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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


Registered: 07/09/16
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: LtLurker]
#25160556 - 04/23/18 06:14 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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Gotcha thanks bro
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: LtLurker]
#25160577 - 04/23/18 06:22 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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you can mix two MS cultures of different varieties and get a new varietal hybrid. you can mix two different varieties of clone together and get a new varietal hybrid you can mix two isolates/monocultures/strains of different varieties together and get a new varietal hybrid or any combination thereof
Quote:
LtLurker said: Nah it's the same thing man. That clone mycellium has already mated. They may over grow each other, but they won't combine into a new variety.
Quote:
LtLurker said:
MS has shit tons of spores that already mated before the 2 varietys are even mixed in substrate, preventing any inter-variety mating.
nope
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LtLurker
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: bodhisatta]
#25160597 - 04/23/18 06:30 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
bodhisatta said: you can mix two MS cultures of different varieties and get a new varietal hybrid. you can mix two different varieties of clone together and get a new varietal hybrid you can mix two isolates/monocultures/strains of different varieties together and get a new varietal hybrid or any combination thereof
Quote:
LtLurker said: Nah it's the same thing man. That clone mycellium has already mated. They may over grow each other, but they won't combine into a new variety.
Quote:
LtLurker said:
MS has shit tons of spores that already mated before the 2 varietys are even mixed in substrate, preventing any inter-variety mating.
nope
GTFO Really? What the fuck have I been reading.
Sorry Enkidu. I'm spreadin around some wrong info. I'm an ass.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: LtLurker]
#25160612 - 04/23/18 06:37 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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anastomosis doesn't stop. Mycelium will cross on a dish.
Stabilizing and obtaining a good varietal hybrid is the hard part. Not making a bunch of crosses
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LtLurker
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: bodhisatta]
#25160648 - 04/23/18 06:48 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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That's pretty wild. I'm gonna need to look into it more. Thanks for jumping in a correcting. Always appreciated.
Late thought. So then why is it when I read about crossing, this technique of isolating single spores and starting from that seems to come up? Just most reliable?
Edited by LtLurker (04/23/18 06:53 PM)
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bodhisatta 
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: LtLurker] 1
#25160744 - 04/23/18 07:30 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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you know you have a cross that's give or take 50/50ish.
sometimes people just print one variety on a foil then another variety right on top then streak the spores of both together to agar. and try to select ones that have visual traits from two visually different varieties. like red spores and leusitic fruits.
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MrSturgill
I'm a damn genuis! Just ask me




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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: bodhisatta]
#25160771 - 04/23/18 07:41 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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-------------------- All You Need
and
The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Shroomery
Read, read, read some more, don't consider anything has been read until everything has been read, then go back and read it again.
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Enkidu
"No-Such-Person"


Registered: 07/09/16
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: MrSturgill]
#25160842 - 04/23/18 08:09 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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Good to know, thaks bod, np lurker, we're all here to learn.
If I have two varieties I can visually identify and I mix them and find a boomer that is visually significantly different, and clone it with a tissue sample, would this in theory give me a cross variety...?
Would you need to grow it out and repeat by cloning the mushroom that continues to show the new characteristics in order to isolste the cross variety traits?
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Dr.Greenthumbs
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: Enkidu]
#25161243 - 04/23/18 10:37 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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That would be considered a hybrid. Correct me if I’m mistaken but, eye believe by selectively cloning mushrooms with a certain phenotypical profile , you would only be copying; not homogenizing the phenotypical structure of that hybrid.. In order to create a new “variety” you would probably need to germinate spores from said mushroom and repeat the breeding cycle in order to begin a Fileal genetic structure. Just another case of inbreeding.
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Enkidu
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Registered: 07/09/16
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: Dr.Greenthumbs]
#25161261 - 04/23/18 10:48 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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So you're saying by taking new clones from the grow of the previously taken clone, I would not be further isolating the expressed characteristics ? It would continue to hold the same phenotype, for example, if 1 in 4 fruits statistically express the characteristics of the hybrid, even after continually selecting and cloning from the mushroom that expressed those characteristics, it would still hold the same 1 in 4 ratio of expression in the fruits that came from the grow that the predecessors expressed...?
Sorry just want to make sure I understand, appreciate the comments.
So in other words, I could in theory take a clone from any of the 4 mushrooms and they would all have the same chances of expressing the new characteristics in the future grow..?
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Dr.Greenthumbs
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: Enkidu]
#25161331 - 04/23/18 11:34 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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Yeah. A clone is a clone is a clone. Only breeding that clone would technically be constructing a new homogenous phenotype. (F1 Stable variety) Open to corrections if this info isn’t correct.
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Dr.Greenthumbs
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: Enkidu]
#25161338 - 04/23/18 11:40 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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Exactly. Similar to breeding and cultivating cannabis. You’re on the right track to solidifying some strong mush genetics. In theory if you found a mutated fruit you could probably begin to work with a print from that mushroom. Each time you collected a spore print from a generation further(selecting mutants), the percentage of mutants should increase each generation. Keep in mind I’m talking about phenotypical mutations like leucistic or albino, not mutations associated with improper fruiting/colonizing conditions and or nutrients.
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Enkidu
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: Dr.Greenthumbs]
#25161346 - 04/23/18 11:44 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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Ok cool, thanks for the comments, this is something I need to research and learn more about
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Dr.Greenthumbs
Stranger


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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: Enkidu]
#25161353 - 04/23/18 11:48 PM (6 years, 8 months ago) |
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I️ don’t think you will find too much information on such advanced breedingbof p.cubes, sounds like you’ve got everything you need to do your own badass research. Why not start with your agar trays now. Sometimes the best way to find a wacky mushroom that may carry traits is withnsome mixed up shit you forgot about lol.
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FishLevelMidnight
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Re: 2 different strains in bulk substrate [Re: Dr.Greenthumbs]
#25602546 - 11/09/18 08:44 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Sorry to bump an old thread,
but if you are planning on making a new variety, what method would give the best success of mixing genetics?
Plating 2 strains on a dish, then transferring the mycelium where they meet. Putting 2 agar wedges from 2 strains in an LC, letting them mix and grow for a bit then using that.
Not entirely my idea, but I have some nice PE/APE/PEU clones that I would love to start mixing with some of the other varieties of cubes I've grown with nice characteristics and startign a stabilization effort of a new variety, so knowing the best way to promote anastomosis between the clone mycelium and a T2 wedge from another cube MS would be great.
Lastly, along those lines, would it be best to mix mycelium from 2 clones vs a clone and MS? Would that help limit the genetic diversity that arises when they do mix (more predictable to see the cross).
I can imagine it hard being able to distinguish a cross of APE vs (insert generic cubensis) non mated generic cubensis when the generic cubensis already has a "wild type" phenotype... does that question make sense?
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