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Offlineclock_of_omens
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #24000745 - 01/11/17 10:26 AM (7 years, 19 days ago)

Quote:

LunarEclipse said:
Quote:

clock_of_omens said:
A conspiracy theory about the term conspiracy theory? Damn that's some meta shit.




Took you off ignore.




Hella.


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: clock_of_omens]
    #24000790 - 01/11/17 10:48 AM (7 years, 19 days ago)

Follow The Money.  Money Never Sleeps, Pal.



--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: clock_of_omens]
    #24001460 - 01/11/17 02:51 PM (7 years, 19 days ago)

Quote:

clock_of_omens said:


People who think there is a larger conspiracy behind 9/11 and the JFK assassination are just as guilty of holding to their narratives against all evidence and ignoring evidence that does not bolster their narrative than people who believe the official narratives. Most of the time, their narratives are just as or even more absurd than the official ones. They are also just as guilty of disparaging the other side, as that is much easier to do than actually listen and consider.

Also, I like how you just ignored my long comment after berating me for not replying to you with anything of substance. Classic.





Quote:

People who think there is a larger conspiracy behind 9/11 and the JFK assassination are just as guilty of holding to their narratives against all evidence and ignoring evidence that does not bolster their narrative than people who believe the official narratives.




... :lolwut:

There is lots of evidence which contradicts the official story. This is for YOU to make an effort to dis-cover like many have done so for themselves. Here though are some hints:

There is not just one story offering alternative evidence for what happened on 9/11.

There is a strong possibility that there has been an infiltration of ideas/stories meant to discredit the more sensible investigations.

But in order to look at all this you have to see the context!


Quote:


context (n.) Look up context at Dictionary.com
    early 15c., from Latin contextus "a joining together," originally past participle of contexere "to weave together," from com "with, together" (see com-) + texere "to weave, to make" (see texture (n.)).




You have to join the dots, and see patterns, connections, PLOTS, and sub-plots, etc.

You have to see/look for what every good detective looks for, MEANS, OPPORTUNITY, and MOTIVE. And of course CUI BONO, or 'who gains'. Who profits from war. Checkout 'War is a Racket'!

You have look at how the story is composed, its layers.

I learnt this VERY much after reading The Sacred Mushroom and the Cross, by John Allegro many years ago where he reveals how biblical mythological script is composed in layers of meaning where the superficial layer is meant for the gullible (like the '19 hijackers with boxcutters' etc etc), where deeper layers are meant for a more intellectual understanding, but the core layer is only meant for the initiated who understand the devices, code, and so on.

Well same is so for the 9/11 story/myth which set the world up for the new 'war on terror' (replacing the 'Devil' boogeyman, or the 'Commies' boogeyman, though that has recently come back) where there now can be perpetual war using 9/11 as its core pretext. Just what they love.

They keep this fear going with related events which are also set-up psychological operations (psyops).

When you say:
Quote:

Most of the time, their narratives are just as or even more absurd than the official ones.



Well, depending on which narratives you mean we may agree on this.:what2: I am skeptical of Dr Judy Wood's story, for example.

And do not presume I do not listen and consider either.

As for your comment. I DID reply to your last comment.


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: zzripz]
    #24001516 - 01/11/17 03:15 PM (7 years, 19 days ago)

Don't worry, zzripz, you play the paranoid conspiracy theorist to a "T".  That's why I don't trust you.  I honestly think you may be getting paid for being so obtuse, then I can't imagine somebody hiring you for it, and I give up.


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Anxiety is what you make it.


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Offlineclock_of_omens
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: zzripz]
    #24001632 - 01/11/17 04:03 PM (7 years, 19 days ago)

Quote:

zzripz said:
There is lots of evidence which contradicts the official story.




Good thing I didn't say there wasn't. What I said is that both sides cling to their narratives despite evidence that goes against them.

Quote:

Well, depending on which narratives you mean we may agree on this.:what2: I am skeptical of Dr Judy Wood's story, for example.




Exactly, there are always multiple narratives coming from the people who disbelieve the official narratives. This is because people often look at evidence the way they want to and disregard evidence that goes against their pet theory. Just like the holders of the official narratives disregard legitimate evidence pointing away from their narrative.

In these types of cases, the very fact that people hold to their narratives and act as if they are sure what happened is absurd. There are too many factors involved and too much 'evidence' that may or may not be true. One has to look at everything and weigh the information taking into account the likelihood of its legitimacy. Most people don't do this. Instead, they find a narrative they like and block out anything that goes against it.

