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Kryptos
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
#24935085 - 01/22/18 10:10 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: Finally, you're arguing in bad faith if you trust American propaganda over real opinions of people that lived through Socialism.
Believe me, I know that Lenin has been idolized by Soviet leadership through the ages to the point where he is basically a saint. They took all the bad shit he did and lumped it in with Stalin. Lenin formed the first secret police though, and he put down the rough blueprint of social control that Stalin so cruelly perfected.
Though, I'd say he also had some good ideas. Just like Stalin. Not many people can drag one of the biggest agrarian societies in the world through the industrial revolution kicking and screaming successfully, especially in time to win two world wars.
Fun fact: when most Russian people, educated or not, speak of Lenin, they normally use the qualifier "granddad Lenin". Being one of those people, I can tell you the propaganda runs deep.
It's a bit like the hero worship we in America have of General Washington, while in reality, George Washington was a mediocre-to-bad general. Benedict Arnold (the famous traitor), on the other hand, pretty much singlehandedly won the battle for independence at Valcour Bay, which is not something most Americans give him credit for. The freezing of the British supply lines in the winter, as well as the inability to sail British warships (and their big guns) down to main rebellion strongholds probably won the war.
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viktor
psychotechnician
Registered: 11/03/10
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: Enlil] 2
#24935086 - 01/22/18 10:12 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: You're only against African and Muslim immigration because you have irrational biases.
Not wanting to get robbed, bashed, or see my family members get raped is perfectly rational.
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
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Enlil
OTD God-King
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: viktor] 3
#24935092 - 01/22/18 10:14 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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That is rational. Thinking that someone is more likely to do that because they are from Africa or are Muslim is the irrational part.
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Falcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: Kryptos]
#24935108 - 01/22/18 10:26 PM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Kryptos said:
Quote:
Falcon91Wolvrn03 said: Finally, you're arguing in bad faith if you trust American propaganda over real opinions of people that lived through Socialism.
Believe me, I know that Lenin has been idolized by Soviet leadership through the ages to the point where he is basically a saint. They took all the bad shit he did and lumped it in with Stalin. Lenin formed the first secret police though, and he put down the rough blueprint of social control that Stalin so cruelly perfected.
Though, I'd say he also had some good ideas. Just like Stalin. Not many people can drag one of the biggest agrarian societies in the world through the industrial revolution kicking and screaming successfully, especially in time to win two world wars.
Fun fact: when most Russian people, educated or not, speak of Lenin, they normally use the qualifier "granddad Lenin". Being one of those people, I can tell you the propaganda runs deep.
It's a bit like the hero worship we in America have of General Washington, while in reality, George Washington was a mediocre-to-bad general. Benedict Arnold (the famous traitor), on the other hand, pretty much singlehandedly won the battle for independence at Valcour Bay, which is not something most Americans give him credit for. The freezing of the British supply lines in the winter, as well as the inability to sail British warships (and their big guns) down to main rebellion strongholds probably won the war.
I'm not saying there wasn't propaganda. I'm saying most people who've lived through both systems say they wish the Soviet Union hadn't collapsed.
-------------------- I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them. I also attack my side if I think they're wrong. People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.
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viktor
psychotechnician
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: Enlil] 2
#24935230 - 01/23/18 12:25 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Enlil said: That is rational. Thinking that someone is more likely to do that because they are from Africa or are Muslim is the irrational part.
Africans and Muslims are massively over-represented in all violent crime stats, not to mention sex crimes and property crimes.
Every country on Earth is a shithole to the direct degree it has a population of Africans or Muslims.
Opposing African or Muslim immigration is no different to opposing rats building a nest in your basement.
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
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The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: viktor] 2
#24935541 - 01/23/18 07:19 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Lot of crime in SE Asia, too.
And Central, South America. And big cities in OECD nations.
And the Balkans. And Eastern Europe. And Russia.
The problem is poverty. So very, very obviously.
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Eminence
Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,627
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: The Ecstatic] 1
#24935640 - 01/23/18 08:45 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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So it has nothing to do with their culture? You realize having money doesn't change their cultural beliefs of male superiority don't you? They have to take anti-rape classes in some countries for fuck's sake. Have you even looked at how much higher the crime, specifically sex crime stats have gone up where Muslims moved to? It is much too high to just write it off as poverty especially considering how easy a lot of them have it once they finally get to Europe. Hundreds of women don't get groped the same night by the same demographic of people due to poverty. If things were to continue as they are now over there then those rough areas in East Europe are gonna be the safest places in Europe period since eastern Europe seems to be the only ones trying to protect their people from the shit that's goin on elsewhere. Even Norway's had enough at this point. Eventually you're gonna have to admit that there is such a thing as superior or inferior cultures, forget economics and everything else involved.
