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Offlineding
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Regressive self-therapy using psychedelics?
    #2569708 - 04/17/04 12:08 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I'm interested in trying out regressive self-therapy (previous experiences with therapists didn't turn out well) using psychedelics a la Grof/Naranjo and others. I already know enough about my mostly repressed childhood to suspect that there was A LOT of trauma going on caused by multiple people but so far, I'm not really having too much success in remembering details from my childhood. I'm not saying my use of psychedelics wasn't helpful. In fact, it loosened me up behaviorally, emotionally and posturewise quite a bit. But still, trying to think about my childhood while being under the influence wasn't much successful, but then, thinking about it before having tried psychedelics didn't work either. Do you guys know any ways of helping past recall while on psychedelics?


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OfflineThe_Hobbit
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Re: Regressive self-therapy using psychedelics? [Re: ding]
    #2569738 - 04/17/04 12:33 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I learned about age regression therapy in school during a hypnosis unit. The teacher did demonstrations on people in the class (only with happy memories, though). You can remember things from your childhood like you were experiencing those memories at that moment. You can remember the color of the socks you were wearing that day if you want.

My teacher was telling us a story about her childhood and how hyno-therapy helped her. When she was young her dad would force-feed her at dinner even though she wasn't hungry. He wasn't being mean, he just thought that she needed a good dinner to be healthy. She got messed up because of that and had an eating addiction into her 20's because her experiences as a kid taught her to eat even when she wasn't hungry. In hypno-therapy, she was brought back to those memories and talked to her younger self, explaining that she didn't have to eat all the time and that her dad really didn't mean to hurt her. That helped her and she doesn't have a problem anymore. And that's why she became a hyno-therapist herself.

Just thought I'd tell you that as another option, even though it's kindof off topic. You don't develop logic until you're 6-8 years old. That's why stuff from your childhood can mess you up emotionally for the rest of your life. Sorry if you know about this stuff already.


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Offlineding
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Re: Regressive self-therapy using psychedelics? [Re: The_Hobbit]
    #2572474 - 04/18/04 12:41 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I'm aware there's such a thing as hypnotherapy, but the problem is, there's no one available to hypnotize me, at least, not right at the moment.

Has anyone here had regressive experiences while tripping, spontaneous or otherwise? How was it like and what did you do to "set it up"?


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InvisibleArrakis
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Re: Regressive self-therapy using psychedelics? [Re: ding]
    #2572724 - 04/18/04 02:27 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

There is a book that sounds right up your alley, called "The Psychedelic Experience" by Timothy Leary, Ralph Metzner, and Richard Alpert.  It's based on the Tibetan Book of the Dead.  It has detailed instructions on how to have therapeutic trips.

I haven't read it all, because personally I think that Tim Leary was full of crap, but I bet that it would be something that you would be interested in. :beer:


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Invisiblezee_werp
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Re: Regressive self-therapy using psychedelics? [Re: ding]
    #2573382 - 04/18/04 10:32 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Hello
I think that this area of self-therapy while under the influence of psychedelics has / has shown to have a lot of potential...which I guess you have already realised so anyway...

There has been one thing which has completley revolutionized the psychedelic experience (and life in general) for me. This is the genre of music known as 'Psychedelic Trance', 'Psytrance' or 'Goa Trance'.

This is music which is designed to induce a trance / hypnotic state. While this particular style is a recent development thanks to technological / social evolution and increased avaliability of psychedelic substances, the idea goes back thousands of years at least. The forefathers of tripping, e.g. South American & other shamans, have been using persistent, rythmic drumming to induce trance states since before recorded history. Once in this trance, they go on a journey into a shamanic state of consciousness. This is another reality. Some would say it is the realms of the unconscious.
Psychedelic Trance has revived these aincent techniques of shamanism on a global scale.

Now usually I will hear this music at outdoor dance parties but I also make it myself and listen to some at home. Usually these parties are quite small and playing all psychedelic music. Other people there are usually really friendly, though the atmosphere isn't that 'social' because most people are busy dancing / trancing out. The locations are always amazing as well...gotta love NZ.

So anyway the usual procedure is I will see fliers etc. around the place for any trance parties coming up in the next few weeks / months (there is usally around one per month within driving distance of where I live). I will keep this in mind just aknowledging the possibility that I will be doing some psychedelic work at that time. In the days leading up to a party I like to prepare myself for the night ahead. This involves things like eating well, getting a good amount of sleep, maybe a little bit of meditation, reading, and some random creative activities like writing, drawing etc (this is really good). Things like these are important steps for a productive psychedelic session, IMO.

