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OfflineOliverJames
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Registered: 02/28/12
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Dogs
    #24105584 - 02/20/17 02:12 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I've always wondered how a dog search would go down. So lets say your pulled over and they suspect you got something, so they bring out the dogs. How accurate are these dogs? Like they do just march them around the car, and if they signal, they take everything out of the car? Or do they actually bring the dogs into the car to try to locate the exact location? I remember seeing some dude last year who literally removed part of his seat to put stuff inside it lol. Even if he got out of the car, I'd find it hard to believe they would actually dismantle the car. Like yea, they might search your baggage, but do they actually rip the car apart?

Feel like this is becoming more and more of a common occurrence as festivals grow in popularity

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InvisiblePatrickKn
I'm a teapot

Registered: 07/10/11
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Re: Dogs [Re: OliverJames]
    #24106661 - 02/20/17 09:01 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I was pulled over a few years ago, officer swore up and down that she smelled marijuana in the car. I had never once smoked in the car, I hadn't smoked for like 6 months at this point anyway. She had a drug dog come up, which took like 45 damn minutes. The dog did it's thing, signaled that I had something in the car pretty much right away, and the cops spent the next 30 minutes searching my car... they obviously didn't find shit.

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OfflineOliverJames
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Re: Dogs [Re: PatrickKn]
    #24106830 - 02/20/17 10:06 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Thats fucked

so basically the dog isnt accurate enough to pin-point exactly where youd have something? I've actually heard theyre usually for show, and that they make them signal whether theres something or not

I just find it hard to believe theyd bust someone u can basically hide it anywhere. From what Ive gathered, if your stealthy enough, even a dog search wont yield anything

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Invisibletdubz
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Re: Dogs [Re: OliverJames]
    #24108278 - 02/21/17 01:15 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

The police know how to make k9 false alert if they really wanted to which would be sorta illegal but not really. First, the officer determines if there is probable cause to bring a K9, if the officer already smells something than he/she will just start searching right then and there. With a K9 alert they can go through your entire vehicle and they usually are not very nice about it if they have suspicion you might be trafficking.

Never give consent to search ever. Unless you know for sure the officer wont find something, a dog probably will.

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InvisibleByrain

Registered: 01/07/10
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Re: Dogs [Re: OliverJames]
    #24109647 - 02/21/17 10:19 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

While in theory the dog could be fairly accurate, but for the dog the main goal is pleasing its handler and for the cop the main goal is busting someone... It should be easy to see the conflict of interest.

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OfflineOliverJames
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Re: Dogs [Re: tdubz]
    #24110176 - 02/22/17 07:04 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

tdubz said:
The police know how to make k9 false alert if they really wanted to which would be sorta illegal but not really. First, the officer determines if there is probable cause to bring a K9, if the officer already smells something than he/she will just start searching right then and there. With a K9 alert they can go through your entire vehicle and they usually are not very nice about it if they have suspicion you might be trafficking.

Never give consent to search ever. Unless you know for sure the officer wont find something, a dog probably will.




This is what I'm getting at

From the stories I've heard, if you refuse to give consent, you greatly raise suspicion and also enrage the cop. This almost always results in a K9 unit being brought in, as opposed to the cop possibly carrying out a routine search on his own.

While refusing to give consent provides you some legal safety, accepting the search may decrease the chances of them finding something because they'll be less suspicious and carry out a less throughout search. So if you've got something but its hidden extremely well, wouldn't it be more advantageous to just let them search the car?

Most of the K9 bust stories on here were from people who had shit in easy to find places, trunk, glovebox, random bag in back seat, etc. It never sounds like the dog is used to pinpoint exactly where your heading something. So if you got a super stealthy spot, wouldn't you be okay?

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Invisibletdubz
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Re: Dogs [Re: OliverJames]
    #24110319 - 02/22/17 08:21 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Yeah maybe, Don't count on them stopping the search too soon if the dog alerts because they know if it's for real or when its not (by their doing) but of course you do not. Also, where you are stopped makes a big difference like on the highway vs the city and by what kind of police...State Trooper or City PD. If you think it's well hidden best to let the officer search an then you can terminate the search at any time if you feel like it is taking too long (assuming you gave consent and the cop did not start searching on his own because he saw or smelt something) If you got a lot of weight and know you are screwed it's probably best to let the dog come as there are various legalities that can be used against the state in court. (meaning do not give consent)

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Invisiblevandago
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Re: Dogs [Re: tdubz]
    #24114303 - 02/23/17 06:52 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

You don't have to give consent, anything past the point of "do you have any weapons?" is harassment.  Get a gopro, or record on your phone. https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=org.aclu.mobile.justice.ca&hl=en if you live in california.


If you have priors there's not much you can do because a prior is reasonable cause from what I am told. I'm no lawyer.

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Invisibletdubz
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Re: Dogs [Re: vandago]
    #24114645 - 02/23/17 09:07 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I don't think priors can give probable cause only if you are on probation or on parole at the time, then they can search you whenever. Not sure on this one either though you would needa ask a state lawyer wherever you are from.

Edited by tdubz (02/23/17 10:43 PM)

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OfflineKryptos
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Re: Dogs [Re: Byrain]
    #24117511 - 02/24/17 10:25 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Byrain said:
While in theory the dog could be fairly accurate, but for the dog the main goal is pleasing its handler and for the cop the main goal is busting someone... It should be easy to see the conflict of interest.




Also in theory, IA should be tracking false positives and retiring dogs that hit a certain percentage.

I have little faith in IA.

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Invisibletdubz
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Re: Dogs [Re: Kryptos]
    #24117620 - 02/24/17 11:43 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

That is something a lawyer brings up during a possible illegal search.

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OfflineAlan RockefellerM
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Re: Dogs [Re: tdubz]
    #24118461 - 02/25/17 09:58 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

tdubz said:
First, the officer determines if there is probable cause to bring a K9





The standard of evidence required to bring a dog is reasonable suspicion, not probable cause.  If it was probable cause, it would be much harder to involve a dog in routine stops.


Regarding the question in the OP, the dogs do pinpoint the location of illegal substances in the car, they paw and point at it.

It is also very common for the dog to say there is nothing in the car, and for the officer to lie and say the dog smelled something.  This is called a false alert.  When you make it to court, you will have an expert testifying that it was a false alert, and the police will call an expert to testify that the dog did really alert.  Since dogs can't talk, the whole thing is a bit ridiculous.


The police sometimes take cars apart, but not always.  It would be best to keep anything illegal in a place that requires more than just a screwdriver to disassemble.

While it is possible to challenge dog searches in court, in practice it is pretty hard.  They mostly exist to take away your fourth amendment rights - but they also can locate contraband.

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