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Offlineesin
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Registered: 11/21/01
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Baking soda - casing PH buffer?
    #2419178 - 03/11/04 03:01 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Right now where i live i can't find any vermiculite for casings but i am having good results with straight peat moss.

As a calcium source i've been using the main "bone" of a sea molusc,  Sepia Esculenta  (i don't know its name in english, but it somewhat resembles a squid). These bones are used in birdcages, so that birds eat it for a source of calcium.
My problem is that these "bones" get very expensive if you use them as peat PH buffer.

I can't find any limestone around. Nor Calcium carbonate powder (only C.C. pills)
Hydrated lime only in very large amounts - not practical at all.

My question is can i use Sodium Bicarbonate to buffer my casings' PH?
We all know it is basic, but do you see any reason for it not to work properly?
Has anyone tried it?

I made a search about this topic but found nothing conclusive.

Well, thanks for your help :smile:!


Edited by esin (03/11/04 03:56 PM)


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: esin]
    #2419344 - 03/11/04 03:37 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Don't know about the baking soda, but a quick search will pull up mail order sources of lime serving nearly every country, in the $.5-$1 per pound price range. Have you considered ordering it?


--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

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OfflineBenFungTorez
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Registered: 04/06/03
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: esin]
    #2419386 - 03/11/04 03:46 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

one of my friends was having problems locating lime or calcium carbonate too...all he was left with was baking soda to adjust the pH of his peat moss.

So....round 1, a complete disaster, just added a random aount of BS, casing did not colinize at all. Guess it was way too basic.

Round 2/3. Got some litmus paper and added tiny bits of of BS while monitoring the pH. So far things seem to be working much better. The myc is loving the straight peat (which he wa a little worried about).

Lesson learned....always check the pH of your casing material and dispite what people say BS seems to work fine if you are careful!

good luck. BFT


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OfflinePooPs
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: BenFungTorez]
    #2419468 - 03/11/04 04:00 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I've found a cheap source of crushed oyster shells in town, seems to work very well so far !

Got oysters in your parts of the world?


--------------------


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Offlineragadinks
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: esin]
    #2419698 - 03/11/04 04:55 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Have you ever tried crushed egg shells ?


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Offlineesin
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: mycofile]
    #2419839 - 03/11/04 05:41 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Thank you all for your answers  :laugh:.

I will look into ordering lime for the future. May be the most practical option.

Will buy some litmus paper, or tournesol tincture, and use Sodium Bicarb in the next casings, carefully measuring PH. If results are good i'll stick to that.

Nopes, no oyster shells at convenient prices here in Portugal (at least that i know of).

As for the egg shells, yes i tried them, but found very little diference in colonization time when using just peat with no PH buffer. And got 2 casings contam'ed with green mold after 2nd flush (no way to be sure if it was because the eggs or not but i don't think the benefit compensates the risk).

If i have success with pure Sodium Bicarbonate, i'll post my results in the Mushroom Cult. forum.

Thanks once again!  :sun:


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Offlinefrock
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: esin]
    #2420618 - 03/11/04 09:36 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Any Petstore should carry calcium carbonate. Used for reptile suppliment. Some contain other stuff to so check for just plain calcium.


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Offlinedrewcifer
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: esin]
    #2423087 - 03/12/04 10:58 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

pool/spa supply stores have calcium carbonate, its labeled "PH +" usually, problem is is that is comes in big ass bags.


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InvisiblePinhead
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: drewcifer]
    #2423737 - 03/12/04 01:44 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Calcium carbonate is common chalk.Buying a box of chalk will only set you back about $1.00


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Invisiblebathrobe
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Registered: 02/07/04
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: Pinhead]
    #2425323 - 03/12/04 10:11 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

buy sidewalk chalk since the dustless chalkboard chalk has some additives that will bungle everything up.


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Offlinecrippledavenger
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: esin]
    #2438639 - 03/16/04 11:31 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Could someone please please please tell me why everyone is so obsessed about all this PH buffering stuff. Why don't you just go and by some peat compost for house plants which is already adjusted to be about ph 6.5 to7. Neutral in other words. I keep on hearing about oyster shells, chalk, God knows what else. I mean do you like making life difficult for yourself, what is the deal, am I missing something here? Gees.


