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 redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,169
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 Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues.  [Re: viktor]
#24113447 - 02/23/17 12:33 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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My ego is tangled up in
1. my sore shoulder.
2. worrying about a leather jacket I paid for that is stuck in customs.
3. Sudly spreading fake news about the sympathetic nervous system.
4. everything else.
I took some eth-lad but I don't expect miracles
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The Blind Ass
Bodhi
Registered: 08/16/16
Posts: 27,619
Loc: The Primordial Mind
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: redgreenvines]
#24113449 - 02/23/17 12:34 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps
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 RJ Tubs 202
Registered: 09/20/08
Posts: 6,175
Loc: USA 
Last seen: 5 days, 15 hours
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: redgreenvines]
#24114967 - 02/23/17 11:51 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
redgreenvines said:
My ego is tangled up in
........
3. Sudly spreading fake news about the sympathetic nervous system.
With all due respect, that is funny as hell.
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sudly
Quasar Praiser
Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 11,369
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: redgreenvines] 1
#24114992 - 02/24/17 12:04 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
3. Sudly spreading fake news about the sympathetic nervous system.
Psilocybin is a substance with sympathomimetic effects.
Quote:
Behavioural effects are dependent on dose and the individual reaction and sensitivity to psilocybin, previous experiences and the setting. The major effects are related to the central nervous system, but there are also some sympathomimetic effects.
http://www.emcdda.europa.eu/publications/drug-profiles/mushrooms
Another reference:
Quote:
Characteristic autonomic effects of the neurovegetative system that were notable for the whole animal excitatory syndrome caused by the central stimulation of the sympathetic nervous system.
http://www.maps.org/research-archive/w3pb/2002/2002_Passie_22704_1.pdf
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I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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The Blind Ass
Bodhi
Registered: 08/16/16
Posts: 27,619
Loc: The Primordial Mind
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: dankcake]
#24115151 - 02/24/17 02:17 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
dankcake said:
Hello All,
I'll make this as condensed and specific as possible, and thanks to those who spend the time to read it. Here's a little bit of what I'm going through:
I learned about ego, before I was introduced to psychedelic drugs. Basically, I would say it was from a string of things that just never worked out for me, despite my competence, over my whole 20's. Things like career, relationships, friends, and hobbies. 4 Relationships that I thought would end in marriage, 12 jobs ranging from working in a sewer to travelling around for a corporation, 3 "waves" of life long friends that I completely had to distance myself from and start a social life over, Tons of hobbies that snowballed and ended up financially and emotionally draining me. You get the picture.
I became the king of transference. When one thing didnt work out, I would hop to the next. Didn't matter if I knew how to do it or not. People stated me as the "most random" person they've ever met, that was "pissing away his potential" because of my lack of commitment to one thing. Really, life was just handing me a shit sandwich, and I was desperately looking for something to value myself on.
Well, one day after many of the problems I had, I was unknowingly looking for something to transfer to. I felt like I had to do something, but had already done everything, and the only stuff I had left was getting more far fetched. I was running ridiculous things through my mind about what I was going to do with my life, and just thought, "What the hell am i thinking to even consider that? This is the most outlandish bullshit ever." Which led to, "Why do I even feel like I have to do something?"
Hence my first time of ego awareness. I wanted the validation from what I was doing, not to even do it. I began thinking, "People all have their own standards, and things they do that they use to value themselves against. HOLY SHIT THE WORLD IS CONSUMED BY IT." I didn't even know the word ego yet. At that point, I just wanted to remove myself from that game I had been playing, and everyone had been playing that I was so aware of.
So, what do I do in attempts to remove myself from these types of game. I do nothing, I literally just try to lay on the floor and be happy, and not compete in any form of ego type validation. I tried to mediate, and clear my thoughts which was going very good. I did this for almost a whole day, until I became hungry. When faced with the decision to eat or not to eat, I realized the calories I consumed would affect my physical appearance, and health. Which in turn, affected how people viewed me. So, I was forced into a position to have to compete in this standard/game/ego validation just to survive as a human.
It blew my mind how it was everywhere, and how I couldn't get away from it. I've since done my best to internalize this concept of ego, learn about it, and honestly that is what led me to psychedelics. They seemed to be the people talking about it the most. I read a ton on it.
I've only done a handful of 2 to 3 gram trips, but I'm wondering if there's just something I dont understand. Maybe I need to blast off into a 5g trip. From what I've been through, the more you kill your ego, the more you kill your "self". The more you are just being, accepting, synchronicity, observing things as just the way they are. It's empowering in a way to feel alive in the world during a moment, and to be able to do whatever you want to do. But that key word "want" seems to always be in your ego.
It pisses me off anytime I hear someone say the word purpose in the same sentence as ego. Is there motivation and purpose without an ego other than just being? It seems like every thing you read on ego is to help people find their purpose. Yes, destroying your ego will help you step away from the bad of your ego, and really that seems like the only time people want to do it. When the ego hurts. I know the ego can control you, and make you do a lot of things you dont want to do. So, my questions are pretty simple.
