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voodoochild1000
psychonautic



Registered: 02/04/15
Posts: 2,531
Loc: Cascades!
Last seen: 8 months, 16 days
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Munchauzen said:
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grow4fun said:
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voodoochild1000 said:
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Explicitdetail said:

Nice pinset!
I've been having problems with my pin set. I wonder if I'm misting too much? When do you start misting and how often do you mist?
Some have said they don't start misting or even open the lid until they see pins popping?
Everything seemed great until it was time for pens to sat then I got a lot of side pins and overall a pretty so soap and set and I'm concerned about my other shoe boxes doing the same. Don't need to mist before pinning as long as your substrate was prep'd proper, provide good FA and daylight and they should pin like that. Also comes down to genetics too.
I thought once it was fully colonised your supposed to create the little beads of moisture with misting and allow them to evaporate and then repeat to trigger pinning.
Are you saying the substrate usually does this on its own as long as it's at field capacity?
I have a bunch of shoeboxes going roght now and I was planning to start misting once the sub fully colonized to maintain the beads of moisture/evaporation, so this Wld be good to know. Provide fresh air, daylight helps too, no need to mist, should be enough moisture to last till 2nd flush. See the droplets of water on the top of the lid? it does that shit for you. keep it simple.
this is just bad advice. the droplets on the lid do absolutely nothing. there are zero mushrooms growing on the lid.
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Tormato said:
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flyhighfunguy said: Is the mycelium supposed to start beading with moisture as soon as it pops through the surface or does it take a little time? Because i know for a fact that my sub was hydrated properly but from what i can see the small spots of myc popping through right now dont have any droplets on them. The side of the sub/tub is building a ton of condensation tho. Its been 2 days since spawn.
I usually wait until the surface is 100% colonized before I start misting...uncolonized sub can get contaminated easily.
if you use CVG, that is not the case. uncolonized CVG will not contaminate. I've let hydrated cvg sit in tubs and buckets for months and never once has it turned, and I've never read anything to the contrary.
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grow4fun said:
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flyhighfunguy said: Idk this is confusing me too. I'm pretty sure your first idea is right. Up until now I've always thought that there should always be beads of moisture on the surface when waiting for pins and all the way up until harvest. I thought that you usually needed to mist to achieve this, unless you have a completely perfectly dialed in monotub or something
There should always be moisture on the surface.
Dood look on the ceiling of your lid, there should be a lot of condensation built on it from the substrate, the condensation will drop back onto the sub without needing to mist, hence why tubs are maintenance free, misting is only needed if there's a lack of moisture.
I would not hang my hat on this. Definitely mist. If you rely on condensation droplets, you have no control on the level of hydration. Did the droplets hydrate the surface enough or too much? Or what if somebody changes the thermostat, now the condensation is gone.
You're suggesting a lazy, half assed approach as a replacement for something that takes like 5 seconds. Thats just bad advice, dood.
Ok....i look at these surface conditions and think...."I need to mist!" Would u agree?
-------------------- ....."So Great!"....-Me on 1.5mg LSD ...."We don't need this" -Larkin in response to my "just picked wild LSD!" post
Edited by voodoochild1000 (03/27/18 06:57 PM)
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Shrooms4life
TrippyShaman



Registered: 06/08/17
Posts: 1,375
Loc: Under the Viel
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Munchauzen said:
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Shrooms4life said: Grow4 is was not your verm, tap water, or coir that came from the spawn brother it happens, chalk it up and move on to the next agar plate.
There are tons of hidden contams that can look like mycelium or hitch a ride on it so even if it looks amazing on agar doesn't mean its 100%.
Anyways here is my best shoebox to date! Spawned on the 19th and just started pinning yesterday, I'm hoping it still fills out even more (gotta zoom in to see the baby pins)

CVG is never the reason for contams - it simply doesn't harbor it. They won't germinate on CVG even if it sits hydrated in a bucket for 6 months with opening it up a bunch of times. I've done this for years, cooking 8 coir bricks at a time. My tub stays full for months sometimes.

