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OfflineGorlax
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ATF * 1
    #25870911 - 03/13/19 12:29 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

It’s funny how hated the ATF is. I follow a few gun pages on instagram and whenever something with the ATF happens they go off about how the ATF is fucked up and how they abuse the constitution. They do have a terrible track record and if you read the official instagram of the ATF  98% of the comments mention Waco or Ruby Ridge. I do think the ATF is a far reaching government agency. Not sure why they need to exist as we have the FBI ?

The comments are seriously hilarious read them.

Also to own a full auto machine gun or become a gun smith you need an ATF tax stamp and allow them access to your life. Essentially they can bust into your house without a search warrant at any time. Kind of crazy they allow it as long as you pay their special tax.

You think the ATF was justified at Waco and Ruby Ridge?



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Offlinetwighead
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Re: ATF [Re: Gorlax]
    #25870959 - 03/13/19 01:15 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Well to be fair - if you run a restaurant, you have to allow a health inspector in at any time... OSHA inspectors handle inspections of factories and other businesses which need to be operated to a degree of properness and safety - or yeah, people get hurt. It's important that they're independent agencies or employers will happily cut corners.

Likewise, if your business is in creating/importing/exporting firearms, it makes sense that you'd be letting in a regulatory agency to check the legality/safety of the practice... Otherwise, what's to stop a gun manufacturer from seriously abusing their position (safety is also a concern for a manufacturer..) - which does have more intense repercussion than a corrupt shoe manufacturing company.


And if someone is seriously slangin' a bunch of unregistered/illegal weapons - fuck them, there are people who shouldn't have guns - sorry republicans :rolleyes:

On the other hand, the ATF probably just seizes them and sells them to a cartel or some shit - they aren't angels either by any means, but the existence of the agency in some form - does have solid reasoning.


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Offlinetwighead
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Re: ATF [Re: twighead] * 1
    #25870963 - 03/13/19 01:27 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

As far as Ruby Ridge - I think they should've been more patient and taken out Weaver and been way more careful about his wife and kids... No mercy for the Aryan Nations pieces of shit up there in Idaho.

Waco was far worse, as there wasn't near the level of investigation that took place with Weaver + Weaver attacked first; but similarly, if you're attempting to resist arrest against a battalion of FBI/ATF agents with your own firearms - the fuck do you expect :lol:

Not that I find the FBI's actions commendable - but you have to be serious about who you're dealing with... they are not gentle - you should not expect them to be if you have guns and you're resisting arrest for almost 2 months.

It's ultimately the men in Waco who decided to resists fault -  that casualties were incurred. Not because I think the FBI should be able to do or get away with these things, but because we all know they'll do it anyway - it's like if you had the SS at your door in the Reich - lol. Everyone knows they're fucking ruthless, and you should act as if they're going to kill you if you put up armed resistance because they probably will.


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Offlineviraldrome
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Re: ATF [Re: Gorlax] * 1
    #25871116 - 03/13/19 04:40 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Quote:

Gorlax said:


Also to own a full auto machine gun or become a gun smith you need an ATF tax stamp and allow them access to your life. Essentially they can bust into your house without a search warrant at any time. Kind of crazy they allow it as long as you pay their special tax.






They should be able to access all your medical files and check to see if you are mental too. And they should speak to your employer and your ex wife, neighbors too. And if you don't like it dont get a machine gun. Anyone attempting to obtain one should go on a list with a few agencies. The government moniter jihad chat, they should be watching you people. I don't want to see another Las Vegas. Despite the gun nut rhetoric all those public shooters /white terrorists always get their death machines from legal sources, its never the black market.


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OfflineMaverick
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Re: ATF [Re: viraldrome]
    #25871121 - 03/13/19 04:44 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Quote:

viraldrome said:
Quote:

Gorlax said:


Also to own a full auto machine gun or become a gun smith you need an ATF tax stamp and allow them access to your life. Essentially they can bust into your house without a search warrant at any time. Kind of crazy they allow it as long as you pay their special tax.






The government moniter jihad chat, they should be watching you people. I don't want to see another Las Vegas. Despite the gun nut rhetoric all those public shooters /white terrorists always get their death machines from legal sources, its never the black market.





This is ironic because it's so true- you ask a right-wing person about monitoring muslim communities and they'll be all for it- you bring up gun control and they'll try to mob lynch you in the street.


