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Offlinel0wbob
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Re: The Official Woodlovers Thread [Re: Ferather]
    #25747809 - 01/16/19 04:37 PM (5 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Ferather said:
Fair enough, next test (if you want), make 120g (dry) spawn, and use a 10+ liter tub (like this set of 3). Spawn at the bottom and WL-Tek on top.




That might be something to try. Gonna check first how long that jar can produce fruits. lots of pins incoming. Pins to fruit took very long ( about 2 weeks ) and looked at first like trich starting.


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OfflineJakeoncid419
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Re: The Official Woodlovers Thread [Re: l0wbob]
    #25748070 - 01/16/19 06:39 PM (5 years, 2 months ago)

I got my azzy spawn outside in a tub covered in snow ive never done it like this but im told it will be just fine by ppl who do it evert year and ive check on it still looks and smells good ill wait until late march to put in ground


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Offlinethe astronaut
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Re: The Official Woodlovers Thread [Re: Jakeoncid419]
    #25748109 - 01/16/19 06:54 PM (5 years, 2 months ago)

I messed up with my psy cyan spawn. 2 jars show contam so I put them in the fridge, their slowly coming around, hopefully. The third jar was perfect no signs of contam. I was hastefully disposing of some pe 6 jars that went too in
Invirtro to save and mixed my psy cyan jar with the refuse. I only realized once it was to late. So instead of disposal I had to spawn to my compost which is mostly pine and spruce, I added some pecan wood chips and covered with snow. Hopefully I didn't screw myself. We'll see I guess.

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OfflineBobbit
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Re: The Official Woodlovers Thread [Re: l0wbob]
    #25748373 - 01/16/19 09:01 PM (5 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

l0wbob said:
Quote:

Ferather said:
Grow-up style? Dialed or totally an experiment?

:takingnotes:




Does "totally an dialed experiment" count?

I knew it should work so i gave it a try as kind of an experiment




I've read the word "dialled" lots on this forum. Can any one explain it to a noob?


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The Official Kiwi Cultivators Thread

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Offlinel0wbob
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Re: The Official Woodlovers Thread [Re: Bobbit]
    #25748680 - 01/17/19 01:19 AM (5 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Bobbit said:
Quote:

l0wbob said:
Quote:

Ferather said:
Grow-up style? Dialed or totally an experiment?

:takingnotes:




Does "totally an dialed experiment" count?

I knew it should work so i gave it a try as kind of an experiment




I've read the word "dialled" lots on this forum. Can any one explain it to a noob?




Well you can replace "dialed" with "done on purpose" ( but i am just a german dude haha, could be wrong )

Quote:

Jakeoncid419 said:
I got my azzy spawn outside in a tub covered in snow ive never done it like this but im told it will be just fine by ppl who do it evert year and ive check on it still looks and smells good ill wait until late march to put in ground





Yeah thats totally fine, i have a pretty big tub that stands outside and which got filled with snow from the  storm.
Now the snow melted and you can see it growing strong mycelium again ( on low temps they grow very slow, but they grow )


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Edited by l0wbob (01/17/19 01:40 AM)

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InvisibleNothingsChanged
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Re: The Official Woodlovers Thread [Re: Bobbit]
    #25748682 - 01/17/19 01:22 AM (5 years, 2 months ago)

dialed is when everything(Conditions) is/are just right for optimal growth and best outcome.


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OfflineFerather
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Re: The Official Woodlovers Thread [Re: l0wbob] * 1
    #25749249 - 01/17/19 11:20 AM (5 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

NothingsChanged said:
dialed is when everything(Conditions) is/are just right for optimal growth and best outcome.



:whathesaid:

----

Quote:

p9hu7 said:
Pretty sure I recall Ferather stating that they can both be treated the same as king oyster.

Quote:

Ferather said:
In most cases you can treat azure-cyan-other like king oyster.







http://www.namyco.org/docs/grow_oyster_mushrooms_on_kitty_litter_illustrated.pdf - Similar to what bobwastaken has done here.
https://freshcapmushrooms.com/learn/growing-mushrooms-in-the-garden-the-king-oyster/ - Really good starter guide.

I prefer making a block and casing it into another larger container (see here). Colonized indoors, fruited outdoors.
If you can dial in outdoor conditions (temperature, light, oxygen, humidity, etc) expect rich fruits, indoors.


