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OfflineQuadman
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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Metacanna] * 1
    #24906661 - 01/12/18 12:15 AM (8 months, 3 days ago)

A pressurized barrel is extremely dangerous , unless engineered to withstand it. 5 psi doesn't sound like much , could be explosive. Would not recommend it.:rolleyes:


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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Quadman] * 1
    #24907292 - 01/12/18 09:53 AM (8 months, 3 days ago)

Agreed on a 5 psi 55 gallon drum, the lid will have a force of 3500 lbs!

The sterilization chamber is drake89’s idea.  It is run at atmospheric pressure.  I am building mine to hold two racks. I am still going through the boiler design to confirm my 15 gallon boiler will provide enough steam.


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OfflineMetacanna
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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: thunderfarm]
    #24923687 - 01/18/18 06:43 PM (7 months, 27 days ago)

Today I went for a visit on a warehouse available for renting, distance 15 minutes from home, 25 minutes to city center. They are asking 400€, a little above what I was thinking but it has a few bonuses.

- 190m2 (2050 sq ft). This is probably enough space even for more long term plans.
- Low density around the warehouse. No nosy neighbors calling the police for no reason. There's a little outdoor space to pile used bags. Private access to warehouse's front door to load / unload my car. This scenario is uncommon at this price range and location.
- The warehouse has high thermal mass as it is built in masonry.

With all this space I wouldn't be doing any definitive wood framing. Instead, I would start with PVC pipes structure and cheap greenhouse sheeting to have things running asap. This solution is cheaper, lighter, much faster to build and although less reliable, achieve the desired effect in the short term. The point is, be more experienced and start selling mushrooms to have a better grasp on the market, only then think about a more definitive layout. 

Concerning plastic sheeting. Is it bad idea to use transparent plastic sheeting? The warehouse has a few windows but no direct sunlight. Assuming that wouldn't be enough I could put the warehouse roof lights on a timer, starting at 8h and turning off at 20h (12h cycle). That would suit me and the mushrooms too, I guess. I'm so cheap I can't even afford a CFL hanging on the FC :dancer:

So far, all places I have visited don't have drains on the floor I could use for the FC. I checked with the landlords if they would let me do it, they don't...
Has anyone dealt with this situation?







The condition of the building is poor, some small repairs are needed. Thing is, as you can see in the pictures the structure has some damp problems, there's green mold in some walls. I can paint the walls but green mold will win over time.
How prejudicial is that for the whole grow op?


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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Metacanna]
    #24923946 - 01/18/18 08:20 PM (7 months, 27 days ago)

That is cheap rent!  What country are you in?  As far as mold, should be OK since you'll end up growing it in you grow room anyway.  For water in the grow room you can make sure the floor is sealed with wood or plastic boards and silicone (or any waterproof adhesive), and vaccuum daily or keep one on a timer if the floor is sloped and the water all goes to one end.


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OfflineMetacanna
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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: drake89]
    #24971001 - 02/06/18 11:50 AM (7 months, 9 days ago)

Thanks drake. More likely the floor will be flat. Before building a definitive FC with proper drainage, I guess the only way is to mop the floor. Once a day would be doable.

After some thought I decided to adjust my plan. I ended to the conclusion that it will be more beneficial for my peace of mind if I run some trials and sell at least a few dozens pounds of mushrooms before start paying rent. Having to pay rent before having accomplished any sales would be stressful for me, selling some mushrooms before will give me a boost on moral and confidence on what I'm doing.

I will start on my backyard, in a 160sq ft (15m2) well insulated shed. I will run the "business" from there during the first 3-6 months. I might be able to fruit some spent blocks outdoors. I don't like the idea of having my neighbors checking on what I'm doing but I have to live with that.

The space is tight, have to fit the lab, incubation chamber and FC in there. Goal is to harvest 20-30lbs weekly out of that space. I suppose the space will feel tight from the beginning but first I want to have all production sold, so there's a good justification to rent a bigger place.

