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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Cultivation
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Grain jars stalled. Should I wait?
    #25612644 -

I did a G2G expansion to 25 jars of WBS around 10/24.

Score to date: 2 lost to Trich, 10 are solidly myceliated, the rest look like this:



Four Questions:
  • Not sure what the white spots are in the last shot - salts? Dehydrated myc? Germinating endospores?

  • Looks like there might be a little wet patch in the second shot? Is that asking for contams? If so, I won't spawn it.

  • Should I wait till these finish before spawning to coir (in monotubs)?

  • My last two tubs Trich'd out; so maybe I should bump my spawn rate up from 4 - 5 jars per 64-quart tub to 6 jars. Splitting my 23 quarts among 4 monos would just about do that. Good strategy?
Possible seasonal factors: I'm in Zone 5a, in a new place; snow has fallen, and the heat pump is running (making the air inside much dryer). The colonization space used to be around 74ΒΊF, and is now around 69ΒΊF.

Thanks for any insight and advice!

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #25612659 -

those are trash


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πŸ…ƒ πŸ„΄ πŸ„° πŸ„Ό    πŸ„² πŸ„» πŸ„Έ πŸ„½ πŸ„Ά πŸ…† πŸ… πŸ„° πŸ„Ώ

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: JHOVA]
    #25612665 -

:whathesaid:I don't see anything good happening in those pics, from bacteria to trich. You can't really blame temperatures, many people are working in those temps.

Edited by puff4200 (11/13/18 06:14 PM)

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: puff4200]
    #25612687 -

Did you;
Turn off all air movement,
Use a sab or fh,
Wear gloves,
Wash your hands
Wipe with iso,
Soap the inside of your sab,
Breathe heavily,
Bump around inside your sab,
Vent your PC?


--------------------
Never give up, never surrender.

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Failboat]
    #25612804 -

JHOVA said:
those are trash


Could you elaborate? I've spawned jars like these to tubs before and had really nice harvests, and no Trich for a 2 - 3 flushes. I've just moved to a new place, though, and have been figuring out the new digs.

puff4200 said:
:whathesaid:I don't see anything good happening in those pics, from bacteria to trich. You can't really blame temperatures, many people are working in those temps.


I've heard temps can be relevant (e.g., favoring Trich over cube mycelium). But I'm not at all convinced that's what it is here. I mention it as a "possible seasonal factor" in the hope that people with more experience will help sort it out. I take it you're saying that a cooler temp is not a factor here.

I'm curious where you see bacteria and Trich. For instance, is it bacteria around the wet seed at the bottom of the middle image (in the original post), and Trich in the white dots on the seeds in that last image? Given that most of what's in the jars displays the color and growth pattern of cube mycelium, I'd love it if you could point out where the Trich or bacteria are visible.

Quirkmeister92 said:
Did you;
Turn off all air movement,


Yes, and sprayed rubbing alcohol into the air around the workspace. But my new place is mostly a single large room. So to really calm things down, I might need to stop air movement more than an hour before doing myc work.
Quote:
Use a sab or fh,
Wear gloves,
Wash your hands
Wipe with iso,
Soap the inside of your sab,


ISO'd gloves and the SAB.
Quote:
Breathe heavily,
Bump around inside your sab,
Vent your PC?


I wore a surgical mask (didn't breathe heavily), but did bump at least once.

I didn't vent the PC. Just waited till morning. Can venting be an issue, though?

I appreciate the help ironing out my process - so thanks!

I mentioned that about 10 jars show solid white myc. I also suspect that my pictures are bad. Not that these are better, but here are a few more:



I'm suspicious of the wispy growth showing on the bottom of the last pic. Cobweb? Or myc?

Thanks again for the help!

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #25612819 -

Venting the PC is part of proper operating procedure. It's in the manual, where you vent the air out, and it is crucial.

Wipe the inside of the SAB with soap and a youch of water so germs get trapped. This way less can simply fall off, which helps with those little bumps.


--------------------
Never give up, never surrender.

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Failboat]
    #25612838 -

Quirkmeister92 said:
Venting the PC is part of proper operating procedure. It's in the manual, where you vent the air out, and it is crucial.


My PC vent works, so it blows off steam during operation. But are you saying that when the process is over, and the heat is turned off, it's also important to vent rather than to just let the temp come down, and the pressure decrease, on its own?

Quote:
Wipe the inside of the SAB with soap and a youch of water so germs get trapped. This way less can simply fall off, which helps with those little bumps.


So you use rubbing alcohol to clean your SAB, and then spray a little (non-sterile?) soapy water in it? I can see how that would trap microbes . . . but just didn't know whether it would also introduce other vectors of contamination. I guess not.

Thanks, Quirkmeister92.

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #25612855 -

When you load the PC and put the lid on, but vefore you place the weight on you vent the air out so there is only steam inside. Again this is explained in the manual.

Do not waste iso wiping down the inside of your sab tub, just smear the soap all over it. This is commonly refferenced in many teks. You should read some more TC teks.


--------------------
Never give up, never surrender.

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Failboat]
    #25612897 -

Your jars can't favor trich over cube mycellium if there isn't trich in your jars. I'd work on sterile technique and make sure your cultures are clean.