Here is Golden oyster, indoors, with limited yellow, stretching to higher oxygen.

     

Same block, outdoors, by far a richer yellow, with more oxygen and light.

     

----

Quote:

l0wbob said:
...Gonna check first how long that jar can produce fruits. lots of pins incoming. Pins to fruit took very long ( about 2 weeks ) and looked at first like trich starting.



WL-Tek uses the upper most nutrient level (not much more can be added without issues), while colonization doesn't slow down, time to fruiting does.
The good news is the total yield, and nutrient level is higher. If speed is needed, reduce the amount of WL-Tek by 50% or more.

Edit: WL-Tek is around 1.6-1.7% total nitrogen, not more than 2% total should be used (too strong), see more here.


--------------------
                   

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https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27857366#27857366

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Edited by Ferather (01/17/19 12:25 PM)

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OfflineBobbit
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Is faster better? [Re: Ferather]
    #25750572 - 01/18/19 01:30 AM (5 years, 2 months ago)

So I have been hypotheorisinking a bit as of late.

When I started this journey last June, something bugged me about the whole cultivating thing.

This has congealed around the ā€˜fastest is bestestā€™ assumption that many seem to agree with.

I mean in regard to myc growth.

I can understand why fast rhisomorphic is important with regard to the ā€˜opportunistā€™ mushroom species. This is how I see cubes. In nature, they seem to colonise a whole field in a fine network, then when a ruminant stops and shits, and the rain is right, BAM, you get some great crops, lickity split!

Woodies on the other hand seem to take their sweet time, slowly creeping waiting for the opportune conditions, then pop up.

Maybe Iā€™m caught in some romantic fantasy, as woodies are the only thing that grows near me (in nature that is :evil:), maybe woodies are just as opportunistic? In fact reading back through, I have just said they are... :lol:

Anyhoo, back to my original hypothesis, maybe slower myc reacts differently and grows fruits easier, after a slower colonisation process. I gotta get some real growing under my belt before experimenting too much.

What do the experts think?


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OfflineJakeoncid419
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Re: Is faster better? [Re: Bobbit]
    #25752359 - 01/18/19 07:58 PM (5 years, 2 months ago)

OK so I am prepping my indoor grow for Azzy. I have 5 pounds of colonized hardwood fuel pellets and sum oat bran. I am now pressure cooking a bag of woodchips hickory cherry alder,  and cardboard.  Tomorrow I will inoculate the bags, Once it is fully colonized and I placed into fruiting conditions do I first want to run it warm to Replicate the summer or do I immediately want to drop my temperature to induce pinning?  I was going to drop to 48F. Iā€™ve never successfully pulled these off indoors so if anyone has I would really appreciate some pointers and tips.

Mush love


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OfflinePsilosopherr
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Re: Is faster better? [Re: Jakeoncid419]
    #25752398 - 01/18/19 08:17 PM (5 years, 2 months ago)

I keep seeing mention of this, so people really succeed with indoor azzies these days? (not to steal your questions spotlight, don't mind me)

Perhaps a combination of lower temps and shorter light cycles to replicate the shorter days of winter.

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OfflineAsuraS
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Re: Is faster better? [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #25752403 - 01/18/19 08:19 PM (5 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Psilosopherr said:
I keep seeing mention of this, so people really succeed with indoor azzies these days? (not to steal your questions spotlight, don't mind me)

Perhaps a combination of lower temps and shorter light cycles to replicate the shorter days of winter.




Fuuuck no, people are not doing indoor azzies. Pipe dream dude.

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OfflineJakeoncid419
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Re: Is faster better? [Re: Asura]
    #25752528 - 01/18/19 09:41 PM (5 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Asura said:
Quote:

Psilosopherr said:
I keep seeing mention of this, so people really succeed with indoor azzies these days? (not to steal your questions spotlight, don't mind me)

Perhaps a combination of lower temps and shorter light cycles to replicate the shorter days of winter.




