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OfflineConnoisseur

Registered: 05/13/11
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Kratom Psychosis
    #23987544 - 01/06/17 07:26 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

Im reading online that kratom can cause seizures and psychosis in rare instances.

Is this actually true? :confused:


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OfflineThe Mycologist
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Connoisseur]
    #23987548 - 01/06/17 07:27 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

High enough dose and I dont doubt it


--------------------
"That you are here—that life exists, and identity;
That the powerful play goes on, and you will contribute a verse.”
― Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass
:acidfire::tmckenna:


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OfflineBikerfool
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: The Mycologist] * 6
    #23987564 - 01/06/17 07:35 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

I developed psychosis after eating too many Big Macs, so the same logic probably applies to kratom.


--------------------
Just an angsty teen contributing to the pubs decline with contentless posts.


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Invisibleshadyy
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Connoisseur]
    #23987580 - 01/06/17 07:42 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

It can fuck with your thyroid function as well.

But it's harmless...ask any opiate addict.


--------------------

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MONICA COULDN'T TELL TIME UNTIL SHE WAS 13


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OfflineConnoisseur

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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: shadyy]
    #23987583 - 01/06/17 07:43 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

im an opi addict and i dont say its harmless but i would say its "safe"


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OfflineLucisM
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Connoisseur]
    #23987610 - 01/06/17 07:53 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

who that peeking in my window...POW...nobody now.



--------------------
©️


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OfflineForresterM
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: shadyy]
    #23987654 - 01/06/17 08:13 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

i hate liz said:
It can fuck with your thyroid function as well.





Thanks for the only actual information posted so far in this thread, does anybody have any more?  Personal experiences?

My experience is I've been using it at relatively high doses for over 2 years now.  Never experienced any psychosis and definitely no seizures (I doubt that one is true).  My recent liver tests came back relatively normal (a little borderline, but I drink a lot).  My thyroid tests did show some abnormalities but that is more likely due to the fact that I recently found out I have Lyme disease.  I hate liz - do you have any more info on this, or a link/source?  I do get the feeling it can seriously effect testosterone levels in men, as it's almost totally killed my sex drive.

In my opinion, taking even an extremely high dose would probably not be all that dangerous, considering you would most likely vomit the entirety of it up before it had a chance to get fully into your system.  Although if you did take too much and manage to keep it down, I imagine you would feel terrible and there's got to be an overdose level where it could be dangerous.

But I'm just speculating here, does anyone else have any useful info?  Interested in this topic as well.


--------------------
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Offlinesanchothestoner
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Forrester]
    #23987658 - 01/06/17 08:15 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

yes i've heard of peepz seizin out on larry


--------------------
I fucking hate you... God damn, I love you...
But we both know if we stick together, we'll just tear ourselves apart
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Invisiblesh4d0ws
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: sanchothestoner]
    #23987684 - 01/06/17 08:25 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

I had a total of 3 seizures in 2016 and although none of them were attributed to krat use the neurologist honestly didn't know a whole lot about krat.

Perhaps my large kratom doses had something to do with it?

Conn can you post a link I really wanna read more about this. Probably should bring it up when I go back to see the neurologist


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Offlinepslyke
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Forrester]
    #23987692 - 01/06/17 08:30 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

I do get the feeling it can seriously effect testosterone levels in men, as it's almost totally killed my sex drive.





^^^ this


--------------------
"What appears impenetrable to us does exist, manifesting itself in the deepest wisdom and the most radiant beauty" Einstein

"The conservatives of 70 years ago would be outraged at what has come to pass. It embodies everything they took up arms for to defeat"Asante


:kratom:


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OfflineForresterM
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: pslyke]
    #23987779 - 01/06/17 09:00 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

pslyke said:
Quote:

I do get the feeling it can seriously effect testosterone levels in men, as it's almost totally killed my sex drive.





^^^ this




Yeah man, it fucking sucks having to choose between:

-do I want to go through this day with severe back pain and no energy to even function / get off the couch, and make it to and through work? 

or,

-do I want to just take the fucking kratom, get my energy, but have to deal with a fucking destroyed stomach (nausea, indigestion, etc - yeah, it does that too after a while - depending on your source, some are better than others), as well as living for months/years with nearly NO libido. 

