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Invisibledurian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant
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Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 17,593
Loc: Raccoon City
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: Fractal420]
    #24793396 - 11/19/17 10:33 AM (6 years, 4 months ago)

Oops. You beat me to it.

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OfflineTiberjuggaligger
Galaxy Creeper

Registered: 08/19/17
Posts: 665
Loc: USA
Last seen: 1 year, 4 months
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: durian_2008]
    #24794048 - 11/19/17 04:56 PM (6 years, 4 months ago)

I may not be posting the news but, I'm still reading it. :cheers:


--------------------


Kirk: What does God need with a starship?
McCoy: Jim, what are you doing?
Kirk: I'm asking a question.
"God": Who is this creature?
Kirk: Who am I? Don't you know? Aren't you God?
Sybok: He has his doubts.
"God": You doubt me?
Kirk: I seek proof.
McCoy: Jim! You don't ask the Almighty for his ID

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OfflineDazzz
Lost in crazytown
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Registered: 11/18/17
Posts: 515
Last seen: 6 years, 2 months
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: Tiberjuggaligger]
    #24802027 - 11/23/17 11:04 AM (6 years, 4 months ago)

Boy oh boy...now thats big pharmaceutical politics playing dirty pool...like it was the first time his parents gave it to him...and four days later..yeah right, parents must feel so bad, it aint right to pin this on them, or on mj...that said, dont give edibles to a baby....seriously man

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Invisiblephishphan2088
Gentile Larry David
Male User Gallery


Registered: 07/30/15
Posts: 352
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: Dazzz]
    #24812166 - 11/28/17 03:28 PM (6 years, 3 months ago)

I am so upset with the media right now. Print, tv, internet, radio, they're all the same. They just want the most views, hits, likes etc. Others said it. The kid had a bad heart. Is it a good idea to give an infant with a bad heart high doses of cannabis? My common sense says no but it hardly seems like a "pot OD" to me. Correlation does not equal causation. SMH


--------------------
sucking at something is the first step in being kinda good at something

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OfflineDazzz
Lost in crazytown
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Registered: 11/18/17
Posts: 515
Last seen: 6 years, 2 months
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: phishphan2088]
    #24813146 - 11/28/17 09:50 PM (6 years, 3 months ago)

I mean if we go down the rabbit hole, an infant cant handle the head trip and anxiety..panic out and heart attack...but that isnt what happened, it was inflamation..allergic reaction maybe...congestive heart failure due to excessive histamine production...leading to mucous membranes producing fluid...I dunno man, thats my only arguement...I love mary jane, but I know how she treats me sometimes....a massive dose, of real high end thc gummies..im tip toeing here...tryin to stay pro mj..always...jus not for babies man, wtf

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OfflineKonyap

Registered: 06/30/07
Posts: 33,945
Loc: Planet Piss
Last seen: 4 years, 4 months
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: Dazzz]
    #24813622 - 11/29/17 04:41 AM (6 years, 3 months ago)

the baby never ingested thc
they said the death of the baby was ASSOCIATED with thc because there was thc candy in the house
they never actually found thc in the baby
the media just ran the article

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Invisibledurian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant
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Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 17,593
Loc: Raccoon City
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: Konyap]
    #24813849 - 11/29/17 08:28 AM (6 years, 3 months ago)

“The only thing that we found was marijuana. High concentrations of marijuana in his blood. And that’s the only thing we found,” Hoyte said.

These are objective, apolitical things, to say, if they are true. It's clinical, it's documentation; the examiners are not shaming, panicking, or pressuring you, per se.

:shrug:

So, assuming that Nappe and Hoyte are credible and sincere, you would have depressed the respiration of a weak person, already having breathing difficulties.

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Invisiblebadchad
Mad Scientist

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 13,377
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: Konyap]
    #24813868 - 11/29/17 08:38 AM (6 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Konyap said:
the baby never ingested thc

they never actually found thc in the baby





Yes they did. They tested and found THC in the child.


--------------------
...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge.  It is an indellible experience; it is forever known.  I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did.

Smith, P.  Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27.

...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely.

Osmond, H.  Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436

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OfflineKonyap

Registered: 06/30/07
Posts: 33,945
Loc: Planet Piss
Last seen: 4 years, 4 months
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: badchad]
    #24814205 - 11/29/17 11:07 AM (6 years, 3 months ago)

http://theantimedia.org/mainstream-media-marijuana-killing-baby/

(ANTIMEDIA) —This week the news cycle was flooded with mainstream headlines suggesting doctors were claiming have discovered the first marijuana overdose.

“Doctors claim baby’s 2015 death was caused by marijuana overdose,” a Fox News headline claimed.

“Baby boy is first marijuana overdose death, doctors claim,” wrote AOL and the New York Daily News.

Local Colorado NBC affiliate 9 News headlined their article “Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death.”

Except that wasn’t what the doctors who investigated the baby’s death said in their report.

According to the doctors, the baby had been lethargic and retching in the days leading up to his hospitalization. An autopsy found the baby had myocarditis, a condition that inflames the heart muscles and causes them to stop working.

The doctors did acknowledge the presence of cannabis in the baby’s system. “The presence of THC metabolites in the patient’s urine and serum, most likely secondary to ingestion, is the only uncovered risk factor in the etiology for his myocarditis,” they wrote.

They even documented the link between cannabis and the condition in other research:

“The link between cannabis use and myocarditis has been documented in multiple teenagers and young adults.”

Further, they urged research into the potential relationship, saying “we believe there exists a plausible relationship that justifies further research into cannabis-associated cardiotoxicity and related practice adjustments.”

