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Offlinetedoro
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unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains
    #25576891 - 10/29/18 07:15 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

I've been experimenting with how I prepare my rye grains and I found something curious.

If I presoak my grains with tap warm water for 24 hours, I can get it up to nearly 46% water content. But when I PC these 5 pound bags, they result in very very dry bags. No contams, but my LI can't leap off.  Its as if the rye husk remains intact and keeps the inner water from humidifying the air in the bag.

I've now been experimenting with presoaking the rye with boiling water (off heat) and getting it to the same water content (only takes 90 minutes).. a few bursted kernels make the bag wayyy wetter. Same water amount in the bag!

In nature, these thing grown on digested kernels. Seems that a bit of breaking the husk helps mimic that. I thought for sure after a long PC run, it would all be the same. Not so!

Now I wonder what a three day soak could make the kernels look like and grow like.

T


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Edited by tedoro (10/29/18 07:35 PM)


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Offlinecelkid
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: tedoro]
    #25576944 - 10/29/18 07:37 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

Ive left my grain to soak for to long before and it sprouted.


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Offlinetedoro
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: celkid]
    #25576979 - 10/29/18 07:55 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

Maybe the mushies would be healthier... like co-op shopping hippies...


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InvisibleLotKid
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: tedoro]
    #25577078 - 10/29/18 08:45 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

Soaking for more than 24 hours usually leads to sprouting. I've never tried using sprouted grains for spawn. I soak for 12-24 hrs then bring the water to a boil, drain and dry. Once the grain is dried it gets bagged up and into the PC.


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Offlinetedoro
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: LotKid]
    #25577107 - 10/29/18 08:51 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

When I do a run its with with 4 bags (5lbs each when done) worth of grain. When I bring it up to a boil, it gets there at a different time because I have a weak stove and four gallons of water on the stove (40 minutes). It hydrates very differently than someone bringing 7 jars worth of grain to a boil in 10 minutes.

I've been trying to find a better way to talk about this grain prep procedure.

Good to know about the 24 hour sprout thing.


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p9hu7's clean spawn thread


Edited by tedoro (10/29/18 08:52 PM)


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InvisibleTheMadHatter420
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: tedoro]
    #25577123 - 10/29/18 08:56 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

Try doing enough for 12 bags, starting with 2lbs of dry grain per bag, 24lbs total. I just soak in hot tap water for a couple hours. Then I bring it up to almost a boil. Shut off and check every 5-10 min. YES it varies but that is why we check it and dump when we see it is properly hydrated. Usually done in about 10-20 min.


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InvisibleLotKid
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: tedoro]
    #25577156 - 10/29/18 09:05 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

I prep my rye by the bushel...



Takes about 30-40 min to boil. Once it's boiling I shut it off and begin draining. Draining takes a good 20-30 min. Then I move the grain to the strainer where I use fans and stirring to help get it cool and dry.


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InvisibleTheMadHatter420
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: LotKid]
    #25577164 - 10/29/18 09:07 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

I have to use 2pcs to hold all my grains currently. I REALLY need to buy a big ass stock pot.


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InvisibleLotKid
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: TheMadHatter420]
    #25577204 - 10/29/18 09:23 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

It's a good investment.


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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: TheMadHatter420]
    #25577218 - 10/29/18 09:32 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

I've noticed that:

The first part of the hydration is easy to achieve... cold or warm. from dry to half hydrated.

The second part seems to need heat.

And there seems to be much more hydration at boiling than just below boiling.

And the grains seem to be more likely to bust if they are introduced to boiling water when they are mostly hydrated.


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Offlinetedoro
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: tedoro]
    #25579709 - 10/30/18 10:07 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

Did tests for the past two days.... I'm so excited and will follow up with photos.

quick summary:

I can easily prep rye berries to 55% water content and have a myco bag too dry to colonize LI.

I can easily prep rye berries to 40% water content and have the bag too wet to fend off bacteria.

Its all if you damage the berry shell or husk.

More soon:

T


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Offlinecelkid
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: tedoro]
    #25579732 - 10/30/18 10:14 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

How are you measuring hydration? By eye?


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Offlinetedoro
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: celkid]
    #25579740 - 10/30/18 10:17 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

I measure the weight of the grain, assume 10% water content. then weigh after simmering/soaking. I also test it with a microwave evaporating the water off and I'm always within a percentage point.


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Edited by tedoro (10/30/18 10:17 PM)


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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: tedoro]
    #25579745 - 10/30/18 10:20 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

I didn't want to go down this road, but I just effed myself hard by assuming water content was king with rye prep. saying your bag has 45% water in it means dick if you don't know how the husk was treated. I just made a bunch of 5 pound bags that have 50% water content and its bone dry in there, my LI just shriveled up.


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Offlinecelkid
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: tedoro]
    #25579754 - 10/30/18 10:23 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

not a bad idea weighing it. I might have to try a similar experiment.

I used to soak for 24h and cook for 5-10mins but would always get quite a few burst grains. Now i soak for like 16h and cook for 5mins so dont get so many burst grains but im starting to think my grain is to dry, colonisation can be slow sometimes.


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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: celkid]
    #25579762 - 10/30/18 10:26 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

I literally just made a test batch of grain at 155 degrees and 170 degrees. The former got to 58% water content before the first bursted berry. 170 is right when the berries take in too much water too fast.

And what I've learned is that if I stop just shy of the bursting shells, load them wet into a PC (bags in my case) I will have a dry bag in a day or two.


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Edited by tedoro (10/30/18 10:27 PM)


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OfflineVroomerMcZoomers
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: tedoro]
    #25579788 - 10/30/18 10:34 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

I dont understand all this grain prep stuff. 

I put 1 cup of rye and 2/3-3/4 cup water in jars with a little gypsum and calcium carbonate, pressure cook it, and it turns out fine every time.

No prep.

Maybe the grain in America is filthy because of a lack of regulations or something, I don't know.  I don't know why all these people soak and wash grain and all this shit.  Ive heard of people finding bugs in their grain.  Ive never seen this.


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Either you repeat the same conventional doctrines everybody is saying, or else you say something true, and it will sound like it's from Neptune.  -Noam Chomsky


Edited by VroomerMcZoomers (10/30/18 10:35 PM)


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Offlinetedoro
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: VroomerMcZoomers]
    #25579858 - 10/30/18 10:57 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

question for you... how do you noc up your jars? grain to grain?


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OfflineVroomerMcZoomers
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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: tedoro]
    #25579870 - 10/30/18 11:03 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

Sometimes, yeah.


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Either you repeat the same conventional doctrines everybody is saying, or else you say something true, and it will sound like it's from Neptune.  -Noam Chomsky


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Re: unboiled rye prep for PC'ing results in very dry grains [Re: VroomerMcZoomers]
    #25579874 - 10/30/18 11:05 PM (2 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

VroomerMcZoomers said:
I put 1 cup of rye and 2/3-3/4 cup water in jars with a little gypsum and calcium carbonate, pressure cook it, and it turns out fine every time.





got any pics?

gypsum and calcium are kinda the same thing right?


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Shop: North Spore Injection Grain Bag, North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   Amazon ½ Pint Jars, Calcium Carbonate, Gypsum, Rye Grain

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