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OnlineKryptos
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #3]
    #25188787 - 05/07/18 12:06 AM (6 years, 14 days ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #3 said:
...A standard underground procedure was used (obtained from an Internet site; details withheld in accordance with Microgram policy)...




Off topic, but this caught my eye. *eyes usernames suspiciously*

Carry on.

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Anonymous #1

Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #3]
    #25202169 - 05/13/18 10:35 PM (6 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #3 said:
This is from their own microgram they used to put out (but since stopped)

Also you might want to copy and paste the links if you want to read them as they may show "www.shroomery.org" as the link referrer if you click them.


MAIL-ORDER PSILOCYBIN MUSHROOM SPORES IN GREAT FALLS, MONTANA

The DEA Western Laboratory (San Francisco, California) recently received a submission of three standard design, plastic, 12 milliliter syringes containing a clear liquid with very small black specks suspended in the solution, suspected to be aqueous suspensions of psilocybin mushroom spores. The exhibits were seized by the Postal Inspector in Great Falls, Montana Each syringe had a piece of colored tape wrapped around it; one red, one white, and one blue Each tape had a different alphanumeric code written on it, the meaning of which was not intuitively obvious. For prosecution purposes (attempt to manufacture psilocybin and/or psilocin, controlled substances), it was necessary to show both that the spores were viable (would grow mushrooms), and that the mushrooms grown from the spores contained psilocybin and/or psilocin. Visual examination of a drop of the liquid at 750x magnification revealed thousands of brownish colored, semi-transparent, oval shaped spores. Each solution was used to inoculate four different growth media: Potato, dextrose, yeas agar (PDY), dog food agar (DFA), malt extract agar (MEA), and brown rice powder and vermiculite. The basic procedures followed those provided in: Gross ST. Detecting psychoactive drugs in the developmental stages of mushrooms. Journal of Forensic Sciences 2000;45(3):527. [Further details not provided in accordance with Bulletin policy.] Mycelium growth was obtained Photo 5 with two of the syringes; analysis of samples of the mycelium by GC/MS and GC/IRD confirmed psilocin (see: Casale JF. An aqueous-organic extraction method for the isolation and identification of psilocin from hallucinogenic mushrooms. Journal of Forensic Sciences 1985;30(1):247). Transfer of the mycelium to a grow chamber resulted in mushroom growth (see Photo 5), and analysis of the dried mushrooms confirmed psilocin. This was the first submission of this type to the Western Laboratory

That's the general process they do when they get unknown spores or cultures, there's numerous micrograms that document them culturing spores. Their drug labs are so backed up nowadays who knows when/if they'll get around to it.

https://www.dea.gov/pr/micrograms/2003/03jul-mb.pdf

#2

- INTELLIGENCE ALERT -
SUSPECTED PSILOCYBE MUSHROOM SPORES IN DETROIT, MICHIGAN
The DEA North Central Laboratory (Chicago, Illinois) recently received three glass vials containing a clear solution, suspected Psilocybe mushroom spores in water. The exhibits were originally contained in three syringes, and were purchased in Detroit, Michigan by agents from
the DEA Detroit Division (details withheld in accordance with Microgram policy). The total net weight and volume of the samples was 35.9 grams (40.0 milliliters). A growth cycle was initiated for all three samples in order to determine whether or not Psilocybe mushrooms could be produced. A standard underground procedure was used (obtained from an Internet site; details withheld in accordance with Microgram policy). Mycelium growth was
observed after about 3 weeks; however, only two small mushrooms grew (which were harvested after 78 days). Analysis of methanolic extracts of the two mushrooms by GC/MS indicated no controlled substances, suggesting that the mushrooms were not Psilocybe mushrooms. It is unclear whether the sale was a scam, or if the solution was contaminated during the transfer from the syringes to the vials, or if there was some other unknown problem with the solution or cultivation procedures. This is the first time that a mushroom grow has been performed at the North Central Laboratory.

https://www.dea.gov/pr/micrograms/2005/mg0105.pdf

Those micrograms are pretty interesting reads, bummer they stopped releasing them, must have realized they weren't the only ones reading them.



What the hell is all this.the way that was written. Makes it sound as though possession of spore syringes is enough to charge Someone with a crime especially where it says
"For prosecution purposes (attempt to manufacture psilocybin and/or psilocin, controlled substances), it was necessary to show both that the spores were viable (would grow mushrooms), and that the mushrooms grown from the spores contained psilocybin and/or psilocin."

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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #25202545 - 05/14/18 05:27 AM (6 years, 6 days ago)

Duh having a spore syringe is enough. If you have cultivation supplies it's intent to manufacture. Most people don't have a microscopy setup for those spores lol.