Kind of a shitty choice, but for some of us the only real option is the latter :undecided:

And now I'm hearing about seizures?  This really scares me.  Does anyone have a source?


--------------------
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-------------------

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InvisibleBurke Dennings
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Forrester] * 5
    #23987804 - 01/06/17 09:12 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

Wow.  Some of you guys have it bad.  I use kratom pretty much daily for years now, and I don't get seizures, stomach problems, indigestion, or any kind of libido reduction.  I hardly get any negative side effects.  Lucky me, I guess!


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Offlinespacechimp
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Connoisseur]
    #23987812 - 01/06/17 09:15 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

ive been using kratom on almost a daily basis for 3 years to get off of opiates and for 2 slipped discs in my back. I use anywhere from 5-15 grams a day and haven't had any side effects except minor constipation. I guess it could happen, never have had any real negative side effects:shrug:


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OfflineForresterM
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Burke Dennings]
    #23987841 - 01/06/17 09:25 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

Burke Dennings said:
Wow.  Some of you guys have it bad.  I use kratom pretty much daily for years now, and I don't get seizures, stomach problems, indigestion, or any kind of libido reduction.  I hardly get any negative side effects.  Lucky me, I guess!




What is your daily dosage? 

I was at 15g/day in one dose, from one source, had to go off it completely as I was having esophageal spasms (your esophagus literally tightens up so bad it feels like you are choking to death, although there is nothing stuck in your throat or blocking your airway, the feeling is similar to choking - scary as fuck). 
Tried a new source, and now I'm pretty ok at 6g in the morning followed by 3g before work.  Much better quality from this source, but I still get the stomach issues although not as bad, and the libido thing, hasn't changed.


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

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InvisibleBurke Dennings
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Forrester]
    #23987861 - 01/06/17 09:32 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

I'm at probably 20-25 grams a day, split between 2 or 3 doses.


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OfflineForresterM
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Burke Dennings]
    #23987912 - 01/06/17 09:54 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

Burke Dennings said:
I'm at probably 20-25 grams a day, split between 2 or 3 doses.




Holy shit man, you are indeed "one of the lucky ones"!


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.


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OfflineConnoisseur

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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Forrester]
    #23988029 - 01/06/17 10:41 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

when i do use kratom as alternative to regular opiates i use 5g on average per dose and dose once or twice a day.

all that dose does for me is get me out of wds it doesnt give me any kind of high like it used to, maybe if i tried doing 10g or more i would get a nice buzz but i dont even see the point anymore after doing kratom so many times.


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OfflineForresterM
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Connoisseur]
    #23988147 - 01/06/17 11:22 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

Connoisseur said:
when i do use kratom as alternative to regular opiates i use 5g on average per dose and dose once or twice a day.

all that dose does for me is get me out of wds it doesnt give me any kind of high like it used to, maybe if i tried doing 10g or more i would get a nice buzz but i dont even see the point anymore after doing kratom so many times.




Well, I would say that the fact that you're using regular opiates at all is going to greatly diminish any high you would have gotten from kratom.  Not knocking anyone's choice to use real opiates, but there is going to be a cross tolerance, so for any regular opiate user, really the only use for kratom IS to avoid withdrawl, like you said.  Pushing the dosage will likely only lead to worse side effects, unless you are one of the "lucky ones"


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.


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OfflineConnoisseur

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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Forrester]
    #23988152 - 01/06/17 11:22 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

i dont get bad side effects at all, never have really.


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OfflineForresterM
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Connoisseur]
    #23988170 - 01/06/17 11:30 PM (7 years, 24 days ago)

Quote:

Connoisseur said:
i dont get bad side effects at all, never have really.




At 5g average dose, I wouldn't really expect you to.  Not the severe, stomach related ones anyway.  No effects on libido eh? 

And does anyone else find kratom makes them a bit "cranky" or more irritable than usual?


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.