Fuuuck no, people are not doing indoor azzies. Pipe dream dude.



it has been done, not with any great success but it has been done most of my azzy bags will go outside im gonna try and get one indoors. but I have been reading a few different WL's grows SubG's, aztecorum (I will be running indoor attempts on these as well as of now subg on grain and I just got Aztec to germ on agar. using untreated outdoor soil for a case layer seems to be a big part of it as well as low temps. anyway I don't expect it to be a worth while endeavor in terms of flush amount but if other peole have pulled indoor fruits I will figure out how to do it.... eventually lol


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InvisiblebobwastakenS
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Re: Is faster better? [Re: Asura] * 2
    #25752570 - 01/18/19 10:07 PM (5 years, 2 months ago)

:whathesaid:  That goes for cyanescens, subaeruginosa and allenii.

I don't even think these species are all that fussy regarding conditions. Azurescens and its counterparts have been fruited (by luck) in bottles, vases, takeaway food containers etc at various temps. Hardly what one would call ideal conditions. I feel too many people (myself included) try to perfect fruiting conditions thinking there may be some break through. It's been done to death. Conditions are important for a good flush but not the reason we don't get any fruits. They wouldn't fruit in nature if they were so particular in this regard.

Moricz has had the greatest success to date with indoor woodlovers and he pasteurizes his substrates. I believe it is a microbial interaction required to induce pinning since the only successful indoor grows have utilized a microbe rich casing of either soil/mulch or unsterilized substrate.

The problem is bringing the outdoors indoors can lead to contamination in a hurry and possibly the fallout of a microbial balance conducive to pinning. One tried solution is to colonize outdoors and bring the substrate indoors to fruit. This has been trialed with some success before. 

To date, nobody has produced an indoor flush that matches or exceeds that of a prolific outdoor bed. There's no reason we shouldn't see a canopy of azurescens indoors if we can fully address their needs. I don't buy into the notion of poor BE given I've seen large clusters of P.subaeruginosa fruiting from partially colonized pine cones.

Again Moricz has come closest and yet he doesn't do anything out of the ordinary. This leads me to believe either his substrates, water source, or cellar provides or favours certain microbes which are beneficial to fruiting.

Genetics also play a role in successful fruitings. It's not the first time I've heard of someone taking a wild clone and having it fruit indoors only to start over with MS and see no success following the same procedure.

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OfflineAsuraS
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Re: Is faster better? [Re: bobwastaken]
    #25752593 - 01/18/19 10:17 PM (5 years, 2 months ago)

"it has been done, not with any great success"....yeah I'm aware of of the indoor grows. Nothing impressive. And
you can't call it an indoor grow when it's in your basement in a cold climate. And the basement windows are
wide open.

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InvisiblebobwastakenS
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Re: Is faster better? [Re: Asura] * 2
    #25752669 - 01/18/19 11:01 PM (5 years, 2 months ago)

I agree it isn't addressing the problems we have fruiting them in the fridge. I like this thread by Rustik as I think he may have been onto something with the importance of actinobacteria. I don't know if anyone ever went down that road of isolating populations of actinobacteria and co-culturing them with woodlovers in a sterile environment to observe if there is any interaction. This is something I'm experimenting with at the moment.  It's not been an especially easy process (due conflicting studies) which requires selective media and membrane filters of correct porosity but once isolated it should be easy enough to maintain and test a culture.

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InvisibleNakoa

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Re: Is faster better? [Re: bobwastaken] * 3
    #25752737 - 01/19/19 12:14 AM (5 years, 2 months ago)

Loving the aggressive allenii myc... Just left a few oats in the bottom of a jar after G2G' ing and dropped some oak chips and black mulch.



Also trying out Ferather's WL Tek. Going strong:


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OfflineBU4O
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Re: Is faster better? [Re: Nakoa]
    #25752847 - 01/19/19 02:13 AM (5 years, 2 months ago)



This plastic tube fruit outdoor,but due to side pinning and cold coming i cut it open and put it inside a bucket with drainage and covered with white pine shavings and put the bucket inside the shed...
It continued to fruit but weird and slow.
Outside under the rain it was beast with many many pins but inside many of the fruits abort and died no matter how much i mist them and water em...

This was the last from the shed.


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Offlinemoricz
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Re: Is faster better? [Re: Psilosopherr] * 3
    #25752935 - 01/19/19 03:40 AM (5 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Psilosopherr said:
I keep seeing mention of this, so people really succeed with indoor azzies these days? (not to steal your questions spotlight, don't mind me)

Perhaps a combination of lower temps and shorter light cycles to replicate the shorter days of winter.




