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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine]
    #26043942 -

split_by_nine said:
qman said:
split_by_nine said:
this is truly about racism. arguing economics doesnt change anyones quality of life, including yours, mine or thiers.


What's about "racism"?



the assumption that central American migrants will negatively affect the stability of "the greatest country in the world".

they speak a different language, yes. but they are people just like every person in your town or city. we all have basic necessities (food, water, shelter) and in the USA you find an abundance of these resources. thats the attraction to come here.. because we have plenty to offer our citizens and guests.

but, because we are free market capitalist economy, the only thing that seems to matter is money.

let me ask this:

do you believe money is more valuable than human life?


Most people including Bernie know that importing millions of broke third world migrants with no skills, education or language ability hurts the existing native population.

"abundance of these resources...plenty to offer our citizens and guests"

What a load of nonsense, we have tens of millions of US citizens without decent housing, health care, education and livable wages. You do realize we have a homeless crisis in the US today? I mean really, where do you come up with this fantasy?

Is money an infinite resource?  No, therefore there must be a priority list with what to do with resources. What should US tax revenue be spent on, poor US citizens or billions of poor people across the globe?  We must help our own citizens first because we have our own problems and issues.

Guess what happens when you flood tens of millions of broke third world migrants into the US?  You turn the US into a third world nation that can't help anybody, including ourselves.

I don't want to live a third world standard of living, either do other US citizens.

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine]
    #26043961 -

split_by_nine said:
qman said:
split_by_nine said:
this is truly about racism. arguing economics doesnt change anyones quality of life, including yours, mine or thiers.


What's about "racism"?



the assumption that central American migrants will negatively affect the stability of "the greatest country in the world".

they speak a different language, yes. but they are people just like every person in your town or city. we all have basic necessities (food, water, shelter) and in the USA you find an abundance of these resources. thats the attraction to come here.. because we have plenty to offer our citizens and guests.

but, because we are free market capitalist economy, the only thing that seems to matter is money.

let me ask this:

do you believe money is more valuable than human life?


Couple of things here. America is a capitalist economy, but it is by no means a “free market”. Secondly, I believe that every human is of infinite worth, however, lives being calculated in terms of a dollar value is nothing new. Think life insurance, or the military they both put a dollar value on life and the military actually categorizes accident scales in terms of dollars.

For example a category 1 accident could be $400,000 or blindness (yes they actually do this) then a cat 2 could be $1,000,000 or death. I’m just coming up with these numbers to make my point, but unfortunately this is how it works right now and I highly doubt this is specific to America. So in terms of how much money is a human life worth? As much as I disagree with it, it depends on the life.

For a lot of democrats though this does make a convenient straw man to use to try to paint those who disagree with you as heartless and cruel. Most people probably fall for it who aren’t aware of how society operates.

Thirdly, and IMO this is the most important point. As far as the whole “they are just like every person in your town or city.” That is not true. There are differences among individuals, and there are differences among groups. Not being able to discuss this openly and honestly breeds distrust, especially in those who are making the large scale societal decisions about immigration.

No, not everyone is the same. Understanding the differences between people and groups and not trying to hide it, is our best bet for assimilation. Assuming that is still the goal. Some democrats say no, that is besides the point. The point is we are not all the same, and tryin to pretend that we are is what got us into this in the first place.

The demographic transformations of our countries is the biggest decision we’ve ever made. Or in America’s case the democrats made for us. Any decision of this magnitude should be discussed only and honestly and calling anyone who asks questions about it “racist” will only make it worse.


--------------------
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Judge Aaron Satie

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: qman] * 2
    #26043967 -

Quote:
In 2018, an estimated 106,147 affirmative asylum applications were received by U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS)—25 percent fewer than the 141,695 in FY 2017. 


estimated 100k migrants. where do you get tens of millions? fox news? and you say im fantasizing


--------------------
🐴:poop:
hpoo or die

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: vault123]
    #26043976 -

https://www.google.com/amp/s/thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/447660-california-set-to-be-first-state-to-offer-health-insurance-to-some-adult%3famp

Dems want to give illegals healthcare. Is that the plan? To lure illegals in with healthcare, welfare and voting rights? The dems are so out of touch with reality. Whats even the point in having a border when you reward the people that cross it illegally?