So I'll drive to the party, usually put my tent up and then go and explore the area. Things are still pretty mellow by this stage in the evening, everyone is just chilling, chatting, swatting the bugs etc.
I will usually go and sit somewhere quietly amongst the bushes or by a creek, whatever, just a nice spot, and meditate for a few minutes. Quiet. Still. Breathing. I think getting aquainted with your surroundings before a trip is another important factor. During this pre-trip stage I usually just relax, and become more receptive to the experience I am about to undergo, accepting that it may bring anything, absolutely anything, into my reality, 'good' or 'bad'.

Then I like to head down to the dance area and have a bit of a dance, say hi to any friends I know there etc. Just basically hangin out and undergoing the final relaxation procedures, as in becoming aquainted  again with the music, with the vibe.

At some stage in the evening (usually between midnight and 3am) I will pop back to my tent to ingest whatever substance I have chosen for the evening. The psychedelic of your choice more or less, I've found most of them to be very effective.

Then I'll head back to the dance zone. Again just chilling, dancing a little, maybe smoke a bit of ganja during the come-on phase. To me this stage is kind of like lying in bed before you fall asleep and go into the dream dimensions.

And from here the rest is history basically. By dancing in rythm with the Psychedelic Trance music, and again meditating, eyes closed, free thought flow, a full hypnotic / trance is induced. The drugs enhance this...a lot. I find that in the beginning stages of trance it is about the surface 'ego' personality / consciousness moving out of the focus, and emerging into a new consciousness in which many facets of the mind are observable. Memories and thoughts can take on a very different perspective, like 3rd person, while also ultra-1st person. From this elevated state of consciousness I have found it possible to navigate, in great detail, many different experiences, including past memores and long forgotten / repressed events. What I have found amazing is the clarity of correlation that can be drawn between these memories that are shown compared to how I am now.

Anyway, I could go into a lot more detail about my personal experiences with this trance state, but in the end every person will have different techniques and different results so I will save you my preconceptions. I have just explained a few things which I felt are important for the leadup / happening of my own voyages, but obviously these specifics are flexible. Its up to you to make this happen. I just wanted to say that yes self therapy with psychedlics CAN be very useful, productive, life-changing etc. provided a good preperation is practiced.

The Psychedelic Trance music is not required to have a great theraputic session, but I found it to really, really help with getting into a good level of awareness. I had done psychedelics a reasonable amount before discovering psytrance, and until the psytrance, I had not really even experienced what I now view as the essential psychedelic expericnce, the LIFE experience. The trance is about focus and clarity being found in the chaos of this reality.

If you want to hear decent stuff be sure to go to a good party. One that is psychedelic orientated and not over-the-top raveish (though I'm not really sure what the scene is like outside of Aotearoa). Basically if it says psychedelic or goa trance on the flier it should be good. Sure you can also buy the music on CD or record from websites like www.psyshop.com but these are individual tracks and for the full trance experience I prefer a seamless set delivered to you by the excellent DJ's who have selected the tracks in a good order (they are really good at doing this usually).

Anyway I hope I haven't bored you. I know this may sound really stupid if you're not usually into the 'rave' scene, some guy tellin you that you should go do some drugs at a trance party to do a little self-therapy, but I'm just going off my own personal experiences here and I can tell you that psychedelic trance has honestly changed my life, a lot, for the better. Its a guide, a tool...or as I like to think, superhighways to hyperdimensions! Hahahaa....OK, so I'm rambling now, sorry. If you're interested then definatley check it out. Just remember -

-Preperation (Physical, mental)
-Good setting
-Psychedelic trance music
-A known dose of a quality psychedelic substance
-An open and receptive mindset
-Some ganja, if you like it

Have fun. And be sure to watch the sunrise. :wink:


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Offlinegotmagog
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Re: Regressive self-therapy using psychedelics? [Re: zee_werp]
    #2573590 - 04/18/04 12:42 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Hey man, u sound like u really love psytrance.
Can u give a list of your favorite bands/albums/tracks, after your good post I want to hear them definitely.


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Offlineding
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Re: Regressive self-therapy using psychedelics? [Re: zee_werp]
    #2575619 - 04/18/04 11:36 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

There probably is a trance party somewhere, I guess, near where I live, but the problem is, I don't know of any and I don't have any connections. And even if by chance I find out about one, I'd still need to get an invitation, wouldn't I?

Anyway, which psychedelic trance music do you recommend? There are way too many to choose from, and I'm really pretty much clueless.


