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TameMe
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Registered: 10/24/05
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On income inequality and moral efficacy
#24094151 - 02/15/17 11:05 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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City in the Sky episode: 'Airborne', on PBS, ended with the moral reflection.... "We take flying for granted." AS IF aviation was such a miraculous invention for us to suddenly be spoiled by. NO! We still take basic plumbing for granted....which is older tech by 1,000s od years...jus flushing our shit away. Somehow, we expect it all to work withought harm or care as long as it means we are keeping poop out of sight and out of mind. And symolteaously keeping mouth water clean.
Plumbers and all oher technicians (in medicine or other utilities/public works that society at large depend on) should be the new standard of a basic 'quality of life'/base income measure. They should earn no less than median wage across all sampling of income and wealth distributions.
If our most vital jobs can't earn a base median income; than society's income and wages will continue to be flawed and out of natural equilibrium. Disequlibrium will ultimately doom all.
This is my thesis. I hope to never have to prove it becuase, I too, am an ungrateful sloth (more importantly: unable & uneilling to prove it)..... just like the rest of you. We all are ignorant bastards paying slave wages for our western amenities....through our use and implied acceptance of the US Dollar.
Edited by TameMe (02/15/17 11:07 PM)
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Crave
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Re: On income inequality and moral efficacy [Re: TameMe]
#24094367 - 02/16/17 02:45 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Another good example:
Cooking. One of the worst jobs in existence it's demeaning and pays low, there is a head cook usually called a sous. He makes a little more and no one else makes much, including that guy. A dishwasher is another loser that isn't even skilled enough to work with a knife or work on a stove.
1000 years ago a person would've begged to be in a situation where he could be around food all day and cook without stopping. It would've been a dream. It would've represented technology beyond ones wildest dreams to be that lucky to have such wealth and enjoy such amenities.
In today's world it's a symbol of a loser who has no ambition in life. A guy who can't get his shit together who just barely brushes by and might even sell drugs on the side to even comprehend expecting to live on that money.
We could go on about this all day. Employment that would've been on a level of skill beyond your wildest comparisons prior in history that today represents you being an outdated tool who can't climb the ladder to gain a little extra respect.
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blingbling
what you chicken stew?
Registered: 09/04/10
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Re: On income inequality and moral efficacy [Re: Crave]
#24094393 - 02/16/17 03:14 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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The reason these jobs pay less can be explained with simple supply and demand economics. There is a greater supply of plumbers and dishwashers than doctors and engineers because the latter professions require substantially more training. If there was a greater supply of doctors and engineers than they would be earning the same as plumbers or dishwashers. If you don't believe me do a google search on doctors pay in cuba. Because of the free education there they have so many doctors that many people who are trained as doctors give up the job for more lucrative jobs, like trading in plumbing supplies which the government has made illegal (the cuban government has enshrined in law that it will fix all housing problems, so fixing these things yourself there is actually against the law which drives up the prices of illegal plumbing supplies).
Crave, I really like your point about what we value now as compared to the past. We live better than the kings of the past, and yet it still feels empty in some strange way. I think simple acts like cooking used to be related to a higher reality and that this bestowed meaning on even these simple tasks such that life was considered totally fulfilling even to the most wretched. I think that in material terms we have gained substantially, but spiritually we are in decline and that these two things are related. We gave up cosmic meaning for economic advancement.
-------------------- Kupo said: let's fuel the robots with psilocybin. cez said: everyone should smoke dmt for religion. dustinthewind13 said: euthanasia and prostitution should be legal and located in the same building. White Beard said: if you see the buddha on the road, rape him, then kill him. then rape him again.
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zzripz
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Re: On income inequality and moral efficacy [Re: TameMe]
#24094407 - 02/16/17 03:26 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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the way we live is not really sustainable and is an enormous waste of energy. Take flushing our sht. It is a big waste of water. The more intelligent way to deal with sht so that it enriches the environment sustainably is compost toilets
Compost Toilets
EVERYone should have a basic income to live:
Finland has become the first country in Europe to pay its unemployed citizens an unconditional monthly sum, in a social experiment that will be watched around the world amid gathering interest in the idea of a universal basic income.
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Re: On income inequality and moral efficacy [Re: TameMe]
#24094519 - 02/16/17 05:01 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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When your mom's basement floods and it's Sunday and the plumber won't come out for 15 bucks an hour, because it's super bowl, what then?
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,060
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Re: On income inequality and moral efficacy [Re: LunarEclipse]
#24094626 - 02/16/17 06:47 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I like the water theme that is emerging in different threads today
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LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
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Re: On income inequality and moral efficacy [Re: redgreenvines]
#24094665 - 02/16/17 07:18 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
redgreenvines said: I like the water theme that is emerging in different threads today
Rain
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
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Crave
Stranger
Registered: 12/04/16
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Re: On income inequality and moral efficacy [Re: blingbling]
#24094693 - 02/16/17 07:34 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
blingbling said: The reason these jobs pay less can be explained with simple supply and demand economics. There is a greater supply of plumbers and dishwashers than doctors and engineers because the latter professions require substantially more training. If there was a greater supply of doctors and engineers than they would be earning the same as plumbers or dishwashers. If you don't believe me do a google search on doctors pay in cuba. Because of the free education there they have so many doctors that many people who are trained as doctors give up the job for more lucrative jobs, like trading in plumbing supplies which the government has made illegal (the cuban government has enshrined in law that it will fix all housing problems, so fixing these things yourself there is actually against the law which drives up the prices of illegal plumbing supplies).
Crave, I really like your point about what we value now as compared to the past. We live better than the kings of the past, and yet it still feels empty in some strange way. I think simple acts like cooking used to be related to a higher reality and that this bestowed meaning on even these simple tasks such that life was considered totally fulfilling even to the most wretched. I think that in material terms we have gained substantially, but spiritually we are in decline and that these two things are related. We gave up cosmic meaning for economic advancement.
That is interesting because they just made a community college free in San Fransisco recently. I wonder how that will effect the economy.
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blingbling
what you chicken stew?
Registered: 09/04/10
Posts: 2,987
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
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Re: On income inequality and moral efficacy [Re: Crave]
#24103480 - 02/19/17 06:16 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I thinking that as long as the government does not outlaw people fixing their own toilets it should be a boost to the economy.
-------------------- Kupo said: let's fuel the robots with psilocybin. cez said: everyone should smoke dmt for religion. dustinthewind13 said: euthanasia and prostitution should be legal and located in the same building. White Beard said: if you see the buddha on the road, rape him, then kill him. then rape him again.
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DieCommie
Registered: 12/11/03
Posts: 29,258
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Re: On income inequality and moral efficacy [Re: blingbling]
#24103834 - 02/19/17 08:00 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Greateter supply of plumbers to engineers? I never heard that one before. I guess ive always been a relatively low level engineer... but we look to the trades with envey for their jobs available, benefits and pay.
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Brian Jones
Club 27
Registered: 12/18/12
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Re: On income inequality and moral efficacy [Re: LunarEclipse]
#24107244 - 02/21/17 02:36 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
LunarEclipse said: When your mom's basement floods and it's Sunday and the plumber won't come out for 15 bucks an hour, because it's super bowl, what then?
If you live in a city between Chicago and Boston you pay 40 something an hour any day of the week, probably a base service call plus the hourly. During the Superbowl forget about it. Where I live an 18 or 19 year old plumber's helper/ apprentice makes 20 something an hour. You must live somewhere with a very low wage standard.
Also can somebody explain the term "moral efficacy" to me. I define the words to be more or less opposites.
-------------------- "The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body" John Lennon I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either. The worst thing about corruption is that it works so well,
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