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Failboat]
    #25612901 -

those jars have multiple types of bacteria going on. jars like that are inviting trich to take hold and proliferate your house. once you pass a certain threshold of mold it makes everything more difficult. you can keep fruiting bacterial jars like that but one day you are gonna regret it and then everything after that has to be perfect or it will go south.

are you using agar?


--------------------
πŸ…ƒ πŸ„΄ πŸ„° πŸ„Ό    πŸ„² πŸ„» πŸ„Έ πŸ„½ πŸ„Ά πŸ…† πŸ… πŸ„° πŸ„Ώ

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Failboat]
    #25612908 -

Quirkmeister92 said:
When you load the PC and put the lid on, but vefore you place the weight on you vent the air out so there is only steam inside. Again this is explained in the manual.


Am I correct that when you say "vent the PC" you mean allow a stream of steam for 10 - 15 minutes before putting the weight on? I do that. It's in the PC manual, and in the FrankHorrigan TEK I followed. I thought you might have meant something else.

Quote:
Do not waste iso wiping down the inside of your sab tub, just smear the soap all over it. This is commonly refferenced in many teks. You should read some more TC teks.


I'll give bodhisatta's SAF SAB TEK, and SpitballJedi's SAB TEK another look - they cite the "water in SAB" protocol.

Thanks for that!

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: puff4200]
    #25612913 -

puff4200 said:
Your jars can't favor trich over cube mycellium if there isn't trich in your jars. I'd work on sterile technique and make sure your cultures are clean.


So you see Trich in those jars? Or are you inferring it's there given that two others in the same G2G batch had it?

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: JHOVA]
    #25612936 -

I'm amazed at what you see in there, and still wonder how much of that might be due to my crappy camera. In the 23 jars, I see a lot of good myc growth, some grains that are perhaps too wet, some that look more dry and have those little white spots on them (is that some of what your judgment is based on?); and, as I said, I had two jars show green Trich, which I removed immediately.

I'm trying to keep procedures clean, JHOVA! and specifically trying not to spread Trich through the house. (Still, independently of what we do, it's in soil, on us, and everywhere, right?)

I didn't have issues till doing work here, in this new home. The previous owner had a "plumbing issue," replaced the flooring, and said the mold issue was resolved. Yes, red flag. I'll be bleaching (or otherwise cleaning) ceiling to floor soon.

I've used agar, but not regularly. I'll start doing so in earnest when, hopefully next month, I have a dedicated room, with a flow hood. That room will not be in the house (and I'm starting fresh, removing the old sheet rock, etc.). If these go south in the meantime, I'll just can everything and wait till I have that proper work environment.

I would love it if you would point out one of the "multiple types of bacteria going on."

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #25612946 -

They don't look good whatever is in those jars and bags and every pic. The farthest pic to the right looks like it could turn color anyday. Mycellium isn't supposed to be that thick and white, the seeds aren't supposed to look like that when there colonized. Nobody's told you they look good, I would relook at your cultures or however you started those.

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #25612947 -

What do you mean it's all over your jars dawg.

None of those are good. If you spawn them (if they even fully colonize to begin with which I doubt) they will mold before your pins are quarter inch tall. And that's tops.

Temp doesn't do anything unless it's past 85.

Proper technique is key. I bet your master had bacteria in it too.


--------------------
If I ever give out misinformation please inform me so I can have the correct information. :cheers:

Tmethyl said:
Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked a monotub that wasn't pinning fast enough. The force of the kick rearranged the genetics of the mushrooms, we now call them Penis Envy.

Caps McGee said:
:thumbsup:
Fun part is figuring out what works best for you

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: puff4200]
    #25612948 -

puff4200 said:
Your jars can't favor trich over cube mycellium if there isn't trich in your jars. I'd work on sterile technique and make sure your cultures are clean.


Yes! I've asked about it here and here, and have been working on this.

That's Plan A. Proper sterilization. I was using an autoclave, but switched to a PC, which I can monitor better . . .

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #25612950 -

...... An autoclave is fully automatic. What do you mean


--------------------
If I ever give out misinformation please inform me so I can have the correct information. :cheers:

Tmethyl said:
Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked a monotub that wasn't pinning fast enough. The force of the kick rearranged the genetics of the mushrooms, we now call them Penis Envy.

Caps McGee said:
:thumbsup:
Fun part is figuring out what works best for you

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: van hatton]
    #25612955 -

puff4200 said:
They don't look good whatever is in those jars and bags and every pic. The farthest pic to the right looks like it could turn color anyday. Mycellium isn't supposed to be that thick and white, the seeds aren't supposed to look like that when there colonized. Nobody's told you they look good, I would relook at your cultures or however you started those.


Yeah, the wispy stuff in that third one what I said I'm suspicious of.
van hatton said:
...... An autoclave is fully automatic. What do you mean

I'd start batches in a communally shared autoclave, but return hours later or the next morning. People change the settings, and sometimes I wasn't 100% confident that the cycle even finished. Etc. It's not an issue with autoclaves, it was an issue with the culture around that autoclave.

Edited by Groovy Hobbit (11/13/18 08:06 PM)

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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #25612979 -

I'm curious: Are you guys going to tell me that these jars, too, are just teeming with Trich and bacteria?


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Re: Grain jars stalled. Should I wait? [Re: Groovy Hobbit]
    #25612986 -

Better but the way the mycellium has wet spots and looks pressed against the jar is bacterial. If you're doing liquid cultures I'd start over. Agar is easier to identify bacteria in.

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