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dmar



Registered: 09/09/18
Posts: 147
Loc: Earth, Milky Way, Virgo Superc...
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Help, wet rye jar problems
#25618196 - 11/16/18 08:31 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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I followed RR's rye tek to a t,but my grain is super wet after PC. I did the toilet paper test on several samples to make sure they were good before I loaded my jars. My filters on the lid are made out of 3 layers of micropore tape,and I put foil over the lids. But when I pulled them out, the lids are soaked even with foil on them, and now the inside of the jars are soaked. I'm confused as to how so much water is making it into the lids during PC when I have foil over the top of the quart jars. I PC my PF tek jars the same way but never have an issue... and my water level is at the minimum line to where only a tiny bit is touching the jars, so it's not boiling up. Anyways, I have a bunch of Agar plates ready to use today to nocc these up, but i'm wondering if I should use them or If I should just take the loss and do another batch of jars? I will say though, I'm able to tumble the jars and the grains aren't sticking together. I'm not sure if this says much about the internal moisture content because I'm new to grains, but RR made it seem like that was a good indicator in his video. What should I do?  I have a bunch of PE6 plates and panaeolus cyanescen plates that I definitely don't want to waste if these aren't good
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filthyknees
no coincidence


Registered: 03/08/13
Posts: 6,283
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: dmar]
#25618347 - 11/16/18 09:45 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Show a more clear picture of the grain. If it passed the toilet paper test I bet it is fine and you are just paranoid but all we need to tell is a clear pic.
-------------------- But if you're in a hurry, and really got to go
If you're in a hurry, might have to find out slow
That it's one thing to try and another to fly
You get there quicker just a step at a time
It's one thing to bark, another to bite
The show ain't over till you pack up at night
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puff4200
Natural born lever puller

Registered: 09/26/10
Posts: 1,269
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: filthyknees]
#25618423 - 11/16/18 10:19 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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from the pics it looks fine but the bottom of the jar would be the tell.
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dmar



Registered: 09/09/18
Posts: 147
Loc: Earth, Milky Way, Virgo Superc...
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: puff4200]
#25618622 - 11/16/18 11:23 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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The bottom of the jars dont have any water pooled up. The tops of the jars just have a lot of condensation. I thought they weren't supposed to be full of condensation like that? I hope I'm just being paranoid, but since this is only my second batch of grain jars, I wanted to be sure before wasting all my best plates on bad jars.
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dmar



Registered: 09/09/18
Posts: 147
Loc: Earth, Milky Way, Virgo Superc...
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: dmar]
#25618627 - 11/16/18 11:25 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Also in that first picture I posted in the OP, the jar looks blurry but that's because that's how much water is condensated in the top. That's what I was trying to point out. Sorry if i made that confusing.
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puff4200
Natural born lever puller

Registered: 09/26/10
Posts: 1,269
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: dmar]
#25618796 - 11/16/18 12:26 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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looks fine to me, I don't even see alpt of popped grains or anything. You said the grains aren't clumping either so I'd use them.
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filthyknees
no coincidence


Registered: 03/08/13
Posts: 6,283
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: puff4200]
#25618818 - 11/16/18 12:33 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Doing great.
If you're worried about moisture, remeber when you g2g or drop your agar in the jar that is the time to give it a shake, that will do any moisture redistributing that needs to happen.
-------------------- But if you're in a hurry, and really got to go
If you're in a hurry, might have to find out slow
That it's one thing to try and another to fly
You get there quicker just a step at a time
It's one thing to bark, another to bite
The show ain't over till you pack up at night
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XeroX84
chip chip chip und chap


Registered: 11/27/17
Posts: 57
Loc: Europe
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: filthyknees]
#25618929 - 11/16/18 01:18 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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From the Pictures it look ok mate
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Tstone
St.of Circumstance


Registered: 10/16/18
Posts: 953
Loc: This Planet
Last seen: 2 months, 21 days
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: XeroX84]
#25619048 - 11/16/18 02:25 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Look fine, did you shake after they cooled? If not, you should do so, before inoculation. Also, condensation is due to the temp in the jar is warmer then the ambient temperature. Condensation is very normal after the PC.it will/ should disapate, and will probably see more towards 100% colonization, as the myc is warmer then ambient temps.
-------------------- Wake now, discover that you are the song that morning brings, but the heart has it's seasons, it's evenings and songs of it's own"
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dmar



Registered: 09/09/18
Posts: 147
Loc: Earth, Milky Way, Virgo Superc...
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: Tstone]
#25619954 - 11/16/18 11:06 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Awesome, thanks for the feedback. I've done my homework, but i'm just asking questions as they come up. I'm steady taking notes. Thanks all. Im gonna use them in the morning. 6 with PE6 on Agar, and 6 with panaeolus cyanescen spores from a syringe.
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dmar