@shrooms4life Your shoebox looks perfect! Great job on that, hope you have a solid yield.
Dude thanks a lot, that shit really means a lot coming from you! I'm surprised in myself on this one because only 1:1 so I thought it might end up drying out faster then I could manage it but with the lid snapped and just misted once a day in the morning its been a Cake walk!! I've got 0 side pins in it with no liner and only a few small bottom pins.
@voodoo nooo no no man those tubs are all dark brown coir = its saturated, it will get super light brown/tan if its dried.
Edited by Shrooms4life (03/27/18 07:12 PM)
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voodoochild1000
psychonautic



Registered: 02/04/15
Posts: 2,531
Loc: Cascades!
Last seen: 8 months, 16 days
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Here's another other tub...last misted about 9 hours ago..  I look at this and think it needs a light misting. Is that accurate?... basically misting then checking it later and if the beads are gone I missed again. Should I wait a little longer between mistings? I'm so f****** sorry if this is redundant I just can't seem to get to the bottom of it and I don't know if I'm over missing and causing shity pin-sets because of it  Also it says I'm maxed out for my weekly limit for pictures now I can't even post more pics
-------------------- ....."So Great!"....-Me on 1.5mg LSD ...."We don't need this" -Larkin in response to my "just picked wild LSD!" post
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Munchauzen


Registered: 06/22/11
Posts: 14,342
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I did shoeboxes for 2 years before this thread got published, and every single one was 1:1 with just 1 quart spawn.
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Zero Nowhere
Beer Drinker



Registered: 01/29/18
Posts: 1,471
Loc: Standing on the moon
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Quote:
voodoochild1000 said: Here's another other tub...last misted about 9 hours ago..
I look at this and think it needs a light misting. Is that accurate?... basically misting then checking it later and if the beads are gone I missed again. Should I wait a little longer between mistings? I'm so f****** sorry if this is redundant I just can't seem to get to the bottom of it and I don't know if I'm over missing and causing shity pin-sets because of it
Also it says I'm maxed out for my weekly limit for pictures now I can't even post more pics
The best advice I've had lately was this" don't mist to often. Shrooms can handle water they thrive in rain. Don't use misting as your main means of hydration."
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Shrooms4life
TrippyShaman



Registered: 06/08/17
Posts: 1,375
Loc: Under the Viel
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Quote:
voodoochild1000 said: Here's another other tub...last misted about 9 hours ago..
I look at this and think it needs a light misting. Is that accurate?... basically misting then checking it later and if the beads are gone I missed again. Should I wait a little longer between mistings? I'm so f****** sorry if this is redundant I just can't seem to get to the bottom of it and I don't know if I'm over missing and causing shity pin-sets because of it
Also it says I'm maxed out for my weekly limit for pictures now I can't even post more pics
No man I wouldn't mist till tommrow, once your mycelium gets matted or overly dried/ wet it's super hard to maintain beads of moisture and you'll end up over saturating the sub and getting a bunch of small fruits.
@munch do you notice bigger yields from 2:2 cause I haven't really seen much difference :/ I normally net about an ounce dried first flush despite amount of spawn used in the smaller tubs.
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SloppyJoseph
Non-sporalator


Registered: 12/08/15
Posts: 8,511
Loc:
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Quote:
Shrooms4life said:
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voodoochild1000 said: Here's another other tub...last misted about 9 hours ago..
I look at this and think it needs a light misting. Is that accurate?... basically misting then checking it later and if the beads are gone I missed again. Should I wait a little longer between mistings? I'm so f****** sorry if this is redundant I just can't seem to get to the bottom of it and I don't know if I'm over missing and causing shity pin-sets because of it
Also it says I'm maxed out for my weekly limit for pictures now I can't even post more pics
No man I wouldn't mist till tommrow, once your mycelium gets matted or overly dried/ wet it's super hard to maintain beads of moisture and you'll end up over saturating the sub and getting a bunch of small fruits.
@munch do you notice bigger yields from 2:2 cause I haven't really seen much difference :/ I normally net about an ounce dried first flush despite amount of spawn used in the smaller tubs.
2:2 is 1:1... you will get bigger yields from 2 qts rather than 1.
-------------------- AMU Q&A
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Munchauzen