Is the purpose of ego death to help you not be controlled by your ego? Hence, letting you decide what you want to take from it?
Or is the purpose of ego death to find your purpose with no ego at all?
Hence, you have a purpose past the ego.
Beautiful that you have found yourself in the position you find yourself. Its rare I see someone come back from behind so far and land where you are.
My response to your question would be...
find out for yourself, experientially.
This is the duty of a monk, to not deceive oneself and to finally settle the great matter and live compassionately in peace with virtuous living in equanimous contemplation via meditation, bliss of non action.
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Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps
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redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,169
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: sudly]
#24115213 - 02/24/17 03:14 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
sudly said:
Quote:
3. Sudly spreading fake news about the sympathetic nervous system.
Psilocybin is a substance with sympathomimetic effects.
I don't deny that some speedy effects also come with psychedelics, it helps to dance, and if you don't move at all you may feel squirmy, but the sympathomimetic aspect is not the main thing, as your quote illustrates, please put it to bed.
It is not a huge scientific revelation to share, and is seldom relevant to the topic.
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sudly
Quasar Praiser
Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 11,369
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: redgreenvines]
#24115235 - 02/24/17 03:55 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Salt isn't the main part of a potato chip but it makes a pretty big difference to the experience.
And it's not just 'speedy' effects, it's stimulation that over time leads to inhibition. E.g. After working out(stimulating), your muscles become tired for a while(inhibited).
The sympathomimetic thing is an effect psilocybin has on the human nervous system.
Quote:
central stimulation of the sympathetic nervous system.
All I've done is stated the characteristics of a substance called psilocybin, and heck this is the shroomery so it should be common knowledge.
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I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,169
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: sudly] 1
#24115285 - 02/24/17 05:12 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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so, for some reason you don't think lysergic acid has any sympathomimetic effects? even cannibis will cause some gut accelleration and drying of mouth.
Sudly;
this is your ego issue, you know a very little about physiology but you fell compelled, for some reason, to smear that little knowledge everywhere you go.
ego is like that - it goes back to dogs pissing on trees and rocks, like goofballs spraying their self-referential tags on buildings that have exposure to their passage.
Everyone is a victim of this behavior.
All I ask is you stick to the topic and refrain from spam spraying every thread with the same half baked pseudo science.
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sudly
Quasar Praiser
Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 11,369
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: redgreenvines]
#24115314 - 02/24/17 05:41 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I don't know why you think I think the things you say I do..
Quote:
In a controlled clinical setting, LSD can be used safely, but it produces significant sympathomimetic stimulation.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25575620
Even so I go to psilocybin because it's a substance that has been widely available to mankind for thousands of years.
I'm starting to think you're a bit of a half baked potato.
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I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
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Mental Slavery
Eternally Confused
Registered: 08/03/14
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: dankcake]
#24117721 - 02/25/17 01:00 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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The ego cannot kill itself
The momentum of thought is playing a trick on itself by saying that it is killing the ego when that which is killing the ego is still ego
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Rhizoid
carbon unit
Registered: 01/22/00
Posts: 1,739
Loc: Europe
Last seen: 2 months, 5 days
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: Mental Slavery]
#24119329 - 02/25/17 05:28 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
Mental Slavery said:
The ego cannot kill itself
The momentum of thought is playing a trick on itself by saying that it is killing the ego when that which is killing the ego is still ego
Another perspective is that the ego never really gets killed, this is just one of the false perceptions that consciousness has about ego before the two are dissociated.
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The Blind Ass
Bodhi
Registered: 08/16/16
Posts: 27,619
Loc: The Primordial Mind
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: Rhizoid]
#24119343 - 02/25/17 05:37 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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no agent or actor exists that can set itself up for dissolution/ego loss.
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder
Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
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 Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: dankcake]
#24119463 - 02/25/17 06:31 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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READ The Master Game by Robert de Ropp.
This book has been VERY influential in my life and the life of my best friend (since the age of 30 months). Here is a synopsis that begins with: "We all ask, at one time or another, "What do I want to do with my life?" https://www.livereal.com/spiritual_arena/spiritual_members/master_game.htm
https://www.amazon.com/Master-Game-Beyond-Drug-Experience/dp/B0007I0F3C/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1488072456&sr=8-3&keywords=the+master+game
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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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laughingdog
Stranger
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,830
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
#24127653 - 03/01/17 01:57 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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one might say 'ego' is the sense of being in control of one's actions
or
being the author of one's actions
this the normal sate of affairs,
and behind this feeling is the notion that one is a unified, stable, entity.
(BUT sometimes one surprises 'one's self', perhaps when talking fast, or feeling spontaneous, and one doesn't know where a response came from...)
The ego death sort of thing is when the inner workings of 'the self', conflicts, subpersonalities, & unconscious processes, etc start to become revealed in consciousness and the illusion of a unified, stable, entity is no longer sustainable. The truth that "one's own" activity is actually impersonal as is the rest of the activity of the universe then becomes obvious.
No ego actually dies as it always was only a mirage sort of "thing"/process/illusion.
