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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
Diddler de ninos
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/12/17
Posts: 1,477
Loc: Son of Texas Flag
Getting back into guitar
    #25055469 - 03/11/18 03:16 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

Hello  everyone. I wanted to put this out here because i find myself checking "my threads" instead of exploring what all the shroomery has to offer sometimes.

I'm going through massive changes in my life, complete career change, about to move after i finish remodeling my house, considering being poor and going to school somewhere or whatever it takes to carve out the life i want.

It used to be, everyone knew me for guitar. I was always playing. Somehow, years and years have gone by and i'm not only picking it back up but approaching it in the same way i approach new subjects to study as an adult.

I got a job the day i turned 15 (sacker, Kroger) and one of my first paychecks went to a catalog and got me a $100 harmony electric kit with a 1watt amp, strap, picks all that. My buddy taught me to read tab and i taught myself every song i could find a tab for (this was '99, the internet was nothing but aol message boards and 30 second porn clips that took 10 minutes to load).

Well, through the years i've gotten a few pawn shop specials or this or that, but now i currently only have one electric, and its that 17 year old guitar.

And i recently taught myself head to toe how to rebuild it, set it up ( a full setup, like 7 steps or something) and i'm almost done rebuilding a $70 guitar into a legitimate instrument, on par with a decent mexican strat.

I'm editing together a detailed build video, looks like its gonna be an hour of edited HD footage including a before and after sound test with same settings and same songs being played. Also the complete build has been filmed and will be fast paced edited. I hope to have this finished and up in two weeks or so. I've been putting off finishing it, so that's another reason for posting this.

I don't have a facebook and right now shroomery is basically my entire social life tbh. It would be awesome to find some people who together can keep motivating each other.

I'm mildly embarassed about my skill level and how rusty it is, how long i've played vs what i can do, but the best way i learn is by putting myself on blast. I've taken some lessons at justinguitar.com, i picked up folk fingerstyle picking patterns pretty quick i'm super stoked about that and want to evolve that, but i'm also working on Litle wing by jimi hendrix, took me about 3 hours to get the first 15 seconds down, but has greatly improved my playing just from adapting to the 4 new things Jimi is making me try already like my thumb. 

I want to pick a joe satriani like Always with you Always with me and i could possibly learn to play it.

Anyway, long post but thats who i am, i'll gladly pop that video in here when i finish, tons of cool things happen in it like for example when i removed the paint to refinish the guitar i lerned it was sunburst under the black paint. But i bought it new! No joke!

I'm also looking for a good guitar forum? Tons of questions i have for a guitar forum i guess. Effects chains, loopers. I'm looking into getting a Boss Katana amp too and am confused on what the effects loop is on the 100w that i don't get on the 50w


--------------------
My name is not a proclamation but a reminder of how to carry myself.

How I made my mush GH                              How I make chocolates

Cannabis


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Invisibleimpatientguy
Ganjalf a very mighty lab wizard
Male User Gallery


Registered: 11/27/14
Posts: 5,054
Loc: USA
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25055528 - 03/11/18 04:44 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

You seem like a cool guy, and I sincerely wish you the best with your move and career change.

That takes guts!


Sorry I can't help with your guitar situation. I don't play any instruments.


Hope your inky cap agar turns out well too!

If I had anything to add on that thread I would haha.


--------------------
Super clean spore printing method: https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5276177



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InvisibleBuffy
The Slayer
Female

Registered: 03/11/18
Posts: 104
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: impatientguy]
    #25055723 - 03/11/18 09:53 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

gearslutz has a good guitar forum, and there's /r/guitar on reddit which is pretty good.

I would encourage you to go beyond tab and start learning to read music, and studying music theory. What you're doing now, learning to play individual songs you like, is really great in its own right. It might seem like you're just learning to put finger one on string three at fret four, but you're actually taking the first steps in the process to learning to play by ear. You're learning to associate that the chord or lick played in song X at Y:YY timestamp is produced by playing HERE on the guitar in this manner. So you know exactly what the sound is you want to play, and you're trying to replicate it, and to facilitate this you are using tab so you know what strings to play and where on the fretboard to fret them. You can eventually cut out the tab to make the process of learning to play a song more efficient. Eventually you might get to the point where you can hear a song, and then play exactly what you just heard on your guitar, your first time touching it without fumbling around for the correct notes.

This is all great and is where I started as well. But what you're not learning is what I was not learning, and that is the broader knowledge of music theory. In Little Wing, you're going to learn to play licks in E minor and G major with the tab you're using for example, but you're not going to learn how they relate to each other.

The techincal ability to physically play the instrument, and the physiological ability to understand music that you are hearing and deduce how to play it yourself is a necessary but incomplete toolset of a musician. You should also strive to understand the fundamentals of music theory such as rhythm and the different time signatures and meters, intervals, harmony, etc.