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The Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: Eminence] 1
#24935669 - 01/23/18 08:58 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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I absolutely do not have to admit that.
I said poverty is the issue. Are these migrants fleeing their Emirati condos to live in ghettos in Europe? Or are they fleeing abject poverty?
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ApostleofAzathoth
lunatic wielding pressure cooker
Registered: 11/16/17
Posts: 699
Loc: Somewhere in the PNW
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: Icelander]
#24935699 - 01/23/18 09:10 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: It's not the system, it's the people.
You can't be serious.
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Eminence
Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 16,627
Loc: Richmond, VA
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: The Ecstatic]
#24940403 - 01/25/18 06:15 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
The Ecstatic said: I absolutely do not have to admit that.
I said poverty is the issue. Are these migrants fleeing their Emirati condos to live in ghettos in Europe? Or are they fleeing abject poverty?
Just to be clear..you're saying the huge increases in sex crimes in European countries where all these Muslims are moving to is due to poverty? You're actually saying that?
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Tantrika
Miss Ann Thrope
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: Eminence] 1
#24940476 - 01/25/18 07:28 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Eminence said:
Quote:
The Ecstatic said: I absolutely do not have to admit that.
I said poverty is the issue. Are these migrants fleeing their Emirati condos to live in ghettos in Europe? Or are they fleeing abject poverty?
Just to be clear..you're saying the huge increases in sex crimes in European countries where all these Muslims are moving to is due to poverty? You're actually saying that?
This is apparently what Sweden is saying:
Quote:
Claim: "There has been a major increase in the number of rapes in Sweden."
Facts: The number of reported rapes in Sweden has risen. But the definition of rape has broadened over time, which makes it difficult to compare the figures. It is also misleading to compare the figures with other countries, as many acts that are considered rape under Swedish law are not considered rape in many other countries.
For example: If a woman in Sweden reports that she has been raped by her husband every night for a year, that is counted as 365 separate offences; in most other countries this would be registered as a single offence, or would not be registered as an offence at all.
Willingness to report such offences also differs dramatically between countries. A culture in which these crimes are talked about openly, and victims are not blamed, will also have more cases reported. Sweden has made a conscious effort to encourage women to report any offence.
Quote:
Claim: "Refugees are behind the increase in crime, but the authorities are covering it up."
Facts: According to the Swedish National Council for Crime Prevention's Swedish Crime Survey, some 13 per cent of the population were the victim of an offence against them personally in 2015. This is an increase on preceding years, although it is roughly the same level as in 2005.
The Swedish National Council for Crime Prevention has conducted two studies into the representation of people from foreign backgrounds among crime suspects, the most recent in 2005. The studies show that the majority of those suspected of crimes were born in Sweden to two Swedish-born parents. The studies also show that the vast majority of people from foreign backgrounds are not suspected of any crimes.
People from foreign backgrounds are suspected of crimes more often than people from a Swedish background. According to the most recent study, people from foreign backgrounds are 2.5 times more likely to be suspected of crimes than people born in Sweden to Swedish-born parents. In a later study, researchers at Stockholm University showed that the main difference in terms of criminal activity between immigrants and others in the population was due to differences in the socioeconomic conditions in which they grew up in Sweden. This means factors such as parents' incomes, and the social circumstances in the area in which an individual grew up.
Swedish government agencies have nothing to gain from covering up statistics and facts; they seek an open and fact-based dialogue. Sweden is an open society governed by a principle of public access to official documents. This means that members of the public, e.g. private individuals and media representatives, have the right to insight into and access to information about the activities of central and local government.
http://www.government.se/articles/2017/02/facts-about-migration-and-crime-in-sweden/
may be misreading the second quote, but it seems to indicate that in native and immigrant populations socioeconomic upbringing bears more weight
but am not posting this to speculate on whether or not that is true just more seeking a point of interest-- does anyone have some sources on the actual cases that are inflating the rape statistics?