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Anonymous #1

Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: bodhisatta]
    #25203240 - 05/14/18 12:45 PM (6 years, 6 days ago)

No I mean the way they made it sound is they found just syringes in the mail. No supplies. I was always under the impression that you had to atleast have mycelium that had germinated and there for contained psilocybin to be charged with anything. Otherwise how do spore websites operate since many have spores and various types of supplies be it grain, spawn bags, filter patches, jars etc. all for sale and I assume in close proximity.

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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #25203279 - 05/14/18 01:05 PM (6 years, 6 days ago)

They don't get a warrant in the first place. If someone caught a spore store selling weed or mushrooms and then they got raided the entire place would be intention to manufacture. Basically don't get cops in your place because if you do syringes turn into intention

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OfflineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #25204182 - 05/14/18 07:43 PM (6 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #1 said:
What the hell is all this.the way that was written. Makes it sound as though possession of spore syringes is enough to charge Someone with a crime especially where it says
"For prosecution purposes (attempt to manufacture psilocybin and/or psilocin, controlled substances), it was necessary to show both that the spores were viable (would grow mushrooms), and that the mushrooms grown from the spores contained psilocybin and/or psilocin."





Yes, it is.  Do you really think that they believe that all the spores are for microscopy?  Would a judge believe it?

Quote:

Anonymous #1 said:
No I mean the way they made it sound is they found just syringes in the mail. No supplies. I was always under the impression that you had to atleast have mycelium that had germinated and there for contained psilocybin to be charged with anything. Otherwise how do spore websites operate since many have spores and various types of supplies be it grain, spawn bags, filter patches, jars etc. all for sale and I assume in close proximity.




To be guilty of intent to manufacture a controlled substance, you have to decide to manufacture, and then you have to do one overt act to further your plot.    If you decide to grow Psilocybe, and then go buy jars, you are guilty of attempt to manufacture.

It's more common that people get charged with actual mushrooms, since they are easier for the crime lab to test.  But the law doesn't require that.

Spore websites operate in a grey area, and claim that the spores are not for cultivation.  Some spore websites won't deal with you if you mention that you are going to grow the spores.

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Anonymous #1

Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #25204600 - 05/14/18 11:56 PM (6 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

Alan Rockefeller said:
Quote:

Anonymous #1 said:
What the hell is all this.the way that was written. Makes it sound as though possession of spore syringes is enough to charge Someone with a crime especially where it says
"For prosecution purposes (attempt to manufacture psilocybin and/or psilocin, controlled substances), it was necessary to show both that the spores were viable (would grow mushrooms), and that the mushrooms grown from the spores contained psilocybin and/or psilocin."





Yes, it is.  Do you really think that they believe that all the spores are for microscopy?  Would a judge believe it?

Quote:

Anonymous #1 said:
No I mean the way they made it sound is they found just syringes in the mail. No supplies. I was always under the impression that you had to atleast have mycelium that had germinated and there for contained psilocybin to be charged with anything. Otherwise how do spore websites operate since many have spores and various types of supplies be it grain, spawn bags, filter patches, jars etc. all for sale and I assume in close proximity.




To be guilty of intent to manufacture a controlled substance, you have to decide to manufacture, and then you have to do one overt act to further your plot.    If you decide to grow Psilocybe, and then go buy jars, you are guilty of attempt to manufacture.

It's more common that people get charged with actual mushrooms, since they are easier for the crime lab to test.  But the law doesn't require that.

Spore websites operate in a grey area, and claim that the spores are not for cultivation.  Some spore websites won't deal with you if you mention that you are going to grow the spores.



So if I lived in a state where spores where legal for microscopy and somehow syringes where discovered in the mail. Would that be enough evidence to get a search warrant? Or would more have to be discovered . Like the syringes where shipped with a book on how to cultivate?

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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #25204838 - 05/15/18 05:13 AM (6 years, 5 days ago)

With a book, more than enough likely. But a extremely slim chance of it being brought to any ones attention unless you already done fucked up

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Anonymous #3

Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #25205672 - 05/15/18 02:29 PM (6 years, 5 days ago)

I was shocked I just recently had to buy some spores and when they arrived, I was amazed to see that the vendor actually put instructions on how to properly Germinate jars and grow the shrooms 0.0

I messaged him ASAP to let him know I thought that was a terrible idea.

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Anonymous #1

Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #3]
    #25206498 - 05/15/18 09:57 PM (6 years, 5 days ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #3 said:
I was shocked I just recently had to buy some spores and when they arrived, I was amazed to see that the vendor actually put instructions on how to properly Germinate jars and grow the shrooms 0.0

I messaged him ASAP to let him know I thought that was a terrible idea.



Wow  You'd think anyone who was going to sell spores would have heard about what happened to psilocybinFanaticus.