Hi :smile:

- Never got azzies indoor, I allways messed up those pots, but I believe they can grow :shrug:
- My cellar is not as sterile as needed to be for like shiitake growing, I got little fly problem, not much, but they can spread the beneficial bacterias.
- My fresh air intake is just filtered with a piece of chlote, not to suck in the little flies or bugs, but again bacterias can get in, among with foreign spores.
- I got spiders, and sometimes some moulds grew on sticked fly dead bodies :laugh:
- I clean the cellar up with bleach once a year! So anything can grow in there :shrug:

My observations on fruitings:
- best if you have an isolate, even better a clone, if a tissue once produced fruits they can fruit much earlier than MS cultures - I saw this with subaeruginosa.
- They thrive on constant 16 CĀ° but I believe they need some dry up period with above 20 CĀ° then dunk, then fruiting conditions.
- I can assume they have some friendship with anaerobic bacterias too, just an idea.
- They start to fruit when the proper temperature maximums are not runnig over. Like Ps. alenii likes no more than 19 CĀ° not for a minute, cyans likes the 15 ish range subaeruginosa likes the 7-10 ish range (CĀ°) at least they started when my cellar cooled down to this temps.
- I have 8 hour on 16 hour off lighting period, that can be also a part of the trigger, like flowering with plants.

- or they really depend on some elf magic :laugh: :laugh:

OR (and I think this is the case) I got somehow a very big luck with those, I'm not a precise shroomer, just mixing things here and there.

Bob has the most precise experiment with subaeruginosa, if he succseed, I bet that azurescens can be done with the same way.

Peace
M

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OfflineFerather
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Re: Is faster better? [Re: Nakoa] * 1
    #25752959 - 01/19/19 04:22 AM (5 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Nakoa said:
...Also trying out Ferather's WL Tek. Going strong:





Gratz, very clean spawn, top job. Lovely growth, thick and populated.
It should adapt over time, and produce even better growth.

:thumbup:


--------------------
                   

Growing mushrooms, general guide and information (Ferather's Journal), https://ibb.co/rG3rML2

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27857366#27857366

DTS DCH Driver for Realtek [DTS:X] - Unlocked and reprogrammed.

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OfflineJakeoncid419
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Re: Is faster better? [Re: bobwastaken]
    #25753319 - 01/19/19 09:49 AM (5 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

bobwastaken said:
I agree it isn't addressing the problems we have fruiting them in the fridge. I like this thread by Rustik as I think he may have been onto something with the importance of actinobacteria. I don't know if anyone ever went down that road of isolating populations of actinobacteria and co-culturing them with woodlovers in a sterile environment to observe if there is any interaction. This is something I'm experimenting with at the moment.  It's not been an especially easy process (due conflicting studies) which requires selective media and membrane filters of correct porosity but once isolated it should be easy enough to maintain and test a culture.




very interesting thread Bob! 15 years old and no one put his theory to the test? I agree tho and while my understanding of the microbes in the soil is limited I also believe that the microbes are imperative to pinning. im hoping that I can achieve this just through my casing. I pasteurized peatmoss, verm, a little COS and some outdoor soil a few months ago and I have been letting it sit. I also have a outdoor hole I dug and mixed in some casing ingredients and am letting that sit for later use. I have a standing A/C unit that I use to cool my lab in the summer, I will be modding it onto one of my grow tents and im going to split one of my bags down into several trays (I can probably get around 10) that way I can try several different casings at once.  also am going to try a few trays with the colonized wood chips that have been in outdoor tubs since September. i also am going to try and bring a bed indoors in September this year and see if I cant get a decent yield from that as well as using some to cut into pasteurized colonized sub and see if that gives me improved yield. unfortunately I do not have cloned genetics but I did spend several months selecting out optimal growths on agar but i am still swinging blind a little bit. However this project will likely take several years and I have been growing them outdoors for about a decade (minus the last 3 years due to extenuating circumstances) so ill have my clones soon enough i just cant wait to get started lol. anyway im loving this thread yall are offering up some fantastic info! i was a little bummed at how rare and incomplete the info is on this on the internet but this thread cheers me up! mush love


--------------------
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online  pant cult classes available last Saturday of every month go to buymeacoffee.com/jakeoncid to sign up (1 on 1 consultations also available
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EXOTICS
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