Quote:

As for your comment. I DID reply to your last comment.




You replied to my flippant comment about the conspiracy theory conspiracy, but you ignored this comment.


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: clock_of_omens]
    #24003176 - 01/12/17 05:16 AM (7 years, 18 days ago)

It is all very well you saying all of this with your words. But they do not mean anything unless you back them up with examples. So? :strokebeard:

And what comment. Can you not see I reply to each point? Past the comment you worried about me neglecting to a new post.


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Offlineclock_of_omens
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: zzripz]
    #24003386 - 01/12/17 08:34 AM (7 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

zzripz said:
It is all very well you saying all of this with your words. But they do not mean anything unless you back them up with examples. So? :strokebeard:




:lolwut:

Asinine.

Quote:

And what comment. Can you not see I reply to each point? Past the comment you worried about me neglecting to a new post.




Dude, are you just being willfully dense? Did you click the link? You did not respond to the comment that link leads to.


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: clock_of_omens]
    #24003802 - 01/12/17 11:23 AM (7 years, 18 days ago)

you are wasting my time, and clogging up my thread with nonesense.


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: zzripz]
    #24003874 - 01/12/17 11:53 AM (7 years, 18 days ago)

This culture is supposed to love the 'rational' and not only have disrespect for what it considers irrational, but also abuse and torture and murder 'it'.

For example, animals, thought not to be rational, and 'animal testing'. The people that do it to them worship their own 'rationality', and will be proud to say they are not sentimental, emotional, in their using of animals for 'science', because they function rationally.

Likewise people(s) considered 'close to/as like animals' have been 'tested' on also. Two terrible such 'operations' spring to mind, the giving of syphilis to AfroAmerican men, and testing Nuclear bombs on native peoples who they considered 'savages':



So just for the hell of it I thought I'd search 'from mythos to rationality' and found this:


Quote:

Summary

Mythos and logos

Already in ancient Greece it was recognised that there were two distinct ways of thinking and acquiring knowledge. One was ‘mythos’, which relied upon narrative (fabula) and folk knowledge, and the other was ‘logos’, which referred to logical and rational analysis of the phenomena in question. From the very beginning the distinction between mythos and logos created controversies. Geoffrey Lloyd (1990) argued that the dispute between mythos and logos was not based on sound analysis of these two kinds of mental processes but that it was a battlefield in which contestants defended their philosophical territories and confronted their political rivals. According to Cassirer (1946), the first philosopher who attacked mythical conceptions was the historian Thucydides, who, despite knowing that the lack of fabula and romance in his writing would detract the attention of readers, nevertheless proclaimed that he desired to present exact historical knowledge. Rationality and methodical procedures characterised Greek thought in all domains of knowing, ranging from the cosmos to the study of nature and self-knowledge.

When we come to Plato, we find that he attributed a higher degree of reality to non-material and abstract ideas acquired through rational thought than to knowing the world through sensations and experience. According to Plato, mythos – or muthos – was always subjected to logos (e.g. Halliwell, 2000). Analysing Plato's citations from numerous poets, Halliwell (2000) finds that imaginative or fictive status or muthoi (mythos) in poetic texts and in Platonic dialogues was always subsumed under logoi (logos). It meant that assertions in Platonic dialogues had to be appraised in terms of truth and falsity, although it was well acknowledged that truth and falsity were difficult to separate. Yet other scholars, like Dodds (1951), argued in considerable detail that even in Plato's thinking we can find cross-fertilisation of rationalism and magical-religious ideas of shamanistic culture and of the occult nature of the Self. Plato strongly argued against images and imagination. For him, imagination was no more than imitation of ideal or true forms, as he explains in the Republic (Plato, 1991, pp. 283–284). Referring to poets, and specifically to Homer, Plato called him an imitator who copied images of virtue, but he could never reach the truth of God. Equally, a painter makes images of things about which he knows nothing and he is admired by those who know even less than he does. source




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Invisiblelaughingdog
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: zzripz]
    #24003920 - 01/12/17 12:14 PM (7 years, 18 days ago)

"Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us?"

well I suppose you could say TV and movies have this effect and use this method

advertising which uses still images works by simple association and is also effective

the issue I have with the idea is in the 3 words: "a predatory elite"

it would seem there are many competing corporations, governments, hackers, cartels, mercinaries, conglomerates, currency manipulators, advertisers, media, wealthy families, and in general bad guys - so that the idea of a single mastermind or unified group seems unlikely.