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RJ Tubs 202
Registered: 09/20/08
Posts: 6,175
Loc: USA
Last seen: 5 days, 15 hours
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: dankcake]
#24132598 - 03/03/17 12:17 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
dankcake said:
It seems like every thing you read on ego is to help people find their purpose.
Much of what I read is how ego can contribute to suffering.
Not that ego is "bad" or to be destroyed. It serves a function.
Take a person who murders someone who offends them.
Now THAT is ego, and how, if unseen, can cause misery.
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laughingdog
Stranger
Registered: 03/14/04
Posts: 4,830
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: RJ Tubs 202] 1
#24133553 - 03/03/17 12:14 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Perhaps this approach is a helpful way to look at the idea.
in order for an individual to function in a group
it must have data on it's relation to it's neighbors,
(and any environmental landmarks, sun's position, magnetic fields, etc.)
so it may also have some data on the group as a whole,
so some distinction is made between self and other,
(in order to do this, a module models itself,
in it's own virtual world).
this would seem to be true whether we talk about:
schools of fish, flocks of birds, (& other migrating species), people, or self driving cars;
so yes a positive function is performed.
But as the non human examples show
the layers of identification humans addon to this (tracking & positioning) function,
in the way of
preferences, fears, conditioning, beliefs, etc.,
are superfluous to the original function;
and in fact tend to ignore the primary importance
of both
the group
and
terrain / environment
and
interrelatedness of all these factors as a unified field.
hence a distortion occurs,
and one might say:
self importance is greatly exaggerated as a result
with the consequence that
suffering is also greatly exaggerated
Edited by laughingdog (03/03/17 12:19 PM)
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RJ Tubs 202
Registered: 09/20/08
Posts: 6,175
Loc: USA
Last seen: 5 days, 15 hours
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: laughingdog]
#24137583 - 03/05/17 01:00 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I like those points. I agree. We absolutely need a concept of self to survive.
Much (all?) of survival is comparison and evaluation of others (and the environment).
Where to set up camp, who's a potential threat, what territory to defend, what mate to pursue . . .
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redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,169
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
#24137899 - 03/05/17 06:29 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
RJ Tubs 202 said:
Quote:
dankcake said:
It seems like every thing you read on ego is to help people find their purpose.
Much of what I read is how ego can contribute to suffering.
Not that ego is "bad" or to be destroyed. It serves a function.
Take a person who murders someone who offends them.
Now THAT is ego, and how, if unseen, can cause misery.
poor example of what is ego, only an example of crime and unexamined irritation.
To get a better sense of ego, think of an actor in a play imagining that he has been given the wrong script, or that other players are doing their parts incorrectly since things are not working out as he imagined they should. He is not sure but everything points to this knowledge, and he is determined to get to the bottom of it, after he finishes this scene.
All the extra wrong headed mental content that circles back to how the self looks (shame), how the situation is undeserved (envy), and how others are wrong (ignorance) boils down into ego, but it is not a thing at all, just the total of all moments spent in wasted thoughts about the self being short changed. It is also related to some magical thinking circling around being able to radically change the script, other actors, the scene, and even the whole play from what is going on.
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remake
Registered: 01/05/16
Posts: 4,213
Loc: South Africa 
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: redgreenvines]
#24138000 - 03/05/17 07:37 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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The problem does not come in with changing the "script".
There is no script.
The "ego's" ultimate incarnation is judgement and thinking for others. The ego does not exist in other's or ourselves. We create it.
To get from point A to point B, for whatever reason, is not supposed to matter.
In discussing ourselves we always fall into hypocrisy.
Once again. The life of judgement is the greatest pitfall of mankind. What you see before you, is all that there is. Where you go next, requires physical input.
Conflict always arises from the mind and from misinterpretation. Our suffering is created by ourselves, and is very real. Desire to "power" or "superiority" is the ultimate superficially constructed mental sphere in which humans find themselves in, and the greatest cause of suffering.
We do not want to impose or live under "power". We want to be free from it in both instances.
This is possible.
"Others" are ourselves in different situations. However, we think these situations as rigid and unable to change.
The situation can in fact be changed at anytime, based on the "way" we think, not "what" we think.
An ideal landscape for progress, I imagine, would be one where we are able to disassociate ideas from our bodies.
Currently we are telling each other what we "are", and where we "are going". Instead of thinking and acting for ourselves based on a peaceful agreement.
We are living in a sea of ideas. And violent ones for that matter. Thus these violent ideas keep on manifesting all over the world.
People are really suffering. None of this suffering means anything. And ultimately has no reason.
Edited by remake (03/05/17 08:16 AM)
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redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,169
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Re: New to the forum! Someone line me out on my ego issues. [Re: remake]
#24138048 - 03/05/17 08:15 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I was just using the actor and script as an analogy to help show that ego is not actually a thing at all but a self-referential flaw in perception and behavior.
it is a construct to point at - a grab bag - like the devil symbolizing evil - which is another grab bag for error.
the actor metaphor is apt because ego is tied to personality, mask, and rehearsed behavior. but it is not what ego is, which is a thing that is no thing at all. just a bag for a bunch of stuff that we can feel guilty and or ashamed about.
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