Edited by Buffy (03/11/18 09:55 AM)


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
Diddler de ninos
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/12/17
Posts: 1,477
Loc: Son of Texas Flag
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Buffy]
    #25056868 - 03/11/18 08:25 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

Thanks impatient, you should try I literally taught myself and became way better than I ever expected. That's probably a big part of why I never really put effort into the hobby, I never had to.

A wise saying I saw, "the guitar is the easiest instrument to pick up and learn but the hardest to master."

very right, I never focused on mhsic theory nor what notes I was playing for example 2nd fret on low E is an F sharp if I'm not mistaken, I can now remember B and E are the two notes that don't have a sharp by the pneumonic B&E(breaking and entering) lol. I don't know the flats but I notice tuner equipment have that.

My main "root imrovement" is that I'm building a scheduled practice routine including a metronome. 1 hour block of time divided into segments, some five minute, some ten, technical finger exercises, five minutes on Barre chord to get that burn (been practicing bother by stone sour great Barre exercise) ten minutes at least to musical theory and fretboard note memorization, some time for expanding song repertoire, alternate fast picking, pinch harmonics, five minutes for minimum movement where you move your fingers as little as possible running thru scale, and what you're talking about is another five minutes for transcribing practice. Hearing something and trying to replicate on the guitar.

Which you're right I'm all over the place. I've started recording some of the melodies I make while humming throughout the day and trying to recreate them with the guitar.


--------------------
My name is not a proclamation but a reminder of how to carry myself.

How I made my mush GH                              How I make chocolates

Cannabis


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InvisibleBuffy
The Slayer
Female

Registered: 03/11/18
Posts: 104
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25057564 - 03/12/18 03:48 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

On a staff the order of sharps can be remembered with the mnemonic

Fat
Cats
Go
Down
Alleys
Eating
Birds

And the flats can be remembered similarly with

B
E
A
D(s)
Get
Cats
Fat


With this you can construct the circle of fifths

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circle_of_fifths


Working with a metronome is a super great habit to form! Make sure you test your limits by slowing the tempo way down, and speeding way up as well, don't just practice at a comfortable tempo, you won't challenge yourself. Also make sure your metronome can do other time signatures like 2/4, 3/4, 6/8, 12/8, etc.

This is a really good metronome app for Android (idk about iOS) which can do pretty much any time signature.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.eumlab.android.prometronome


Edited by Buffy (03/12/18 03:53 AM)


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
Diddler de ninos
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/12/17
Posts: 1,477
Loc: Son of Texas Flag
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Buffy]
    #25059451 - 03/13/18 01:00 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

How do I incorporate the metronome into cover songs I can already play like hotel California or Metallica songs? I assume I'd have to find the specific timing of the song which I would need from a music book free tabs online don't have that?


--------------------
My name is not a proclamation but a reminder of how to carry myself.

How I made my mush GH                              How I make chocolates

Cannabis


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
Diddler de ninos
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/12/17
Posts: 1,477
Loc: Son of Texas Flag
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25059466 - 03/13/18 01:06 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

Ive been staring at what you typed for two minutes like an idiot, is a staff the symbol at the beginning of sheet music? I can't read sheet music, not since fifth grade and up taught me music wasn't important anymore.

I don't know how to incorporate what youre telling me. I thought it meant I could memorize what each line and space meant from top to bottom but probably not


--------------------
My name is not a proclamation but a reminder of how to carry myself.

How I made my mush GH                              How I make chocolates

Cannabis


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InvisibleBuffy
The Slayer
Female

Registered: 03/11/18
Posts: 104
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25059565 - 03/13/18 02:46 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

To incorporate a metronome into cover songs, first you need to figure out the time signature of the song. Start with determining how many primary beats the song has. For instance, probably the most common time signature for rock music is 4/4, which means 4 beats per measure, and the beats themselves are quarter notes. It's also extremely helpful to conduct along with the music.

There are two types of meters, simple and compound. Simple meters are subdivided into twos, and compound meters are subdivided into threes.

4/4 is a simple quadruple meter, so it's subdivided by twos. The primary beat is

1 2 3 4 1 2 3 4 ...

Subdividing each quarter note by two gives you eight eighth notes, and it's counted like this (+ pronounced as "and")

1 + 2 + 3 + 4 + 1 + 2 + 3 + 4 + ...

Subdividing the eighth notes by two gives you sixteenth notes

1 e + uh 2 e + uh 3 e + uh 4 e + uh

And you can keep subdividing by two, but verbally counting the measures becomes quite difficult so stick with "one ee and uh two ee and uh three ee and uh four ee and uh" for all subsequent subdivisions.

So that's a simple quadruple. A compound meter is subdivided into threes.

1 trip ple 2 trip ple 3 trip ple 4 trip ple

This would be a 12/8, which is a compound quadruple meter. Four primary beats, subdivided into threes, totalling 12 eighth notes per measure. You could count it as 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12, or you could say 1 2 3 2 2 3 3 2 3 4 2 3.

