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HALFemptyJOSH
Magician



Registered: 09/01/03
Posts: 428
Loc: USA
Last seen: 6 years, 2 months
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fertilizer question 1
#25593567 - 11/05/18 10:12 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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it seems every fertilizer wants to keep the PH a secret. ( i guess i'll have to test and treat) But my question is more about NPK. I see a lot of people using composts with 2-2-2 NPK. Why not just add some 23-24-2 NPK fertilizer to some coir for a bulk substrate? Why are people using a low NPK compost?
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,915
Loc: Milky way
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Mushrooms are not plants. And they do poorly on overly enriched substrate.
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HALFemptyJOSH
Magician



Registered: 09/01/03
Posts: 428
Loc: USA
Last seen: 6 years, 2 months
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I guess I'm just ahead of the curve here.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,915
Loc: Milky way
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Then show us what we're missing.

It always goes like this. How come mushroom cultivators dont do xy&z things I thought of to make everything better.
In most cases that person hasn't even grown before. Sometimes they have. Both cases they never produce anything compelling to support their idea/theory.
Then they say we don't know what we're talking about and we'll get shown But we never get shown
Sometimes they come back with the excuse the operation they run is too big to show. But then why are they asking here lol.
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ithikuss
Level 4 Mage



Registered: 08/13/18
Posts: 650
Loc: Nightosphere
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Quote:
bodhisatta said: Then show us what we're missing.

It always goes like this. How come mushroom cultivators dont do xy&z things I thought of to make everything better.
In most cases that person hasn't even grown before. Sometimes they have. Both cases they never produce anything compelling to support their idea/theory.
Then they say we don't know what we're talking about and we'll get shown But we never get shown
Sometimes they come back with the excuse the operation they run is too big to show. But then why are they asking here lol.
Stop using all this logic, it's illogical...  p.s. why do we need doctors when there is WMD and google.. or advice from senior cultivators when know it alls, know it all already..
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Edited by ithikuss (11/05/18 10:53 AM)
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HALFemptyJOSH
Magician



Registered: 09/01/03
Posts: 428
Loc: USA
Last seen: 6 years, 2 months
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Re: fertilizer question [Re: ithikuss] 1
#25593694 - 11/05/18 11:04 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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it's not at all complicated and just because YOU do it a certain way doesn't mean shit to me.
I can only imagine manure that is pure manure which they grow straight out of is not very nutrient rich.. okay.. maybe not. Why put coffee grounds in your substrate.. Why bloodmeal? why worm castings? But yes adding fertilizer to coir for substrate... We flame people with ideas like that.. lmao
I get what you're saying you just don't get what I'm saying. People using like a 50/50 compost and coir/straw (what have you) but a compost that is 2-2-2 is mostly just filler which I'm sure a mushroom would like coir and straw more than some dirt and sticks (they are like you said not plants)
This is simply about convenience for those that don't want to ask farmers for manure. Mushrooms aren't too keen on potassium (it is radioactive afterall) So adding a 23-24-2 fertilizer to your coir would be fair. If not the cheapest way to enrich a coir based substrate.. But unpopular opinion I must be wrong.. LMAO
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ithikuss
Level 4 Mage



Registered: 08/13/18
Posts: 650
Loc: Nightosphere
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Quote:
HALFemptyJOSH said: it's not at all complicated and just because YOU do it a certain way doesn't mean shit to me.
I can only imagine manure that is pure manure which they grow straight out of is not very nutrient rich.. okay.. maybe not. Why put coffee grounds in your substrate.. Why bloodmeal? why worm castings? But yes adding fertilizer to coir for substrate... We flame people with ideas like that.. lmao
I get what you're saying you just don't get what I'm saying. People using like a 50/50 compost and coir/straw (what have you) but a compost that is 2-2-2 is mostly just filler which I'm sure a mushroom would like coir and straw more than some dirt and sticks (they are like you said not plants)
This is simply about convenience for those that don't want to ask farmers for manure. Mushrooms aren't too keen on potassium (it is radioactive afterall) So adding a 23-24-2 fertilizer to your coir would be fair. If not the cheapest way to enrich a coir based substrate.. But unpopular opinion I must be wrong.. LMAO
then like Bod said, come back with evidence to back up your claim. Not a but hurt paragraph about how you're right in theory and the the methods that are producing are inferior..
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HALFemptyJOSH
Magician



