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InvisibleShenmue
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Drying Panaeolus cyanescens
    #25891679 - 03/23/19 10:45 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

This question is only for people that have successfully grown panaeolus cyanescens. I've been reading that panaeolus cyanescens is a fragile species of mushroom. It contains more psilocin than psilocybin. Several people on the dmt nexus have claimed that they dramatically decreased the potency of panaeolus cyanescens from using a oven and food dehydrator. Apparently it can't handle heat the way that cubes can. They said that anything over room temperature is bad for psilocin. Should I purchase the Cabela's Six-Tray Heavy-Duty Dehydrator that can do 80°f-160 or should I buy the Excalibur 4 tray dehydrator that does 95°f and up?? The excalibur is built better but it can't go down to 80°f. Panaeolus cyanescens is going to be the main species I grow so I want the best drying method possible. I already purchased 2 cheaper dehydrators. One broke and the other one runs way hotter than its supposed to. What are your thoughts on this. This question is for people that grow pans lol.


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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25892656 - 03/23/19 08:34 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

I guess I'll have to decide on my own 😂


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OfflineDnDRnD
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25892693 - 03/23/19 09:12 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

I plan to use a nesco I think its called it has 94-156 degrees Fahrenheit control, I figure thats a good range, hell I'll probably still put it at 156 for pans


--------------------
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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #25892742 - 03/23/19 09:46 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Just dont buy a presto! I purchased one that's adjustable and it runs at the wrong temperature. Test the temperature and if it reads wrong send it back. I'm reading to many mixed messages on drying panaeolus cyanescens.


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OfflineIgnorantOne
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25893139 - 03/24/19 03:01 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

If they are that temp sensitive then air dry with a fan in the dryest room of the house. You could try the damprid method too but that shit is dangerous and not honestly worth the risk to your mushies.


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OfflineDnDRnD
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: IgnorantOne]
    #25893290 - 03/24/19 08:48 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Quote:

IgnorantOne said:
If they are that temp sensitive then air dry with a fan in the dryest room of the house. You could try the damprid method too but that shit is dangerous and not honestly worth the risk to your mushies.




I doubt that they are that temp sensitive as the alkaloids are stable up to around 400 degrees Fahrenheit, air drying is no longer recommended as a reliable method for drying


--------------------
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https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24126032

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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #25893343 - 03/24/19 09:48 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

The dmt nexus says the melting point is 219.2 degrees fahrenheit for psilocin. If people are dehydrating at 160°f in my opinion that's kind of pushing it. My dehydrator runs at the wrong temperature and I'm sure it's not the only one. Even if it's not destroying the psilocin there's other alkaloids that it might effect. Who the f--k knows lol. Half of you think heat doesn't matter and the other half thinks it does... I guess I'll just run it at 80°f..


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OfflineDnDRnD
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25893352 - 03/24/19 09:58 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

That's not a true temperature, it degrades alot higher hell people deep fry cubes with no potency loss


--------------------
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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #25893379 - 03/24/19 10:18 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Actually it is the correct temperature, take a look. https://wiki.dmt-nexus.me/Psychedelic_Compounds_Chemical_and_Physical_Properties

Psilocybin melting point is 220-228°c
Psilocin melting point is 103-104°C 


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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25893397 - 03/24/19 10:33 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

If heat doesn't matter then why do people keep their mushrooms in the freezer?

Dude I'm not saying that you're wrong. I'm just trying to learn and get to the bottom of this question. I once made a alcohol tincture with cubes. After i evaporated it to the correct level I noticed that there was sugar floating around in the alcohol. It bothered me so I used a crock pot to heat the extraction vessel to see if I could melt the sugar. The alcohol in the vessel turned blue and when I tried to use it I couldn't feel anything. Maybe it was something else, who knows. It just seems like some mushroom species might be more sensitive than people think.. you have to remember that I'm concerned about panaeolus cyanescens not cubes.


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Offlinedungdigger
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25893621 - 03/24/19 12:42 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Hey Fam,

I am just starting out with pan cyans myself.

I'm based in Asia, and started out with a single water buffalo patty that pinned. I broke it up, fed it straw and more shit in my outdoor garden, and got some good prints from a dozen or so fruits over this last month, but in my excitement, my spore tek was amateurish, so I'll likely need multiple transfers on my potato flake agar to get something clean enough to spawn to my BRF/Verm jars.
I'm going to clone to agar too, nothing specific, just to get my feet wet cloning, probably just use the next handsome shroom that pops up.

I had my initial shrooms ID on here, and have eaten all of them!
Never had enough to get more than mild effects, 1.5g fresh, barely alerts me, but on the plus side, I'm not dead yet!

They could be any number of the panoleus race, only microscopy would tell, I may send some spores to one of the experts here from my actual farmed fruit, when that happens.

Feel free to PM me for any sensitive details you might want to share going forward. Maybe we could trade spores down the line?