Compound meters exist to make triplet feels easier to notate and play. If you have a 4/4 and play a triplet for every beat, it becomes a whole lot easier to just use a 12/8, because it's designed to facilitate a triplet feel.

So for figuring out a time signature, listen to the song and figure out how many primary beats there are per measure, and for rock music this is usually 4, and then verbally count along with the 1 2 3 4 and try subdividing by two, and then by three, and see which one fits better. If there are four primary beats and subdividing by 2 sounds right, you're almost certainly in a 4/4. If there are four primary beats and subdividing by three sounds right, you're probably in a 12/8. There are many different time signatures, so you'll have to do a fair amount of studying and practice to get this down, but this is another necessary component of being a proficient musician.

So now that you've got your time signature, you can put your metronome app in the same time signature, start the song and then try to start the metronome exactly on the downbeat. Your metronome will either be going faster or slower in all likelihood, so this will let you "dial in" the tempo to find what the tempo of the song is.

There are some practicality issues with this however. First of all, if you're going to practice along with a song, having a metronome going along with it won't help you all that much, and may cause more problems. It's very hard to get the tempo exactly right and start exactly on the downbeat, so you might play along just fine for thirty seconds or so, but then your metronome and song go out of sync.

Another problem with this approach is, a lot of rock songs, especially classic rock songs, have varying tempo. They were not recorded with a click track, so what holds the band together is simply the drummer and his internal feel for rhythm. Lots of times drummers will speed up the tempo during fills on their drums, or if a part of a song has an increase in dynamics, the drummer will speed up slightly, so it's pretty much impossible to try to set a metronome to a whole lot of rock music.

The real value in working with a metronome in this example would be to figure out the time signature, figure out the approximate tempo, and then turn off the song and slow down the metronome to work on a part you are having trouble with, then you can steadily bring it up to speed to the tempo it's supposed to be at.


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InvisibleBuffy
The Slayer
Female

Registered: 03/11/18
Posts: 104
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Buffy]
    #25059585 - 03/13/18 03:25 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

So a staff has five lines and four spaces. This is a staff.



In order to determine what notes the lines and spaces are, you need a cleff. For guitar the relevant cleff is the treble cleff, or G cleff. It's the top one in this picture.



It's called a G clef because it loops around and circles the G on the staff. A common mnemonic to memorize the notes in the treble cleff is this: starting from the bottom, the five lines are Every Good Boy Does Fine, and also starting from the bottom, just above the first line, the spaces spell out F A C E.

In the staff, you have to have some way to convey the key signature that the song is in. This is used with accidentals, which are sharps (#) and flats (b). A sharp raises the pitch of a note by half a step (one fret), and a flat lowers the pitch of a note by half a step (one fret). This is what key signatures look like, and this is the key of B major.



I'll inject a lesson within this lesson ...

So the key of C major is sometimes known as the people's key, because there are no sharps, no flats. You read the notes on the staff exactly as they are without raising or lowering a single pitch. The C major scale is

C D E F G A B C

All keys have something called a relative minor, which is a minor key that shares the same key signature, and notes of the relative major scale. C major is C D E F G A B C, and the relative minor is A minor, so it has all the same notes, it just starts on a different root (tonic), which is a. A B C D E F G A

So the circle of fifths lets you determine how many sharps or flats each key signature has, and where they go, and it also lets you determine the relative minor. From the key of C, to do the sharps you go up five intervals with the C counted as 1, and you add a sharp.

C D E F G
1 2 3 4 5

So the key of G major has one sharp, and it's applied to the F. This is where my first mnemonic came in.

Fat
Cats
Go
Down
Alleys
Eating
Birds

So the notes in the scale of G major are G A B C D E F# G

From G, keep going down the circle of fiths.

G A B C D
1 2 3 4 5

So our next key is D major, and it gets two sharps. F# and C#, which makes the D major scale D E F# G A B C# D

Keep going

D E F G A
1 2 3 4 5

A major gets three sharps, and they are F#, C#, and G#, and the A major scale is A B C# D E F# G# A

To determine the flats, you do the same thing, only go up four intervals.

C D E F
1 2 3 4

F major has one flat, and it's B.

B
E
A
D(s)
Get
Cats
Fat

The scale of F major is F G A Bb C D E F

From F keep going

F G A B
1 2 3 4

The key of Bb major has two flats, which are Bb and Eb, and the scale is spelled Bb C D Eb F G A Bb

Keep going and the full circle of fifths is:




I know this is a lot to take in and a message board isn't the best format for trying to learn this stuff, but I do encourage you to study the fundamentals of music theory in depth, because though there is a MASSIVE amount of stuff to learn about music, it is extremely REWARDING!

