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Offlineflickedbic
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Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom
    #24624707 - 09/12/17 11:34 PM (9 days, 1 hour ago)

This is like a bad movie...

Some are speculating he aspirated powder on an improper Toss and Wash technique, the pulmonary edema caused by coughing.  I also read somewhere his blood levels show his dosing was way off the charts.



http://www.adirondackdailyenterprise.com/news/local-news/2017/09/coroner-kratom-overdose-killed-tupper-lake-police-sergeant/

Quote:

Sep 12, 2017

TUPPER LAKE — After a month-long investigation, the coroner’s official cause of death for Tupper Lake police Sgt. Matthew Dana has been ruled as an overdose of kratom.

Toxicology reports, received Friday, took longer than usual due to how uncommon it is to test for the plant from southeast Asia, according to Franklin County Coroner Shawn Stuart. After consulting with local medical examiner Dr. C. Francis Varga, Stuart ruled Tuesday that the manner of death was accidental, meaning Dana did not intend to overdose.

Dana died on the evening of Sunday, Aug. 6, at the Tupper Lake home he shared with his girlfriend.

Formally, Stuart said the cause of death was a hemorrhagic pulmonary edema — blood in the lungs — as a result of an overdose of mitragynine, the active chemical in kratom.

“I think we always assumed that kratom played a role,” Stuart said. “That was the only substance found at the scene.”

Toxicology tests came back negative for narcotics and opioids, the other drugs that were screened for, and Stuart said Dana was otherwise in remarkably good health.

“The only thing wrong with the guy was [a hemorrhagic] pulmonary edema,” Stuart said, “and the only thing in his system was this crazy amount of kratom.”

The report revealed Dana had 3,500 nanograms per milliliter of mitragynine in his blood, according to Stuart, who said that is nearly five times as much as in other people whose deaths involved kratom. The federal Drug Enforcement Agency reported last year that it is aware of 15 kratom-related deaths in the U.S. between 2014 and 2016.

Nationwide, kratom’s many defenders say it has never killed anyone and that those deaths were largely due to other factors.

Kratom is a controversial plant from southeast Asia which has been banned by several countries but remains legal in most U.S. states, including New York. It was traditionally used for pain relief, to heal wounds, to treat digestive ailments and to stimulate energy. It is also used today as a recreational drug, a bodybuilding tool and a way to stop dependency on prescription narcotics or heroin.

Questions still remain, including why Dana took kratom.

Stuart said that when he and Varga finish the written coroner’s report, it will be available to the public.

At the state police Troop B barracks in Ray Brook Tuesday, Senior Investigator Marshall Rocque said only that they would use the coroner’s report in their ongoing investigation.

Village police Chief Eric Proulx, who hired and promoted Dana on the village squad, did not respond to a request for comment.

Dana was a graduate of Tupper Lake High School in the Class of 2008, North Country Community College in the Class of 2010 and the State University of New York at Canton in the Class of 2012. He entered the Tupper Lake Police Department as a part-time officer in 2012, then full-time in 2013 after he finished the police academy. He was promoted to sergeant in 2016. Colleagues remembered him actively pursuing narcotics investigations with a strong desire to alleviate Tupper Lake’s drug problem. He sat on the Franklin County narcotics task force and performed undercover operations. He was remembered as being hard-working and well-liked by co-workers and the public.




Edited by Mostly_Harmless (09/13/17 02:56 AM)


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Offlinechibiabos
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: flickedbic]
    #24624748 - 09/13/17 12:01 AM (9 days, 52 minutes ago)

I don't know much about kratom.  I've never heard of a kratom overdose though.  :shrug:

That being said, expect a ban soon because blue lives matter and stuff.


Edited by chibiabos (09/13/17 12:04 AM)


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Invisibletdubz
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: flickedbic]
    #24624880 - 09/13/17 01:23 AM (8 days, 23 hours ago)

I dont think its possible to overdose on kratom and if it is it would have to be a rediculous amount. Kratom does not cause respotory depression to the cns like traditional opioids. He either choked, it was adultrated, or something else.


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Offlineniteman

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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: flickedbic]
    #24624962 - 09/13/17 02:06 AM (8 days, 22 hours ago)

Buy your Kratom now! It really sucks this happened I never say never but honestly doesn't even seem like od seems like you said he choked or aspirated which honestly is a shitty way to die.


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Offlineperikleous
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: niteman] * 1
    #24625167 - 09/13/17 04:09 AM (8 days, 20 hours ago)

this is like saying my beer bottle broke, cut me and I bled to death, is it an alcohol related death?