Registered: 09/01/03
Posts: 428
Loc: USA
Last seen: 6 years, 2 months
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Re: fertilizer question [Re: ithikuss]
#25593763 - 11/05/18 11:36 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Fine, whatever that rotation won't have visible results for about a month as I have already prepared 18 4X9X9 trays and will not be making another 18 trays for at least 12 more days. But that isn't even the point. The point here is I'm being told to produce pictures of proof to people that probably don't even think about NPK or what kind of filler is in their compost. And being a 15 year old shroomerite I'd expect a little more respect. My question was not "Should I usee 24-23-2 fertilizer with my coir?" That's a damn of course I should.. My question was more "Why are you still wasting money using 2-2-2 compost?"
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Bumholio
What's the craic



Registered: 07/23/18
Posts: 4,269
Loc: Shroomsville
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Quote:
HALFemptyJOSH said: And being a 15 year old shroomerite I'd expect a little more respect.
I was always taught you don't expect respect you earn it.
Like the others have said, test your theory, post your findings, don't get butt hurt
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"great things may come to those who wait, but only what's left by those who hustle"
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,915
Loc: Milky way
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Quote:
HALFemptyJOSH said: Fine, whatever that rotation won't have visible results for about a month as I have already prepared 18 4X9X9 trays and will not be making another 18 trays for at least 12 more days. But that isn't even the point. The point here is I'm being told to produce pictures of proof to people that probably don't even think about NPK or what kind of filler is in their compost. And being a 15 year old shroomerite I'd expect a little more respect. My question was not "Should I usee 24-23-2 fertilizer with my coir?" That's a damn of course I should.. My question was more "Why are you still wasting money using 2-2-2 compost?"
So no document of any results prior to this next round? That's somewhat strange. Why not wait to post this thread until you had the evidence
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36fuckin5
Alchemycologist


Registered: 08/11/03
Posts: 12,097
Loc: Diving into Mystical Territori...
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Re: fertilizer question [Re: bodhisatta] 1
#25593947 - 11/05/18 12:52 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Who the hell uses compost for Cubensis anymore? You're talking about some 20-year-old shit that didn't work as well as just dumping water on coir.
We don't worry about NPK because it doesn't matter. We can pull 200% BE with just grain and coir. This isn't a plant. Their nutritional needs aren't complex.
So basically put up or shut up cause you sound like every other noob who can't actually produce results. And you better be using an isolate (I'm sure you're not) or your results mean dick. If you want respect then earn it.
-------------------- Pat The Bunny said:
A punk rock song won't ever change the world, but I can tell you about a couple that changed me.
bodhisatta said:
i recommend common sense and figuring it out.
These are the TEKs I use. They're all as cheap and easy as possible, just like your mom.
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thegiantwithin
Stranger

Registered: 05/16/18
Posts: 78
Last seen: 5 years, 5 months
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Re: fertilizer question *DELETED* [Re: 36fuckin5]
#25613076 - 11/13/18 09:07 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Post deleted by thegiantwithin
Reason for deletion: Because
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ithikuss
Level 4 Mage