My own journey as a guitarist started with learning from tab books, and then I took lessons and learned how to learn by ear, mainly by playing along to songs I wanted to learn. I did not learn the fundamentals of music theory, so my abilities as a musician were limited. Though I got to a point where I could play proficiently and "shred" on the guitar, I did not have an understanding of things like time signatures, meters, relative minors, key signatures, rhythm, and as a result I did not know, and could not really speak the language of music. Get me with a group of other guitarists just like me, and I was fine. "Oh you play a power chord at the fifth fret on the E string" or whatever. No biggie. But get me in a room with musicians and I'm like "um .... time signature? It's a six eight? What is that????"

Since I've been studying music at University, I have gained a much deeper understanding of music, how it works, why it works, and I can now much more easily listen to a song and figure out how to play it, understand what is happening in it, I write better music, I play better rhythmically, harmonically, I'm just a much more well rounded, competent musician.

Maybe you might consider University, or private lessons, or just learning stuff on your own with a website like musictheory.net which is very good, but trust me when I tell you that a deep study of music is well worth the effort.

<3


Edited by Buffy (03/13/18 03:33 AM)


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
Diddler de ninos
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/12/17
Posts: 1,477
Loc: Son of Texas Flag
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Buffy]
    #25060306 - 03/13/18 01:00 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

I've always felt that way even in high school, but even the bands that were made up of kids two years older than us and playing all the local shows, all except one didn't know any way to communicate music any other way either and we were all "so good".

As much of rockstars as we thought we were the first time we tried to branch outside our deep grooves of practice the card house collapsed.

It's the summation of setting my goals too low back then and just wanting to play the songs on the radio which I had no idea would become reality so quick; not knowing how to practice and avoiding what already sounds good;lessons being very expensive for any real length of time and not having help to bridge certain things, that cost me years. Like what I'm supposed to do with scales.

Which I will never really be able to improve on and implement chords into what I create when I make melodies from the pentatonic scales I know because I have no clue what key and what notes of the scale are available for chords and how to bridge it all together.

Musical theory is frustrating to approach and learn, this isn't the second or third time, but for some reason my eyes immediately go glassy because it's a lot to explain and have to memorize as a foundation itself, no other foundation for these new pieces to attach it to which makes it easy. And needing to apply it with the guitar in my hand somehow.

I have very much thought about taking some college guitar courses, the shroomery had gotten me interested in all kinds of things I never thought much about and has kindled a love for botany and microbiology and I may be going back to school part time soon. Guitar would definitely be a priority course, I think it's the only way I'll practice theory enough to every become fluent. It's far too boring to practice piece by piece with an example I found somewhere in the key of __ and a common ___ chord progression and then I learn hands on , ok in this key I can see how these minors and these fifths and this and all this work together. And work on that small sliver of the wheel of fifths and then find another piece to self study.... And years later link them altogether.

It's not something to be avoided but it's something that honestly should have been built upon in our early educations and built up right like our reading and writing and math skills, but where I live they remove it entirely at 6th grade unless u join the formal band and spend money each year and go to all the events and all that. We had to make more time in our curriculum to memorize random facts so we scored well on the state educational exams so our schools got more funding.

I don't know anything useful, but I've spent years answering which one arrives first, a train leaving from point a to point to point b at 50mph or a car from point c to point b at 35mph.

Someone hire me!


--------------------
My name is not a proclamation but a reminder of how to carry myself.

How I made my mush GH                              How I make chocolates

Cannabis


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
Diddler de ninos
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/12/17
Posts: 1,477
Loc: Son of Texas Flag
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25060310 - 03/13/18 01:04 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

I have the music theory packet I downloaded from Justinguitar, his lessons are limited in difficulty but wide spread on areas of guitar and really well done. He's had a few video lessons that the way he explains to Barre the strings on a Barre chord make things ten times easier. His approach into folk fingerstyle etc
If I can find an easy to understand anchor for theory, which this may be, then it may become fun when little tidbits I kearn stick and can be recalled. Then the whole task will be doable. His site is part of what got me reinspired to pick it back up, actually having someone make sense.

No anchor and no hope, I have like eight other "skill blocks" I have to fit into a practice routine and boring stuff loses to anything challenging on the fretboard, esp when I'm seeing big improvements again like I used to back In HS

I'm lucky to have a knowledgeable and loves to teach guitarist drop in, thank you! I hope to have something to share here before too long


--------------------
My name is not a proclamation but a reminder of how to carry myself.

How I made my mush GH                              How I make chocolates

Cannabis


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
Diddler de ninos
I'm a teapot


Registered: 03/12/17
Posts: 1,477
Loc: Son of Texas Flag
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25061575 - 03/13/18 11:08 PM (2 years, 10 months ago)

Buffy - i suppose i was thinking i would use the metronome somehow with the cover songs i know super well, but on video notice myself speeding up parts and slowing others down. But thanks to your excellent explanation its obvious even if i did always have the timing of the song it would vary for the reasons you stated.

