intense radio bursts. :strokebeard:

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Re: Astronomy [Re: LogicaL Chaos] * 1
    #26136514 -

enjoy it while you can...



--------------------
evil always wins, good can only do good, evil will lie and cheat until it fools good into doing evil

freedom is the ability to take wrong action, right actions are constrained by nature

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Re: Astronomy [Re: killingravensun]
    #26146220 -

SETI has a new array of telescope to called VERITAS which stands for Very Energetic Radiation Imaging Telescope Array System. They are looking for "alien lasers":  https://earthsky.org/space/breakthrough-listen-seti-optical-beacons-technosignatures

This is very exciting. Imagine if they detect some Very Energetic Radiation signals. Could find ET life out in our cosmic neighborhood.

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Re: Astronomy [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #26146330 -

seems like the odds are that most life in the universe is not using consciousness in the same way we earth humans are, for example we cannot communicate with the vast majority of life forms here on earth, only recently have we been able to have limited commmunication with our close cousins like apes, if there were a "planet of the apes" they wouldnt be trying to communicate with aliens just as here on earth they dont seem to be trying, most species dont try to communicate with other species at least as we understand communication

and if the aliens are far advanced then odds are they communicate in a way we cannot fathom, perhaps a form of telepathy, which we would never recognize as communication

but maybe there are human like life forms out there that are much the same as us, and if we contact them and maybe they come here then god help us all, we earthlings are pretty fucked up with the wars and pollution and the rest, the aliens we contact may be no better and will come to enslave us or eat us, or maybe they find us so contemptable that they just kill us all so we dont spread out and become competition and pollute the rest of the galaxy


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evil always wins, good can only do good, evil will lie and cheat until it fools good into doing evil

freedom is the ability to take wrong action, right actions are constrained by nature

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Re: Astronomy [Re: killingravensun] * 1
    #26146494 -

That was the main thesis of Cixin Liu in his "Three-Body" trilogy. He basically assumes that our universe is one of war and conquest, and that as an alien civilization becomes aware of a counterpart in an earlier stage of development, its primary objective becomes to destroy it. If a weaker planet discovers a stronger, its motivation is to hide, if it has any awareness of what is really going on. All civilizations care about in Liu's cosmos is how to be top-dog, and there are no alliances. His theory is that this is the only possible route evolution could have taken in the universe, and that everyone must follow it.

Of course, these books are fictitious, but it's an intriguing idea.


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Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici

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Re: Astronomy [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #26146536 -

i will try to look into that trilogy, not much for fiction but some fiction is prereality so its good for perspective

i grew up with star trek, i know a lot of people did, it would be nice to think that we will become peaceful explorers of space, finding other like minded life forms to join us, having a prime directive that forbids exploitation, but in reality we have the powers that be getting ready to mine asteroids for their various metals and minerals that will end up here on earth as just so much more pollution, the insanity of it all is lost on most people i think

we, humans, give our energy to the rich guys, they use our labor to build a space exploration system, a system which creates massive amounts of pollution on the front end and also rains it down on us with every launch, the rich guys then use that system to go find more pollutants to bring back to earth so they can get even richer, then the rich guys start talking about colonizing mars, maybe to get away from the pollution or more likely just to rape it for its resources, total batshit crazy


--------------------
evil always wins, good can only do good, evil will lie and cheat until it fools good into doing evil

freedom is the ability to take wrong action, right actions are constrained by nature

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Re: Astronomy [Re: killingravensun] * 1
    #26151563 -

I love astronomy.

I wish I would have focused in school.  I want to be an astrophysicist. Oh well


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Hi this is the late great elemenetflip8/m.o.d.i.z.u other profile.


I want to start fresh

And having an inbox is nice

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Re: Astronomy [Re: Uzidom] * 1
    #26165001 -

I love astronomy too! I have a Dobsonian telescope and was just looking at Saturn and Jupiter a few days ago.  The mission approved by Nasa to Europa and the James Webb Space telescope are two upcoming missions I'm very excited to see the results of.

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General Interest > Science and Technology
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