Registered: 08/13/18
Posts: 650
Loc: Nightosphere
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Quote:
thegiantwithin said: "It always goes like this. How come mushroom cultivators dont do xy&z things I thought of to make everything better."
"So basically put up or shut up cause you sound like every other noob who can't actually produce results. And you better be using an isolate (I'm sure you're not) or your results mean dick. If you want respect then earn it."
This is why this place sucks these days; a few dumb ass snowflake man-boys attack anyone asking questions that might contradict their holier than though methodology now dominate the conversation by shutting everyone else down with their immature attitudes.
So how about you boys grow up, shut up, and stop crying like the red-headed step children you are every time someone asks a question your frail egos can't cope with? The rest of the adults here are trying to have an intelligent conversation, which you keep rudely interrupting.
Sad really, because this place used to be full of people that were interested in experimentation and learning. Good thing there's other forums on Facebook and Mewe where people actually _help_ others learn versus tear into them for daring to ask questions.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1386696498248239/ https://mewe.com/group/5ab93311a5f4e54ad2b5b9da https://mewe.com/group/5a78a311cd0f852c2259135b
no one shut anyone down, just asked for evidence of the theory before saying it's "ahead of the curve" and possibly causing people to waste money and time in effort to follow said 'advice'. Then getting butt hurt and lashing out for not having the evidence of this theory at the time. dunno why you're getting butt hurt in the first place trying to earn some SJW points for the day... ALSO, IMO, directing people to facebook where they prize themselves on getting and selling your private information is a pretty sad and nasty thing to do...
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Nimph
Im Unclecaptainblue!!!!

Registered: 08/12/18
Posts: 1,605
Loc: The dirty
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Light fertilizing might have some benefit to out door exotics, we'd need to experiment to find out.
Cubes though have no need.
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  Hunters save your exotic prints to trade! https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/25617539
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Failboat
Free man

Registered: 02/01/18
Posts: 8,736
Last seen: 1 month, 1 day
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Quote:
HALFemptyJOSH said: my question is more about NPK. I see a lot of people using composts with 2-2-2 NPK. Why not just add some 23-24-2 NPK fertilizer to some coir for a bulk substrate? Why are people using a low NPK compost?
Because it is unnecessary and wasteful.Quote:
36fuckin5 said: Who the hell uses compost for Cubensis anymore? You're talking about some 20-year-old shit that didn't work as well as just dumping water on coir.
We don't worry about NPK because it doesn't matter. We can pull 200% BE with just grain and coir. This isn't a plant. Their nutritional needs aren't complex.

Quote:
thegiantwithin said: "It always goes like this. How come mushroom cultivators dont do xy&z things I thought of to make everything better."
"So basically put up or shut up cause you sound like every other noob who can't actually produce results. And you better be using an isolate (I'm sure you're not) or your results mean dick. If you want respect then earn it."
This is why this place sucks these days; a few dumb ass snowflake man-boys attack anyone asking questions that might contradict their holier than though methodology now dominate the conversation by shutting everyone else down with their immature attitudes.
So how about you boys grow up, shut up, and stop crying like the red-headed step children you are every time someone asks a question your frail egos can't cope with? The rest of the adults here are trying to have an intelligent conversation, which you keep rudely interrupting.
Sad really, because this place used to be full of people that were interested in experimentation and learning. Good thing there's other forums on Facebook and Mewe where people actually _help_ others learn versus tear into them for daring to ask questions.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1386696498248239/ https://mewe.com/group/5ab93311a5f4e54ad2b5b9da https://mewe.com/group/5a78a311cd0f852c2259135b
You are wrong and sound like you don't know about what we are discussing. You should probably leave, quietly...
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 62,905
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 8 minutes, 9 seconds
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Re: fertilizer question [Re: Failboat] 1
#25613310 - 11/14/18 12:06 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Nobody really uses bloodmeal gypsum coffee and all that jaz for cubes these days, canopies are being pulled with strait coir
-------------------- It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor
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elasticaltiger
Like Tigers in Coitus