I find it hard to believe but i just noticed that.. i never practice the cover songs for the complete song, many I can't play all the way through some solos for example, but i also never play along with the song. I don't know its that fine line huh, its all fun to slide up there and jam out on a metallica riff for 45 seconds and then slide down here and play a papa roach song.

And i practiced today pretty well but without my metronome again, without my music theory booklet again, and i noticed during my "make melodies from scales" time block in my practice that, yeah i need to double time it on some music knowledge. I'm drastically improving in the melodies i come up with on the spot because i'm now fluid between two pentatonic positions instead of just one, doubling my notes and possibilities. And i guess i'm pretty musical, i'm always humming and i have no problem making new beats. Even made a sweet new simple little chord progression but its really catchy, i'd upload it here if i knew how. 

Can i upload HD footage here? I guess youtube or vimeo clips?  ...lot of work.  But its catchy i'm learning to do my A maj chord with a different fingering so theres more room there plus you just lift your index finger for an A7 I think it is. Catchy.

But i was so musically engaged today that i found wanting to be able to flow and i can't, i have zero knowledge to be able to solo or to even begin to make songs beyong these 15 chords i know and all the sound-good tricks that power chords and pop punk has taught me.

It's a horrible realization.

how do i incorporate a metronome into practice then if i don't practice it with songs? Simply set to a beat and run through scales hitting the notes on the beat, and increase and decrease tempos making sure every note is perfect?  I see the potential for that, but not beyond a five minute block in my practice schedule. Why does everyone harp on about it then and how can i fully utilize this tool?


--------------------
My name is not a proclamation but a reminder of how to carry myself.

How I made my mush GH                              How I make chocolates

Cannabis


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InvisibleBuffy
The Slayer
Female

Registered: 03/11/18
Posts: 104
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25061739 - 03/14/18 12:48 AM (2 years, 10 months ago)

Regarding work with the metronome, aside from practicing a song without playing along with it, just playing with the metrnome and being able to slow down the tempo to work on parts you're struggling with, so you can slowly bring them up to speed, you can also work on some common rhythms in the same way. Start slow, and increase your speed as you progress.

Here's some examples that I found on the internet and drew in the counts in mspaint (sorry content creator, lost your link so can't cite). This is not full notation for any instrument, it's just different rhythms in 4/4. You can play just an open low E, or practice playing the rhythms with full chords like E major, C Major, A Major etc., work these rhythms into the practice you do with scales, you can come up with lots of different exercises and I encourage you to. But I'll go over some of these rhythms for you. First:

This chart shows you whole notes through sixtyfourth notes, and whole rests through sixyfourth rests. Subdividing into sixtyfourths is quite uncommon, usually you will be working with whole notes/rests through sixteenth notes/rests for most music.







So here's our rhythm exercises.





So it's a 4/4, which means four quarter notes per measure. You read from the top to bottom, left to right. Top line first measure has two quarter notes followed by two quarter rests. On the rests, you don't play anything. So the count, and when you play, is 1 2 (rest rest). So you could set your metronome, play an E major chord along to this rhythm, play on the 1 and the 2 only. 1 2 (rest) (rest) 1 2 (rest) (rest) etc.


The second measure is two quarter notes, followed by a quarter rest, eighth rest, then eight note. And the count is 1 2 (rest) (4rest) and. You play quarter notes on the first two beats, rest a full beat on the count of 3, and then rest another half a beat and play on the "and" of 4.

The next measure count is 1 2 (rest) 4.

And the final measure on the top line is 1 2 (rest) 4 and.


In my writing on the exercises, the 1 2 3 and 4 beats are always listed where they should be, but the ones in (parenthesis) you do not play, because they are rests. The counts are merely written in there to show where the quarter value beats should be.

So I recommend trying to play these rhythms with chords, or power chords, or even just open strings along with the metronome slow at first, and then increase your tempo as you get better at it. For this exercise, play the + with an upstroke, everything else down. Also, try perfecting one measure before trying others. Don't try to play all start to finish like you're trying to play a song with it. Each measure has a different rhythm, and they're going to take some work to get them down, so start with just practicing one measure at a time, over and over until you get it.

Glad to help out, let me know if you don't understand something with this, and also with the Justin guitar theory lessons.


Edited by Buffy (03/14/18 12:53 AM)


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
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Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Buffy]
    #25089321 - 03/25/18 01:19 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

Well. I'm rendering some footage now, snippets of an early morning jam, just because the Shroomery wants to see guitar playing in a post about guitars.

I had to wear safety glasses for a while while playing (<- isn't English great), the rust is just flying off now, my playing has really started to tighten up.

