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OfflineThorasta
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Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please.
    #25139977 - 04/15/18 12:30 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

This website is kind of overwhelming with the massive overload of information.

I have a pressure cooker already. 
I'd like to start off with agar.  Because it sounds like I'll get better results without too much extra work.

Please recommend TEK articles and a shopping list.  Yes - I can and will figure this out on my own without help, but if you are feeling generous with your time, I'd be grateful.

Thx - Thorasta!
P.S.  I'm realizing cubes aren't a wood chip shroom.  derp derp - what do I grow them in?  I'm embarrassed I don't already know this.
P.P.S.  PLEASE define your acronyms.  For instance - I don't know what FC means, but through context I know this ought to be obvious.

Edited by Thorasta (04/15/18 12:36 AM)

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Offlinemushhiehunter
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: Thorasta]
    #25139992 - 04/15/18 12:42 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Thorasta said:
This website is kind of overwhelming with the massive overload of information.

I have a pressure cooker already. 
I'd like to start off with agar.  Because it sounds like I'll get better results without too much extra work.

Please recommend TEK articles and a shopping list.  Yes - I can and will figure this out on my own without help, but if you are feeling generous with your time, I'd be grateful.

Thx - Thorasta!
P.S.  I'm realizing cubes aren't a wood chip shroom.  derp derp - what do I grow them in?  I'm embarrassed I don't already know this.
P.P.S.  PLEASE define your acronyms.  For instance - I don't know what FC means, but through context I know this ought to be obvious.




Welcome to shroomery!! You are the best kind of noob because you ask first and then do things, usually it's the other way around.

Ok... so the best route depends on what you want to achieve? A bit of cubes for you and your friends?

The gold standard for a beginner like you is going PF tek to a proper SGFC.

If you want to get into agar (and I highly suggest it), your best bet are pasty's no pour plates. And once you get a good culture going, you can go to bulk with agar-grains-cvg :smile:

Links:
SGFC

PF tek

Pasty plates

How to use a pressure cooker


Oh... almost forgot:
SAB

Edited by mushhiehunter (04/15/18 12:47 AM)

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Offlinemisterswisher
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: Thorasta]
    #25139998 - 04/15/18 12:46 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Dont start with agar.

You can purchase the agar but you dont really need it for rn.

For your first grow
buy this

and 2 of these

inoculate the rye berries through the self healing plug. Let it sit 2 weeks, shake it let it sit another week

once its fully colonized mix it in a sterlite bin with the 2 bags of manure, make sure no grains are showing on top.

Seal the container up for a couple weeks, until its fully colonized. Open it and fan fresh air in, and give it a light misting. cover it up, but dont snap the lid on leave some room for air to flow, and check on it daily. If the surface of the mycelium doesn't have beads of water on it spray it. also make sure the tub is getting some sort of light from your window. This will induce pinning and help it grow fruits. (No light = skinny curly weird fruits)

If you follow this you'll get at least 2 oz of dried mushrooms within a month and a half to 2 months.

Edited by misterswisher (04/15/18 12:49 AM)

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Offlinemisterswisher
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: misterswisher]
    #25140000 - 04/15/18 12:47 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

After that take your biggest and baddest mushroom and clone it into agar.

Then repeat that process, but instead of spores inoculate with agar culture.
You'll get even better results.

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Offlinemushhiehunter
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: misterswisher]
    #25140008 - 04/15/18 12:54 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

misterswisher said:
After that take your biggest and baddest mushroom and clone it into agar.

Then repeat that process, but instead of spores inoculate with agar culture.
You'll get even better results.



Quote:

misterswisher said:
Dont start with agar.

You can purchase the agar but you dont really need it for rn.

For your first grow
buy this

and 2 of these

inoculate the rye berries through the self healing plug. Let it sit 2 weeks, shake it let it sit another week

once its fully colonized mix it in a sterlite bin with the 2 bags of manure, make sure no grains are showing on top.

Seal the container up for a couple weeks, until its fully colonized. Open it and fan fresh air in, and give it a light misting. cover it up, but dont snap the lid on leave some room for air to flow, and check on it daily. If the surface of the mycelium doesn't have beads of water on it spray it. also make sure the tub is getting some sort of light from your window. This will induce pinning and help it grow fruits. (No light = skinny curly weird fruits)

If you follow this you'll get at least 2 oz of dried mushrooms within a month and a half to 2 months.