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: ballsalsa] * 1
    #26043984 -

vault123 said:
Thirdly, and IMO this is the most important point. As far as the whole “they are just like every person in your town or city.” That is not true. There are differences among individuals, and there are differences among groups.



humans are humans, period. and everyone should be treated as so and not excluded because they dont root for your chosen team.

sure we have our different beliefs and religions and cultures. but what exactly  are you defending? the USA promotes diversity and inclusion. just admit it, your job is secure and you've never been demoted or taken a pay cut because some new folks moved into your town.


--------------------
🐴:poop:
hpoo or die

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #26044009 -

I can’t help but get the feeling this is some kind of bait. I’ll bite though. Alright, show me where you’re seeing that “80% of Americans agree with DACA.” I’m sure you already know this, but it is very easy to manipulate the answer to a question based on the wording.


--------------------
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Judge Aaron Satie

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine] * 1
    #26044013 -

the whole DEM vs. REPUB thing is completely useless in our modern times. all they do today is bitch and moan about the other side. yet they still take OUR tax dollars to live their lavish lifestyles and never really do anything in the long-term to benefit America as a whole.   

yes we need to fix immigration laws. hell, we need to fix 90% of the old draconian laws that dont really apply to our society as it is today. 

I know some disagree with my opinion and thats okay. but i stand for human rights as a whole. we as a planet have the capability to give all humans a decent standard of living.. but thats not happening because the brainwashed humans value the almighty dollar more than they value their neighbors.


--------------------
🐴:poop:
hpoo or die

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: vault123] * 1
    #26044025 -

I agree with every single thing that you said. To answer your question, I wasn’t aware that I was defending anything.


--------------------
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Judge Aaron Satie

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine]
    #26044031 -

split_by_nine said:
Quote:
In 2018, an estimated 106,147 affirmative asylum applications were received by U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS)—25 percent fewer than the 141,695 in FY 2017. 


estimated 100k migrants. where do you get tens of millions? fox news? and you say im fantasizing


No, just Yale and MIT researchers.

https://thehill.com/latino/407848-yale-mit-study-22-million-not-11-million-undocumented-immigrants-in-us

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine]
    #26044037 -

I don’t have the document with me, but there was a Harvard Professor who did a study and found 22 million illegals living in America. It was a credible study. It got a lot of attention. That’s probably what he’s referring to. There was another study performed later challenging the figures. I’m not sure where the general consensus stands on which was more accurate, but that’s probably the one he was referring to.


--------------------
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Judge Aaron Satie

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine] * 1
    #26044038 -

split_by_nine said:
vault123 said:
Thirdly, and IMO this is the most important point. As far as the whole “they are just like every person in your town or city.” That is not true. There are differences among individuals, and there are differences among groups.



humans are humans, period. and everyone should be treated as so and not excluded because they dont root for your chosen team.

sure we have our different beliefs and religions and cultures. but what exactly  are you defending? the USA promotes diversity and inclusion. just admit it, your job is secure and you've never been demoted or taken a pay cut because some new folks moved into your town.


No, the US doesn't promote diversity and inclusion to non-US citizens. In fact, the vast majority of US immigration policy has been HIGHLY discriminatory in nature and that has served US very well.

Again, bringing in poor people into the US doesn't create economic prosperity, it takes away from US citizens in need. Obviously, you don't care about the tens of millions of poor US citizens because you're trying to save the world.

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine] * 1
    #26044043 -

i do understand why so many of you are against illegal immigration. i do understand why so many of you love your country.

what i dont understand is how you cant seem to see this issue from the other side.

i dont understand why you wont for once try to imagine what its like to be an immigrant. they dont have it easy.

imagine how hard it is to walk thousands of miles with little to no food or water.

where is the compassion i ask? where is the empathy?

is this really the land of the free and home of the brave?


Jurors in Pima County will answer those questions later this month as they determine the fate of a 37-year-old Arizona man caught helping a pair of migrants.  For his crimes — basically offering food, water and shelter and later pointing to some mountains — Scott Warren could be facing 20 years in prison.

20 years in prison for giving folks food and water. this is retarded.  sorry to drop the R word.


--------------------
🐴:poop:
hpoo or die

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: qman]
    #26044073 -

qman said:
split_by_nine said:
Quote:
In 2018, an estimated 106,147 affirmative asylum applications were received by U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS)—25 percent fewer than the 141,695 in FY 2017. 


estimated 100k migrants. where do you get tens of millions? fox news? and you say im fantasizing


No, just Yale and MIT researchers.

https://thehill.com/latino/407848-yale-mit-study-22-million-not-11-million-undocumented-immigrants-in-us



lol did you even read that article?