A large part of that was breaking out the old 2x12 amp and putting it in a doorway to act like a shroud of aural death and cranked it up as loud as I could and jammed on a strap

Playing on a strap was never something I did, only played with a band once or twice, both on stage with no practice. I don't mind the nerves, I love adrenaline. But now that I've included it in my hourly practice, it started out I had to do five minutes and that was all I did because my playing fell apart I couldn't even do open chords or slide a power chord or anything

Now, somehow, it's just about the same thing. I have to sling my axe kinda high but I don't care I can really rock out now.

So, for the first time ever, I cranked that shit up as loud as I could (6, unless I get a longer cable and can walk further away) and had my four channel stompbox outside and I played for three hours that day.

I also recently bought a new metal guitar off Craigslist to set up and upgrade a little. Sounds great, intonation is off so some chords sound out of tune, I can notice that now thanks to my previous in depth guitar overhaul. But I've been playing it like it's going out of style.

Started the music theory, basically first few lessons are learning notes along fifth and sixth strings, low E and A for our lurkers who are learning with me, and once all those notes are known like A, A#, B, C, C#, etc, then we learn octave shapes that will tell us ok this note on fifth string is same note on third string, and that will teach all notes of fretboard.

Then a ton of exercises to enforce it. Then major scale theory, minor scale theory, chord theory, diatonic chord theory, extended chord theory, CAGED system which I read a lot about, and I think that's about it.

It's an accelerated, trimmed down music course.

I have a lot to work on, now that I have a sweet humbucker guitar (with coil taps so it sounds like a half decent single coil too) I realize my pinch harmonics aren't squealing because of me and technique rather than coils. So much to practice it's a waste to spend anytime playing songs kinda but that's what keeps me interested and noticing my progress.

Dug out an old guitar music book. Perhaps you can help me decipher any and all details on this supposed to be simple song. I'd really love to play it and don't see why I couldn't, if I could properly read all this. The tabs even get crazy in these.

Old L.A. tonight by Ozzy. Beautiful song


Those are guitar one, they are mimicing the piano entry. When I do the f Barre chord and c chord and play that tab it sounds nothing like it but I kind of see kinda don't.

But I could set my metronome to 76 bpm and practice along? Obviously it will eander a bit here and there bc rock and roll and string bend emotions but basically yes?

What about the sheet music tells me which notes to play beyond an e or an e an octave higher? So many es on fretboard. Besides the chord charts of course but I'm assuming u won't always get those, I'm having flashbacks to playing recorder in third grade and that sheet music for ode to joy



Enter guitar two, the beauty kicking in



What does the mf mean? I'll have a guitar jam up here today or tomorrow for people to rock out to!


--------------------
My name is not a proclamation but a reminder of how to carry myself.

How I made my mush GH                              How I make chocolates

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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
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Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25090007 - 03/25/18 06:34 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

Here's another one



So what is guitar one doing? What's that symbol mean and does it play a d5 letting it ring then playing it again immeidatley letting off then moving to a D5 and C?

On the lower section did they combine two guitars on same tab? So I'm not expected to play 10th fret D string and 3rd fret a string as a chord, that's a stretch.

Also, now that I've been thinking about it how does this even work? These books are transcribed by some dude named Danny begelman and it says they're "authentically transcribed" by him, and as such the hal Leonard corporation has copyrighted the info contained in the book. So it says I can't record or perform these songs publicly.

I assume I'd owe them royalties or maybe even punitive charges.

But....why would I be paying the mooch who transcribed it and put out a book? And how can they call it authentic, no matter how good he is at transcribing and how well he studied live performances.


--------------------
My name is not a proclamation but a reminder of how to carry myself.

How I made my mush GH                              How I make chocolates

Cannabis


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
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Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25092777 - 03/26/18 08:40 PM (2 years, 9 months ago)

:rockon:  :matrix2:    :rockon:

be



Question - what do you call what i'm doing in the beginning, its an open chord that i alternate fingers on one of the strings making a mini melody inside the chord melody. 

everything has a term, like trill, vibrato, arpeggio, etc.  I would assume this does? 

Enjoy my fabulous noobness everyone! If you jam lets jam!


--------------------
My name is not a proclamation but a reminder of how to carry myself.

How I made my mush GH                              How I make chocolates

Cannabis


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
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Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25112532 - 04/04/18 02:19 AM (2 years, 9 months ago)

Well, a lot of those questions were obvious when i put in the time. Yes, thats guitar one and two, both on the same section of sheet music at the same time. That was very confusing to me in my early teens ripe with ADHD, i wasn't going to sit there and figure that out. I tried stretching and hitting it as a chord, as it said, and after a while of it sounding like crap i dropped it and moved on.

Thanks to Buffy for being a part of my guitar renaissance, by dusing off these old guitar books and actually getting a little bit down, i'm on a new level now. Ozzy's guitarists were always the biggest inspiration to me, inspired me to play.

Also, on music theory progression, quick references to learn the notes on the 5th and 6th strings easy (two fattest strings), 3 gay cats, meaning 3rd frets notes are G on 6th string and C on fifth string...

playing guitar gives you "5 able digits"... 5th fret is A on 6th and D on 5th...

