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InvisibleR.I.P.Zappa
Myco Melyco


Registered: 03/30/18
Posts: 1,212
Loc: In Between Space and Time Flag
Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Ferather]
    #25527172 - 10/10/18 02:44 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Ferather said:
It's also aggregated, usually this is not a good sign.




Looked up the definition of aggregated, could you better define that?

I'm interested in getting better at noticing the different nuisances of questionable culture growth. :strokebeard:

Atm if it don't look round and even I don't A2G it.


--------------------
-The heaviest thing one will ever carry is a thought-
-"Like a Blind man In an orgy you gotta feel things out.".-
-When we agree about our hallucinations, we call it “reality".-
-If you defy authority because your told to, that's no better than blindly trusting authority.-

psychonautwiki.org

How it should & shouldn't look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
BOD's Easy AF OAT prep tek.
Principles of mushroom growing for beginners

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OfflineBrain Bulb
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: MadHatter333]
    #25527181 - 10/10/18 02:47 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

MadHatter333 said:
When you guys take transfer do you put the mycelium face down or face up on the next plate?




This one landed myc down.  Not intentional.  Was planning to do some more transfers from the outer edges.


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Offlinetryptkaloids
Learner
I'm a teapot


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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: MadHatter333]
    #25527184 - 10/10/18 02:48 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

MadHatter333 said:
When you guys take transfer do you put the mycelium face down or face up on the next plate?



I dont even think about it :shrug:


--------------------
"Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
Flowchart for Recommended plan of action.
Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms
Use the Damn search engine
After you know what you're doing, take a break 
Pick a book, Make some chips!
Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
 

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OfflineBrain Bulb
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Ferather]
    #25527191 - 10/10/18 02:52 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Ferather said:
It's also aggregated, usually this is not a good sign.





I was going to ask the same question.  Are you referring to the different colors of the agar?


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OfflineFerather
Mycological
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Registered: 03/19/15
Posts: 6,325
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Brain Bulb]
    #25527280 - 10/10/18 03:26 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/aggregated

To cluster, to consolidate. In this case mycelium forming a larger-thicker structure.

----

Hyphal growth

"In an area rich in nutrients, the mycelium will branch often and grow slowly, so maximising the amount of nutrients it can extract. By contrast, in an area low in nutrients the hyphae grow more rapidly and with little branching.
Moreover, in many cases the bulk of the mycelium doesn't grow as individual hyphae - but as bundles of hyphae. Some bundles are simply fairly loose and unstructured aggregations of hyphae, with no differentiation in the functions of the component hyphae.
The opposite also occurs commonly, with a definite structure to the bundle and marked differentiation in the nature of the hyphae making up the bundle."

Rhizomorphs

"These hyphal bundles are referred to by various terms (mycelial cords, mycelial strands or rhizomorphs) and you will see some variation in the use of these terms.
Some people use the term rhizomorph for anything but the loosest of bundles whereas others will use it only for highly structured bundles.
I'll use the word "rhizomorph" here as a general term for all such bundles."

https://www.anbg.gov.au/fungi/mycelium.html

----

Two images of mine, Left: Control - Right: WL-Tek

   

----

My terms

Tomentose - Cottony, woolly, woven, lots of splitting and populating.
Rhizomorph - Lightly clustered mycelium, various reasons.
Aggregated - Very clustered, possibly even solid.


The agar has aggregated mycelium (solid masses later branching into tomentose growth), and rhizomorphs.
I've seen various mycelium aggregate in the presence of, and due to, infection and also toxins.

Personally I believe in this case the aggregation is a response to bacteria-other.


--------------------
                   

Growing mushrooms, general guide and information (Ferather's Journal), https://ibb.co/rG3rML2

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27857366#27857366

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Edited by Ferather (10/10/18 03:34 PM)

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OfflineIntergalacticSpore
Grows shrooms on agar
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Registered: 08/30/18
Posts: 194
Loc: Eastern Europe
Last seen: 3 years, 27 days
Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Ferather]
    #25527316 - 10/10/18 03:40 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

I've been doing some A2A and fruit clone2A and feel really comfortable with it now, is there a reason to use spores long term?
I've heard forever cloning is bad also that mycelium gets used to certain types of agar (like rye flour all the time).

How much of this is "mainstream" shroomery science.

Tried searching threads about these topics but (my) results were inconclusive.


--------------------
One day I will evolve from agar mushroom grower :goat:

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Offlinetryptkaloids
Learner
I'm a teapot


Registered: 02/08/15
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: IntergalacticSpore] * 1
    #25527382 - 10/10/18 03:53 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Changing nute sources can do amazing things for a seemingly "weak" culture. Although bod claims the same result can be acheived just by changing nute % I highly doubt it as it didnt work for me.