I can't speak to heat (teas, soups, pizzas) destroying the magic, but my own research leads me to conclude this may be myth, it's an ongoing debate though, I will hopefully soon have enough homegrown fruit to draw my own conclusions.

So far, tea seems to be the route I deal with best. Raw is vile, mainly because the taste lingers on and on, and does not improve with time directly after ingesting. Gel caps took forever (3 hours?!) Tea seems to work best, I also squeeze in some fresh lemon. Mind you, I've been using minute amount so far, just the sporadic buttons that fruit under my bushes for now.

I have nothing but a fan to dry them with, I've been advised against Sun drying, also we generally can't get a lot of the fancy kit in Asia, importing it can be prohibitive thanks to protectionist taxes, some items are taxed at double their value, it's fucked up.

I have a tek for making a scratch built 'Biltong' machine, (biltong is like beef jerky, only insanely better) it should work for mushrooms too, plus, I miss that moist, rich, Biltong from my expat childhood days in Africa.


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OfflineIgnorantOne
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #25893831 - 03/24/19 02:30 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Yeah man, I hear you. Still, just trying to offer a means to an end. I dehydrate and if I do not have enough to fill a tray I will open-air dry with no issues. That being said, I will only open-air dry in the winter. Summer is no bueno due to 90% humidity.


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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: IgnorantOne]
    #25894039 - 03/24/19 03:53 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)



Edited by Shenmue (03/24/19 03:53 PM)


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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25894104 - 03/24/19 04:17 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

All mushrooms shall worship me!!!! FOR ALL TIME!!! It puts the manure on its skin or it gets the dehydrator again!!!! 



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OfflineSFS96S
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25895142 - 03/25/19 02:38 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

I really don’t think dehydrating them at 160f will hurt them at all. The same chemicals are in cubes it doesn’t matter the concentration of the chemicals. Most links I found said melting point was around 175c for psilocin but who knows. I know I boil the fuck out of my shrooms with no potency loss so I think everyone just overthinks it. Just my 2 cents:shrug:


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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: SFS96]
    #25895710 - 03/25/19 01:14 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

That's actually not true. Panaeolus cyanescens has alkaloids that cubes don't have. Also Panaeolus cyanescens has more psilocin than psilocybin while cubes have more psilocybin than psilocin. If they had the same alkaloids people wouldn't bother growing panaeolus cyanescens..


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OfflineDnDRnD
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25895727 - 03/25/19 01:24 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Shenmue said:
That's actually not true. Panaeolus cyanescens has alkaloids that cubes don't have. Also Panaeolus cyanescens has more psilocin than psilocybin while cubes have more psilocybin than psilocin. If they had the same alkaloids people wouldn't bother growing panaeolus cyanescens..




People would still grow pans because theyre stronger, they all contain psilocybin, psilocin, baeocystin, and norbaeocystin as alkaloids


--------------------
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https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24126032

Pastywhytes No Pour Agar Tek (PastyPlates)
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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #25897463 - 03/26/19 09:32 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

It seems like people think it's a different experience.


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OfflineDnDRnD
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25897716 - 03/26/19 11:59 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Shenmue said:
It seems like people think it's a different experience.




Well that's because it has different ratios of those alkaloids then cubes, but drying at normal temps should be fine I mean hell people make tea out of pans and it works fine, which you can always make tea with fresh pans and freeze it for later if your that worried


--------------------
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https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24126032

Pastywhytes No Pour Agar Tek (PastyPlates)
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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #25898926 - 03/26/19 10:33 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

I'll get back to you in about a month lol. Ill get some experience with pans before I decided to argue about them lol.


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OfflineDnDRnD
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25898929 - 03/26/19 10:35 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Im just going off of stuff I've read on here and wiki


--------------------
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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #25899353 - 03/27/19 05:23 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Then you don't know what you're talking about, just like me 😂. I asked for opinions from panaeolus cultivators and only cube growers replied lol. I've done a ton of research and almost all pan growers thinks it's a different experience. Your body doesn't have to break anything down so it's a smoother experience. I'll find out..


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OfflineDnDRnD
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25899484 - 03/27/19 08:39 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Actually i do know what im talking about? The information is readily available dude and yes your body still has to break stuff down and again it's a cleaner experience so to speak due to differing alkaloid ratios, but the alkaloids are stable up to 400 degrees Fahrenheit (according to bod) so you can dehydrate like normal or if your really worried make tea with them fresh and freeze for later


--------------------
Bods Easy AF Oat Prep Tek
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24126032

Pastywhytes No Pour Agar Tek (PastyPlates)
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19208976

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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #25901490 - 03/28/19 08:51 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Psilocybin melting point is 220-228°c
Psilocin melting point is 103-104°C 

How many more times do I need to say it lol. Psilocin has a different melting point than psilocybin! Lol


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OfflineDnDRnD
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25901493 - 03/28/19 08:55 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

103 degrees Celsius is still 217 degrees Fahrenheit dude, dehydrating on 160-170 won't cause any problem especially since thats melting point not boiling or sublimation point


--------------------
Bods Easy AF Oat Prep Tek
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24126032

Pastywhytes No Pour Agar Tek (PastyPlates)
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19208976

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OfflineIgnorantOne
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25902169 - 03/28/19 03:44 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

You do know 100c is the boiling point of water right? No dehydrator is going to get that high(this could be bullshit). Well, none that I am aware of. The temps on your dehydrator should be in Fahrenheit which could cause some confusion if you are not familiar with the differences between Celcius and Fahrenheit.