I will rephrase it, I drank from a cracked beer bottle, the glass did internal damage, is this a alcohol related death?


Edited by perikleous (09/13/17 04:12 AM)


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OfflineTheHunt
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: perikleous]
    #24625254 - 09/13/17 05:47 AM (8 days, 19 hours ago)

Sort of what I was thinking. It's because he inhaled Kratom a bit evertime he would dose. And eventually bled his lungs.


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InvisibleAmanita86
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: TheHunt]
    #24625257 - 09/13/17 05:50 AM (8 days, 19 hours ago)

:nojustno:


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InvisibleMush 4 Brains
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: Amanita86] * 1
    #24625312 - 09/13/17 07:13 AM (8 days, 17 hours ago)


“The only thing wrong with the guy was [a hemorrhagic] pulmonary edema,” Stuart said, “and the only thing in his system was this crazy amount of kratom.”

The report revealed Dana had 3,500 nanograms per milliliter of mitragynine in his blood, according to Stuart, who said that is nearly five times as much as in other people whose deaths involved kratom. The federal Drug Enforcement Agency reported last year that it is aware of 15 kratom-related deaths in the U.S. between 2014 and 2016."


My bullshit senses are tingling! A "crazy amount of kratom in his system?" What kind of fucking description of measurement is that?! Lol there was this guy I knew who died after smoking a whole fuck ton of marijuanas.

They get particular with nanograms of mitragynine in his blood as if that means a God damn thing to anyone but hell it sounds scientific and 3,500 is kind of a big number right? So I got to thinking and decided to look up the LD50 of mitragynine.

This is what I found from scientific american
Quote:



Overdosing and drug mixing aside, is kratom dangerous?

People are afraid of opioid analgesics because they can lead to respiratory depression [difficulty breathing]. When you overdose on these drugs, your respiratory rate drops to zero. In animal studies where rats were given mitragynine, those rats had no respiratory depression. This opens the possibility of someday developing a pain medication as effective as morphine but without the risk of accidentally overdosing and dying.





So how exactly did this guy die?...because it most certainly wasn't from an overdose.

They also mention that it was "5 times as much as found in other people who's deaths INVOLVED kratom." And again, another point that means fuck all. These deaths they speak of "involved" kratom. Very tricky wording there. If I were to die after drinking 2 shots of vodka and swallowing a couple fist fulls of oxy, you could say my death involved alcohol.


"Questions still remain, including why Dana took kratom"

Oh I don't know, probably for similar reasons as to why big pharma is interested in kratom, because it's a safe effective opiate like pain killer with limited risk of addiction/dependence.

The man probably had aches and pains from years of working the physically demanding job of police officer and was intelligent enough to research/seek out a very safe, practical substance to manage his pain.

Now they're gonna paint him as some sort of closeted troubled deviant.

And many people will buy into all this bullshit because drugs are icky bad and so are the people who use them after all.


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InvisibleAmanita86
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: Mush 4 Brains]
    #24625319 - 09/13/17 07:24 AM (8 days, 17 hours ago)

“I think we always assumed that kratom played a role,” Stuart said. “That was the only substance found at the scene".

Even in this bullshit statement nobody is willing to say that kratom was at fault because their accusation could easily be anhillated as the bullshit it is.  All they have is the power of suggestion in order to fish people's attentions who have ZERO knowledge of this plant so as to implant negative opinions and demonize the evil weed.  Same ol shit dog, just a different day.


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OfflineKryptos
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: Mush 4 Brains]
    #24625364 - 09/13/17 08:22 AM (8 days, 16 hours ago)

[Edited due to bad math, oops, maybe I'll retype this later]


Edited by Kryptos (09/13/17 08:44 AM)


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OfflineMorel Guy
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: Kryptos]
    #24625388 - 09/13/17 08:40 AM (8 days, 16 hours ago)

Lol at controversial plant.

Plants don't create controversy, humans do. 

How much did he take?  Most I Did was 40 00' caps.  Waste of kratom.


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OfflineKryptos
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: Morel Guy]
    #24625395 - 09/13/17 08:43 AM (8 days, 16 hours ago)

Assuming no weird body chemistry interactions that may have amplified the dose by some weird mechanism, it seems like he took a *WHOLE* lot more than 40 00' caps. According to the coroner report, he had about 17.5mg of active ingredient in his body alone.