Registered: 06/22/11
Posts: 14,342
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Quote:
SloppyJoseph said:
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Shrooms4life said:
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voodoochild1000 said: Here's another other tub...last misted about 9 hours ago..
I look at this and think it needs a light misting. Is that accurate?... basically misting then checking it later and if the beads are gone I missed again. Should I wait a little longer between mistings? I'm so f****** sorry if this is redundant I just can't seem to get to the bottom of it and I don't know if I'm over missing and causing shity pin-sets because of it
Also it says I'm maxed out for my weekly limit for pictures now I can't even post more pics
No man I wouldn't mist till tommrow, once your mycelium gets matted or overly dried/ wet it's super hard to maintain beads of moisture and you'll end up over saturating the sub and getting a bunch of small fruits.
@munch do you notice bigger yields from 2:2 cause I haven't really seen much difference :/ I normally net about an ounce dried first flush despite amount of spawn used in the smaller tubs.
2:2 is 1:1... you will get bigger yields from 2 qts rather than 1.


amount of spawn = amount of yield. its a direct correlation. a shoebox with 2 quarts of spawn should have a much denser canopy than one with one quart of spawn. both can still achieve full canopies, just 2 will be a fuller 'forest' so to speak.
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wushroow


Registered: 02/03/17
Posts: 369
Last seen: 5 years, 7 months
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Quote:
Shrooms4life said: Grow4 is was not your verm, tap water, or coir that came from the spawn brother it happens, chalk it up and move on to the next agar plate.
There are tons of hidden contams that can look like mycelium or hitch a ride on it so even if it looks amazing on agar doesn't mean its 100%.
Anyways here is my best shoebox to date! Spawned on the 19th and just started pinning yesterday, I'm hoping it still fills out even more (gotta zoom in to see the baby pins)

Nice! Did you case this? Trying to decide if I should case
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Madcapper144
Drummer


Registered: 01/05/18
Posts: 266
Last seen: 6 months, 10 days
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Re: Making shoeboxes [Re: Enkidu]
#25095761 - 03/27/18 08:17 PM (5 years, 9 months ago) |
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New to shoeboxes and was wondering when is it a good time to put a dub tub on them? Originally I was just going to dub them when it got to 100% + a day or two but now I'm thinking I should leave the lid on till my pin set comes in?
-------------------- Buy the ticket, take the ride!!
 
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Munchauzen


Registered: 06/22/11
Posts: 14,342
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when the pins start growing. if you wait longer than that, the microcurrents inside the shoebox will make the fruits turn about. not that this affects yield, but if you want a pretty canopy with a bunch of straight upright mushrooms, then dub them early.
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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thanks munch! im tryin here. people want to dissect this shit like its crossing the alps.(i know i do)
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Shrooms4life
TrippyShaman



Registered: 06/08/17
Posts: 1,375
Loc: Under the Viel
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Re: Making shoeboxes [Re: wushroow]
#25095776 - 03/27/18 08:28 PM (5 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
wushroow said:
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Shrooms4life said: Grow4 is was not your verm, tap water, or coir that came from the spawn brother it happens, chalk it up and move on to the next agar plate.
There are tons of hidden contams that can look like mycelium or hitch a ride on it so even if it looks amazing on agar doesn't mean its 100%.
Anyways here is my best shoebox to date! Spawned on the 19th and just started pinning yesterday, I'm hoping it still fills out even more (gotta zoom in to see the baby pins)

Nice! Did you case this? Trying to decide if I should case 
I just did a psuedo casing at spawn and then flipped the lid at 30% top layer colonized.
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mushroomnate
Pstranger



Registered: 05/17/17
Posts: 3,100
Last seen: 2 days, 12 hours
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I was goin thru some old pics. Back when I was somewhat good at shoeboxes...
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grow4fun