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Offlineding
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Re: Regressive self-therapy using psychedelics? [Re: zee_werp]
    #2576416 - 04/19/04 02:52 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Another question: Does psychedelic trance music still work when not under the influence of psychedelic drugs?


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Offlineding
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: ding]
    #2576625 - 04/19/04 04:17 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

I just downloaded one psychedelic trance mp3 at random from the web since I thought any file would probably be OK and found out it had lyrics I didn't agree with. Since I only have a slow (phone modem) internet connection, I really can't afford to keep trying out different online files. Now, if the lyrics were about something like love or something like that, I don't think I'd really mind, but still, for the purpose of self-therapy, I'd prefer files with no lyrics at all. Do you have any recomendations for lyricless psychedelic trance CDs (internet downloads just take way too long)?


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Offlineesin
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: ding]
    #2578226 - 04/19/04 04:28 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Lol if it has lyrics it isn't psytrance.

Well there are so many awesome psy-trance bands i don't even know where to start. And so many different psy-trance styles.

If you like Goa trance, check out:
-Astral Projection (just awesome, older stuff better than newer stuff IMHO)
-Hallucinogen (no words needed)
-Oforia
-Shiva Chandra
-Chi-AD
-etc...

If you like darker sounds:
-Dark Nebula,
-Psychotic Micro,
-Psycho Talk,
-Grapes of Wrath,
-Digital Talk,
-etc..
would be good choices. Not really my type of sound, though, but that's what they play in the deep night at parties.

If you like full on music (late night/early morning party stuff), check:
-1200 mics,
-GMS,
-Dynamic,
-CPU (very very powerful and psychedelic sound - recommended),
-Absolum,
-Eskimo (this kid is causing dancefloor madness around the world)...
-etc...

My personal favorite style is morning full on trance (powerful melodic psy for sunny mornings), like:
-Protoculture (my fav at the moment - check out album 'Refractions'- strongly recommended),
-Astrix
-Beat Hackers,
-Bizarre Contact,
-Rastaliens (really good german psy - check 'Freestyle'),
-Tryptich,
-Talamasca,
-Logic Bomb,
-etc...

Good compilations are, for example, 'Mystery of the 13 crystal skulls' (TIPworld) all volumes, 'Ancient Future' (Enzyme Recs), 'Origin' (Nano Recs).
Most of these VA's are 2004 stuff. All of them are very full on.
I only started to know the psytrance world 2 years ago, so i don't know much old stuff...

But please, find a party: Isratrance Forum There's a North America forum, you should find good parties there. Listening to trance at home is nothing like listening to it at a party. It is made to be played very loud at parties, in the nature, with lots of people dancing and smiling. That's the real trance experience. There is where you truly FLY with it :laugh:!

At home it's cool and all but nothing like the parties.






Hope you enjoy it. The parties are some kind of alternate dimension. A new world where lots of stuff you can't even imagine are possible.
Just be careful, don't get fried.

take care  :sun:


Edited by esin (04/19/04 04:52 PM)


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Offlineding
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: esin]
    #2579004 - 04/19/04 07:43 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Lol if it has lyrics it isn't psytrance.





Are you sure? I decided to download a few more short samples online (Goa trance) and many selections definitely contained lyrics like um, genetically engineered spider (!), not that I really care about that, but as I've said, I'd prefer an internally directed trip, not an externally directed one. Well, at least it's not like the other track about destruction of the state.

PS. Hmm, I've download yet a few more samples, and this time some of them REALLY contained lyrics I disagree with. And it's under Psy Trance too.


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Offlinepsyborg
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: ding]
    #2579125 - 04/19/04 08:15 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Give us the names of the songs you downloaded, I'd like to check out wether it truly is Psy. Alot of people would lable trance as Psy.


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Offlineding
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: psyborg]
    #2579225 - 04/19/04 08:42 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Well, I can't find all the downloads I was refering to but here's some of them:

http://www.psyshop.com/shop/CDs/aya/aya1cd002.html
http://www.psyshop.com/shop/CDs/yse/yse2cd040.html


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Offlineesin
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: ding]
    #2579274 - 04/19/04 08:55 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Well, many psytrance tracks have short samples of sentences, quotes, or words to transmit a certain idea, or to give the song a story.
If that's what you meant by lyrics well than psytrance can have them.


What i meant is that generaly psytrance isn't sung.
(There are a few tracks that can be labeled as psytrance that have vocals though, but usually under some sound effects so that they don't sound like a normal human voice)

edit: It's difficult to recommend a CD which doesn't have lyrics. Some particular tracks have them, some haven't.

