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Anonymous #1
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 Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed  [Re: mndfreeze]
#25432304 - 09/03/18 06:48 AM (5 years, 7 months ago) |
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Thank you very much for your posts everyone! Mindfreeze, thank you very much for caring! passifloracaerulea, thank you very much for sharing your experience, I can really relate! And your words ring very true!
I always felt I was weird, that I was different from everyone. Since I was a small child, 7 or 8, I was mad at this world and this life, saying how it doesn't make any sense, how it is pointless, how it is worthless and not worth living, how it has no meaning. But now I think it's all subterfuge, I think I found my personal meaning and point of living. And it's exactly this battle between "good" and "evil", this struggle between those contrasting parts, choosing good and love despite all the bad experiences, madness and pain I've endured. It doesn't have to be "true", but it gives me the meaning I've been craving. Does that make any sense?
For many, many years, all that hate and resistance was a part of my identity. I'd switch between "good me" and "evil me" at least every few days, and I'd accept each part as "me". I thought it was good to be evil. But now I can clearly see that I'm not those bad thoughts, they are happening to me, maybe from an outside source, or maybe from just a screwed up neurotransmitter balance. Whatever the reason, I know that's not me.
I've always been drawn to spirituality, always felt that there is something more than we can see and hear, but always a part of me tried to hinder my progress on that part. This year, I've rejected all the "evil", all the hatred, pain, resistance to people, egocentricism... Or at least I'm trying to. I'm focused on feeling love and understanding to everyone and everything, releasing my pain, releasing resistance to everything that is happening, accepting everything as it is, releasing my ego, but also the resistance I felt to people who are led by their survival mind, their egoic self.
But the problem is that since I started on that path, the other part is fighting back, hard. But that just makes me believe even more that I'm on the right track and that I must persevere
Now, back to more "rational" topics. I'm scared of going to the psychiatrist, guys. I'm really fucking scared. I don't know what will happen next. I don't know if I'll end up much worse. Most of you said that this is mostly my fight, and I do believe this is true. Will the meds, if they give me any, screw up my brain further. Because from what I can tell, they don't work at least, and may hinder my progress in spirituality and dealing with this.
Should I refuse the meds? And only request some kind of talk therapy or DBT? This is a state-funded shrink, it's free, and I somehow don't think they have the time or the interest to talk to people at lenght and may just give me a bucket of drugs and say go crazy (pun not intended).
I really don't know what to do. I'll go see him and try to calmly and rationally decide what to do.
Another thing I'm scared of, what will he do if I tell him about the suicidal ideation? Should I phrase it something like "I've been bothered by those thoughts since I was 10, but now I know they are irrational and that they will pass, they always do." Or does that sound worse? I don't want to be forcefully hospitalized or something.
Thank you all very much for your support, it really means a lot to me!
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 passifloracaerulea
Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 10,485
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: Anonymous #1]
#25432618 - 09/03/18 10:01 AM (5 years, 7 months ago) |
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You shouldn't be hospitalized unless you start talking about suicide. You can always refuse drugs and ask to be referred to a psychotherapist, who can't prescribe drugs. They are more likely to engage in true discussion. As long as you are being honest with yourself and others, I think you're on the best possible path. Out of curiosity, were you a victim of psychopathic, narcissistic, or sexual abuse as a kid?
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Anonymous #1
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: passifloracaerulea]
#25433027 - 09/03/18 01:21 PM (5 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
passifloracaerulea said:
Out of curiosity, were you a victim of psychopathic, narcissistic, or sexual abuse as a kid?
Yeah, kinda. It maybe wasn't very severe, but it was constant and from multiple sources. Constant bullying from other children, dislike and bullying from professors all up to high school, not rape, but some sexual abuse or harassment from some children my age, I felt unloved at home, exposed to constant anger and squabbling by my parents etc. So it wasn't severe abuse from one source, but it all piled together, no one ever stood in my defense, I never felt like having a safe harbor. Everything around me was basically a hostile environment. Felt like everyone around me just wants to stomp on me in any way they can. I'm just now starting to feel like some people like, starting to form connections without alcohol. Just a few years ago I'd have to drink 5 beers just to talk to people, just to stop feeling like they hate me from the moment they see me.
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passifloracaerulea
Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 10,485
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: Anonymous #1]
#25433070 - 09/03/18 01:41 PM (5 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Anonymous #1 said:
Quote:
passifloracaerulea said:
Out of curiosity, were you a victim of psychopathic, narcissistic, or sexual abuse as a kid?