Unfortunately the result of so much bad energy has had a unified effect of continual war - for centuries, and more recently of world wide pollution.

The other long result of civilization has been inequality - in this case for thousands of years - and therefore not a result of the manipulations of current power seekers.

To what degree war has been a result of myth making is perhaps an interesting question. Certainly some wars have been started by lies. Others seem to be the result of population pressures.

Pollution would not seem to be caused by "storytelling".

Likewise anthropolocial studies of the rise of inequality in different cultures does not point to "storytelling" as the cause. Again we are looking at thousands of years in this case.

So, (even skipping individual psychological factors) human misery cannot be blamed on "a predatory elite" that attempts to control us in my opinion.


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InvisibleDividedQuantumM
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: laughingdog]
    #24003938 - 01/12/17 12:24 PM (7 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

laughingdog said:
Likewise anthropolocial studies of the rise of inequality in different cultures does not point to "storytelling" as the cause. Again we are looking at thousands of years in this case.

So, (even skipping individual psychological factors) human misery cannot be blamed on "a predatory elite" that attempts to control us in my opinion.




Absolutely. I just read a book about ancient Rome, and they were plagued by inequality. Its effect on the culture at large was one (of many) of the reasons that the empire weakened and eventually fizzled out. The general phenomenon seems to be that a rich minority controls the majority of the property (including money), and there is therefore differential wealth and earning power, which leads to a huge imbalance. This has nothing to do with storytelling.

It has been about the 1% since time immemorial, and if you really look, it has been about the 1% in the U.S. since its beginning. The Founding Fathers were really principally interested in the 1%. And this has carried on toward the present. They don't have to manipulate us through stories. They simply have all the power, and are basically untouchable.


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Vi Veri Universum Vivus Vici


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Offlineclock_of_omens
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: zzripz]
    #24003999 - 01/12/17 12:50 PM (7 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

zzripz said:
you are wasting my time, and clogging up my thread with nonesense.




Lol. Don't pretend you care about your thread being 'clogged', you can't even be bothered to read all the replies anyway. :smug:


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InvisiblePrem. Kissoff
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: zzripz]
    #24004041 - 01/12/17 01:07 PM (7 years, 18 days ago)

Always felt some people have more aptitude for storytelling, my brain is easily distracted, my step-father was a natural and definitely would have been whatever position that was before writing.


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: zzripz]
    #24004214 - 01/12/17 02:02 PM (7 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

zzripz said:
you are wasting my time, and clogging up my thread with nonesense.



just nig him like you do everyone else that doesn't lap up your bullshit without question.


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: DividedQuantum]
    #24004248 - 01/12/17 02:13 PM (7 years, 18 days ago)

I think it's always wise to keep in mind that history was written by the victors.  The true "story" is far from what's in the history books at school.  Of course this is mind control along with the narrative presented by the media.

Hollywood is an interesting phenomenon.  The message that Disney presents, for example, is certainly meant to influence young minds in ways that surely they don't understand, nor do their parents. This doesn't change the fact that such influence is taking place. 

McDonald's for example has made a living by telling a story that kids want to hear.  Maybe the babies in the food is working too. Human DNA yep it's in there, along with the pink slime.


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #24004271 - 01/12/17 02:20 PM (7 years, 18 days ago)

not really. pink slime is not used in their products. that's essentially bullshit.

and human DNA also ends up in my mom's food. her food safety procedures are ASININE, hell, she doesn't even wear gloves when she prepares food!


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: akira_akuma]
    #24004282 - 01/12/17 02:24 PM (7 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

akira_akuma said:
not really. pink slime is not used in their products. that's essentially bullshit.

and human DNA also ends up in my mom's food. her food safety procedures are ASININE, hell, she doesn't even wear gloves when she prepares food!




Maybe she's spirit cooking and you just don't know about it because she calls it a Pot Luck Dinner.  Ha!


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #24004288 - 01/12/17 02:25 PM (7 years, 18 days ago)

that's gotta be it.


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: akira_akuma]
    #24004313 - 01/12/17 02:32 PM (7 years, 18 days ago)

Quote:

akira_akuma said:
that's gotta be it.




Does she like goat products?


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Offlineakira_akuma
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Re: Does a predatory elite exploit our natural storytelling genius to control us? [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #24004320 - 01/12/17 02:35 PM (7 years, 18 days ago)

probably. the goat often will try to gore it's keeper, so i'm sure she likes goats- to add her immortal blood into the recipe, she does what she needs to.


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