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BattyKoda
WCA President



Registered: 09/11/17
Posts: 8,023
Loc: Boof Hard Or Go Home
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: mushboy]
#24872983 - 12/28/17 08:53 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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--------------------
 
A Man Must Learn To Sail In All Winds. RIP ModestMouse & Big Worm
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 35,378
Loc: eating the cats
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: Piaseski]
#24872984 - 12/28/17 08:53 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
Piaseski said: we rely on the spawn ratio and fast colonisation of the bulk to beat out any potential issues.
thats the misconception that violets post/journal causes. thats just not true. this is my argument.
Quote:
We all know when we spawn colonised grain/cakes/whatever to tubs, we are introducing spores
that part is true. but that does not cause the contams. bad spawn does. not exposure to air after the food source is colonized.
bulk is not a food source in that regard. thats why open air SPAWN RUNNING or fruiting works.
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Violet



Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: mushboy]
#24872987 - 12/28/17 08:56 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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Okay I WILL post again to say.... Piaseski gets it ^^^^^^
Also, I would like to apologize for being 'abrasive', it's just damn-well earned from this OP in particular. I really did try to just approach it plainly as a myco topic at first, I really did. That's not what this guy wanted, tho. He wanted drivel and slander. It's not exactly my way to butter those people up.
Quote:
mushboy said:
Quote:
Piaseski said: we rely on the spawn ratio and fast colonisation of the bulk to beat out any potential issues.
thats the misconception that violets post/journal causes. thats just not true. this is my argument.
Hold on hold on hold on hold on.... YOU THINK THAT'S NOT TRUE?
Omg it got better It got better
-------------------- Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!
PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek! For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
• Violet's Teks and Posts •
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ChickenFarmer
Lost Child


Registered: 11/30/17
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: Violet] 1
#24872994 - 12/28/17 09:00 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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When you're too new to understand the argument but you know it's good...
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 35,378
Loc: eating the cats
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: Violet]
#24872995 - 12/28/17 09:00 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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i got some 1:10 ratio open air stuff in the works. so my low ratio to bulk will all contam by that logic?
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Piaseski
Day Tripper
Registered: 11/09/15
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: mushboy] 2
#24872996 - 12/28/17 09:01 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
mushboy said:
Quote:
Piaseski said: we rely on the spawn ratio and fast colonisation of the bulk to beat out any potential issues.
thats the misconception that violets post/journal causes. thats just not true. this is my argument.
I'm not sure i understand you.
As i see it:
1. You spawn in the open air 2. Bacteria/Mold spores possibly (let's say certainly really, given the ubiquity of them) land on the (at this point) uncolonise bulk material, and your colonised grain thats mixed in. 3. In the ideal scenario, the mycellium has a head start due to the ratio and fully colonises before any nasty spores can germinate. (Especially with the sub being geared towards what shrooms want, and against what nasties want).
I take 'Vector' to mean a way in which contaminates are POTENTIALLY introduced, and there can be no argument that spawning open air is even remotely sterile.
Even open air fruiting a fully colonised sub, introduces contaminate spores - they just have a hard time getting hold until later flushes when the myc is weak.
Unless i've been very confused about how this works for a long time, i think we're just arguing over interpretations of terms here.
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JHOVA
Post whore



Registered: 02/17/17
Posts: 4,727
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: mushboy] 3
#24873000 - 12/28/17 09:02 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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Do you even believe what you are saying mushboy?
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 35,378
Loc: eating the cats
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: Piaseski]
#24873001 - 12/28/17 09:03 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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1. correct 2. yes. it does not matter 3. that 'ideal scenario' is fiction. we are growing indoors. ideal would be outdoor hands off from the mushrooms point of view.
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Piaseski
Day Tripper
Registered: 11/09/15
Posts: 391
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: mushboy] 2
#24873004 - 12/28/17 09:03 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
mushboy said: i got some 1:10 ratio open air stuff in the works. so my low ratio to bulk will all contam by that logic?
As my understanding goes, it is certainly more likely too.
I think this is all about the meaning of the term Vector...i dont take it to mean guarenteed contam, you seem to.
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tryptkaloids
Learner