Sooo are you really suggesting to inoculate grains with MS syringe? And then you don't even tell him to pasteurize the manure? You suggest him to do cloning without experience with agar??  :shotsfired:

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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: Thorasta]
    #25140014 - 04/15/18 01:02 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Please don't do what the other guy suggested, it can work, but you should do things right from the beginning, don't half ass it...

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Offlinemisterswisher
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: mushhiehunter]
    #25140017 - 04/15/18 01:02 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Manure and grains are presterilized, thats why i recommended it bud.

You suggest he uses a ms to agar?????
That's just a mess and unless he wants to waste months isolating a strain he is better off doing a multispore grow and then cloning his best fruit.

Cloning isnt hard, just throw a piece of tissue into sterile agar.

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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: misterswisher]
    #25140023 - 04/15/18 01:08 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

misterswisher said:
Manure and grains are presterilized, thats why i recommended it bud.

You suggest he uses a ms to agar?????
That's just a mess and unless he wants to waste months isolating a strain he is better off doing a multispore grow and then cloning his best fruit.

Cloning isnt hard, just throw a piece of tissue into sterile agar.





Dude, one of the main advatnages of PF tek (even though I don't use it) is that you can use MS syringe since it's VERY contam resistant. Meanwhile I want him to get used to agar, go MS-agar and just get a clean growth, no isolation at all. by the time he will be able to get a clean growth on agar, he will have shrooms to clone from his PF tek.
You are right that cloning is the way to go, but he needs to be able to clone properly and practicing with ms syringe is ideal.

:wink:

(btw STERILIZED manure is asking for trouble, we pasteurize manure)

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OfflineRealmLAir
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: Thorasta]
    #25140024 - 04/15/18 01:10 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

If you want to follow be my guest. im open to help you.

I go MS or swab ---> "Pasty plate"-->Transfer (at least twice to ensure clean or strong growth)--->1/2 pint "WBS" (wild bird seed)--->quart "G2g" (grain to grain transfer)

Once my quart jars are colonized, I use the "Bucket tek" to get my Coco coir to field capacity.

Then spawn to "Shoeboxes".
Everybody has their own spawn ratio they use. I go 1:1 or 1:2. But i keep my colonized quarts to their own shoebox. So if i inoculated 6 quarts, im spawning them to 6 shoeboxes, you follow?

when it comes time to fruit, I dont mist too much, i actually dunk the substrate as needed. I use a finger to feel the sub and its water content, if it feels dry i dunk for about 20 mins. If too moist, i will flip the lid to let it breathe a bit.

Then when it comes time to pick you fruits I just twist and pull at the base. My shoeboxes usually run 2/3 flushes and then i toss them out. Every flush i get a minimum of 3/4 oz (or 21 grams Avg.) so at the end of the run i am left with about 1 1/2-2 oz dry fruits.


This was a quick kinda detailed overview of what i am used to following. You are welcome to form your own methods. Any questions feel free to ask. No question is too stupid to ask.

Edited by RealmLAir (04/15/18 01:12 AM)

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Offlinemisterswisher
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: mushhiehunter]
    #25140035 - 04/15/18 01:15 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

What?? Yeah pf tek is contam resistant in the sense that brown rice doens't contain endospores. but MS has nothing to do with sterility.

If your getting contams from a ms its bc the ms has contams in it and you need to buy your syringe of a sponsor.

Multispore cakes are pretty much hit or miss, and likely it'll be a miss and you wont get jack shit for yield.

Sterilized is actually better than pasteurized too you really dont know what your talking about i take it.

"Pasteurization is the process of heating food, specifically liquids, to a specific temperature to slow microbial growth in the food. Sterilization refers to the process of eliminating all forms of bacteria from any product. ... This process kills the heat susceptible organisms and their spores."

Also those grain bags and manure bags are great. If they contam on you, just hit up outgrow and they'll ship you a new one free of charge since they garentee a 100% sterile product.


Stop trying to teach noobs when you dont even know the difference between pasteurization and sterilization

SHOTS FIRED

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Offlinemushhiehunter
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: misterswisher]
    #25140037 - 04/15/18 01:17 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

misterswisher said:
What?? Yeah pf tek is contam resistant in the sense that brown rice doens't contain endospores. but MS has nothing to do with sterility.

If your getting contams from a ms its bc the ms has contams in it and you need to buy your syringe of a sponsor.

Multispore cakes are pretty much hit or miss, and likely it'll be a miss and you wont get jack shit for yield.

Sterilized is actually better than pasteurized too you really dont know what your talking about i take it.