I still have to drill two holes on the shed for intake and exhaust, probably 6', what do you think? My idea is to have all the space on negative pressure by having a fan on the exhaust of the FC and passive on intake.

For humidity I ordered 10x 3$ single disk pond foggers on ebay. I ordered different models from different sellers to check if there's some of them that last a bit longer. This will probably suck but will get me started.
The foggers are all powered through a single 24V AC/DC unit. The one I have allows to adjust voltage so I can play with that and see how the transducer respond.

I ordered a 48x24 99,995% HEPA from Mann+Hummel, a German manufacturer. Lucky me they have distributors all over Europe. 195€ with shipping. Also, ordered a 1200 CFM blower from ebay, 150€.

For 5€ got a new 11 gallon drum barrel, exactly the same design as the 55G, but smaller.



This will run with a 2000W heater element and a float valve on the bottom, filled with 3 gallons of water. The lid will be perforated with 3-4 small holes to let pressure escape. Temperature will be controlled with this Temperature Controller. It operates up to 210F so probably the barrel won't reach 212F, I guess that won't be a problem anyway. If someone here is using this model, do you know where to get replacement sensors? 

This will get me started. Once I'm happy with the design of the small barrel I can upgrade with a 55G.

Right now my biggest concern is air circulation inside a small stacked space. My second biggest concern is to have to mop the floor or have my FC transformed into a pond. 

That's it for now.


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Offlinedeadmandave
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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Metacanna]
    #24972456 - 02/06/18 10:26 PM (7 months, 8 days ago)

i think a prototype farm in your backyard is a great idea. Lets you get in the swing of things without an enormous investment.

as far as ventilating your grow shed, i think the idea is to have a positive pressure inside the grow room. this will help push everything out, i.e. it will help prevent little critters, spores and other floaty things from getting inside the cracks and crevices of your grow room.

have your blower/fan take air from outside of the shed, or from your incubation area and pull it through a simple filter (could be a furnace filter or polyfil) and into the grow room. have a louvered vent to allow air out.

do you have any space in your house for the lab work? a lab can be tiny, simple table with a hepa and some shelves for storing things. I would keep it out of the grow shed if at all possible. I think its best to have incubation and fruiting separated from the lab.


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OfflineMetacanna
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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: deadmandave]
    #24972690 - 02/07/18 12:31 AM (7 months, 8 days ago)

The idea behind negative pressure is to have a single fan exhausting CO2 and spores from the FC to the exterior of the shed while sucking air from a passive intake hole on the shed. For positive pressure I would need a second fan for the intake.
If I have positive pressure inside the FC, unless 100% sealed, won't the spores escape into the shed instead of being redirected to the exterior? 

Yeah, I know what you mean but unfortunately I don't have room in my house to set the lab, I could, but my wife would burn me alive. To adapt to this situation I won't be doing agar, just grain to grain and inoculation of sawdust fruiting blocks. Up to 10% spawn will probably offset less than ideal sterile conditions.
The substrate mixing and bagging will be done outdoors. 

A polyfil filter for the intake is definitely a priority. It's incredible how nasty it gets after running only a few days. 

Thanks for the input.


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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Metacanna]
    #24973280 - 02/07/18 10:24 AM (7 months, 8 days ago)

Yes you might get some spores landing in the shed depending how the FC is built but imho I think that is better than pulling all the spores/bugs/dust/pollen that gets close to the FC inside.

Also you should only need 1 fan either way, whether you're pulling air in or pushing air out.

Of course it's your decision and either way will work especially if this is only temporary trial run.

Maybe your wife will lighten up to the idea when she sees you bringing home some sweet mushroom $$$ :lol:


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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: deadmandave]
    #25026845 - 02/27/18 07:28 PM (6 months, 18 days ago)

:takingnotes:

I'm from Spain too and I'm practising for in one future start my mushroom farm.