Quote:
The Yale study, which goes as far back as 1990, found the same upward and downward trajectory as the ACS studies, with the undocumented population ballooning through the 1990s and plateauing after 2007.


and

Quote:
The researchers emphasized the new number does not imply a growth in illegal immigration but a longstanding miscount of existing undocumented immigrants.


it says thats how many people are living undocumented in the us over a migration period of nearly two decades.  lol nice try


--------------------
🐴:poop:
hpoo or die

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine]
    #26044080 -

we have an open discussion about migration, but we have zero input from actual migrants. that sounds fair


--------------------
🐴:poop:
hpoo or die

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine] * 1
    #26044087 -

for those of you who think Scott Warren should spend 20 years in prison for helping people, i bet you would sing a different tune if in fact you were the one he was helping. its easy to point fingers from the other side of the fence

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine]
    #26044108 -

My girlfriends sister was raped when she came across the border in mexico. Her aunt and cousin wer left stranded by a coyote when they crossed into mexico. That was when it was cheap. Now it costs $13,000 for 2 people.

Its bad. Africans from west africa where there is an uncontained outbreak of ebola are already here in texas.
About 350 congolese showed up in texas. They Crossed the ocean to get to texas. They speak french. What a mess.

https://www.breitbart.com/border/2019/06/08/350-congolese-migrants-arrive-in-san-antonio/


--------------------
🅃 🄴 🄰 🄼    🄲 🄻 🄸 🄽 🄶 🅆 🅁 🄰 🄿

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine]
    #26044110 -

split_by_nine said:
i do understand why so many of you are against illegal immigration. i do understand why so many of you love your country.

what i dont understand is how you cant seem to see this issue from the other side.

i dont understand why you wont for once try to imagine what its like to be an immigrant. they dont have it easy.

imagine how hard it is to walk thousands of miles with little to no food or water.

where is the compassion i ask? where is the empathy?

is this really the land of the free and home of the brave?


Jurors in Pima County will answer those questions later this month as they determine the fate of a 37-year-old Arizona man caught helping a pair of migrants.  For his crimes — basically offering food, water and shelter and later pointing to some mountains — Scott Warren could be facing 20 years in prison.

20 years in prison for giving folks food and water. this is retarded.  sorry to drop the R word.


I could ask you the same thing, where is your compassion for the current US citizens without housing, food, health care, education and a livable wage?  Yet, you're so very quick to cut the pie into even smaller pieces at their expense. Where is your empathy for them? 

Let's fix our own poverty problems before we try to solve global poverty. It's called one step at a time. Attempting to do everything at once usually means getting nothing done at all.

"land of the free"

That was never true.  My Polish ancestors were allowed to immigrate to the US for one reason- cheap labor.

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine]
    #26044114 -

split_by_nine said:
qman said:
split_by_nine said:
Quote:
In 2018, an estimated 106,147 affirmative asylum applications were received by U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS)—25 percent fewer than the 141,695 in FY 2017. 


estimated 100k migrants. where do you get tens of millions? fox news? and you say im fantasizing


No, just Yale and MIT researchers.

https://thehill.com/latino/407848-yale-mit-study-22-million-not-11-million-undocumented-immigrants-in-us



lol did you even read that article?

Quote:
The Yale study, which goes as far back as 1990, found the same upward and downward trajectory as the ACS studies, with the undocumented population ballooning through the 1990s and plateauing after 2007.


and

Quote:
The researchers emphasized the new number does not imply a growth in illegal immigration but a longstanding miscount of existing undocumented immigrants.


it says thats how many people are living undocumented in the us over a migration period of nearly two decades.  lol nice try


I could care less when they got here, it's irrelevant.

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: split_by_nine] * 2
    #26044130 -

split_by_nine said:
we have an open discussion about migration, but we have zero input from actual migrants. that sounds fair


It's because you don't care what's legal or fair for US citizens. 

I'm not sacrificing my standard of living for your save the world fantasies. In fact, most liberals talk a great game, but they're not different than myself, they want the highest standard of living for themselves and their family.

What they want is exactly what you want, they want others to sacrifice for non-US citizens to meet their ideological goals, but they don't want any change in their first world standard of living.

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Re: Closed or open borders? [Re: vault123] * 1
    #26044133 -

Immigration is an imaginary problem affecting only the minds of fearful xenophobes.


--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”

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