Registered: 02/08/15
Posts: 12,738
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: Piaseski] 2
#24873006 - 12/28/17 09:04 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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I respect you both, but I can't help but feel like you are just fighting over misread context. Let's just all lay out what we mean when we say substrate. I think this all depends on if you are using bull sub that needs proper pasteurization
-------------------- "Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
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Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms
Use the Damn search engine
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Pick a book, Make some chips!
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 35,378
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: Piaseski]
#24873008 - 12/28/17 09:05 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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your understanding is off. thats my point dude.
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tryptkaloids
Learner



Registered: 02/08/15
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: Piaseski] 2
#24873010 - 12/28/17 09:06 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
Piaseski said: i think we're just arguing over interpretations of terms here.
-------------------- "Remember, kids, the difference between science and screwing around is writing it down" -adam savage
Flowchart for Recommended plan of action.
Learn the tried and true way to grow mushrooms
Use the Damn search engine
After you know what you're doing, take a break
Pick a book, Make some chips!
Josex said:Don't take the site seriously bro, ain't worth it.
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 35,378
Loc: eating the cats
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: JHOVA]
#24873011 - 12/28/17 09:06 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
JHOVA said: Do you even believe what you are saying mushboy?
what do you think i am saying? maybe some confusion has taken place.
i believe you can, because i have, open air you monos from the second they are spawned.
whats so insane about that?
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Violet



Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: Piaseski] 2
#24873012 - 12/28/17 09:06 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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I reiterate, Piaseski gets it ^^^^^^ VECTOR
No, mushboy, I'm not saying it WILL contam. Unless using a sub that is especially likely to contam on its own regardless, the idea is that mycelium will colonize it first.
That has ALWAYS been the idea.
Welcome to Mushroom Cultivation.
-------------------- Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!
PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek! For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
• Violet's Teks and Posts •
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 35,378
Loc: eating the cats
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: Violet]
#24873024 - 12/28/17 09:11 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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no. this has gotten side tracked. my point, this thread is about open air fruiting.
and the debate that the 'vector' is irrelevant.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,915
Loc: Milky way
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: mushboy]
#24873028 - 12/28/17 09:15 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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colonization conditions are not aseptic. The lids are not perfect etc... The difference between open air and not open air contamination exposure is like 100 million contaminants vs 1 billion. Either way your still exposing colonizing substrate to plenty of airborne contamination.
Open air fruiting is no more a vector than open air spawning. Neither of which are vectors lol.
You basically can't fuck bulk up with clean spawn and properly prepared substrate.
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Piaseski
Day Tripper
Registered: 11/09/15
Posts: 391
Last seen: 1 year, 1 month
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: mushboy] 2
#24873031 - 12/28/17 09:16 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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No no no no
That's the whole debate, Violet said open air fruiting/spawning/whatfuckingever is a vector for contamination.
It IS, it just issssss.
It doesn't mean it WILL contam.
We all work this way, and it works, nobody is disagreeing there.
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Violet



Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 4,205
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: mushboy]
#24873034 - 12/28/17 09:17 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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Okay, mushbwains, if this thread is about open-air fruiting, why bring up ANYTHING I've said about open-air spawning into it at all?
Killin' me, smalls
Bring up something I've said about open-air fruiting, if you can find something. Here's one, I once spoke about moving from 'pinning' to 'cropping' conditions in the Pods tek by removing lids of containers fruiting together when the pins are large enough to emit humidity protecting the cake below from drying out. So I'm an advocate for open-air fruiting where workable.
No way am I hitting my 4000th post in this stupid thread. This thread is bad, and you should FEEEEEEEL bad.
-------------------- Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!
PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek! For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
• Violet's Teks and Posts •
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent


Registered: 04/30/13
Posts: 61,915
Loc: Milky way
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector [Re: Violet]
#24873036 - 12/28/17 09:19 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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Quote:
Violet said: No way am I hitting my 4000th post in this stupid thread. This thread is bad, and you should FEEEEEEEL bad.
answer questions and have a debate or leave. No ones interested in your what you think of mushboy's thread.
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Atlantis Reaction
Stranger
Registered: 07/04/17
Posts: 184
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Re: debate about open air fruiting being vector *DELETED* [Re: mushboy]
#24873037 - 12/28/17 09:19 AM (7 years, 20 days ago) |
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Post deleted by bodhisatta
Reason for deletion: Off topic
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