"Pasteurization is the process of heating food, specifically liquids, to a specific temperature to slow microbial growth in the food. Sterilization refers to the process of eliminating all forms of bacteria from any product. ... This process kills the heat susceptible organisms and their spores."

Also those grain bags and manure bags are great. If they contam on you, just hit up outgrow and they'll ship you a new one free of charge since they garentee a 100% sterile product.


Stop trying to teach noobs when you dont even know the difference between pasteurization and sterilization

SHOTS FIRED




:jolly::laugh2: People like you are the reason we get sad newbies here with bacterial spawn...

Edited by mushhiehunter (04/15/18 01:20 AM)

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Offlinemisterswisher
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: mushhiehunter]
    #25140049 - 04/15/18 01:25 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

I really wasn't trying to be a dick until you did.
I don't understand why your laughing?

If I'm wrong educate, don't post memes like some angered prepubescent kid.
That's not what this forum is for, its for education.

Also, if he really wanted to he could pc those bags and sterilize them more, but im telling you I TRUST THAT BRAND. I've seen a few grows from those bags with not a single problem.

He could also just use voir and verm and not have to deal with any issues like that at all man.

Its people like you who confuse noobs on this forum. Spreading misinformation.

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Offlinemisterswisher
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: misterswisher]
    #25140056 - 04/15/18 01:30 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Also people pasturize manure to MAKE their spawn bacterial, as it lets some bacteria live and they say it helps the mycelium grow.
Bacterial spawn isnt a problem, at all unless its bad.
Sterilization eliminates bacteria. Pasteurization doesn't. again you dont know the difference.

edit: by bad i mean like its full of bacteria.

As long as you do what i said and keep your tub closed while it colonizes you wont have a problem.

Edited by misterswisher (04/15/18 01:35 AM)

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Offlinemushhiehunter
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: misterswisher]
    #25140066 - 04/15/18 01:39 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

misterswisher said:
I really wasn't trying to be a dick until you did.
I don't understand why your laughing?

If I'm wrong educate, don't post memes like some angered prepubescent kid.
That's not what this forum is for, its for education.

Also, if he really wanted to he could pc those bags and sterilize them more, but im telling you I TRUST THAT BRAND. I've seen a few grows from those bags with not a single problem.

He could also just use voir and verm and not have to deal with any issues like that at all man.

Its people like you who confuse noobs on this forum. Spreading misinformation.





Ok, I'm sorry for my reaction, you are right, we should educate each other and be civil about it.

Sooo:

a) yes, I do know what pasteurization is and we really do pasteurize manure and not sterilize it because the leftover bacteria in the manure are actually good for the mycelium

b) BRF in PF tek is very contam resistant and it's not about the endospores so much (because if you go 2,5h PC cycle @18psi there's not gonna be ANY endospores left (statistically). The thing about BRF as a spawn is that it is naturally resistant to contams and therefore it's suitable for MS syringe.

c) MS syringe is never completely clean - think how they are made, it's just impossible.

d) innoculating grains with MS syringe is not advisable because of the high probability of contamination taking much better hold compared to the BRF.

What you said about cakes being hit or miss... that is not because of the spawn choice (BRFxgrains) it's crapshoot because of the genetic variability you inevitably get from MS syringe.

+ suggesting him to buy pre-sterilized spawn and manure is like suggesting someone who wants to learn fishing to go to the fish market. He's got a PC already, no need to pay extra.

Now are we on the same page?

Edited by mushhiehunter (04/15/18 01:50 AM)

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Offlinemisterswisher
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: mushhiehunter]
    #25140071 - 04/15/18 01:49 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Yes and I understand. I actually just did a shit ton of research because of this lil argument.

So instead of my initial post op if you want a really simple and easy grow.(Again cakes are bad imo. You're gonna get way more bang for your buck growing bulk)

So do what mushhiehunter said, make some brf jars (you're gonna need 4, so make 6-8 just incase)
Let it colonize, after a week shake it up, let it finish colonizing.
Give it an extra day or 2 just to make sure theres no uncolonized spawn.

Then break up those "cakes" into a sterlite tub with this:
https://www.shroomsupply.com/bulk-substrates/pre-pasteurized-mushroom-compost?zenid=mn5pmmolguejq3np9ent75d5r6

make sure all your spawn is covered in substrate and leave it closed up to fully colonize.

Once its fully colonized fan the tub and mist it.

It should yield at least an oz or two, even with ms.

But as i was saying earlier ms is not an exactly great way to grow because it has a huge array of genetics (Meaning some mushrooms can be potent and good, and others will be garbage) so once you grow a fruit you like, clone it.