What kind of lyrics do you disagree with?
the 'genetically engineered spider' kind of thing?

Many have references about drugs, altered states, spiritual issues, philosophical, technology stuff, etc...
But the main thing about this kind of music is not the lyrics. You have to try to let the music take over. Notice all the weird psychedelic sounds and patterns. Dancing is a huge help. Psychedelics do magic.


Edited by esin (04/19/04 09:21 PM)


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OfflinePeyoteZen
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: esin]
    #2580152 - 04/19/04 11:40 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Shrooms have worked wonders on my psyche
A lot of childhood bullshit was cleared up pretty well


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Offlinemockeylock
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: esin]
    #2580177 - 04/19/04 11:44 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

esin said:

But the main thing about this kind of music is not the lyrics. You have to try to let the music take over. Notice all the weird psychedelic sounds and patterns. Dancing is a huge help. Psychedelics do magic.




I don't listen to techno type music, but as a big jamband fan I totally agree with this statement. It's all about the vibe, the groove, the psychedelic essence of music. Just experiencing music under these conditions has changed me considerably as a person. The words are good to help form the general structure of the song and give you something to ground yourself in. but it's during the instumentals that one can truly let go and let their consiousness flow. It's like your mind is a leaf floating down a river. It goes where the river goes. The trip is such an internal experience yet we are 100 times more vulnerable to outside influences and they WILL determine the extent of your inward journey. Extended musical performances/compositions are the perfect medium to carry your tripping mind....


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Offlineding
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: esin]
    #2580223 - 04/19/04 11:54 PM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

What kind of lyrics do you disagree with?
the 'genetically engineered spider' kind of thing?




I think you misunderstood me. I said I didn't really care about THAT (meaning the spider). But there was one mentioning the destruction of the state, for example. But my main objection is that I'd prefer an internally guided session.

Quote:

The trip is such an internal experience yet we are 100 times more vulnerable to outside influences and they WILL determine the extent of your inward journey.




But that's precisely my point!


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Invisiblezee_werp
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: ding]
    #2580493 - 04/20/04 12:53 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Esin, I agree with what you are saying fully. When it comes to psytrance, there is no way to replicate an actual party with a proper soundsystem, good location and a good vibe etc.

The thing about buying CD's / records is, that they are usually going to be composed of indiviual tracks with gaps in between. And they usually haven't really been mixed in a good way for a decent trance session. At a party, the DJ's mix the tracks seamlessly so the music doesn't stop at all for the whole night. And the tracks are selected in a way which makes for an awesome journey.

And Ding, to answer your question, does Psytrance work without drugs? Well I would say yes, but usually not to the same level. But what I can say for certain is that short sample clips will not be giving you a real taste of what it is really like.

It is hard to say how infact psytrance 'works'. You need to enter it with no preconceptions. My advice would be to find a party and just try it out. The sample clips just aren't gonna do it. You don't usually need an invitation to a trance party but they do usually have a cover charge.

Another thing I thought I really should mention is nitrous oxide. Have you tried this before? It has given me some very amazing insights into my reality, the overall situation, life. I thouroughly reccomend it especially while on psychedelics and especially with some psytrance.


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Offlinepsyborg
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: ding]
    #2580529 - 04/20/04 12:58 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Well I consider myself to be quite knowledgeably on Psy and I have really not heard of any of the groups on those 2 discs, but then again I might just be moving in a diff group. But yeah Esin is right there is clips or quotes, but very rarelly original vocals in a Psy track. The message of Pdy in conveid in a total diff way, that is what makes the genre so great. Try some Infected Mushroom, that will really get you into it.

:laugh:


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Offlineding
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Re: Psychedelic trance [Re: zee_werp]
    #2580945 - 04/20/04 02:02 AM (12 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

And they usually haven't really been mixed in a good way for a decent trance session. At a party, the DJ's mix the tracks seamlessly so the music doesn't stop at all for the whole night. And the tracks are selected in a way which makes for an awesome journey.





In that case, would choosing CD compilations "selected by DJs" help? I looked up the isratrance website and I couldn't find any trance party in my area (I don't have a car, so I can't go very far). Also, I've looked up a bit (but not much yet) on psychedelic trance music on the web and apparently, strobe lights are helpful in inducing a trance. Also, how about binaural sounds or light and sound machines?

Quote:

Another thing I thought I really should mention is nitrous oxide. Have you tried this before? It has given me some very amazing insights into my reality, the overall situation, life. I thouroughly reccomend it especially while on psychedelics and especially with some psytrance.




No, but I might consider trying it.


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