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OfflineConnoisseur

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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Forrester]
    #23988205 - 01/06/17 11:44 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

thats the opiate anger that makes some people cranky.

and at that dose it doesnt effect my sex drive much.


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Invisible404
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Connoisseur]
    #23988210 - 01/06/17 11:49 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

Connoisseur said:
Im reading online that kratom can cause seizures and psychosis in rare instances.

Is this actually true? :confused:




i have eaten an ounce in one go and the only thing happened to me was i puked my guts out. last doc i saw said that opiates and any drug really for the most part (except probably the ones that fight seizures) can trigger them as you disrupt the brains neurochemistry, so probably


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InvisibleSham87
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: 404]
    #23988260 - 01/07/17 12:19 AM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Kratom lifts me up like a cup of coffee would for anyone else. No effect on my libido as far as I can tell and I've been dosing for 3 years now.

I keep my doses at 5 gs in the morning, 5 gs at lunch, and 3 - 4 gs at night.


--------------------
:mushroom2::sun::crazy2::leaf:




...once in a while you get shown the light in the strangest places if you look at it right...



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InvisibleAmanita86
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Sham87]
    #23988273 - 01/07/17 12:27 AM (7 years, 23 days ago)

No problems here..I take it every morning I have to work.:shrug:


--------------------
:mushroom2:Orange clock, pencil:bouncysmoke:
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:mushroom2:*Mark 15:34:levitate::mushroom2::blueninja:
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Offlinepslyke
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Amanita86]
    #23988729 - 01/07/17 08:03 AM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Anyone that uses kratom regularly have their total or free testosterone checked?


--------------------
"What appears impenetrable to us does exist, manifesting itself in the deepest wisdom and the most radiant beauty" Einstein

"The conservatives of 70 years ago would be outraged at what has come to pass. It embodies everything they took up arms for to defeat"Asante


:kratom:


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Offlinespacechimp
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Forrester]
    #23988863 - 01/07/17 09:16 AM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

Forrester said:
Quote:

Connoisseur said:
i dont get bad side effects at all, never have really.




At 5g average dose, I wouldn't really expect you to.  Not the severe, stomach related ones anyway.  No effects on libido eh? 

And does anyone else find kratom makes them a bit "cranky" or more irritable than usual?




No i actually get a boost in my mood from kratom. Like coffee but much better. I actually dont have any single bad effect from it. I would put down my caffeine and nicotine addiction before it. Love the shit!


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InvisibleCookieCrumbsM
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Connoisseur]
    #23988921 - 01/07/17 09:31 AM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Being that it is unregulated there's honestly no telling what could be in a batch of kratom. I've found pin wires and pieces of wood in some of mine. Haven't had anything bunk yet, did have a batch that made me sick but I was trying a new strain so it's probably just that I didn't tolerate it well. I've read stories of other people getting bunk or spoiled/improperly processed kratom too.

Now if you're buying from headshops or just willy nilly on the net then what you're buying could be like 40% kratom and idk 50% powdered sugar 5% food color and 5% RCs.

I'm aware powdered sugar doesn't have the same consistency but I imagine some powder does. I just can't think of what.



This is why I'm in favor of regulation. Just not the "regulation" we get. From people that don't know shit about what they're doing and don't really give a shit about the people.


--------------------
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Offlinespacechimp
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: CookieCrumbs]
    #23988934 - 01/07/17 09:34 AM (7 years, 23 days ago)

you've had wood and wires in your kratom? Thats crazy!:whatwhatwhat:


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InvisibleCookieCrumbsM
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: spacechimp]
    #23988968 - 01/07/17 09:47 AM (7 years, 23 days ago)

I buy in bulk and what gets processed in bulk... well it's no surprising things sneak in there so I don't fault the vendor. Though of course I complained and they gave me free stuff and insist they sift their product prior to shipping now. Which, considering the batches I got afterward, I believe them. They changed their packaging too.


--------------------
          :dancingbear: Free time is the only time :dancingbear:                    :thatsinteresting:


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OfflineConnoisseur

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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: CookieCrumbs]
    #23988997 - 01/07/17 10:01 AM (7 years, 23 days ago)

oh my god cookie that actually scares me that your saying that kinda thing...jesus imagine if you ingested that...