Registered: 09/09/18
Posts: 147
Loc: Earth, Milky Way, Virgo Superc...
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: dmar]
#25619958 - 11/16/18 11:10 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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I do have another question though. I have other jars, which I'll post pics of later, that aren't really recovering after shaking at 30% colonization or so. How long does it normally take for the mycelium to start growing normally again after the shake? I know there's no specific timeline, but after how many days should I become concerned?
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Cam the info rat
Intrigued

Registered: 09/24/18
Posts: 25
Loc: Land of ignorance
Last seen: 6 years, 27 days
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: dmar]
#25619968 - 11/16/18 11:23 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
dmar said: I do have another question though. I have other jars, which I'll post pics of later, that aren't really recovering after shaking at 30% colonization or so. How long does it normally take for the mycelium to start growing normally again after the shake? I know there's no specific timeline, but after how many days should I become concerned?
It depends on the size of the jars you’re using and the temp you’re colonizing. I normally see a dense growth after about 5 days. 3 days minimum for the recovery and then a couple more days before seeing growth with the naked eye
-------------------- Striving to be anywhere near RR’s skill level
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elPeligroso 5150
Stranger



Registered: 11/13/17
Posts: 166
Last seen: 3 years, 1 month
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Those grains are ready to rock. Spot on. Give them another shake before you nocc em and you good to go! Good job!
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Tstone
St.of Circumstance


Registered: 10/16/18
Posts: 953
Loc: This Planet
Last seen: 2 months, 21 days
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems *DELETED* [Re: dmar]
#25620628 - 11/17/18 10:08 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Post deleted by Tstone
Reason for deletion: Duplicate
-------------------- Wake now, discover that you are the song that morning brings, but the heart has it's seasons, it's evenings and songs of it's own"
Edited by Tstone (11/17/18 10:08 AM)
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Tstone
St.of Circumstance


Registered: 10/16/18
Posts: 953
Loc: This Planet
Last seen: 2 months, 21 days
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: Tstone]
#25620636 - 11/17/18 10:13 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Here's mine, this is G2G, 1qt to 8 qts,transferred 11/9, shook 11/15, so 4 days after shake.
-------------------- Wake now, discover that you are the song that morning brings, but the heart has it's seasons, it's evenings and songs of it's own"
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dmar



Registered: 09/09/18
Posts: 147
Loc: Earth, Milky Way, Virgo Superc...
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Quote:
Cam the info rat said:
Quote:
dmar said: I do have another question though. I have other jars, which I'll post pics of later, that aren't really recovering after shaking at 30% colonization or so. How long does it normally take for the mycelium to start growing normally again after the shake? I know there's no specific timeline, but after how many days should I become concerned?
It depends on the size of the jars you’re using and the temp you’re colonizing. I normally see a dense growth after about 5 days. 3 days minimum for the recovery and then a couple more days before seeing growth with the naked eye
I'm using Quart jars at 70-76 degrees. I was just curious because they were growing nicely, then I shook and after two days, I didn't notice growth so I wasn't sure if the shake stalled the myc. I'll just keep an eye on them.
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dmar



Registered: 09/09/18
Posts: 147
Loc: Earth, Milky Way, Virgo Superc...
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: Tstone]
#25620648 - 11/17/18 10:18 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Tstone said: Here's mine, this is G2G, 1qt to 8 qts,transferred 11/9, shook 11/15, so 4 days after shake.

I have one that's been going since the 1st and several that have been going since the 9th, and they look nowhere near as colonized as yours, even though the myc that I inocculated with was healthy and grew fairly quickly on the Agar. My temp and moisture content is good, so other than that and genetics, what else might be causing slow colonization?? Could my 3 layer micropore tape filter not be allowing enough gas exchange?
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Tstone
St.of Circumstance


Registered: 10/16/18
Posts: 953
Loc: This Planet
Last seen: 2 months, 21 days
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: dmar]
#25620678 - 11/17/18 10:32 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Not a micropore tape user, polyfil here, but I think 3 layers too much, 2 max I use a 1/4" hole punch( in office supplies at Staples)in my lids, just one hole.
Here's my transition from left to right: G2G yesterday, middle one 4 days after G2G, last one 9 days. When I soak my berries, I use half water and half coffee, 2 tablespoon of gypsum, and a teaspoon of lime. I boil in the soaking water. Works for me. I'm newer to this, but 60+jars, even my first, not a single problem.
-------------------- Wake now, discover that you are the song that morning brings, but the heart has it's seasons, it's evenings and songs of it's own"
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Tstone
St.of Circumstance