100kg grain 30€?? where??

If you want a HEPA laminar flow filter look at Salvador Escoda (spanish supplier). I got mine from them.
 
Good luck!:thumbup:


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OfflineMetacanna
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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Inocybe]
    #25038712 - 03/04/18 06:59 PM (6 months, 13 days ago)

Hola hermano. In Spain you can easily get wheat, rye and barley for 5-6€ 20kg bags. Look for local poultry, cattle or horse feeding stores. Same price for wheat bran. Usually these stores are not found online, you have to drive around rural areas 20-30km away from the city. Ask to local people working on the land where to buy it. In one drive you will find it.

I got my HEPA 48'x24' from Mann+Hummel, paid 195€. Thanks anyway.

______

So, I stopped being a pussy and decided to don't waste time in my backyard, instead I'm starting in a bigger space. I'm taking more risks for sure but while planning I got more confident about the market, so here I go.
My plan has been going back and forth as I get more into the mushroom business scene, so understand if I'm incoherent or contradict myself at some point.

If everything goes right I'm signing a rental contract this week for this space:



(It has more area that isn't in pictures)

This place is 3km, 6 minutes driving from my place. Driving times are crucial for me, I feel dumb when daily commuting long distances. At this distance I can even walk to my workplace when not resourcing / distributing.

This warehouse is 100m2 (1100 sqft), has 3 different water access points, many waterproof sockets installed 3 feet high (lower my chances of being electrocuted), one drainage point and 4 sewer access points where I can install a drain with a siphon, so smell don't pass.
It's located on the back of a residencial 5 story building side by side with more buildings. This means this space has lots of thermal mass, structure is in masonry.

The walls being in concrete plaster can be misted, in turn they release moisture all the time acting as a humidity backup. From time to time I have to mist with a bleach dilution or the walls will turn into a fungi paradise. 

The entrance is large enough to have a truck with a dump trailer coming in the garage door and unloading large quantities of sawdust. Very likely this will be the scenario as I'm struggling to find oak pellets suppliers, thought it would be easier at first but the only thing I find is pine pellets. In alternative I found a source that can supply fresh cork oak sawdust in bulk (minimum 1 tone load), being fresh is good for immediate use but not so good for storing, I will need to bag and pile it a corner to reduce the mess, which makes me wonder if it's good idea to bag fresh (wet) sawdust. (?)

I ordered the materials to build two 55G drums. Each one will run independently with its own heating element and PID, this is less energy efficient than other designs but in turn gives me more flexibility, I can have each one on casters and easily move them around (i.e. to unload sterilized bags in the lab), plus, if I have components failing in one barrel the other keeps going. 
The heating elements and PIDs will take a while to be delivered so I will get a gas burner, install a float valve and put one drum at work asap.

For shelving I will start with a single 14'x3'x8' and 5 shelves for the incubation room, in theory I will be able to fit around 1000 6lbs bags in there. I can have this built for 150€, the structure in non treated wood and the shelving in plastic chicken wire.
This is a priority, so I can have many bags incubating from the very beginning while I'm building the grow chamber, I won't have the lab ready but I have the flow hood and a table to inoculate bags, not ideal but is no reason to delay production.
In the growing chamber I will use some rusty but solid shelves I got for free.

Money wise I'm keeping close track of everything I pay for, right now I'm better than my initial projection, rent and materials and equipments being cheaper. Biggest surprise so far is on the oak sawdust price...

I hope to have solid updates in a month.


Edited by Metacanna (03/04/18 08:25 PM)


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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Metacanna]
    #25041584 - 03/05/18 10:48 PM (6 months, 12 days ago)

Loving the action you've taken to get to this point. I wish you prosperity and abundance in your venture.

I've been looking to do the same thing, but it's been nothing but a dream for me. The unknown makes me nervous...

