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Offlines.dante
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Registered: 01/24/17
Posts: 3
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
Harmala freebase extraction - a question
    #24036001 - 01/24/17 01:07 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

Hi guys, it's been so long since I visited this place that I forgot my username and had to re-register

Same thing happened with the Nexus and as they're not taking new registrations currently I've ended up back in this wonderful place :sun:

I'm about to start a harmala extraction tek found on the Nexus. I've re-written it up myself in an attempt to familiarise myself properly before I start (first time doing a harmala extraction) but one aspect of it is unclear to me. I hope someone can help.

The Tek: Easy Caapi Vine Alkaloid Extraction Guide

My question is: there is mention of saving the liquid at various points in the process (during Remove Soluble Impurities, Acidify, Remove Excess NaOH, etc...). Do I save the liquid from each step in the same container? Is it all being used for an overnight settling as mentioned in the Remove Excess NaOH step? I don't think this is clearly explain unless I'm missing something here.

Besides that I'm pretty clear on what I'm doing, I just want to make sure anything I set aside I set aside correctly.

Thanks in advance!


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OfflineSabnock
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Registered: 01/02/14
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Re: Harmala freebase extraction - a question [Re: s.dante]
    #24036312 - 01/24/17 03:10 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

Here's what i do.

Boil up a good bit of whole Rue seed or shredded Caapi vine, strain the seed/vine from each boil and filter the liquid, adding the seed/vine back to the pot for another boil, i'd say do about 4 to 6 boils just in case to make sure you get everything from the plant material. Collect all strained/filtered boils into one pot, reducing it all down as you go along. Once all boils are combined and reduced down to say 400 to 600mls, add about 75 to 100mls of vinegar, stir, and allow things to cool to room temp. Once cooled to room temp, dissolve about 15 grams of washing soda (sodium carbonate) into 100mls of hot water, add the soda water to the reduced brew, stir it in, and it'll precipitate out the crude extract.

Now you wanna filter this extract out with a coffee filter, keeping the extract and discarding the left behind liquid, and clean the extract up a few times. What i do is get 400mls of warm water, add 75mls of vinegar to it, then toss in the extract/filter making sure all the extract falls off the filter and goes into the liquid, then stir/dissolve the extract as much as you can. Then you wanna filter the liquid and the coffee filter will catch the black/brown plant gunk, once filtered, re-base with 15 grams of washing soda in 100mls of hot water, which will precipitate out the extract, which you filter and clean up more by re-dissolving in fresh warm water with 75mls of vinegar, filter, re-base with 15 grams of washing soda. Once you've successfully gotten it pretty clean, filter it out, close and squeeze the coffee filter in a paper towel to make sure you get as much moisture out as possible, then open the coffee filter and let it sit out to dry. Once the extract is dry, is can be scraped up and used.

The general rule is to not use too much acid, so i use 75 to 100mls of distilled white 5% vinegar i think it is, and to use 10 to 15 grams of washing soda per 400 to 600mls, but i use 20 grams if the liquid is 800mls. Also wetting the coffee filters and spoon with a few drops of water adding the water back to the brew/extract liquid is what i do to try to avoid any loss of actives. Also you might wanna try to break up any big clumps of the final extract so it will dry better, i've had some chunks retain moisture before which threw off the weight a little bit, so break up those clumps. When done, you should have a nice and clean/pure compact freebased Rue extract. If you want to further clean it up and get a purified Harmala extract (separating it from Rue's other alkaloids), you'll need to do a Manske extraction on the freebased Rue extract by dissolving it into some warm vinegar water, diluting the brew a bit, heat it up on the stove top, add some salt (forget how much though), stir/dissolve the salt into the brew, then once it's all dissolved put the brew in the fridge and over the next day or so it should precipitate out the pure Harmala salts, which you can collect from the liquid, and re-base with washing soda for a purified Harmala freebased extract.


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InvisibleFriendlyFace
Falling, with style


Registered: 06/14/12
Posts: 229
Loc: The Q Continuum
Re: Harmala freebase extraction - a question [Re: Sabnock]
    #24037183 - 01/24/17 08:24 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

Yeah you can save them all together and just add some more base before letting it settle to make sure all the alkaloids crash out.

Truth is harmala extraction is not really an exact science. So whatever works for you. I honestly don't bother with saving the stuff cause I let it settle for a day or so between each decant step anyway.


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Oh no you've really done it this time


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InvisibleFriendlyFace
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Registered: 06/14/12
Posts: 229
Loc: The Q Continuum
Re: Harmala freebase extraction - a question [Re: FriendlyFace]
    #24037206 - 01/24/17 08:31 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

I'm sorry I mistyped. You really only want to be saving the rinses from your base steps in case not everything has settled. When it says to decant the acidic solution away from the plant particles and save it,  that is just what you continue the main part of the tek with. That is where pretty much all of your alkaloids are. Once you base that and rinse a few times (saving the rinses) you can dry your alkaloids and then you're done.

Again if you let it settle for a day or so between rinses there is no real reason to save the rinse water. But it just depends on how much of a hurry you are in.

Also to the above poster I would highly recommend trying out gibran's tek linked in the OP. No filtering makes things WAY easier. And if you're using rue, just manske your results to your satisfaction.