And 7 B&E.  For some reason i have no problem remembering B&E because its like thug talk for breaking and entering. Same way i remember sharps, B and E have no sharps, A, A#, B, C, C#, D, D#, E, F, F#, G, G#

So now that i know those, i can learn the fret before and after each, and have the top two strings. Then on to octave shapes, giving me the entire fretboard.  It'll take time.

I would very much like to know if this sheet music could have told me the correct timing for this song, as the bpm was wrong, and the notes appear to line up with tabulature, which is spaced wrong for song.



:rockon:    :rockon:



:rockon:  I still can't believe i'm playing this song!!  :rockon:


Edited by Humble Newcomer (04/04/18 03:52 AM)


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InvisibleBuffy
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Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25119898 - 04/07/18 03:46 AM (2 years, 9 months ago)

Hey sorry for taking so long to respond, been pretty busy with school. I'll reply soon when I have a chance.


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
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Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Buffy]
    #25122124 - 04/08/18 12:55 AM (2 years, 9 months ago)

No worries buddy. Half the questions were stupid and didnt deserve time wasted on them. I'll be making some more videos and having questions with them, I kinda like doing the video thing I've never seen myself play on video and so I notice little things I want to correct as I watchyself play

And the anonymity kinda helps alleviate any potential embarrassment, I'm a gourmet guy mostly I don't have much to hide but its neat.

Big Barre chord exercise tonight. Putting together what I'm learning in music theory with playing.

Haters gonna hate, but I love Torn by Natalie Imbruglia, Im an 80s and early 90s kid, I remember it well, it's a good song, and it's perfect for this phase.

And a KILLER Barre chord workout. I actually know and can see the notes on the fifth and sixth string now so in this video lesson (how to play starts at about six minutes) when he's playing and naming what chord he just says A or B flat or C major and it's badass knowing where to go for the first time without everything screechinf to a halt amd foing first fret g string to third ftet a string or whatever.

An A chord. Ok, Barre chord at fifth fret of sixth string. Do u want a major, minor, 7th or minor 7th Barre A Barre chord? Cuz now i can change just one finger and get any. Ahh!



I really struggle with major Barre chords down on the five strings only when you have to either claw your three small fingers in or have two barres basically one with your index and another one step higher with your ring. Like the c major in tbe chorus of this song. I don't have it yet


--------------------
My name is not a proclamation but a reminder of how to carry myself.

How I made my mush GH                              How I make chocolates

Cannabis


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InvisibleBuffy
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Posts: 104
Re: Getting back into guitar [Re: Humble Newcomer]
    #25137566 - 04/14/18 05:46 AM (2 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Humble Newcomer said:
Well. I'm rendering some footage now, snippets of an early morning jam, just because the Shroomery wants to see guitar playing in a post about guitars.

I had to wear safety glasses for a while while playing (<- isn't English great), the rust is just flying off now, my playing has really started to tighten up.

A large part of that was breaking out the old 2x12 amp and putting it in a doorway to act like a shroud of aural death and cranked it up as loud as I could and jammed on a strap

Playing on a strap was never something I did, only played with a band once or twice, both on stage with no practice. I don't mind the nerves, I love adrenaline. But now that I've included it in my hourly practice, it started out I had to do five minutes and that was all I did because my playing fell apart I couldn't even do open chords or slide a power chord or anything

Now, somehow, it's just about the same thing. I have to sling my axe kinda high but I don't care I can really rock out now.

So, for the first time ever, I cranked that shit up as loud as I could (6, unless I get a longer cable and can walk further away) and had my four channel stompbox outside and I played for three hours that day.

I also recently bought a new metal guitar off Craigslist to set up and upgrade a little. Sounds great, intonation is off so some chords sound out of tune, I can notice that now thanks to my previous in depth guitar overhaul. But I've been playing it like it's going out of style.

Started the music theory, basically first few lessons are learning notes along fifth and sixth strings, low E and A for our lurkers who are learning with me, and once all those notes are known like A, A#, B, C, C#, etc, then we learn octave shapes that will tell us ok this note on fifth string is same note on third string, and that will teach all notes of fretboard.

Then a ton of exercises to enforce it. Then major scale theory, minor scale theory, chord theory, diatonic chord theory, extended chord theory, CAGED system which I read a lot about, and I think that's about it.

It's an accelerated, trimmed down music course.

I have a lot to work on, now that I have a sweet humbucker guitar (with coil taps so it sounds like a half decent single coil too) I realize my pinch harmonics aren't squealing because of me and technique rather than coils. So much to practice it's a waste to spend anytime playing songs kinda but that's what keeps me interested and noticing my progress.

Dug out an old guitar music book. Perhaps you can help me decipher any and all details on this supposed to be simple song. I'd really love to play it and don't see why I couldn't, if I could properly read all this. The tabs even get crazy in these.