You get used to it as you go. I have made a habit of double checking temps when I read stuff since I was taught Fahrenheit but a lot of documentation uses Celcius.


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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #25910910 - 04/02/19 06:02 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

I just tested a couple dehydrators. They run a lot hotter than their supposed to. I bet if you paid under $100 for your dehydrator that its wrong. How much do you want to bet?


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Offlinepoisoned
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25910917 - 04/02/19 06:08 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Why does it even matter?

Melting point is not a point where it starts decomposing. It's melting point. Is sugar any less sweet if you melt it?

Also, it's quite hard to get over 100ºC if your contents are not bone dry yet. Water evaporation will keep it at 100ºC


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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: poisoned]
    #25910939 - 04/02/19 06:44 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

I always use desiccant when drying, I put a layer at the bottom with a separation layer of perforated tinfoil in a airtight container.

I also store them this way they keep for years and don't lose any potency.


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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: dr psilocybin] * 1
    #25911330 - 04/02/19 12:28 PM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Quote:

dr psilocybin said:
I always use desiccant when drying, I put a layer at the bottom with a separation layer of perforated tinfoil in a airtight container.

I also store them this way they keep for years and don't lose any potency.




This is an old and extremely outdated method that doesn't work reliably for most people

I dont care if my dehydrator runs hotter then its labelled because potency wont begin to degrade till around 300-500 degrees Fahrenheit


--------------------
Bods Easy AF Oat Prep Tek
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24126032

Pastywhytes No Pour Agar Tek (PastyPlates)
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Offlinedr psilocybin
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #25912737 - 04/03/19 05:48 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

whatever works for you dude, I have never had a problem this way :confused:


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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: dr psilocybin] * 1
    #25912892 - 04/03/19 08:21 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

If you live in a super dry and hot climate then I could see it working but all the trusted cultivators recommend dehydrators because air and desiccant drying doesnt get all the moisture out which can lead to mushrooms rotting and losing potency, you want to dry them as quickly as possible to "lock in" the alkaloids so to speak


--------------------
Bods Easy AF Oat Prep Tek
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/24126032

Pastywhytes No Pour Agar Tek (PastyPlates)
https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/19208976

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Offlinedr psilocybin
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #25913234 - 04/03/19 11:21 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

I live in the UK so not the hottest here at the moment, thanks for the advice another thing to add to the shopping list. :thumbup:


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InvisibleShenmue
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: dr psilocybin]
    #25914069 - 04/03/19 07:22 PM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Everyone on the dmtnexus says stay far away from heat when it comes to panaeolus cyanescens. I looked all over shroomery.org and cant find much when it comes to this topic. Most people don't grow pans so that probably has something to do with it. There's more alkaloids in panaeolus cyanescens than the ones we're talking about. Maybe the other alkaloids are sensitive to heat 🤷‍♂️. I'm going to dry half with heat and the other half without heat then I'll compare the potency 👍.


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OfflineDnDRnD
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25914111 - 04/03/19 07:56 PM (1 year, 10 months ago)

They're the same alkaloids just present in a higher amount, its still psilocybin, psilocin, baeocystin, and norbaeocystin


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OfflineSFS96S
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: Shenmue]
    #25914613 - 04/04/19 02:00 AM (1 year, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Shenmue said:
Everyone on the dmtnexus says stay far away from heat when it comes to panaeolus cyanescens. I looked all over shroomery.org and cant find much when it comes to this topic. Most people don't grow pans so that probably has something to do with it. There's more alkaloids in panaeolus cyanescens than the ones we're talking about. Maybe the other alkaloids are sensitive to heat 🤷‍♂️. I'm going to dry half with heat and the other half without heat then I'll compare the potency 👍.




That’s because they don’t know what there talking about :shrug:
If you really want to know message a experienced pan grower like jakeonacid and ask. He grows fuck tons :mushroom2:


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OfflinePhony Phone
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Re: Drying Panaeolus cyanescens [Re: DnDRnD]
    #27053391 - 11/23/20 07:29 AM (3 months, 11 days ago)

so, can we finally get some definite answer on this from some pan expert? Opinions on the matter are divided but seems like most agree on a lower-than-cubensis drying temp, some even resort to cool air drying. Does it even matter?

(I know this is a necrobump but its relevant and didnt feel like opening a thread)


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