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Offlinemisterswisher
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: misterswisher]
    #25140074 - 04/15/18 01:52 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

you can also buy these bags for spawn and inoculate them
http://out-grow.com/mushroom-growing-substrates-c-4/brf-bags-brown-rice-flour-based-mushroom-substrate-p-65.html

but your gonna want some medical tape or a bandaid because it doesn't have the self healing port.

(what i'd do is heat the end of your syringe up and poke it through while its red hot, let it cool off inside the bag for about a minute and then inject the spores. Pull it out and then cover the hole with some sort of sterile adhesive)

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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: misterswisher]
    #25140076 - 04/15/18 01:52 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

misterswisher said:
Yes and I understand. I actually just did a shit ton of research because of this lil argument.

So instead of my initial post op if you want a really simple and easy grow.(Again cakes are bad imo. You're gonna get way more bang for your buck growing bulk)

So do what mushhiehunter said, make some brf jars (you're gonna need 4, so make 6-8 just incase)
Let it colonize, after a week shake it up, let it finish colonizing.
Give it an extra day or 2 just to make sure theres no uncolonized spawn.

Then break up those "cakes" into a sterlite tub with this:
https://www.shroomsupply.com/bulk-substrates/pre-pasteurized-mushroom-compost?zenid=mn5pmmolguejq3np9ent75d5r6

make sure all your spawn is covered in substrate and leave it closed up to fully colonize.

Once its fully colonized fan the tub and mist it.

It should yield at least an oz or two, even with ms.

But as i was saying earlier ms is not an exactly great way to grow because it has a huge array of genetics (Meaning some mushrooms can be potent and good, and others will be garbage) so once you grow a fruit you like, clone it.




elaborate please on why cakes are bad? The dry verm barrier is actually really good at protcting the spawn - so no shaking needed.

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Offlinemisterswisher
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: mushhiehunter]
    #25140085 - 04/15/18 02:00 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Cakes are not necessarily bad. They're just not worth it imo. Think about it man your gonna make a fruiting chamber anyway. that fruiting chamber can hold either ~12 cakes(made of only brf and verm.) or a couple pounds of substrate with nutrients.

And like you said he's using ms. Which means each cake is gonna have different genetics. Cakes don't usually yield too high unless you have killer genetics.

Also cakes are not easier than bulk especially if you buy pre pasturized substrate.

Op could make 4 brf 'cakes' as spawn and buy sub and get 2 zips.
or he could make 12 brf cakes and get maybe a zip if he's lucky.


Also, shaking helps the grains/brf colonize faster, and when growing bulk keeps them from clumping together.(so you can use your hands to break them up instead of a cheese grater lmao)

Edited by misterswisher (04/15/18 02:03 AM)

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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: misterswisher]
    #25140090 - 04/15/18 02:10 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

misterswisher said:
Cakes are not necessarily bad. They're just not worth it imo. Think about it man your gonna make a fruiting chamber anyway. that fruiting chamber can hold either ~12 cakes(made of only brf and verm.) or a couple pounds of substrate with nutrients.

And like you said he's using ms. Which means each cake is gonna have different genetics. Cakes don't usually yield too high unless you have killer genetics.

Also cakes are not easier than bulk especially if you buy pre pasturized substrate.

Op could make 4 brf 'cakes' as spawn and buy sub and get 2 zips.
or he could make 12 brf cakes and get maybe a zip if he's lucky.





See the thing about many small cakes is that if one goes bad, you can just throw it away, if he goes big, he has to throw away more.

The second part about each cake having different genetics... it's not only each cake will have different genetics but also each single cake will have multiple cultures growing on it. Yes, it is a crapshoot but he can take a clone (the genetic variability is good here)

You know why was being such a dick? Because when I started, I did 2 pf tek grows and jumped straight to grains and monos... it took me a whole year to get used to agar and get some decent grain grows... PF tek inoculation can (but shouldn't) be done in open air environment.

I just don't want to see another post with pictures of bacterial spawn with the poster being excited he's got beautiful spawn just to learn his hard work went to shit...

But I might have been just unlucky and someone with luck can pull a grain grow on the first try...

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OfflineBurblesV
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Re: Newbie. Ordered cube syringe. Help with shopping list and tek list please. [Re: mushhiehunter]
    #25140115 - 04/15/18 02:37 AM (6 years, 8 months ago)

What is your ultimate goal? Growing mushrooms as a hobby and exploring all the nooks that the hobby offers, or just doing a quick, successful grow?

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