Registered: 03/02/18
Posts: 171
Last seen: 2 years, 10 months
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Quote:
Munchauzen said:
I would not hang my hat on this. Definitely mist. If you rely on condensation droplets, you have no control on the level of hydration. Did the droplets hydrate the surface enough or too much? Or what if somebody changes the thermostat, now the condensation is gone.
You're suggesting a lazy, half assed approach as a replacement for something that takes like 5 seconds. Thats just bad advice, dood.
How is that bad advice though? The whole point of a tub is to set and forget it, what happened to that? I can go without misting it and provide great pinsets and flushes. Condensation around the inside walls and ceiling of the tub do provide droplets to the top of the substrate. No need to mist for a good pinset. It helps IF you know what you are doing, misting about wildly will just do nothing but fuck it up. If you provide the right conditions misting to create a good pinset is not necessary in some cases. Why spend 5 seconds when you can spend 0 seconds letting nature do the work for you? lol. But to say my advice is half assed and just plain bad advice isn't nice when it's a proven method. (maybe half assed cuz i keep things simple)
I only mist to replace moisture lost, and yes I'll mist during 1st flush if i feel like it. But to create a pinset it's not necessary at all, could cause more harm than good. But to each his own right?
Do you personally mist every single one of those shoeboxes individually to create a pinset? if you do then thats cool but im too busy/lazy to do all that work when the tub itself will do it for ya.
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Explicitdetail
Rickshaw Bandit



Registered: 02/03/17
Posts: 592
Loc: North of the Equator
Last seen: 1 month, 8 days
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Re: Making shoeboxes [Re: grow4fun]
#25095974 - 03/27/18 10:22 PM (5 years, 9 months ago) |
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Based off the two logs in your sig, maybe you should take some advice instead of acting like you know what your talking about. If your misting before first flush it means your sub was under capacity when you spawned it. Knowing when to mist comes with experience and being able to read what the surface is telling you.
-------------------- "Problems that remain persistently insoluble should always be suspected as questions asked in the wrong way."

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flyhighfunguy


Registered: 09/13/17
Posts: 1,550
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Munchauzen said:
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grow4fun said:
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mushboy said:

all i know is your pics look like some boxes i had that were literally buried in a closet. more air doesnt mean a fan. it means, flip the lid. or put inside a dialed in monotub. not blowing air on a tote
and proper light cycles 12/12 with a single 6500k cfl would work fine. but whatever you are doing isnt working so do the opposite.
thats what i do.
Yeah they are buried thats the problem, will fix it.
I just think a fan blowing into the closet might help giving FA, idk man, if I had space to grow anywhere else i would, got people coming and going. It's a heat hobby you know that. 
Did an edit you probably didn't see it. I had a GH with trays over a year ago, no fanning, same closet but without the shelves. They grew fat fruits but had a light cycle 12/12 like you are saying, not a 6500k however just a standard shitty lamp. I will keep the door open and blow indirect air into it. Those tubs are dubbed, no latch, easily slide off if moved. I'll post an update to see if these bastards bounce back.
I saw your subs. If you haven't removed the fan yet, it could very easily be the cause of your poor pinset. Your sub looks like it dried out quite a lot before the first flush, which would happen if you have a fan blowing on it.
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grow4fun said:
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Xerbia said: First shoebox, 13 days after spawning. Clone from pf tek cake on 1 qt grass seed spawned to 1 qt substrate consisting of coir/hpoo/verm/gypsum. Was a massive pinset, but a lot of aborts. Is it normal to have so many abort like that?