The reason to keep using spores is because genetic diversity is a great thing. If it can be avoided is wouldnt clone from a clone culture. But i also wouldn't get rid of a clone culture if I wanted to keep it going. I would slant it.

Cloning from a clone is one step closer to Senescense but growing a clone out multiple times from the same culture is not

Spores give you a chance to find awesome clone cultures


--------------------
"Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
Flowchart for Recommended plan of action.
Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms
Use the Damn search engine
After you know what you're doing, take a break 
Pick a book, Make some chips!
Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
 

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InvisibleR.I.P.Zappa
Myco Melyco


Registered: 03/30/18
Posts: 1,212
Loc: In Between Space and Time Flag
Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Ferather] * 1
    #25527394 - 10/10/18 03:57 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Excellent, I get it now, thanks! :cookiemonster:


--------------------
-The heaviest thing one will ever carry is a thought-
-"Like a Blind man In an orgy you gotta feel things out.".-
-When we agree about our hallucinations, we call it “reality".-
-If you defy authority because your told to, that's no better than blindly trusting authority.-

psychonautwiki.org

How it should & shouldn't look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE
BOD's Easy AF OAT prep tek.
Principles of mushroom growing for beginners

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Offline00Burnout
That one guy
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Registered: 05/02/16
Posts: 2,186
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: IntergalacticSpore]
    #25527400 - 10/10/18 03:59 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Beat me to the punch tryp, but in fewer words lol


--------------------
Peace, pot and microdot!:mushroom2:
No amount of progress has ever been made in the way of man without challenging the things we think we understand.-00Burnout
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OfflineFerather
Mycological
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Registered: 03/19/15
Posts: 6,325
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: IntergalacticSpore]
    #25527426 - 10/10/18 04:07 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

What tryptkaloids has already said, plus my response (not that you need it), spent time on it now....

:smile:

---

Quote:

IntergalacticSpore said:
I've been doing some A2A and fruit clone2A and feel really comfortable with it now.




Good to hear.

:thumbup:


Quote:

IntergalacticSpore said:
Is there a reason to use spores long term?




Sometimes you might want to reset the genetics you are handling, or to make new clones.
Spores = multi-genetics | Random speed, size, colour and yield (so on).


Quote:

IntergalacticSpore said:
I've heard forever cloning is bad also that mycelium gets used to certain types of agar (like rye flour all the time).




If you keep it on cellulose and trace starch combined you 'should' be fine for life (ignoring loss for various reasons).
Ideally you should store it on the main fruiting media, and possibly add other components over time.

For example, you normally fruit using coir + grain spawn, sometimes add some straw-other.

----

Most mycelium will be utilizing cellulose, hemicellulose and sometimes phenols-lignin.
Technically starch is secondary, it wouldn't usually be in abundance.

If you analyze compost, or even wood, you won't find much starch or simple sugar.

----

Malt extract is composed of sugars that are produced 'after' enzymes have been added.

https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/how-to-brew/how-malt-extract-is-made/

Ideally you want the mycelium to produce the above enzymes.


--------------------
                   

Growing mushrooms, general guide and information (Ferather's Journal), https://ibb.co/rG3rML2

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27857366#27857366

DTS DCH Driver for Realtek [DTS:X] - Unlocked and reprogrammed.

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Offline00Burnout
That one guy
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Ferather] * 1
    #25527465 - 10/10/18 04:17 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Ultimately, don't continously clone a clone, go back to spores for diversity (or if your culture dies), and as far as saving a culture goes, look into slants (I reaaaaally need to slant some of my cultures).

If you have a culture you like, but aren't sure if you wanna slant it just yet, keep a "master plate" in cold storage. When you need to make LC or grow out a plate for wedges go back, grab a little piece and put the culture back in cold storage. Every now and then (about 6 months) you'll need to create a new master, which will narrow down genetics a tad. Doing this, and switching media/nute % from time to time will allow you to grow off the same culture for years.


--------------------
Peace, pot and microdot!:mushroom2:
No amount of progress has ever been made in the way of man without challenging the things we think we understand.-00Burnout
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Trade List
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Offlinetryptkaloids
Learner
I'm a teapot


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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: 00Burnout]
    #25527487 - 10/10/18 04:24 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Here's what i would do to reuse a culture. Take 2 transfers from clean culture. Put one in cold storage, then when the warm one grows out take it to 8 more pasty plates and let it sit until i need it. Then take the 8 new plates to 1 or 2 jars each, use those as masters then rinse and repeat with the one in warm storage.