Edited by Maverick (03/13/19 04:45 AM)


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Invisiblelavod
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Re: ATF [Re: Maverick]
    #25871290 - 03/13/19 08:19 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Fuck 'em.  In 2004, the ATF determined that a 14" shoestring was a machine gun.  It took them 3 years to reverse that determination.  https://www.everydaynodaysoff.com/2010/01/25/shoestring-machine-gun/


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OfflineichugwindexS
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Re: ATF [Re: lavod]
    #25871385 - 03/13/19 09:41 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Alascan Thunder Fuck? I like that one.


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They'll be like..."yo, yo, why, why your shit sound so different?
Know'm saying why why your shit like.. on another level?
why it sound so different?" like its bad thing
And i be like why not? nigga, haha~ Kid Cudi


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OfflinePupenhause
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Re: ATF [Re: ichugwindex]
    #25871402 - 03/13/19 09:53 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

They determine minuscule details on guns that makes a law abiding gun owner a felon unless their pay a tax.  My ar9 is a pistol.  Just last year if i had shouldered the "arm brace" that looks AND FUNCTIONS as a stock, I'd have been a felon because I didn't pay $200 to get SBR stamp.  I can't put a vertical grip on it without a $200 tax stamp.  Can't have an actual defined stock on it without paying a $200 tax stamp.  I can't own a supressor which doesn't actually silence a gun(with exception of a .22 rifle) without paying a $200 tax stamp and going thru a trust. 

They are nothing more than a tax collector and they have somehow convinced themselves and liberals that their gun laws make everyone safe.  Their NFA and AOW are fucking worthless.  They are fucking worthless.


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: ATF [Re: Pupenhause]
    #25871561 - 03/13/19 11:20 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Ruby Ridge the guy was told his barrel was too short and he had to pay a 200$ tax. He said it wasn’t and they pressed charges. They then said if he lost they would take his land and his family would become homeless. That is pretty crazy for a 200$ tax.  They were authorized to kill on sight. That’s insane. They killed their dog the kid came out and killed the kid so yeah they had a stand off as most people would.

Waco they “believed” they were converting guns to full auto. Most reports say they were stockpiling weapons which isn’t illegal. I know a lot of people with probably the same or equivalent amount of guns. They authorized the use of military weapons on civilians. Through 400 flammable tear gas canisters into a wooden structure and burned nearly 80 people alive 25 of which were children. That is insane for simply having suspicion. They even lied about the tear gas until they were caught.

it truly is a tax collection gang. If someone wants to use their full auto guns for harm they just have to pay the tax it isn’t preventing anything.


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OfflineJenny Baker
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Re: ATF [Re: Gorlax]
    #25871565 - 03/13/19 11:22 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

how do crazy people acquire guns?  it's like magic like u can't just go into big 5 and buy a gun, i woudn't be allowed to own a gun :smirk:


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: ATF [Re: Jenny Baker]
    #25871614 - 03/13/19 11:57 AM (2 months, 7 days ago)

I live in a really lax gun state and they do a pretty good job at vetting people unless you do a private sale then all you need is a government ID but if that was the case and you knew you were acquiring a gun when you know you can’t have one you are then the one breaking the law.

I recently purchased an AR15 with a “short barrel” it looks almost identical to all other AR15’s but because the barrel is literally a few inches shorter it is called a pistol. It is stupid as fuck. It has a “thordsen cheek rest” which is almost  a stock but it is illegal to shoulder it unless I pay a tax. My other AR15 is a lot nicer with a 300$ hair trigger and I can legally shoulder that. I was told by a FFL dealer i met at the range you could press it against your cheek to legally “stabilize” it. Essentially it means nothing if you can just use your cheek and not your shoulder.

I purchased the AR15 pistol from a friend for dirt cheap because it wouldn’t cycle right and found out it was simply missinf a pin in the gas chamber a fucking 1$ fix and doubles my money with it. I have no actual interest in owning an AR15 pistol but I do. I guess they are used primarily in vehicles so you don’t have to deal with a lengthy as barrel smacking into everything. The more u know.


Edited by Gorlax (03/13/19 12:18 PM)


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OfflinePupenhause
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Re: ATF [Re: Gorlax]
    #25871634 - 03/13/19 12:05 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Quote:

Gorlax said:
I live in a really lax gun state and they do a pretty good job at vetting people unless you do a private sale then all you need is a government ID but if that was the case and you knew you were acquiring a gun when you know you can’t have one you are then the one breaking the law.