Old L.A. tonight by Ozzy. Beautiful song


Those are guitar one, they are mimicing the piano entry. When I do the f Barre chord and c chord and play that tab it sounds nothing like it but I kind of see kinda don't.

But I could set my metronome to 76 bpm and practice along? Obviously it will eander a bit here and there bc rock and roll and string bend emotions but basically yes?

What about the sheet music tells me which notes to play beyond an e or an e an octave higher? So many es on fretboard. Besides the chord charts of course but I'm assuming u won't always get those, I'm having flashbacks to playing recorder in third grade and that sheet music for ode to joy



Enter guitar two, the beauty kicking in



What does the mf mean? I'll have a guitar jam up here today or tomorrow for people to rock out to!






That is a great song! Ozzy has definitely had some killer guitarists, and I went through a very heavy Zakk Wylde phase in my younger days. Check out Pride and Glory and early Black Label Society if you haven't, really great stuff!

Old LA Tonight guitar one:

So for this I think you should really focus on getting the rhythm right with full chords first before playing it exactly as written in the tab. Because piano and guitar are such different instruments and are played so differently, there are a lot of challenges when trying to play piano parts on guitar. With the piano, you can play a chord with both hands, and alternate between left right left right in a rhythm manner, almost like you're playing drums or bongos. With guitar you typically don't play by drumming down on it in an alternating L R L R pattern. Another thing is that playing piano pieces on guitar tends to lend itself better to fingerstyle where the strings are plucked with your thumb and fingers (excluding pinky), so for now I think you should play the full chords and focus on getting the rhythm on that guitar one part, rather than arpeggiating it, playing it as a broken chord, one or two notes at a time like in the tab.

So the rhythm for the first two measures, being the F major and then C major measures, is 1 and 2 and 3 and 4e, 1 and 2 and 3 and 4e.

When it goes to the G major, the rhythm is 1 and 2 and uh 3 and 4 and.

The A minor is 1 2 and 3 e and uh (4) and.


I can't see enough of the second line to really comment on it, but there's a big challenge in trying to teach via written word only, since it's impossible for you to hear me verbalize the counts, or play the parts on the guitar. However in this case we have the recorded version from the album on youtube, or you might even have the song on CD or something, so listen to the first four measures on the recording, and count along with it.

1 and 2 and 3 and 4 e
1 and 2 and 3 and 4 e
1 and 2 and uh 3 and 4 and
1 2 and 3 e and uh (4) and


Once you get the count right, strum along with the song for those first four measures, making sure you're playing the same rhythm. The rhythm transcription for these measures is correct, but in the recorded version the rhthym is a bit hard to hear in the third measure on the piano because the pianist is playing some notes a bit quieter.

Once you're able to play the rhythms correctly with full chords, then go on and work out the arpeggiated parts as is written in the book. 

Were you able to make sense of those 4/4 subdivision rhythm exercises I posted? It's gotta be super hard to understand what I'm saying in regards to subdiving and counting out the subdivisions.

At some point I could possibly do Skype lessons with you or something like that if you would be interested. I'm looking for students and though I would charge you an hourly, it would be very reasonable. I'm a totally unemployed University student so I couldn't really commit to Skype teaching for free. It's a lot easier to teach in person, but it can be done via Skype or similar video chat programs, and I do think it would be worthwhile for you and you'd be satisfied with it. So just let me know if you're interested and we can work something out.

Now onto your other posts!


edit: mf means mezzo-forte, which means moderately or half loud.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamics_(music)

The transcription says mf with slight distortion, and on the album it sounds to me like Zakk is going straight into his JCM 800 amp which is cranked a bit to get a natural overdrive sound. The JCM 800 is a master volume amp, meaning it has a master volume and a pre-amp volume. They were designed to be able to get an overdriven/distorted sound at low volumes, rather than having to crank up the amplifier all the way to get natural tube distortion like with non master volume amps.

Zakk Wylde typically gets a decent amount of gain through his amp, and then uses a pedal like the Boss Super Overdrive to really make it scream. On this section in the song he's going straight into amp, no pedal. So we can say this is mezzo-forte, moderately loud with slight distortion. Kicking on the pedal would be forte, which means loud, with lots of distortion. He does this at 3:15 here:



I don't know what amp you have, but hopefully you're able to dial in a bit of overdrive on your amp. You mentioned something about a pedal as well, and I don't know what you have, but hopefully you have distortion. So what you should do for this song is get a bit of overdrive on your amp, use your bridge pickup, which is what he's using, and no pedal. That's your mezzo-forte with slight distotion. Kick on your pedal now you've got forte with heavy distortion, which is probably what it says in the book when it gets to that part. It might even say ff (very loud) or fff (very very loud).





Edited by Buffy (04/14/18 06:06 AM)


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