Sorry if thats a bit unorganized


--------------------
"Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
Flowchart for Recommended plan of action.
Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms
Use the Damn search engine
After you know what you're doing, take a break 
Pick a book, Make some chips!
Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
 

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OfflineFerather
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: 00Burnout]
    #25527496 - 10/10/18 04:28 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

If you clone a clone, you will also copy any defect it generated while colonizing, fruiting.
A master that you keep adding to, is a lot better, you expand the primary master.

I add left over spawn to around 25g paper pellets + water, colonize it, cut off the O2, and then it's the fridge.
When I need to, I take samples to agar, then spawn, then it's fruiting media and fruiting setup.

If I get low on master, I simply add more substrate, at this point it can change it a bit.

Note: 25g of paper pellets + 70% water content, requires a 250ml container.

----

When the master stops, you will need spores again.


--------------------
                   

Growing mushrooms, general guide and information (Ferather's Journal), https://ibb.co/rG3rML2

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/27857366#27857366

DTS DCH Driver for Realtek [DTS:X] - Unlocked and reprogrammed.

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Offline00Burnout
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: tryptkaloids]
    #25527514 - 10/10/18 04:35 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

tryptkaloids said:
Here's what i would do to reuse a culture. Take 2 transfers from clean culture. Put one in cold storage, then when the warm one grows out take it to 8 more pasty plates and let it sit until i need it. Then take the 8 new plates to 1 or 2 jars each, use those as masters then rinse and repeat with the one in warm storage.

Sorry if thats a bit unorganized




Realistically, that's more like what I did with my truffle culture, except I don't have even close to the original to go back to. It's super close to being an isolate. I think I see 2 sectors what do you, and anyone else think?


--------------------
Peace, pot and microdot!:mushroom2:
No amount of progress has ever been made in the way of man without challenging the things we think we understand.-00Burnout
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Trade List
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InvisibleMadHatter333
We Are All Mad Here

Registered: 09/20/17
Posts: 4,650
Loc: Your Mom’s Rabbit Hole
Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: Ferather]
    #25527663 - 10/10/18 05:25 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Ferather said:
I do downward on wood lovers and T-Gel, not that it matters when it penetrates the agar.

       




I’ll probably do myc down. Thanks guys for the help.


--------------------

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Offline00Burnout
That one guy
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: MadHatter333]
    #25527676 - 10/10/18 05:30 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

I just wouldn't worry about it tbh. If it lands myc down, awesome, if it doesn't, oh well. Don't spend the extra time trying to flip it over, that's just more time for contams to come in. Regardless of how it lands the myc will leap off, they're hungry and want food!


--------------------
Peace, pot and microdot!:mushroom2:
No amount of progress has ever been made in the way of man without challenging the things we think we understand.-00Burnout
Ghetto Greenhouse
Trade List
https://psychedelia.space

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Offlinetryptkaloids
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I'm a teapot


Registered: 02/08/15
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: 00Burnout]
    #25527689 - 10/10/18 05:35 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

:whathesaid: thats exactly why i dont even think about it


--------------------
"Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
Flowchart for Recommended plan of action.
Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms
Use the Damn search engine
After you know what you're doing, take a break 
Pick a book, Make some chips!
Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
 

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Offlinegizmodo
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: tryptkaloids]
    #25527776 - 10/10/18 06:30 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Where do you guys get your grain or sawdust from?
Looking to fruit some lions mane soon and I haven't yet pointed a finger at where I'm going to be getting that stuff from.


--------------------

One must be mindful to maintain their balance on the slippery earth.

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OfflineDreamReality
MycoPilot
I'm a teapot

Registered: 03/31/09
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: gizmodo]
    #25527789 - 10/10/18 06:35 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Walmart. 40lb bags of WBS


--------------------
Dream's Mono Flip Tek


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InvisibleMunchauzen
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Registered: 06/22/11
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Re: Cultivation General Discussion [Re: gizmodo] * 1
    #25527857 - 10/10/18 07:07 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

gizmodo said:
Where do you guys get your grain or sawdust from?
Looking to fruit some lions mane soon and I haven't yet pointed a finger at where I'm going to be getting that stuff from.



ranch/farm feed stores for whole oats. going rate for grains is typically $12-$15 for 50 lbs. get the triple cleaned stuff sometimes called racehorse oats. other oats will have bullshit in it. the worst ive ever seen in triple cleaned equine oats was a bit of extra chaff.

for the sawdust, you will want to get hardwood pellet fuel. you can probably also find that at the farm supply store, but you can definitely get it at Walmart/Lowes/HomeDepot. its for pellet stoves, which are pretty common. do not goto the wood section at lowes and ask for their sawdust. they will give it to you, but its from pressure treated lumber, and you do not want that. the pellet fuel is all natural, just compressed little pieces of sawdust.

search up the Lipa Tek for prepping your sawdust bags, its like the easiest tek in mycology.

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