Registered: 10/16/18
Posts: 953
Loc: This Planet
Last seen: 2 months, 21 days
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: Tstone]
#25620706 - 11/17/18 10:40 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Here's my drying set up, I use turkey foil pans, can hold 8-10 qts, poked holes in it( from the inside, so metal shards face out) a few solid stirs, tissue dry in 17-20 minutes. I like this for more surface area, and doesn't make much of a mess, and they last, I just rinse after each batch,I strain in a colender first though, then immediate transfer to turkey pan $3.50, a good colander is over $25 ( big stainless steel)
-------------------- Wake now, discover that you are the song that morning brings, but the heart has it's seasons, it's evenings and songs of it's own"
Edited by Tstone (11/17/18 10:43 AM)
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dmar



Registered: 09/09/18
Posts: 147
Loc: Earth, Milky Way, Virgo Superc...
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: Tstone]
#25621128 - 11/17/18 02:40 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Tstone said: Not a micropore tape user, polyfil here, but I think 3 layers too much, 2 max I use a 1/4" hole punch( in office supplies at Staples)in my lids, just one hole.
Here's my transition from left to right: G2G yesterday, middle one 4 days after G2G, last one 9 days. When I soak my berries, I use half water and half coffee, 2 tablespoon of gypsum, and a teaspoon of lime. I boil in the soaking water. Works for me. I'm newer to this, but 60+jars, even my first, not a single problem.

Thanks for the tip on that. I have both gypsum and calcium carbonate/hydrated lime and I meant to put it in the soak water, but I completely forgot. I'm going to do that next time. And I wasn't sure about whether or not 3 layers would be too much. I've read other threads where micropore tape users specifically said they use 3 or 4 layers with no issues. I'm about to order some polyfil though to run them side by side and compare. Also I may pull a layer of tape off a few of the jars just to see if it makes a difference.
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dmar



Registered: 09/09/18
Posts: 147
Loc: Earth, Milky Way, Virgo Superc...
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: dmar]
#25621153 - 11/17/18 02:51 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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So now that i've covered water content and filter material, the next thing I want to be sure on is the size of the holes themselves.
My holes are almost exactly big enough to fit my index finger into (I don't have sausage fingers). I see other people who have said to make a single 1/4" hole. Is that referring to the diameter of the hole? I was relatively inconsistent with my hole sizes on the jars. I just realized after measurement that some of them have 1/2" diameter holes, and some have almost 1" holes. I figure if I made a hole too big, the extra tape will make up for the size by restricting some of the FAE.
Is that much of an issue? What size holes are you guys putting in your grain lids on Quart jars?
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Tstone
St.of Circumstance


Registered: 10/16/18
Posts: 953
Loc: This Planet
Last seen: 2 months, 21 days
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: dmar]
#25621897 - 11/17/18 08:12 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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1- 1/4" hole for me, works perfect. It's towards the side cause hole punch won't reach farther, and if too far in, the hole punch crimps the edge in the V of the punch mouth. To big of holes may cause the rye to dry out too fast.
Edited by Tstone (11/17/18 08:16 PM)
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dmar



Registered: 09/09/18
Posts: 147
Loc: Earth, Milky Way, Virgo Superc...
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: Tstone]
#25621994 - 11/17/18 09:04 PM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Tstone said: 1- 1/4" hole for me, works perfect. It's towards the side cause hole punch won't reach farther, and if too far in, the hole punch crimps the edge in the V of the punch mouth. To big of holes may cause the rye to dry out too fast.

Yeah, mine are all two or three times the size of those. The inside of my jars are still looking moist enough though and some have been in there for over a week, so I think i'm doing pretty good. Like I said, I think the multiple layers of micropore tape is metering the airflow enough to compensate for the large holes, so I think I accidentally did a good job
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Apc123
Mushroom momma



Registered: 04/26/18
Posts: 1,243
Loc: United States
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Re: Help, wet rye jar problems [Re: dmar]
#25622170 - 11/18/18 12:00 AM (6 years, 1 month ago) |
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Condensation normally goes away within 24 to 48 hours after PCing. Looks good
Ps I trick I did when I first started out was to put rubber bands around the neck of the jars after I covered the jars with foil. Just as an extra measure so water didn't get in.
-------------------- The thing about deceit is, you don't know your being deceived...
The only thing I am sure about is that I know nothing - socrates
Believe nothing you hear and half of what u see.
  
Edited by Apc123 (11/18/18 12:03 AM)
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