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Offlinedurian_2008
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: Kryptos]
    #24625406 - 09/13/17 08:57 AM (8 days, 15 hours ago)

Pulmonary edema
https://medlineplus.gov/ency/article/000140.htm

There's a guilty line of discussion, where people question whether they have made themselves ill, or were they covering undiagnosed health problems.


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InvisibleCookieCrumbsM
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: Kryptos]
    #24625717 - 09/13/17 11:49 AM (8 days, 13 hours ago)

Quote:

perikleous said:
this is like saying my beer bottle broke, cut me and I bled to death, is it an alcohol related death?

I will rephrase it, I drank from a cracked beer bottle, the glass did internal damage, is this a alcohol related death?





Well they tried to tell us heroin and gay sex gives you AIDS so why not?

Only difference in your example is that alcohol has monster companies and hundreds of millions in the public, and billions world wide, that are willing to defend it.

It's always easy to pick on the little guys.
Quote:

Kryptos said:
Assuming no weird body chemistry interactions that may have amplified the dose by some weird mechanism, it seems like he took a *WHOLE* lot more than 40 00' caps. According to the coroner report, he had about 17.5mg of active ingredient in his body alone.




The pub had this same article and their math said it was something like 1.5 grams of kratom powder.


It isn't clear from the article whether he was taking powder or extracts or even drinking tea. Seems like another half assed autopsy and shitty propaganda.


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Offlinesunshine
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: durian_2008]
    #24625724 - 09/13/17 11:52 AM (8 days, 13 hours ago)

Kratom must be very good.  I found a bunch of really interesting herbs over a two year span of testing, which was extremely dangerous.  I no longer test new herbs.


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Offlinelifeiswhatyoumake
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: chibiabos]
    #24625747 - 09/13/17 11:59 AM (8 days, 12 hours ago)

Quote:

chibiabos said:
I don't know much about kratom.  I've never heard of a kratom overdose though.  :shrug:

That being said, expect a ban soon because blue lives matter and stuff.






You've never heard of some one throwing up from kratom or being too high and getting a headache?
It's very easy to overdose on kratom, but it's super hard to die from an overdose.


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InvisibleCookieCrumbsM
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: sunshine] * 3
    #24625764 - 09/13/17 12:06 PM (8 days, 12 hours ago)

Herbs unfortunately have the same kind of false ideal that pharmaceutical drugs do: they must be safe because they're tested and legalized, they must be safe because they're just plants and our ancestors used plants.


Nothing is safe. I wouldn't be surprised if kratom played a role in the officer's death. Which would probably be because he either used it improperly, the product was laced with something else, or he had an underlying medical condition. Or perhaps a combination of all 3. Sadly we and his grieving family are likely to never know because we've enabled medical officials to say "because drugs" and end their job there.


Saying the drug is relatively safe when used properly is very different from saying its harmless.
Water is harmless. Water molecules can't kill anyone. Yet people drown in it all the time. People are allergic to it. People have died from drinking too much of it. That may not be a typical definition of OD but it was still using too much and I personally can't believe that some amount (comparatively large amount probably) of kratom can't be fatal, even in healthy individuals.

Though I can't imagine how much that may be. For some people, unhealthy people, it may not be much at all.


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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: CookieCrumbs]
    #24625899 - 09/13/17 12:53 PM (8 days, 12 hours ago)

I believe it can be potent, at times, and is prone to abuse.

Noone else has reported water and blood on the lungs, of which I am aware, although I am skeptical of shoddy extractions, because the solvents are dangerous.

Sometimes, the side effects of herbs are easily traceable to additives, on a chemical safety sheet.

I don't know the reason for this, but believe it is possible to find out.

If the coroner feels differently, why should he be a coroner. Sorry, not sorry. In memory, you  are throwing one of your own people, under the bus, to make a political statement, as best I can tell.


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: chibiabos]
    #24626189 - 09/13/17 02:39 PM (8 days, 10 hours ago)

Quote:

chibiabos said:
I don't know much about kratom.  I've never heard of a kratom overdose though.  :shrug:

That being said, expect a ban soon because blue lives matter and stuff.




They already tried banning it on a nation wide scale and in many states, most attempts were thwarted by the many people who rely on kratom to function healthily.

I don't think this will make a ban any more likely unless more details come out. But I imagine more details will show kratom was not directly responsible so who knows if they will bother investigating further.


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Offlinetoday mylove
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Re: Narcotics Sergeant Dies from Kratom [Re: musiclover420]
    #24626803 - 09/13/17 06:24 PM (8 days, 6 hours ago)

Maybe he was using super potent extracts or something  :justdontknow:


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