Registered: 06/24/13
Posts: 8,438
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Re: fertilizer question [Re: cronicr] 1
#25613511 - 11/14/18 03:28 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
cronicr said: Nobody really uses bloodmeal gypsum coffee and all that jaz for cubes these days, canopies are being pulled with strait coir
This.
No matter what shit you put in your compost it will never equal the amount of food provided by whole grains.
You THINK you're growing on coir or compost because that's the bulk of the volume of the substeate but it's the grains that are providing all the nutrition. That's what you're really growing on.
The more shit you add to you bulk substrate the more important proper pasteurization becomes.
When coir doesn't require proper pasteurization and grains providing more nutrition than the mycelium is already capeable of consuming then there is no reason to invest more time, money and effort into adding nutrients that are completely unnecessary.
When you grow a lot, all these things become very important, time, money, and effort. You learn to cut out everything unnecessary. You'll never convince anyone that adding some more stuff to their substrates, increasing the time, money and effort put in, is going to pay off in flushes when we already can maximize output.
Even if it did noticeably increase yield the increase would have to be substantial to make it worth the time money and effort involved.
-------------------- First time growing cakes? DON'T make a Shotgun Fruiting Chamber
The Shmuvbox. - The Old TC's Like it
Afraid to Start Growing From Your Own Prints? Drop it Like a Tiger! No Pouring. No Syringes. No Cutting. No flaming. No Contamination. No Bullshit.
"The best thing to do while your waiting is to start more stuff. I usually got so much happening that I have tossed projects simply because I didn't have time for them. -Pastywhite QFT
Pastywhite's Easy Agar Tek (PastyPlates)
Tiger Drop Video Demos By munchauzen
Van Gogh would’ve sold more than one painting if he’d put tigers in them.―Bill Watterson
EZEKIEL 23:20
Edited by elasticaltiger (11/14/18 03:30 AM)
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elasticaltiger
Like Tigers in Coitus




Registered: 06/24/13
Posts: 8,438
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Focusing on finding and keeping good genetics will beat out and pay off better than any snake oil you can add to your bulk sub. 
Edit: I shouldn't have said snake oil.compost does provide stuff but in the last 5 years I have not seen anyone produce the evidence that highly nutritious compost and subs perform better than good genetics on coir and grains.
-------------------- First time growing cakes? DON'T make a Shotgun Fruiting Chamber
The Shmuvbox. - The Old TC's Like it
Afraid to Start Growing From Your Own Prints? Drop it Like a Tiger! No Pouring. No Syringes. No Cutting. No flaming. No Contamination. No Bullshit.
"The best thing to do while your waiting is to start more stuff. I usually got so much happening that I have tossed projects simply because I didn't have time for them. -Pastywhite QFT
Pastywhite's Easy Agar Tek (PastyPlates)
Tiger Drop Video Demos By munchauzen
Van Gogh would’ve sold more than one painting if he’d put tigers in them.―Bill Watterson
EZEKIEL 23:20
Edited by elasticaltiger (11/14/18 06:43 AM)
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,915
Loc: Milky way
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Re: fertilizer question [Re: Failboat]
#25613581 - 11/14/18 05:04 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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We're interested in experimentation and learning here hence the criticism the OP got.

There's no experimentation and learning on FB there's coddling and patting people on the back for shit. If you want to call everyone a dumbass for not using fertilizer yet post no results then go to Facebook where there's no critical thinking and you can get away with that crap. Don't believe me go to the shroomery Facebook page which is basically cancer. We demand intelligent discussion here.. and the OP did not provide...
Here at the shroomery we actually want to see results and know about things. OP didn't tell us anything about methodology, nothing about materials, nothing about results. Didn't show anything. Didn't discuss anything. Just said we're all dumb and doing it wrong. Outrageous claims need outrageous evidence.
There's no experimentation there is no learning. There's just a Troll post at the top of this thread.
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 62,905
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 8 minutes, 9 seconds
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How would you even know about the fb group bod you havent been there in forever lol. Its 10× as active as here with over 100k members with no pub n otd thats 100k members pisting strictly id and cult lol. Since your departure things have changed drastically
-------------------- It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor
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