Edited by FriendlyFace (01/24/17 08:39 PM)


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OfflineSabnock
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Re: Harmala freebase extraction - a question [Re: FriendlyFace]
    #24037468 - 01/24/17 10:32 PM (7 years, 5 days ago)

Yeah gibrans and the tao of Rue is where i first read about these extractions and is pretty much the same as what i do but i do it my own way. I don't mind the filtering, i get about 4 grams of pure freebased Rue extract from 100 grams of Rue seed, though i'm sure somewhere i'm missing maybe 500mgs or so worth of extract but it's not bad at all considering. I mainly just stick to ingesting the Rue seed powder though, but i also like extract, just not as much as the fuller spectrum plant feel of the actual Rue seed. And as for a manske extraction, i really don't need that unless i want purified Harmala extract but since i like full spectrum i stay with freebased Rue extract or Rue seed powder. I'm sure my method of extraction could use a few tweaks, but it surely works, and i love smoking the Rue extract btw (especially with the Cannabis).


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Offline1Love1
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Registered: 12/22/16
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Last seen: 2 years, 7 months
Re: Harmala freebase extraction - a question [Re: s.dante]
    #24038332 - 01/25/17 10:49 AM (7 years, 5 days ago)

Quote:

s.dante said:
Hi guys, it's been so long since I visited this place that I forgot my username and had to re-register

Same thing happened with the Nexus and as they're not taking new registrations currently I've ended up back in this wonderful place :sun:






Welcome back!!! Yea same thing happened to me, can't remember my old log in info...

And what's the deal over at the Nexus??? It seems like there are always some exclusive measures being taken...

Great members over there but I've never gotten as chill a vibe there as I get here...Much love to the Nexus for the immense help they've been through the years!!!


--------------------
Yung Synthesis.

Egyptian Prescription....Purple Lotus Lean...YBezuk.com


Organic Ascension (Brazilian Crystals)
https://www.etsy.com/shop/oacrystals


Edited by 1Love1 (01/25/17 10:51 AM)


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Offlines.dante
Stranger
Registered: 01/24/17
Posts: 3
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
Re: Harmala freebase extraction - a question [Re: 1Love1]
    #24038633 - 01/25/17 01:10 PM (7 years, 5 days ago)

Quote:

FriendlyFace said:
I'm sorry I mistyped. You really only want to be saving the rinses from your base steps in case not everything has settled. When it says to decant the acidic solution away from the plant particles and save it,  that is just what you continue the main part of the tek with. That is where pretty much all of your alkaloids are. Once you base that and rinse a few times (saving the rinses) you can dry your alkaloids and then you're done.

Again if you let it settle for a day or so between rinses there is no real reason to save the rinse water. But it just depends on how much of a hurry you are in.





Gotcha. I was planning on allowing 24 hours to settle anyway as I'm not in a rush particularly.

So to clarify,

Step 2 – Basification of the brew:
• Dissolve 5g of NaOH in 50ml of distilled water, add to brew
• Stir periodically for about 5 minutes (alkaloids will begin to precipitate)
• Allow alkaloids to settle and solution to clarify

Step 3 – Remove soluble impurities:
• Siphon off clear, dark brown liquid from the measuring jug, discard
• Add 200ml of distilled water to remaining precipitate, stir, allow precipitate to settle for 24 hours
• Once precipitate has settled pour off remaining clear liquid and decant into separate Pyrex measuring jug (for use later), leaving precipitate behind
• Place precipitate into Pyrex measuring beaker for acidification

If I allow enough time I can remove the part above?


Quote:

1Love1 said:
Quote:

s.dante said:
Hi guys, it's been so long since I visited this place that I forgot my username and had to re-register

Same thing happened with the Nexus and as they're not taking new registrations currently I've ended up back in this wonderful place :sun:








Welcome back!!! Yea same thing happened to me, can't remember my old log in info...

And what's the deal over at the Nexus??? It seems like there are always some exclusive measures being taken...

Great members over there but I've never gotten as chill a vibe there as I get here...Much love to the Nexus for the immense help they've been through the years!!!




Yeah something about too many new members to manage. Seems the place has gained in popularity lately and the admins/mods can't keep up. Every so often I think they open up the gates.

Still this place and the Nexus are invaluable resources and both fantastic communities in their own right!


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InvisibleFriendlyFace
Falling, with style


Registered: 06/14/12
Posts: 229
Loc: The Q Continuum
Re: Harmala freebase extraction - a question [Re: s.dante]
    #24038714 - 01/25/17 01:46 PM (7 years, 5 days ago)

If you pour it off it might be good to save it. But if you carefully decant with a baster or syringe and make sure not to suck up any of the solids there is no need if it's settled for a while.


--------------------
Oh no you've really done it this time


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Offlines.dante
Stranger
Registered: 01/24/17
Posts: 3
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
Re: Harmala freebase extraction - a question [Re: s.dante]
    #24038788 - 01/25/17 02:17 PM (7 years, 5 days ago)

Awesome, thanks. I guess my concern is that I'll throw away some valuable liquid, but if this is just a rinse, and may not contain too much harmalas if it's left long enough, I think I can spare it for the sake of simplicity this time around.

So the goods are in the precipitate left after this step, right? Then the acidifying step is where the alkaloids become soluble and the remaining (insoluble) sediment is removed? Then I freebase the salts, wash etc etc.


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InvisibleFriendlyFace
Falling, with style


Registered: 06/14/12
Posts: 229
Loc: The Q Continuum
Re: Harmala freebase extraction - a question [Re: s.dante]
    #24039267 - 01/25/17 04:55 PM (7 years, 5 days ago)

Yep :thumbup:

You should be able to see if any significant amount of fb alkaloids make it into your rinse water and you can decide from there if you want to keep it for settling or not.

Good luck


--------------------
Oh no you've really done it this time


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