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Connoisseur]
    #23989519 - 01/07/17 01:02 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

Connoisseur said:
oh my god cookie that actually scares me that your saying that kinda thing...jesus imagine if you ingested that...




Imagine all the stuff people ingest without realizing it. Bugs and tons of gross stuff.

As long as you buy from a good source you shouldn't have to worry.

As for the side effects, I have a hard time believing kratom could actually cause psychosis or seizures. Maybe in some rare people or when extremely abused it could be possible but I doubt most people would be effected.

It enhances libido a bit IME too but I just take smaller doses. Just like cannabis it can make me extra horny or get me too distracted to care.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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InvisibleCookieCrumbsM
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: musiclover420]
    #23989818 - 01/07/17 03:18 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Yeah I'm glad I encapsulate it. The biggest thing I find is hair. I dunno what kratom veins look like so it could be that and it could be my own hair.


But I think pretty much any drug can exacerbate mental illness. So reports of psychosis could actually be undeveloped or undiagnosed cases of schizophrenia.


--------------------
          :dancingbear: Free time is the only time :dancingbear:                    :thatsinteresting:


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: CookieCrumbs]
    #23989887 - 01/07/17 03:39 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

CookieCrumbs said:
But I think pretty much any drug can exacerbate mental illness. So reports of psychosis could actually be undeveloped or undiagnosed cases of schizophrenia.




Exactly, plus most people who use kratom do or have done other drugs which are just as if not more likely to contribute to mental health issues in many cases.

Even alcohol and tobacco are most likely more harmful.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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Invisiblesh4d0ws
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: CookieCrumbs]
    #23989900 - 01/07/17 03:44 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

I have never found other stuff in any kratom and I've ordered quite a lot in the past 2 years

Perhaps it is a supplier issue? Or maybe that stuff was in mine and I was just too high to notice :shrug:


I guess it could have been mixed with desmethyl tramadol or whatever (the same shit they mixed in that kratom in europe that killed some people) and I wouldn't have known but as far visible things like hair, pins, wood, etc...never seen anything like that


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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: sh4d0ws] * 1
    #23990355 - 01/07/17 06:07 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

I only take 2-5 grams and a tramadol, it makes me feel good but not high.  Plenty of pep in my step, gets rid of most my knee/back pain, clear headed, and I leave my girl friend satisfied.  I don't take it every day though. Just when I need it.  Nothing but good.  I can't idmagine taking 10-28 grams that would put my dick in the dirt.


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Offlinepinedownpioneer
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: pinedownpioneer]
    #23990368 - 01/07/17 06:11 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

The stuff I got now is quality.  I have yet to try the home grown..been saving all the leafs though.


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OfflineDeemstar
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: pinedownpioneer]
    #23990419 - 01/07/17 06:29 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

As somebody that suffers with varieties of mental illnesses breeding from a true psychosis, kratom helps me mellow out. Worst i've gotten is mild opiate sick from it where i puked but i still felt pretty good.


Edited by Deemstar (01/07/17 06:30 PM)


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Offlinemusiclover420
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Deemstar]
    #23990499 - 01/07/17 07:02 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

I actually remember reading a story about someone who used kratom and worked with a semi crazy old vet or something.

Anyways one day at work he was taking his kratom and the crazy vet was pretty out of it so he gave him some and a bit later he was acting much less crazy.


--------------------
Don't worry about me, I've got all that I need. And I'm singing my song to the sky

You know how it feels, With the breeze of the sun in your eyes. Not minding that time's passing by

I've got all and more, My smile, just as before. Is all that I carry with me

I talk to myself, I need nobody else. I'm lost and I'm mine, yes I'm free



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OfflineForresterM
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: musiclover420]
    #23990852 - 01/07/17 08:38 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

As with any drug, I think we can learn from this thread that

- source and quality/purity/maybe even strain are very important
- the same drug can effect two different people VERY differently
- negative side effects certainly seem to me to depend on dose, and lower dosing does seem much safer and better overall

As far as getting testosterone levels checked - I plan to.  I'm getting all sorts of tests done lately and many more to come, due to my Lyme disease, so that's one I will definitely report results on.