I recently purchased an AR15 with a “short barrel” it looks almost identical to all other AR15’s but because the barrel is literally a few inches shorter it is called a pistol. It is stupid as fuck. It has a stock but it is illegal to shoulder it unless I pay a tax. My other AR15 is a lot nicer with a 300$ hair trigger and I can legally shoulder that. I was told by a FFL dealer i met at the range you could press it against your cheek to legally “stabilize” it. Essentially it means nothing if you can just use your cheek and not your shoulder.

I purchased the AR15 pistol from a friend for dirt cheap because it wouldn’t cycle right and found out it was simply missinf a pin in the gas chamber a fucking 1$ fix and doubles my money with it. I have no actual interest in owning an AR15 pistol but I do. I guess they are used primarily in vehicles so you don’t have to deal with a lengthy as barrel smacking into everything. The more u know.




If it has a stock and you didn't get the tax stamp, you're in possession of an sbr and now a felon.  If its a brace, it is still a pistol, but they changed the law and you can now shoulder it.  My ar9 has a 4" barrel which is what I keep in my truck, loaded and ready.  But here's the kicker, if i pay the tax and put an actual stock on it, I can't have it loaded in my truck because its now a rifle.  Literally their definition of a stock defines what kind of gun you have.


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: ATF [Re: Pupenhause]
    #25871654 - 03/13/19 12:16 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

It isn’t an an actual stock it’s a Thordsen cheek rest which is almost like a stock just didn’t think anyone would know what that was. The stupidity of it is extremely dumb. ATF is ok with them.


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OfflinePupenhause
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Re: ATF [Re: Gorlax] * 1
    #25871668 - 03/13/19 12:27 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

I know what it is.  The ATF over reaches with this shit.  It functions as a stock, but it's not a stock because they say it isn't.


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: ATF [Re: Pupenhause]
    #25871680 - 03/13/19 12:33 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Right the biggest problem is what you said. An ordinary marksmen can be shooting and based on how they “hold” the gun can be instantly a felon. That is bullshit. Also the Vegas shooter used bump stocks which are 100% legal and do not require a tax stamp so the ATF literally picks and chooses what it wants to enforce. Bump stocks are stupid as fuck and just a waste of ammo. I laugh when people show up and unload all their ammo in 5 min with them. Absolutely no fun in that unless you wanna look cool.


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OfflineichugwindexS
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Re: ATF [Re: Gorlax]
    #25871796 - 03/13/19 01:37 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Goddamn Brady bill. I still think I should legally be able to have landmines in my yard and belt fed guns


--------------------
:raver2::trippinbawelz::raver2:


They'll be like..."yo, yo, why, why your shit sound so different?
Know'm saying why why your shit like.. on another level?
why it sound so different?" like its bad thing
And i be like why not? nigga, haha~ Kid Cudi


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: ATF [Re: ichugwindex]
    #25871833 - 03/13/19 02:01 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

You can just pay a tax derrr :dawerp:


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Offlinetwighead
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Re: ATF [Re: ichugwindex]
    #25871836 - 03/13/19 02:02 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

Yeah, but weaver was a straight up card carrying nazi... so bless the ATF for atleast trying to take him down :lol:

Fucking up the Aryan nations over 1990-2008 was one of the best things the local and fed govt have done in North Idaho... they may be unrepentant rednecks, but even they banded together to rid us of Nazi fucks. I grew up seeing their bitch asses walking into restaurants with their swastika armbands, spitting on the waitresses, trying to  intimidate people...

The tragedy at Ruby Ridge was that weavers family paid for him being a fuckhead nazi. And now hes a millionaire because of it.


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OfflineTexXx
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Re: ATF [Re: Gorlax]
    #25871852 - 03/13/19 02:09 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

which Waco incdent?

The one where the government burned woman and children alive ?

or

The time they set up the bikers at twin peaks opening fire on them from a Mexican restaurant rooftop killing around 20.

They had snipers set up hours before the "fight" broke out.

& that "fight" that broke out that allowed the ATF, FBI, & Waco to open fire on anyone on the Twin Peaks property arrested & charged 180 people. Anyways the official report changed so many fucking times it is disgusting.

Read more @ agingrebel.com


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Life.


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InvisibleRobo
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Registered: 05/08/07
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Re: ATF [Re: Gorlax]
    #25871930 - 03/13/19 02:55 PM (2 months, 7 days ago)

I'm a big "Waco person" I guess, seen most of the documentaries and the mini-series. If you've listened to Boards of Canada, you're probably familiar with David Koresh and the Branch Davidians (religious doomsday cult).

It's an interesting event in American history. They executed their warrant / raid on these people with a small army of federal agents, eventually burning the place to the ground. It was an attack by the government against US citizens to flex their authority.


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