Yeah, kinda. It maybe wasn't very severe, but it was constant and from multiple sources. Constant bullying from other children, dislike and bullying from professors all up to high school, not rape, but some sexual abuse or harassment from some children my age, I felt unloved at home, exposed to constant anger and squabbling by my parents etc. So it wasn't severe abuse from one source, but it all piled together, no one ever stood in my defense, I never felt like having a safe harbor. Everything around me was basically a hostile environment. Felt like everyone around me just wants to stomp on me in any way they can. I'm just now starting to feel like some people like, starting to form connections without alcohol. Just a few years ago I'd have to drink 5 beers just to talk to people, just to stop feeling like they hate me from the moment they see me.
I had a similar experience with mostly bullies who were clear psychopaths and sociopaths. It really sucks that these people actually create our triggers and wear us down over years. It's weird how I don't remember a lot of names and faces from school, but these dipshits have burnt images of themselves clear as day into my memory.
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passifloracaerulea
Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 10,485
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: passifloracaerulea]
#25434898 - 09/04/18 11:43 AM (5 years, 7 months ago) |
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This guy is very helpful.
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 MarkostheGnostic
Elder
Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida 
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: Anonymous #1] 3
#25441544 - 09/06/18 11:38 PM (5 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Anonymous #1 said:
Quote:
Jokeshopbeard said:
Please read the book we both mentioned asap. It will help more than drugs, I promise.
Fuck, I read about 20% of the book and I'm even more scared of going to the shrink now. Seems like they have absolutely no idea how to treat this. I'd really have to stumble upon one who specializes in this disorder. Others are much more likely to make things worse. But the appointment has already been made so I'll go and see what he has to say.
Fuck, fuck, fuck. I can't stand this anymore. One hour I'm the most kind, loving helpful soul, the next I want to see humanity destroyed and their children burned by nuclear blasts, like a demon is possessing me. Fuck this disorder, man, it truly sucks donkey balls!
As Jokeshopbeard mentioned (he and I both had BPD ex-wives and we've discussed this at length), DBT, Dialectical Behavioral Therapy, developed by Marsha Linehan, is probably the best psychotherapeutic technique for showing someone with DBT how to adjust to the warp-n-woof of this particular condition. Personality disorders can be likened to visual astigmatisms, dimples on the cornea (one type) which distorts one's vision. I have an astigmatism that cause me to see a capital letter 'L' when it's an 'I,' and a 'Q' when it's an 'O,' just for an example.
The analogy is that personalities have distortions. Each predominant type of distortion distorts in predominant ways: one can be avoidant, or paranoid, narcissistic, codependent, etc.. The causes may differ but since psychoanalytical thinking is out of vogue, behavioral techniques are in. Firefighters don't show up at a fire and start asking how it started, that comes later. They just get in there and put out the blaze as efficiently as possible.
Consider interviewing therapists who specialize in BPD, AND who are trained in DBT because a lot of therapists would rather not deal. I'm a therapist and one of my BPD female clients demonstrated classic suicidal threat if I didn't comply with her demands. I did not comply (she asked to move into my consulting room, or else)! I confronted her, because acquiescing or backing down is processed as an abandonment, and abandonment issues are the sine qua non of BPD dynamics according to the major psychoanalytic experts on this condition (Masterson, Gunderson, Rinsley, Kernberg, etc.). I did not 'cure' her, but we did eliminate certain symptoms and she did say I had been the most effective of any of her therapists. I was using what I had learned, so I'm passing that to you.
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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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Anonymous #1
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
#25484887 - 09/24/18 10:30 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Update.
So, I went to the doc today and he said I don't have BPD. He didn't ask any in-depth questions, he seemed to equate BPD and psychopathy (he said something like "well, you feel guilty and apologize after an outburst, psychopaths wouldn't do that, you don't have BPD). But, God bless his words, I pray he is right. He at first seemed to think I'm bipolar (as did I), but I don't have noticeable manias so he just diagnosed depression. He gave me a script for duloxetine (Cymbalta) and Valium, I'll go pick up the drugs tomorrow and see if they help. I'm scared shitless of diazepam, I already know I'm going to get addicted to this shit...
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passifloracaerulea
Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 10,485
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: Anonymous #1] 1
#25484978 - 09/24/18 11:05 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Valium and klonopin to me are less dangerous than xanax, ativan, or etizolam. The longer half life makes it less tempting to continue dosing for me.
