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OfflineTyperwritermonky
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My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) * 1
    #25339319 - 07/21/18 05:49 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

Hey y'all!  Had something occur to me the last few days when I was in the shower or soaking in the tub on how what we all call Reality - or have come to collectively understand as Reality - is actually created.  I broke it down into three main terms; subjective reality, objective reality, and awareness.  These are more then terms - they are functions in the formation of Reality - and ideally a formulaic equation would able to be derived... until then, here's what I have.  I can't really find a point in which it doesn't make sense; and am open to questions and criticism!

So in the models, the three circles of the venn diagram in the first model are the same three loci in the second model of how Reality is formed - and where the circles in the venn diagram overlap are focal points on the model. If you follow the arrows on that model it shows you the directional flow, that always ends up in the infinite creation of Reality. The venn diagram is more useful for understanding what exactly that Reality is, and the realities that create it.

As well, the subjective/objective focal point is more of a reflective area, and I think a better term would be subjective/objective reflective point.  So just use that instead.





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Edited by Typerwritermonky (07/21/18 06:02 PM)


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: Typerwritermonky]
    #25339523 - 07/21/18 08:34 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

I like this venn diagram but maybe do not agree with each of the labels

my problem is in the naming in the middle and the upper overlap.


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OfflineTyperwritermonky
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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: redgreenvines]
    #25339836 - 07/22/18 12:59 AM (2 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

redgreenvines said:
I like this venn diagram but maybe do not agree with each of the labels

my problem is in the naming in the middle and the upper overlap.




So I'm defenitely set on "the other" - because when subjective and objective reality overlap - yet we have no awareness of it - that is what other beings experience. But what would you term "Reality as we know"?  I have the * there to denote I'm not quite sure what to call it, and maybe just a symbol would be better - would like to improve that term.


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Go ahead and PM me or ask about it, as well as microdosing LSD.


Edited by Typerwritermonky (07/22/18 01:00 AM)


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: Typerwritermonky] * 4
    #25341961 - 07/23/18 11:19 AM (2 years, 9 months ago)


while trying to make sense of this
I came up with a more unified view, what distorts it this way is the term reality:
Implying a kind of Inner, Outer, Spirit approach to trinity, which I see as a crude system that fragments badly.

Instead, I see inner reality as mental reflections of outer reality including all of memory which includes all past versions of outer reality from the experiences of the person, and awareness is a subset of the mental reality/experience, more like Russian dolls than zones that overlap in part.


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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: Typerwritermonky]
    #25342349 - 07/23/18 02:46 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

1) I suspect any system that doesn't acknowledge paradox, misses the mark.
Hence Taoism is full of paradox. See for example both Chuang Tzu and Lao tzu.

2) Any belief system, (which is what models are in danger of becoming),
only turns into another filtering system. Additionally while filtering out anything that doesn't fit, at the the same time they tend to fool the believer into thinking they have the inside scoop. So they do double harm.

3) Such systems are not necessary, many people who spontaneously experienced awakenings did so without systems...so...when we come up with such systems we might wonder why we invest energy in them...and wonder what we expect to get out of them.
And of course many people who experienced awakenings with psychedelics, did so without relying on systems.

4) Systems are products of the logical, conscious, or rational mind, and mystical experience of 'deeper' 'realities', is precisely not that, and awakening is almost never experienced as a result of rational cognitive processes.


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OfflineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: redgreenvines]
    #25348538 - 07/26/18 07:07 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

Awesome stuff.

How i understand it, reality exists in different "forms", like objective reality and our own consciousness reality, two different realities stemming from a Source. Basically treating reality like its an object such as energy.

Great stuff guys :popcorn:


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OfflineFreedom
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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: Typerwritermonky]
    #25350017 - 07/27/18 11:19 AM (2 years, 9 months ago)

im wondering what you mean by subjective and objective. The way I think of these terms is subjective is our sense perceptions and objective is our conceptual model.


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OfflineTyperwritermonky
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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #25358145 - 07/31/18 02:07 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

LogicaL Chaos said:
Awesome stuff.

How i understand it, reality exists in different "forms", like objective reality and our own consciousness reality, two different realities stemming from a Source. Basically treating reality like its an object such as energy.

Great stuff guys :popcorn:





excactly.  in the end, subjective, objective, and awareness all are the same "source".  Or what you can call Source, Creator, Krishna.. etc. etc.  we just percieve them as seperate because we do not exist in a non-dual state.  only when one gets to full "moksha" either through meditation, or high dose psychedelic/disso experience, can they see that they are all one although appear to be three.

Aristotle's exposition on the one-dot/two-dot is perfect for this.


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Go ahead and PM me or ask about it, as well as microdosing LSD.


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OfflineTyperwritermonky
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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: Freedom]
    #25358155 - 07/31/18 02:12 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Freedom said:
im wondering what you mean by subjective and objective. The way I think of these terms is subjective is our sense perceptions and objective is our conceptual model.





Subjective reality is the way that reality appears to the self, and can exist without awareness.  A good example is a man who is very drunk can believe his subjective reality is correct when awareness dissapears due to inebriation; that girl was very into him, that guy wanted to fight him - in his subjective reality that was total truth.

But if he had awareness and wasn't in a drunken stupor, he'd be able to have the subjective/awareness of ego-mind that involves superego - and would be able to consult that to establish "that girl didn't want me" and "that guy didn't want to fight".

Objective reality is the way that things appear without any terms of subjectivity; as in an ego-death state.  The ego-mind goes away, subjectivity dissapears and all thats left is the awareness/objective overlap space.  At even higher doses, awareness goes away and it is pure objective reality (5-meo-DMT, very high ketamine breakthroughs, very high DMT breakthroughs).  This is the purest form of the "reality" we experience.


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My Daily Stack: Rhodiola Rosea, True Calm, Ginkgo Biloba, Fresh Bee Pollen, Lions Mane/Reishi/Chaga/Cordyceps Complex, Kanna, Full Spectrum Multivitamin, Full Spectrum Omega Fatty Acids, Zyflamend Full Body Support, Turmeric and Black Pepper Complex, Ashwaghanda, Skullcap, Magnolia Bark, NAC, Beta-Carotene, Potassium and Magnesium.

Go ahead and PM me or ask about it, as well as microdosing LSD.


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Invisibleredgreenvines
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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: Typerwritermonky]
    #25358421 - 07/31/18 04:28 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

needs clearer understanding of subjective and objective
also
needs a clearer and more consistent understanding of perception distinct from mystic attributions (eg. shiva and krishna are not why we can perceive things as separate).

leaving these three terms vague devalues this thread.


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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: Typerwritermonky]
    #25358936 - 07/31/18 09:14 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

The only reality is the one you are experiencing right here. Everything you can think of, postulate, or refer to, happens right here. This is all there is, and if there was something else, it would be here too.

Damnit RGV beat me to it. Should have read the fucking thread.

(edit: changed "now" to "here" as time is a spooky thing)


Edited by xFrockx (07/31/18 09:18 PM)


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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: xFrockx]
    #25359123 - 07/31/18 10:20 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

Well if subjectivity is our experience.. then objectivity is an abstract concept.. so therefore subjectivity is concrete..

^This is taken as a priori..

And is switched to objective first and subjective second using a posteriori logic


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Re: My Bi-Fold Models of How Reality Is Created (Diagrams Included) [Re: BrendanFlock]
    #25360312 - 08/01/18 03:52 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

It's all just the tail wagging the dog.


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