I'm hope I can take that leap of faith to do the same as you have done, some day soon.
I would love to hear about your progress.  :seriousthumbsup:


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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Timmy Meow]
    #25044638 - 03/07/18 08:57 AM (6 months, 11 days ago)

Have you tried the poultry, cattle or horse feeding store grain? I thought that those grains have fungicides, because for animals they don't use organically grown grain. That's why the grain I buy is 29€ for a 25kg bag.


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OfflineMetacanna
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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Inocybe]
    #25044654 - 03/07/18 09:11 AM (6 months, 11 days ago)

No I didn't. I just found the source but didn't run any batch with those yet.

Let me put it this away: Have you been unsuccessful on your grows because you weren't using organically grown grain?
I have seen in the USA some growers using GMO soybean hulls mixed with sawdust with great success, which leads me to think there's no reason to pay extra for organic grain.


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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Metacanna]
    #25044666 - 03/07/18 09:24 AM (6 months, 11 days ago)

Maybe you should try it first :shrug:

As far as I know, GMO are Genetically Modified Organisms, they could have also fungicides, but GMO doesn't necessary mean that they contain fungicides. I think that they were genetically modified to be more resistant to some patogenic fungi or diseases.

Anyway, if you are going to use non organic grain, post your results as it could be interesting to know we can use them :rockon:


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OfflineMetacanna
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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Inocybe]
    #25044676 - 03/07/18 09:34 AM (6 months, 11 days ago)

Right but usually GMO seeds are designed to resist to pesticides and gunficides so these can be used in large scale ops.
I will keep you updated.


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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Metacanna]
    #25046419 - 03/07/18 05:33 PM (6 months, 10 days ago)

Anyone that says you cannot make an organic mushroom out of a GMO substrate is out of their mind and have no clue what they are talking about. Pesticides on crops nowadays have short lives and concentrations at harvest are pretty nill. They break down in the sunlight pretty fast.  I use conventional substrates for spawn and bulk. I have never had any problems growing with them . Ever


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Onlinedrake89
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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: lipa]
    #25047925 - 03/08/18 08:07 AM (6 months, 10 days ago)

Quote:

lipa said:
Anyone that says you cannot make an organic mushroom out of a GMO substrate is out of their mind and have no clue what they are talking about. Pesticides on crops nowadays have short lives and concentrations at harvest are pretty nill. They break down in the sunlight pretty fast.  I use conventional substrates for spawn and bulk. I have never had any problems growing with them . Ever



That and you really can't get OG substrate where I live, besides sawdust.  So supplements are treated like animal feed.  You get an exemption if you prove you can't buy it locally and follow the rest of the rules.


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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: drake89]
    #25048001 - 03/08/18 09:29 AM (6 months, 10 days ago)

The main GMO is for the herbicide Roundup or glyphosate. They are modified so the herbicide dies not kill corn or soybeans. It is non selective herbicide so that is why Monsanto altered the crops to resist the Roundup.


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Rumors of my demise have been greatly exaggerated.
                                            Mark Twain
My glass is neither half full nor half empty, it is twice as big as it should be.


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OfflineMetacanna
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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Quadman]
    #25050494 - 03/08/18 10:40 PM (6 months, 9 days ago)

So finally I got the key. Here we go.



The plan:




It will take a while until I have all those shelves made. In the meanwhile, I will use what I already have.

Things to start with:

1 - Lower the roof to 9' with plastic sheeting. Framing in PVC pipes and wood, white plastic double sheeting for walls and roof.
2 - Assemble shelves, furniture and all garbage I carry with me wherever I go.
3 - Get a 55 gallon drum + a gas burner and start processing substrate.
4 - Yet to come.

:awedance:


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Re: Setting up a mushroom farm (raw business plan included) [Re: Metacanna]
    #25050548 - 03/08/18 11:09 PM (6 months, 9 days ago)

:popcorn::like:


--------------------
Rumors of my demise have been greatly exaggerated.
                                            Mark Twain
My glass is neither half full nor half empty, it is twice as big as it should be.


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