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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Registered: 10/10/02
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Why is it...
    #2409396 - 03/08/04 11:00 PM (20 years, 25 days ago)

That America has the highest homocide rate of any country not currently engaged in a civil war? Some say it's guns, some say it's the media, some say it's lack of prayer in schools, and some say it's the ethnic diversity. How would you explain America's violent tendencies?


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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InvisibletrendalM Happy Birthday!
J♠
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Registered: 04/17/01
Posts: 20,815
Loc: Ontario, Canada Flag
Re: Why is it... [Re: silversoul7]
    #2409413 - 03/08/04 11:07 PM (20 years, 25 days ago)

Some say it's guns
Despite common opinion...Canada has many guns, too.

some say it's the media
Most of our media is copied from America anyway...

some say it's lack of prayer in schools
Canada is among the least religious countries in the world, according to recent surveys...

and some say it's the ethnic diversity
Our government uses the term "multicultural melting pot"...

I don't know why America has so many homicides...but it can't be any of these things alone if we in Canada share all these attributes yet have such a lower homicide rate.


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Invisibledaussaulit
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Registered: 08/06/02
Posts: 2,894
Loc: Earth
Re: Why is it... [Re: trendal]
    #2409424 - 03/08/04 11:10 PM (20 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

trendal said:
Some say it's guns
Despite common opinion...Canada has many guns, too.



But why are there so many more gun deaths in the US than in Canada?

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Anonymous

Re: Why is it... [Re: silversoul7]
    #2409427 - 03/08/04 11:11 PM (20 years, 25 days ago)

Map & Graph: Crime: Top 100 Murders (per capita)


Country Description
1. Colombia 0.65 per 1000 people
2. South Africa 0.5 per 1000 people
3. Jamaica 0.33 per 1000 people
4. Venezuela 0.33 per 1000 people
5. Russia 0.2 per 1000 people
6. Mexico 0.13 per 1000 people
7. Lithuania 0.1 per 1000 people
8. Estonia 0.1 per 1000 people
9. Latvia 0.1 per 1000 people
10. Belarus 0.1 per 1000 people
11. Ukraine 0.09 per 1000 people
12. Papua New Guinea 0.09 per 1000 people
13. Kyrgyzstan 0.09 per 1000 people
14. Thailand 0.08 per 1000 people
15. Zimbabwe 0.08 per 1000 people
16. Zambia 0.08 per 1000 people
17. Moldova 0.08 per 1000 people
18. Seychelles 0.07 per 1000 people
19. Costa Rica 0.06 per 1000 people
20. Poland 0.06 per 1000 people
21. Georgia 0.05 per 1000 people
22. Uruguay 0.05 per 1000 people
23. United States 0.05 per 1000 people

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_mur_cap

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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: Why is it... [Re: ]
    #2409432 - 03/08/04 11:13 PM (20 years, 25 days ago)

Ok, maybe I'm thinking of "violent crime" rate rather than "homocide," but the question still stands.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Anonymous

Re: Why is it... [Re: silversoul7]
    #2409467 - 03/08/04 11:23 PM (20 years, 25 days ago)

we've got a whole lot of urban poor who never learned how to behave.

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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: Why is it... [Re: ]
    #2409534 - 03/08/04 11:41 PM (20 years, 25 days ago)

But why have they "never learned how to behave"? We certainly aren't the only nation with a lot of urban poor.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Anonymous

Re: Why is it... [Re: silversoul7]
    #2409588 - 03/08/04 11:51 PM (20 years, 25 days ago)

i think it's a problem with the culture of america's poor.

there are a lot of contributing factors. single-parent homes, illicit drug trade, poverty, lack of effective deterrents.

it is definitely a problem of the urban poor. if you look at the crime rate amongst white america, it's comparible to europe.

it's not directly motivated by poverty either. most violent crimes are not commited for economic gain. poverty is only a secondary cause.

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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: Why is it... [Re: ]
    #2409620 - 03/08/04 11:59 PM (20 years, 25 days ago)

You bring up the drug trade, and I think there might definitely be something there. Gangs would probably be a lot less powerful if they didn't have the illicit drug trade to fund them. As for lack of effective deterrents, I don't know about that. The U.S. is the only first-world nation to still use the death penalty.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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Anonymous

Re: Why is it... [Re: silversoul7]
    #2409653 - 03/09/04 12:09 AM (20 years, 25 days ago)

prison sentences for violent crimes are unacceptably short. i'm certainly not saying that this is the only cause, or even the main one, but it definitely factors in.

the average time served for murder is 10 and a half years. it's 5 and a half for rape, three and a half for robbery, and 2 for assault. that's just not enough.