Could be too much condensation dropping on the pins, that causes aborts.
No, it doesn't. Mushrooms are ±90% water, water does not cause them to abort. People dunk PF-tek cakes covered in pins all the time, and they fruit fine.
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voodoochild1000 said:
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Psicomvb said: For me and my growing arrangement my success is pretty much all in getting the field capacity right, making it leveled all the way across, using a liner (cuz I'm a noob and they have saved my ass from side pins repeatedly), and leaving them totally alone unless they get reeeeeallllly dry. I'll sometimes flip the lid / dub depending on the situation, like with the APE it just felt right to do that early on in the pinning process, but for me it hadn't really mattered if I leave it on until they grow too tall and you gotta dub em. Sorry it's not much thorough info but my technique is mostly set and forget because I've realized they grow worse when I pay a lot of attention to them. I also do a 12/12 light cycle with a 6500k bulb but even that turns into 16/8 and 14/10 frequently.
Maybe I just need to f*** with s*** less and try eyeliner? I'm popping the lids and looking at the substrate multiple times a day and Miss Thing and you're saying you don't pop the lids until you actually see a bunch of pins popping up? I feel like I need to mist the substrate if it's not having any moisture on the surface?... my room is like 35% humidity and it seems to try things off relatively quickly. Should I just let my unpin boxes chill until they've got pins? I feel like the substrate need some moisture though
...awesome pics man!
It doesn't matter at all if you open them up. It was not the secret to homeboy's success. If you want to check out the surface conditions, go for it. It will not hurt it. If anything, it helps spot dry or contaminated subs before its too late.
To determine if you sub needs misting, reference this post https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/23999053/fpart/all/vc/1 You should maintain beads of moisture on the surface, and a properly dialed in FC will produce this naturally without misting. For shoeboxes, I currently fruit them two in a monotub with one layer of micropore tape, your mileage may very given local conditions.
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flyhighfunguy said: Do you guys have any preferred ways of harvesting shoeboxes? Is it usually pretty easy to just get in there with a knife and cut them out?
Put your hand on the substrate, turn it upside down, and slide the shoebox off the top. Then place the substrate on the bottom (now top) of the empty shoebox.

Alright thanks for the reply, thats what i was thinking at first. Ill make sure to mist if i feel there arent a lot of beads on top of the surface.
For harvesting, what if there is a full canopy? Can you still put your hand on top of the mushrooms and flip it upside down or would this crush the mushrooms?
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voodoochild1000
psychonautic



Registered: 02/04/15
Posts: 2,531
Loc: Cascades!
Last seen: 8 months, 16 days
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Man, I'm just having such a hard time knowing if I misting too much or not misting enough.
.. so much contradictory information out there. Everything from keeping a constant layer of water beads to misting and let evaporate then mist again to don't mist at all until the first flush is in.
Some say you need beads on there to promote pin formation and other say you need the water to evaporate off to cause the pins to form
The lack of a concrete step by step procedure is really causing a great deal of frustration and I'm having relatively shity pin sets.
Some say Even if you don't have water beads on the surface but you still have noticeable condensation on the side walls that you do not mist and let it just go until the first flushes in? At no time do you mist it and put beads down before that?

Here is a tub that's just starting to pin. I haven't misted this tub in 24 hours. Condensation on the side walls still. In your opinion would you mist this or just let it ride?
I'm sorry if I'm being redundant I just can't seem to get a handle on this. My pin sets are not very impressive and getting a lot of side pins.
If I touch my substrate it still feels moist but there's not any beads on the surface.
I saw one hypotheses that suggested side pins were due to the conditions on the edges being slightly dryer which would lead me to believe that my top surface is too moist and needs to be slightly dryer?
... the guide to proper surface conditions led me to believe that I basically want to keep beads on the surface constantly to cause pinning? But my results haven't been very great and my pens tend to form on the sides and edges...
I have done significant research and asked a ton of questions and could just really use some one to walk me through this part and help me get it figured out I don't want to ruin my project because I I'm confused and don't understand exactly what I need to do..
Thanks so much for your help I really appreciate it.
-------------------- ....."So Great!"....-Me on 1.5mg LSD ...."We don't need this" -Larkin in response to my "just picked wild LSD!" post
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mushboy
modboy



Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 32,281
Loc: where?
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let em ride. stop misting days ago.
the substrate needs to be on the drier side so the water CAN pool into beads.
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Tormato  
The Goddess Kali Meh 😛




Registered: 07/01/17
Posts: 6,067
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Re: Making shoeboxes [Re: mushboy]
#25096698 - 03/28/18 09:44 AM (5 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
mushboy said: let em ride. stop misting days ago.
the substrate needs to be on the drier side so the water CAN pool into beads.
Those subs looks soaked!
-------------------- Helpful Threads The Shroomery Store Tormato's Q&A Thread Post Questions Here or PM me! "Lately it occurs to me what a long, strange trip it's been." ~ Grateful Dead Before you start...Do you have a Pressure Cooker and a Dehydrator? I highly recommend getting both!
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