Nevertheless, they also cautioned that there were limitations in their report, citing “the case study design, the limitations on interpreting an exact time, dose and route of cannabis exposure, the specificity of histopathology being used to classify etiology of myocarditis, and inconsistent blood culture results.”

In their discussion, they carefully explained that “As of this writing, this is the first reported pediatric death associated with cannabis exposure.” In other words, there was correlation – not causation. They did not conclude cannabis caused the death, though media outlets reported they had.

As those headlines emerged, one of the doctors spoke out to clarify.

“We are absolutely not saying that marijuana killed that child,” said Thomas Nappe, one of the co-authors.
Nappe is currently the director of medical toxicology at St. Luke’s University Health Network in Bethlehem, Pa, and is listed as affiliated with Denver Health and Hospital Authority’s Rocky Mountain Poison and Drug Center in the report. Christopher O. Hoyte of University of Colorado School of Medicine at Anschutz Medical Center, who also authored the report, was reportedly unavailable for an interview, according to the Washington Post.

According to the Post, “Nappe emphasized that the word ‘associated’ should not be interpreted as indicating a cause and effect.”

Even if cannabis did cause the death, explained Keith Humphreys, an addiction specialist and professor of psychiatry at Stanford University, it would be “a very unusual event.” He said cannabis poses “virtually no risk.”

Even so, the doctors were clear that more research is needed and cautioned parents to keep cannabis away from children.

“In states where cannabis is legalized, it is important that physicians not only counsel parents on preventing exposure to cannabis, but to also consider cannabis toxicity in unexplained pediatric myocarditis and cardiac deaths as a basis for urine drug screening in this setting.”

Based on media reports, Noah Kaufman, a Northern Colorado emergency room physician, disapproved of claims that cannabis caused the overdose.

“You just can’t make those statements because then what happens is lay people say, ‘Oh my God, did you hear a kid died from marijuana poisoning?’ and it can be sensationalized. It’s not based on reality. It’s based on somebody kind of jumping the gun and making a conclusion, and scientifically you can’t do that.”

Upon hearing the doctors hadn’t made those certain claims, he said “that’s more responsible,” those his previous assessment of jumping the gun do still apply to the media outlets that incorrectly covered the story.

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Invisiblebadchad
Mad Scientist

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 13,377
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: Konyap]
    #24814232 - 11/29/17 11:18 AM (6 years, 3 months ago)

Yes. As you acknowledge by the source you posted, the baby in fact, ingested THC.

Quote:

Konyap said:

The doctors did acknowledge the presence of cannabis in the baby’s system. “The presence of THC metabolites in the patient’s urine and serum, most likely secondary to ingestion, is the only uncovered risk factor in the etiology for his myocarditis,” they wrote.





--------------------
...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge.  It is an indellible experience; it is forever known.  I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did.

Smith, P.  Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27.

...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely.

Osmond, H.  Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436

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Invisibledurian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant
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Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 17,593
Loc: Raccoon City
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: badchad]
    #24814290 - 11/29/17 11:39 AM (6 years, 3 months ago)

There are two persistent talking points --
Reefer madness
Plant material can only be harmless

What's wrong with saying it does have nameable effects and taking direct, personal responsibility for those.

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Offlinerickpsfuckyou
listening to Mozzy
Male


Registered: 11/26/05
Posts: 1,860
Last seen: 2 years, 6 months
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: durian_2008]
    #24833575 - 12/08/17 08:44 AM (6 years, 3 months ago)

it was the vaccines they failed to mention, not the weed.


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Invisibledurian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant
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Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 17,593
Loc: Raccoon City
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: rickpsfuckyou]
    #24834503 - 12/08/17 06:03 PM (6 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

rickpsfuckyou said:
it was the vaccines they failed to mention




This is one of the many innocent questions, I have asked in public schools, and was treated like I was trying to trick the (biology) teacher.



:whistling:

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Offlinemusiclover420
psychonaut
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Registered: 11/06/12
Posts: 19,563
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: durian_2008]
    #24834511 - 12/08/17 06:08 PM (6 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

durian_2008 said:
Quote:

rickpsfuckyou said:
it was the vaccines they failed to mention




This is one of the many innocent questions, I have asked in public schools, and was treated like I was trying to trick the (biology) teacher.



:whistling:




I think I read that book.

But yeah vaccines are a hot topic, I have sort of mixed views on them. Clearly they are very important in some cases but I also think people overlook some factors.

I have heard some sketchy stuff about additives to vaccines, some of which is probably BS but I also doubt all vaccines contain the same stuff aside from the obvious different viruses used to develop the immunity.

It also seems like not everyone would react the same even with identical vaccines just due to various personal factors such as regular immunity and overall health.

It doesn't help that there is a lot of misinformation being spread around.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free


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Invisibledurian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant
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Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 17,593
Loc: Raccoon City
Re: Colorado doctors claim first marijuana overdose death [Re: musiclover420] * 1
    #24834569 - 12/08/17 06:35 PM (6 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

I think I read that book.



He gets in trouble for objective morality, imo.

We were told that science did not have an accurate picture what is alive.

I asked, how do you know whether it is dead or weakened.

By the fact that it resulted in immune response and not disease.

This implies that test cases became ill, until the critical threshold was established.

Outbreaks are reported to occur, under "charitable" conditions.

Further, it is not beneficial to provoke systemic, immune responses to other antigens, for instance peanut-based adjuvants or bee venom.

"Itis", as in myocarditis, is an inflammation, and marijuana might be seen as an anti-inflammatory.  It's possible that the state-accredited coroner or subsidized media has a political bias.

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