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/html/cjusew96/ts.htm

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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: Why is it... [Re: ]
    #2409680 - 03/09/04 12:17 AM (20 years, 25 days ago)

Ok, in that case, I agree. We do need to extend the length of these sentences. Of course, one of the reasons that they get such small sentences is because of prison overcrowding due to all the drug offenders coming in. When you look at it, it's amazing how so many problems are connected to the Drug War.


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"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire

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InvisibleLoki
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Registered: 02/10/04
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Re: Why is it... [Re: silversoul7]
    #2410082 - 03/09/04 04:59 AM (20 years, 24 days ago)

My thought is that it's guns.
Without guns, homocide becomes a little harder.

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OfflineGazzBut
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Registered: 10/15/02
Posts: 4,773
Loc: London UK
Last seen: 2 months, 24 days
Re: Why is it... [Re: ]
    #2410125 - 03/09/04 05:50 AM (20 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

we've got a whole lot of urban poor who never learned how to behave.





The system creates a whole lot of urban poor. Without them, it just wouldnt work properly. Of course those who have nothing are more likely to be involved in violent crimes born of frustration and desperation.


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Always Smi2le

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OfflineGazzBut
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Posts: 4,773
Loc: London UK
Last seen: 2 months, 24 days
Re: Why is it... [Re: GazzBut]
    #2410126 - 03/09/04 05:51 AM (20 years, 24 days ago)

Its also fairly obvious that the general attitude towards firearms and the love of cowboy films also has a large part to play in the level of violent crimes in the US.  :smirk:


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Always Smi2le

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Anonymous

Re: Why is it... [Re: Loki]
    #2410158 - 03/09/04 06:19 AM (20 years, 24 days ago)

My thought is that it's guns.

there are countries with less legal gun ownership, or none at all, than america, with higher crimes rates. there are others with more guns and significantly lower crime rates. it's easy to blame guns but that just isn't the problem.

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Anonymous

Re: Why is it... [Re: silversoul7]
    #2410159 - 03/09/04 06:23 AM (20 years, 24 days ago)

because americans are fat,
stupid, lazy, hateful, and ignorant.

we gorge ourselves on mcdonalds
and think we're the baddest shit
out there when most of us are
dumb as hell.

yeah, something like that.

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Anonymous

Re: Why is it... [Re: GazzBut]
    #2410165 - 03/09/04 06:28 AM (20 years, 24 days ago)

The system creates a whole lot of urban poor. Without them, it just wouldnt work properly.

what system?

Of course those who have nothing are more likely to be involved in violent crimes born of frustration and desperation.

most violent crimes are not for financial gain. most assaults and murders are set in motion by arguments (which are often drug related). the US is up there in the world's per capita rape rate too, and i never heard of anyone raping for money. poverty is a secondary cause. poverty in america breeds crime when people are brought up in shitty environments by shitty parents, not because people are out there stealing to eat.

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Anonymous

Re: Why is it... [Re: GazzBut]
    #2410166 - 03/09/04 06:30 AM (20 years, 24 days ago)

Its also fairly obvious that the general attitude towards firearms and the love of cowboy films also has a large part to play in the level of violent crimes in the US.

that attitude being what?

if you insert the words, "amongst black youth" after "towards firearms" and replace "cowboy films" with "gangster rap" the statement would be a little more accurate.

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OfflineHagbardCeline
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Registered: 05/10/03
Posts: 10,028
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Re: Why is it... [Re: Loki]
    #2410196 - 03/09/04 06:55 AM (20 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

My thought is that it's guns.





Well, at least your half right. But it isn't because there are too many, but too few.

States that have adopted concealed carry license programs, have drastically lowered violent crime.

This doesn't address the root cause of course, but does provide aid in confronting it.


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I keep it real because I think it is important that a highly esteemed individual such as myself keep it real lest they experience the dreaded spontaneous non-existance of no longer keeping it real. - Hagbard Celine

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InvisibleEvolving
Resident Cynic

Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
Re: Why is it... [Re: ]
    #2410729 - 03/09/04 10:43 AM (20 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

GazzBut said:
The system creates...



Quote:

mushmaster said:
what system?



The welfare plantation/family destruction/vote buying system coupled with the drug war/legislated morality/criminal employment system. To sum it up, TOO MUCH FUCKING GOVERNMENT.


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To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.'  Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence.  Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains.  Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.

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