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OfflineFishLevelMidnight
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Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization?
    #24976691 - 02/08/18 03:04 PM (6 years, 23 days ago)

I got some mycobags with a 5 um filter, was hoping I could presealed and autoclave but the bags exploded, so I’m hoping for another option.

If I ziptie the top closed and autoclave, will it explode or draw in contaminates from the top while cooling?

I know this is a silly question, but how closed would the tiptoe be? Like as tight as possible, or tight enough to not see a hole but looser than tight as possible if that makes sense...


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InvisibleInocybe
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: FishLevelMidnight]
    #24976709 - 02/08/18 03:14 PM (6 years, 23 days ago)

When I PC bags, I use a tyvek sleeve in the bag. They are reusable, so you don't need to get a new one every time. If you dont have tyvek, you can use polyfill and then ziptie it to the bag to hold the polyfill in place. When sterilizing large amounts of enriched sawdust bags I preseal the 0,2um filter bags, and then steam sterilize at low pressure for 6-8h in a 55 gal drum. Hope it helps.

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OfflineFishLevelMidnight
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: Inocybe]
    #24976720 - 02/08/18 03:19 PM (6 years, 23 days ago)

Can I use the postal tyvek for that then?

The idea is to put it in the top of the bag and fold down, then pull out and ziptie tight after the autoclave cycle?

If I use polyfil instead I can just leave as is after the cycle right?

Thanks for that!


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OfflinepoofterFroth
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: FishLevelMidnight]
    #24976870 - 02/08/18 04:38 PM (6 years, 23 days ago)

Tyvek and zip ties are both unnecessary, as is pre-sealing them...


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OfflineFishLevelMidnight
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: poofterFroth]
    #24976961 - 02/08/18 05:24 PM (6 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

poofterFroth said:
Tyvek and zip ties are both unnecessary, as is pre-sealing them...




Very helpful comment, thanks for sharing how you do it!


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OfflinepoofterFroth
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: FishLevelMidnight]
    #24977000 - 02/08/18 05:42 PM (6 years, 23 days ago)

Just push out most of the air and fold the tops closed. :hug:



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Edited by poofterFroth (02/08/18 05:44 PM)

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OfflineFishLevelMidnight
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: poofterFroth]
    #24977053 - 02/08/18 06:06 PM (6 years, 23 days ago)

I might be a little dense, so you just fold the top of the bag over itself (like an opened bag of chips) and it won’t open during the autoclave?

Thanks!


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OfflineHumbled
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: poofterFroth]
    #24977327 - 02/08/18 08:11 PM (6 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

poofterFroth said:
Just push out most of the air and fold the tops closed. :hug:






This is news for me. Thanks for that tip. Next time I autoclave I will give it a try and skip the sleeves.


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: Humbled]
    #24977398 - 02/08/18 08:42 PM (6 years, 23 days ago)

I usually take my bags out of the PC before they're entirely cooled off, still warm and malleable, one time i didn't empty PC til a full day later and noticed the bags were somewhat vacuum packed, they kept their shape and felt tight and the folds were crisp and tight -  I'm going to run 2 bags sleevless tomorrow and let them cool overnight in the sterile PC, and if i achieve that same semi-vacuum packed feel i think it may work


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OfflinepoofterFroth
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: Humbled]
    #24977474 - 02/08/18 09:18 PM (6 years, 23 days ago)

Ok ok ok... I guess I'm just gonna try to explain my process with pictures.

Here goes; (I'm only using dry grains as an example, but I use the same folding technique for grains and sawdust sacks)



So I kinda push out the air, then neatly fold/tuck the top opening of the bag up and under - using the filter patch as a guide, then fold it all down against the bag...(sorta hard to explain but easy to do).

Hopefully it makes more sense now.

The weight of the bags pressing against each other holds everything closed, and the pressure cook pretty much vacuums each bag tightly closed.

I've never had any issues doing it this way.

That whole tyvek thing was just a shitty snake-oil gimmick to help sell an overly long and boring video once upon a time...


:brucelee:


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InvisibleHumble Newcomer
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: poofterFroth]
    #24977529 - 02/08/18 09:44 PM (6 years, 23 days ago)

Thanks, i look forward to trying this.


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OfflineHumbled
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: poofterFroth]
    #24977867 - 02/09/18 02:59 AM (6 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

poofterFroth said:

That whole tyvek thing was just a shitty snake-oil gimmick to help sell an overly long and boring video once upon a time...

:brucelee:




Haha, well said. I think I can see how the plastic at the opening should just stick together and force the air to move through the patch upon cooling. Would this be the idea or are the bags still under vacuum after PCing?


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OfflineBry Bry
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: Humbled]
    #24977995 - 02/09/18 05:50 AM (6 years, 23 days ago)

I fold a piece of paper towel and slip it in the opening. I fold the excess plastic around and pc for 3 hrs. My bags are still vacuum tight after a PC run with the paper towel in place.

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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: Humbled]
    #24977997 - 02/09/18 05:50 AM (6 years, 23 days ago)

This works fine if your PC holds vacuum, or you cool at the flow hood. I've lost bags with this method ( valve on autoclave doesn't hold )  Pre-seal all never had blowout using .5 micron bags.


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OfflineFishLevelMidnight
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: Quadman]
    #24978499 - 02/09/18 11:40 AM (6 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

Quadman said:
This works fine if your PC holds vacuum, or you cool at the flow hood. I've lost bags with this method ( valve on autoclave doesn't hold )  Pre-seal all never had blowout using .5 micron bags.




I edited to adjust, the filters are 5 micron, from mycohaus.

I am using an industrial AC that gets down to pressure (from 18 PSI) in about 10 minutes or so, maybe that is the issue?

I presealed with the gussets in, maybe its supposed to be out? I also tried to tuck the bags against themselves but apparently to no avail.

I am going to do a batch of 2 6.5 qt bags, 1 with ziptie and one with poofs method and see what works for me and my set up.

Thanks so much for the responses guys! I got the myco fever and I want to cultivate these edible woodlover species ASAP and I have 3 LC ready to go :P


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OfflineQuadman
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: FishLevelMidnight]
    #24979040 - 02/09/18 04:36 PM (6 years, 22 days ago)

Dumping pressure can cause air in bags to expand. Yes , I believe that is the problem. Seal bags flat , not gusseted. Cheaper sealers won't do well on multiple layers of plastic.


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OfflineFishLevelMidnight
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: Quadman]
    #24979053 - 02/09/18 04:46 PM (6 years, 22 days ago)

Maybe I’ll try 3X bags with about 4 qt then, ziptie, fold over and non gusseted presealed (preferred, fingers crossed)

Thanks!


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OfflineGr0wer
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Re: Is tyvek necessary for sawdust block sterilization? [Re: FishLevelMidnight]
    #24979152 - 02/09/18 05:33 PM (6 years, 22 days ago)

YOu dont even need to fold the gussets, just grab the caddy corners and pull, fold, load. For spawn i do gussets into the PC just so i can tuck the opening under the fold and keep it a bit cleaner.

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