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OfflinePooPs
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: crippledavenger]
    #2442327 - 03/17/04 09:18 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

crippledavenger said:
Could someone please please please tell me why everyone is so obsessed about all this PH buffering stuff. Why don't you just go and by some peat compost for house plants which is already adjusted to be about ph 6.5 to7. Neutral in other words. I keep on hearing about oyster shells, chalk, God knows what else. I mean do you like making life difficult for yourself, what is the deal, am I missing something here? Gees.




That's fine for the initial ph.. as the casing flushes i beleive the ph will drift and ph Buffer keeps it in relative check . !


--------------------


-----------
Sniff, Sniff... What's that smell???... ohhhhh.!!
------------------


Pot Free for another : nevermind.. never made it..


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Offlinecrippledavenger
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: PooPs]
    #2442474 - 03/17/04 10:06 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I apologize for the tone of my last post but I am very lazy and hate spending money so the idea of searching for difficult to find ingredients and paying for them is what I hate. Not to mention working out the correct amounts. I can guarantee you that peat based compost for plants(Not peat on its own) that you find everywhere, is adjusted to neutral Ph. (have checked makers) Raw pure peat needs a buffer of lime or calcium base, as mentioned.

the problem is though possibly fertilisers in the compost which will not affect the mushroom but might be bad for you. This might be overcome by soaking the compost in plenty of water before sterilisation or getting hold of peat based compost designed for cuttings which has no fertiliser added

I am doing some experiments with peat which are quite promising, will post results when I get them.


Also as someone mentioned already, don't use baking soda, it's a salt.

Compost is designed to maintain its P. H. over many months, much longer than even many flushes.



Edited by crippledavenger (03/17/04 12:16 PM)


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: crippledavenger]
    #2442503 - 03/17/04 10:15 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

An initial ph of 7.5-9 is what you want to shoot for with casings. Peat is too acidic and will favor contamination unless you lime it.


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OfflineAkrobatik
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: crippledavenger]
    #2442908 - 03/17/04 12:45 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

You want the peat to be slightly basic since mushroom mycelium produce acids that can lower the PH by almost 2 points by the 2nd or 3rd flush, which will promote contaminate growth.


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Offlinefresh313
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: Akrobatik]
    #2446438 - 03/18/04 10:01 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

you should be able to find hydrated lime at any lowes, home depot, garden store, etc.. hoffmans is a good brand.


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Offlinekohsamui
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: esin]
    #2452002 - 03/19/04 05:30 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Sodium Bicarbonate when used as a buffer causes a small amount of trouble and could cause a big one. Na (Sodium) radicals can combine with the H2O2 and produce NaOH which is not a nice thing to feed the myco. I would stick to lime flour, crushed egg shells or if you are deparate go to the rock sales people and get some crushed limestone rock and use the dust from that. IMHO


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OfflineMikeOLogical
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: esin]
    #2452756 - 03/19/04 09:38 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

you can mail order vermiculite from uline, they sell it as a packing material... www.uline.com


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We got Nothing!
we're no longer selling jars.  :laugh:


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OfflineMikeOLogical
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: esin]
    #2452767 - 03/19/04 09:41 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

http://www.uline.com/AdvSearchResult.asp...p;Method=BROWSE
this link goes straight to vermiculite...


--------------------
We got Nothing!
we're no longer selling jars.  :laugh:


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Invisiblemycofile
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Re: Baking soda - casing PH buffer? [Re: MikeOLogical]
    #2458414 - 03/21/04 10:01 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Or buy horticultural verm from places like this:
http://homeharvest.com/soilamendmentsperlitevermiculite.htm
They also have lime:
http://homeharvest.com/soilconditionerspH.htm
don't get the dolomitic, it has too much magnessium


--------------------
"From a certain point of view"
-Jedi Master Obi Wan Kenobi

PM me with any cultivation questions.

I just looked at my profile and realized I had a website at one point in time on geocities, it's not there anymore and I have no idea what I had on it. Anybody remember my website from several years aga? PM if so please.


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