I am also going to be getting results soon on my brain neurotransmitter test, which should be really interesting.  Might even help reveal why I've been a drug seeker since I was 13 years old and always leaned towards depression or anxiety.  Would be nice if I finally got some answers after 20 plus years!


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Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
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Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.


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Offlinespacechimp
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Registered: 12/01/13
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: Forrester]
    #24011492 - 01/15/17 08:36 AM (7 years, 15 days ago)

Quote:

Forrester said:
As with any drug, I think we can learn from this thread that

- source and quality/purity/maybe even strain are very important
- the same drug can effect two different people VERY differently
- negative side effects certainly seem to me to depend on dose, and lower dosing does seem much safer and better overall

As far as getting testosterone levels checked - I plan to.  I'm getting all sorts of tests done lately and many more to come, due to my Lyme disease, so that's one I will definitely report results on.

I am also going to be getting results soon on my brain neurotransmitter test, which should be really interesting.  Might even help reveal why I've been a drug seeker since I was 13 years old and always leaned towards depression or anxiety.  Would be nice if I finally got some answers after 20 plus years!




please report back on the t levels. i find that interesting even though there could be a variety of factors got low t.


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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
High on Spite
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Posts: 19,067
Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: spacechimp] * 1
    #24011597 - 01/15/17 09:24 AM (7 years, 15 days ago)

I would like someone to name a psychoactive substance that is not alleged to cause seizures and psychosis in some rare case.  Normal life stress can do the same thing if you're predisposed to it or something.


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OfflineLuSiD enthusiast
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Registered: 03/14/13
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Last seen: 4 years, 9 months
Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #24011723 - 01/15/17 10:07 AM (7 years, 15 days ago)

I've broke 50 grams quite a few times. Pretty sure the most i took was closer to 4 ounces and I've never had a psychotic episode.

Sure as hell didn't feel great. But you kinda anticipate that when you dose so highly and stupidly.


--------------------
I'm addicted to coke, weed, booze, ludes and speed.
Not LSD, you can't get addicted to LSD, it was built by scientists.

I ain't got no demons that gonna get woke.


In erowid we trust.

Just take your damn pills and don't ask any questions, you'll be fine.


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Invisiblemoonrockmushy
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Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: LuSiD enthusiast]
    #24011755 - 01/15/17 10:14 AM (7 years, 15 days ago)

Yeah I mean the worst part for me was the headaches, and extreme motion sickness.  Plus if you are doing toss and wash you're going to be puking up semi-dry powder/sludge and likely get dehydrated on top of everything so anything other than puking, dry-heaving for way too long, and laying in bed are a no-go.

It's not like opiate sickness for me, where once I puke and empty my stomach I usually feel better.  A big part of opiate sickness for me was that it basically stopped my digestion, so I'd just puke because I could not process even a tiny amount of food.  This might have to do with the wicked sweet tooth I have on opiates.

When I puke off of kratom I generally don't feel any better.  It is more like puking when you're extremely hung over from drinking where it doesn't bring any relief, you've just gotta stop at some point or else you will pass out from dry heaving too much.


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OfflineForresterM
aspiring sociopath
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Registered: 02/05/13
Posts: 9,351
Loc: Northeast USA Flag
Last seen: 25 days, 20 hours
Re: Kratom Psychosis [Re: moonrockmushy]
    #24012193 - 01/15/17 01:05 PM (7 years, 15 days ago)

Quote:

moonrockmushy said:
Yeah I mean the worst part for me was the headaches




I used to get the headaches a lot, but since switching sources I haven't had that problem at all.  I almost wonder if it isn't pesticides or something being sprayed on them that cause the headaches. 

I wish Kratom would catch on as a legitimate herbal product (like Kava kava, etc), so we could start seeing Organic, pesticide-free, and know more about the source.  Having a standardized extract (that worked) would be nice too.


--------------------
Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here.
-------------------

Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them?  Try this double extraction method.


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