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OfflineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #3]
    #25217681 - 05/20/18 10:47 PM (6 years, 1 hour ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #1 said:
So if I lived in a state where spores where legal for microscopy and somehow syringes where discovered in the mail. Would that be enough evidence to get a search warrant? Or would more have to be discovered . Like the syringes where shipped with a book on how to cultivate?





That is up to the judge that they ask for the warrant, but I think it'd be enough for most judges.  The standard of evidence for a search warrant is probable cause, meaning it's more likely than not that a crime occurred.  Since most people who buy spores grow them, I think that'd be enough for probable cause.

It'd take a rather aggressive postal inspector though, most of them are more used to finding actual drugs than trying to make a case from spores.


Quote:

Anonymous #3 said:
I was shocked I just recently had to buy some spores and when they arrived, I was amazed to see that the vendor actually put instructions on how to properly Germinate jars and grow the shrooms 0.0

I messaged him ASAP to let him know I thought that was a terrible idea.





I've never heard of that, though I imagine they will probably get away with it.  In the 70's / 80's the feds were going after spore vendors aggressively, but they haven't in a long time.

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Anonymous #2

Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #25232014 - 05/27/18 01:28 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

How hard do you think it would be to find one of these syringe shops and find spores that have germinated within the syringe?

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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #2]
    #25232019 - 05/27/18 01:32 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Not hard. But who cares. Oral sex is illegal and on the books in a few states(though federally unconstitutional) think its hard to find people giving head in Georgia?

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OfflineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #2]
    #25239233 - 05/30/18 08:56 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #2 said:
How hard do you think it would be to find one of these syringe shops and find spores that have germinated within the syringe?





Why would anyone care if some of the spores germinated?

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Anonymous #3

Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #25239509 - 05/31/18 12:17 AM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Probably because the whole "once germination has occurred you're manufacturing a schedule 1" ordeal

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Anonymous #2

Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Alan Rockefeller]
    #25239626 - 05/31/18 03:52 AM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Alan Rockefeller said:
Quote:

Anonymous #2 said:
How hard do you think it would be to find one of these syringe shops and find spores that have germinated within the syringe?





Why would anyone care if some of the spores germinated?



Because you now have growing mycelium meaning you are officially “manufacturing” psilocybin.  I’m just wondering where do we draw the line here?  When playing by the rules now and getting black/white right/wrong I could see the potential for a headline to say “Spore vendor caught illegally manufacturing Schedule 1 drug.  Estimated street value of 14 cents was recovered today”.  I just want to define how far we’re willing to go here in order to keep the peace, protect and serve.

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OfflineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #3] * 1
    #25241962 - 06/01/18 02:58 AM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #3 said:
Probably because the whole "once germination has occurred you're manufacturing a schedule 1" ordeal





It's not really like that - it's more like the cops find something sketchy, test it for psilocybin with gc/ms, and the charges stick if it's positive.  A few hyphae germinating won't produce more than a few nanograms of psilocybin, so there would be no positive test.  A colonized petri dish, maybe.

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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Anonymous #3] * 1
    #25265403 - 06/13/18 11:10 AM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous #3 said:
Probably because the whole "once germination has occurred you're manufacturing a schedule 1" ordeal



To be clear, there is no such thing as being guilty of "intent to manufacture."  That is not a crime.  ATTEMPT to manufacture is a crime, and it occurs as soon as you form the intent to manufacture AND take a step (or a significant step, depending on the state) in furtherance of that goal.  Intent alone is not enough.

Whether cultivation supplies and a spore syringe are enough evidence to convict for attempt is up to the jury.  For a defendant, that's not a great bet if it goes to trial, though.  In any case, it's definitely enough to charge.


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OfflineHoodafucisdat
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Enlil]
    #25265427 - 06/13/18 11:23 AM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Bummer man. Dudes busted strait up. I wonder what kind of vacation time it will bring? I know lots of mycologists but none who got caught. Anyone know what kinda time getting popped brings?


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OnlineKryptos
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Re: Cultivation setup caught up in a drug bust. Any advice for SWIM? (moved) [Re: Enlil]
    #25266645 - 06/13/18 08:25 PM (5 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

Anonymous #3 said:
Probably because the whole "once germination has occurred you're manufacturing a schedule 1" ordeal



To be clear, there is no such thing as being guilty of "intent to manufacture."  That is not a crime.  ATTEMPT to manufacture is a crime, and it occurs as soon as you form the intent to manufacture AND take a step (or a significant step, depending on the state) in furtherance of that goal.  Intent alone is not enough.

Whether cultivation supplies and a spore syringe are enough evidence to convict for attempt is up to the jury.  For a defendant, that's not a great bet if it goes to trial, though.  In any case, it's definitely enough to charge.




Couldn't you pick up a conspiracy if you talked about it and someone else took a step in furtherance of the crime?

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