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Anonymous #1
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: passifloracaerulea]
#25484995 - 09/24/18 11:13 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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passifloracaerulea, would you say that you feel guilt after an outburst? Do you apologize to someone you hurt, verbally or otherwise? I'm just not convinced this rules out BPD.
I'll see after tomorrow. Xanax makes me feel great for a while, and I usually don't redose, but it still makes me feel angry and agitated a day or two after taking it. And I hate feeling those feelings, even more than depression. The doc said diazepam is much more suited for my symptoms than xanax, so we'll see. He said I can eat it whenever I feel the need, he's not worried about addiction (but I am).
And this duloxetin is an SNRI, seems to be moderately efficient for both depression and anxiety. I really hope this works, at least a bit, so I can stand on my feet again.
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RJ Tubs 202
Registered: 09/20/08
Posts: 6,175
Loc: USA
Last seen: 6 days, 8 hours
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: Anonymous #1]
#25487021 - 09/25/18 12:26 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Valium is being given for depression?
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mndfreeze  
Shroomery Secret Service
Registered: 04/22/02
Posts: 20,538
Loc: PuppetMasterFlash
Last seen: 3 days, 3 hours
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
#25487040 - 09/25/18 12:52 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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He did say depression AND anxiety. Maybe flipping between both the doc decided it was serious enough to give a benzo for the anxiety side of things.
My bipolar ex (who now claims she has bpd) was given mood stabilizers, anti depressants, and benzo's. Debatable how much it all helped since she was still batshit insane regardless, but she is a pretty extreme case.
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Nothing says love like grannies prolapsed anus!
quote]Urb said:
I know... Its fucked up... Ill fix it minyana..[/quote]
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passifloracaerulea
Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 10,485
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: Anonymous #1]
#25487587 - 09/25/18 09:22 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Anonymous #1 said:
passifloracaerulea, would you say that you feel guilt after an outburst? Do you apologize to someone you hurt, verbally or otherwise? I'm just not convinced this rules out BPD.
I'll see after tomorrow. Xanax makes me feel great for a while, and I usually don't redose, but it still makes me feel angry and agitated a day or two after taking it. And I hate feeling those feelings, even more than depression. The doc said diazepam is much more suited for my symptoms than xanax, so we'll see. He said I can eat it whenever I feel the need, he's not worried about addiction (but I am).
And this duloxetin is an SNRI, seems to be moderately efficient for both depression and anxiety. I really hope this works, at least a bit, so I can stand on my feet again.
unless the person has really fucked me over kike working on my crew, then jumping my mine.
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Jokeshopbeard
Humble Student
Registered: 11/30/11
Posts: 26,088
Loc: Deep in the system
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: mndfreeze] 1
#25487596 - 09/25/18 09:26 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
mndfreeze said:
My bipolar ex (who now claims she has bpd) was given mood stabilizers, anti depressants, and benzo's. Debatable how much it all helped since she was still batshit insane regardless, but she is a pretty extreme case.
IME, none of that shit really works for BPD. Behaviour therapy seems to be what works best. Although big pharma has all those tasty drugs it needs to sell!!
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Let it be seen that you are nothing. And in knowing that you are nothing... there is nothing to lose, there is nothing to gain. What can happen to you? Something can happen to the body, but it will either heal or it won't. What's the big deal? Let life knock you to bits. Let life take you apart. Let life destroy you. It will only destroy what you are not.
--Jac O'keeffe
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder
Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: Anonymous #1] 3
#25491347 - 09/26/18 06:46 PM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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BPD does have a bad reputation for clinicians. Partly, the threats of suicide while under one's care is scary for the therapist. Sometimes there is another personality disorder together with the presenting problem, it is called co-morbidity. Trump is called a "malignant narcissist" by psychiatrists, for example, because he meets all the DSM-5 criteria for both Narcissistic Personality Disorder and Antisocial Personality Disorder. But one can have "features" of another disorder without having the full criteria of it. So, one can experience paranoia without being a Paranoid Personality Disordered individual. My ex wife was clearly Borderline, but she also demonstrated both Antisocial AND Sadistic personality traits. It's like a kind of pathological solar system - the dominant disorder is the sun and the secondary features are like orbiting planets, each with their own characteristics.