An increase in rape in the civilized world is appalling regardless of the statistics but my way of thinking about this, drawing on the above quotes, is sort of: if we look at the above example and draw a temporary number of 365 rape offenses 365 has very different implications if it is 365 Swedish women who have been raped or one immigrant woman raped 365 times by a man she was forced to marry before moving and becoming a Swedish citizen
neither case is 'positive' due to the circumstances of rape but the potential that a single individual is being lawfully dealt with 365 'times' for having taken a previously underage bride is far more easy for me to stomach than the potential of hundreds of women suffering to cause the same 'amount' of charges
unfortunately, seem to recall akira posting a thread a while back regarding child marriages not being dealt with upon immigration into the country which could mean the statistic used here is a diversionary tactic or could mean that the statistic used here is an accurate example but is reached as a result of their poor enforcement policy at the front-end
in either circumstance, it would be interesting to know if there is a collision of policies going on or if there are being coverups of situations similar to the Germany assaults
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The Ecstatic
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: Eminence]
#24940739 - 01/25/18 10:22 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Eminence said:
Quote:
The Ecstatic said: I absolutely do not have to admit that.
I said poverty is the issue. Are these migrants fleeing their Emirati condos to live in ghettos in Europe? Or are they fleeing abject poverty?
Just to be clear..you're saying the huge increases in sex crimes in European countries where all these Muslims are moving to is due to poverty? You're actually saying that?
Virtually all of the "increase" in rapes in Sweden is due to the redefintion of rape by Swedish lawmakers, to a more all encompassing, feminist defintion.
But if all you do is read Breitbart headlines, youll be convinced of roaming muslim rape gangs.
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xzylocybin
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: The Ecstatic] 2
#24940792 - 01/25/18 10:43 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Ecstatic knows what he says is bs, he just shows up to throw off discussion and sow division. The overwhelming majority of sex crime cases in scandinavian countries (95%+) are perpetrated by foriegn migrants against local women. Pay no attention to ecstatics autistic mewlings, his bs diversion tactics may have worked when this was first coming to light but muslim rape/trafficing gangs are well documented across northern Europe now.
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Enlil
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Loc: Uncanny Valley
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: xzylocybin] 1
#24940795 - 01/25/18 10:44 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
xzylocybin said: The overwhelming majority of sex crime cases in scandinavian countries (95%+) are perpetrated by foriegn migrants against local women.
Source?
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xzylocybin
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: Enlil]
#24940811 - 01/25/18 10:50 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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I don't care if you believe me enlil if you actually want to know you will look it up yourself. Those are crime statisticts from sweden.
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Enlil
OTD God-King
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: xzylocybin] 1
#24940821 - 01/25/18 10:52 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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When you make a claim, you have the burden of providing proof. If you can't, you probably pulled it out of your ass.
99.7% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
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xzylocybin
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: Enlil]
#24940835 - 01/25/18 10:56 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Should I fucking repeat myself? I don't care if you believe me, if you are genuinely curious you will look it up yourself. I dont think you acually care and would deny or ignore any evidence I gave you anyways.
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Near Dylan
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: xzylocybin] 1
#24940856 - 01/25/18 11:08 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Not only did I not find anything related to that statistic, but I found an explanation why Sweden has 3 times the amount of rape than the rest of Europe. This is because the rest of Europe only reports a rape when a guilty conviction has been given, but Sweden reports ALL reports of rape, even ones that end in a not guilty verdict. This means the statistic gets really inflated, and anybody in Sweden who falsely files a rape report against a Muslim gets to have their part in the statistic.
Also, if a woman says she was raped everyday for a month, they report that as 30 rapes. If 4 people do that that's over 100 rape cases. If they were found to be lying, then that's a big contributor to the statistic that is completely false.
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Edited by Near Dylan (01/25/18 11:16 AM)
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Thundermuscle75
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: The Ecstatic]
#24940867 - 01/25/18 11:16 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Virtually all of the "increase" in rapes in Sweden is due to the redefintion of rape by Swedish lawmakers, to a more all encompassing, feminist defintion.
But if all you do is read Breitbart headlines, youll be convinced of roaming muslim rape gangs.
That's interesting if true. It's astoning how much the far right and far left seem to feed each other and gorge themselves at an all you can eat, potluck buffet of bullshit.
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shivas.wisdom
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Re: If Nazism is just an Ideology how come Im barred from believing in it? [Re: Near Dylan] 1
#24940884 - 01/25/18 11:23 AM (6 years, 2 months ago) |
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I found this blog post: https://muslimstatistics.wordpress.com/2016/08/21/sweden-migrants-responsible-for-95-of-all-crimes-overrepresented-by-430/
Unfortunately, after a cursory study of the page's contents, I was unable to find support for the claims made in the title anywhere in the body. For example, '95%' only appears in the title. My guess is that certain people will see the blog post, be overwhelmed by the graphs and technical jargon, and just use the title in formulating their beliefs.
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