BUT, BPD is not Antisocial PD so I don't know what he's going on about. Moreover, some people like Dr. Michael Stone, have shown degrees of psychopathy, from 01 - 22. At the lower levels there may well be some guilt or remorse, it's not black and white, but as the categories worsen these empathetic feelings markedly diminish and disappear. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Most_Evil Mind you, I am not diagnosing here, or even suggesting, just putting out some info. My ex had criminal tendencies but not all Borderlines do.  My BPD client who hinted at suicide if I didn't allow her to move into my consulting room was not trying to extort in a criminal way, it was an element of her BPD condition. Sometimes the element can swell to become just as large like in a 'binary star system.' The character played by Glenn Close in the film Fatal Attraction, for example, portrayed a Borderline with marked Antisocial features, but not the character portraying BPD played by Diane Keaton in the film Looking for Mr. Goodbar.
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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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passifloracaerulea
Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 10,485
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: MarkostheGnostic] 1
#25491986 - 09/27/18 12:09 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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I have extreme empathy for animals and for people who get shit on day in day out. Some people should spontaneously combust though.
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Anonymous #1
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: passifloracaerulea]
#25492009 - 09/27/18 12:36 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
passifloracaerulea said:
I have extreme empathy for animals and for people who get shit on day in day out. Some people should spontaneously combust though.
This feels like I have written it! I feel exactly the same, I can't even squish a fly, I feel extreme empathy for animals and even plants, and for people who are beaten and broken, homeless, lonely, whatever, and will at least talk to them, actually listen, because that's often the thing people need.
I just started taking the meds so can't know if they will work or not, but I feel good right now.
And this will probably sound crazy, I used to be the most rational and skeptical person ever, but now I suspect I might be a victim of a psychic attack of some kind. All of my recent symptoms are really weird and make no sense, don't fit in any diagnosis, not really, but they fit perfectly with the description of a psychic attack on woo-woo websites. And I know exactly who and why might be attacking me. An obsidian ball in combination with protection visualization really helps, I feel strong, calm, happy and sane, so even if it's a pure placebo, I'm gonna stick with it and try to "strengthen my aura".
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passifloracaerulea
Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 10,485
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: Anonymous #1]
#25492419 - 09/27/18 08:12 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Huh, I mine and make rainbow obsidian spheres. Funny...
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder
Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: passifloracaerulea] 2
#25494712 - 09/28/18 01:52 AM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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I watched this today: How to Spot the 9 Traits of Borderline Personality Disorder
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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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CookieCrumbs
Fucked off to the pub
Registered: 12/10/11
Posts: 14,168
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: Anonymous #1] 3
#25496812 - 09/28/18 08:44 PM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Anonymous #1 said:
Update.
So, I went to the doc today and he said I don't have BPD. He didn't ask any in-depth questions, he seemed to equate BPD and psychopathy (he said something like "well, you feel guilty and apologize after an outburst, psychopaths wouldn't do that, you don't have BPD). But, God bless his words, I pray he is right. He at first seemed to think I'm bipolar (as did I), but I don't have noticeable manias so he just diagnosed depression. He gave me a script for duloxetine (Cymbalta) and Valium, I'll go pick up the drugs tomorrow and see if they help. I'm scared shitless of diazepam, I already know I'm going to get addicted to this shit...
Sounds like he doesn't really know what BPD is. It is not psychopathy (or antisocial personality disorder as Markos said.)
Not sure what country you're in but based on what you've said I'd be VERY wary of your professionals.
But then again I'm wary of professionals here in the states. It's apparently common for us with BPD to distrust.
Being said it's quite obvious many of them attempt to diagnose and treat what they aren't qualified to. BPD and PTSD are similar and usually have the same environmental cause. For that matter alot of mental illness symptoms overlap. Not great to diagnose yourself. But never good to know more about mental illness than the professional you're paying.
Benzos and mood stabilizers can tone down episodes but won't really control them. That's something you have to learn to do.
Passiflora and JSB made great points. You kinda need to shape your life in a way to control the downs. Train your brain. Many of us with BPD are happier avoiding relationships altogether and focusing on other things in life. I think that's important for everyone though. You need to be comfortable and happy with yourself before you can be happy with someone else.
Take care of yourself. Work on yourself. Drugs are a tool. Not a solution.
Good luck.
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  Free time is the only time 
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passifloracaerulea
Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 10,485
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Re: Borderline personality disorder experience and advice needed [Re: CookieCrumbs] 1
#25496843 - 09/28/18 08:50 PM (5 years, 6 months ago) |
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She actually knows her shit. I wish I had a therapist that cool.
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