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OfflineShrms
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Registered: 06/18/16
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Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
Whats going on in this mini monotub?
    #23980964 - 01/04/17 10:05 AM (7 years, 26 days ago)

He guys,

I postet some of the pictures already in the "TNF Q & A" thread but did not get an answer since a few days so I hope it is ok to summarize here and add some updated pictures.


I created my first monotub according to Pasty's guide (20 quart mini mono), spawned cubensis Ecuador rye spawn to pasteurized CVG (1:2). I had not enough spawn for 3" sub so it is only about 2" deep. All holes are 1" instead of 1.25" standard holes because I did not have the appropriate tools.

Day 5
Here what it was looking like after 5 days of colonizing (all holes were covered with duct tape; tub was covered with dark plastic bag):



Day 8
Here another picture 8 days after spawning to bulk, this day it went into fruiting. I applied 6500K light 12/12 and I tried to dial in the tub with polyfill like a boss.



Day 18
The tub after 10 days in fruiting conditions. I had some problems with moisture content in the tub, there weren't condensation rings around the holes (and low evaporation from sub surface) so I installed a fan facing to the opposite direction of the tub):



From now on I had condensation rings around the bottom holes (1/2 inch) and a larger area nearly down to the sub from one top hole (the other one had only a small ring). I misted the surface of the substrate 2 times a day to compensate for evaporation (sub was dry at several areas).

Here some close up's of the suspicios areas after 10 days:


Day 21
And finally the pics from today (13 days of fruiting):




I don't know what is going on here, from what I read so far I would say metabolites? There are a lot of little knots and a few pins that look really strange, maybe mutant genetic? Rye was inoculated with agar, so no multispore.

What could the reason for this behaviour be and can I do something to fix it? In some other threads with comparable appearance people assumed a dry sub for reason. I believe that too, because the effect startet between and around the holes where the sub dries first. I thought it is perfect to mist after the surface of the sub gets dry over day/night because evaporation promotes a good pinset.

I really appreciate your help and hope it's not totally lost.


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InvisiblemushboyMDiscord
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Re: Whats going on in this mini monotub? [Re: Shrms]
    #23980968 - 01/04/17 10:07 AM (7 years, 26 days ago)

hard to tell but that substrate looks dry. keep misting it.. im not sure what you are asking.


Edited by mushboy (01/04/17 10:07 AM)


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OfflineShrms
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Re: Whats going on in this mini monotub? [Re: mushboy]
    #23981000 - 01/04/17 10:19 AM (7 years, 26 days ago)

Quote:

mushboy said:
hard to tell but that substrate looks dry. keep misting it.. im not sure what you are asking.




I want to know what these clumpy yellow / brown accumulations are, I have never seen this before in any of my grows (trays, always with casing layer). So it looks normal and healthy to you?


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InvisiblemushboyMDiscord
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Re: Whats going on in this mini monotub? [Re: Shrms]
    #23981009 - 01/04/17 10:22 AM (7 years, 26 days ago)

not sure what the yellowing is. either crusted metabolites from bacteria/damaged dry myc?


BUT no its not healthy. you are correct about evaporation being a pinning trigger.
evaporation does not mean to let the surface completely dry out though.


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InvisibleComebackKid
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Re: Whats going on in this mini monotub? [Re: mushboy]
    #23981014 - 01/04/17 10:25 AM (7 years, 26 days ago)

From your pictures I would guess that its a little bacterial.
Day 5 there's a spot that's clearly not colonized and even by day 8 the myc is still having trouble.
Now when you look at day 21 the first pic I would guess is taken from the other side of the tub and that little yellow patch is the same patch that the myc had trouble colonizing due to bacteria.

Looks like it's knotting though and should be fine. Keep an eye out for mold though. In the meantime you could give it a light misting and let the water bead up nicely on the surface.
Maybe open up your poly a bit and turn the fan off.
Pasty has another EZ tek for dialing in your tub with micropore tape. I would check that out. It's much easier to gauge air flow than guessing with tightening polyfil

Examples of surface moisture from my last grow.

Notice that the beads of moisture didn't evaporate during growth. FAE is the most important pinning trigger

EDIT
I want to point out that my sub surface was actually a little too wet. If you look closely you can spot a few areas where the water started to pool up. You want to avoid pooling water!


--------------------
:amanita2: Substrate surface conditions / Monotub prep and care :sporedrop:

Look around you... Everything you see exists inside the mind.
Consciousness, the awareness that is experiencing this mind,
is peering in from outside the universe.

Our individual experiences are all part of the universe's experience of itself


Edited by ComebackKid (01/04/17 10:35 AM)


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OfflineShrms
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Re: Whats going on in this mini monotub? [Re: ComebackKid]
    #24006634 - 01/13/17 09:28 AM (7 years, 17 days ago)

Quote:

ComebackKid said:
Pasty has another EZ tek for dialing in your tub with micropore tape. I would check that out. It's much easier to gauge air flow than guessing with tightening polyfil




Thanks for your answers and the micropore tape tip. I tried it out and IMHO it is much better than that polyfill stuffing and very easy to apply. And if it's too dry one can just add another layer :thumbup:

I want to give an update about the grow, it turned out to a mutant show:


Despite liner there was a lot of side pinning, some of them growed completely under the substrate:


On one mushroom were some suspicious spots:


My questions:
1: Is the cap on the last picture bacterial?
2: Why are there so much mutant mushrooms? Some growed upside down, sometimes only caps, twins and other weird growth. Is it just genetics or bacterial contamination or a combination?
3: Are they safe to consume or is there any reason not to do that?

Besides the mutants there are also a lot of nice mushrooms, overall yield is about 13 oz (wet) which is ok for me. I dunked the substrate after harvest according to TheChief's TEK and this time applied a thin casing layer which I had over from some trays. I wonder what will happen the next flush (if there is one).


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OfflinePsilosoulful

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Re: Whats going on in this mini monotub? [Re: Shrms]
    #24006692 - 01/13/17 09:58 AM (7 years, 17 days ago)

1: The mushroom in the last picture is fine, just some mycelial fragments in the middle, I've had that happen too.

2: Genetics man, you can't really predict which tubs will spit out a bunch of mutants and which ones will grow normally.
You just have to keep testing out different cultures and go from there.

3: They look good to me, happy trails man :tongue:


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InvisibleComebackKid
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Re: Whats going on in this mini monotub? [Re: Psilosoulful]
    #24006831 - 01/13/17 10:58 AM (7 years, 17 days ago)

Peteyboy had a PE6 tub that looked similar. I think whatever print youre using just has unstable genetics.
Although I have seen contamination make mushrooms grow in weird ways.
Either way theyre safe to consume :thumbup:

Glad everything worked out!


--------------------
:amanita2: Substrate surface conditions / Monotub prep and care :sporedrop:

Look around you... Everything you see exists inside the mind.
Consciousness, the awareness that is experiencing this mind,
is peering in from outside the universe.

Our individual experiences are all part of the universe's experience of itself


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OfflineShrms
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Re: Whats going on in this mini monotub? [Re: ComebackKid]
    #24040982 - 01/26/17 11:15 AM (7 years, 4 days ago)

Hello again,

I want to show what the second flush brought and have some questions again. But first let the pictures speak itself:


I harvested the big one yesterday, for my relations quite a big one :smile:





I am going to harvest everything today and dunk the tub for 1 hour - same procedure as last time.


Unfortunately massive side pinning - again

As you can see there are no mutant mushrooms at all, at least at the surface.  I read somewhere this happens often for PE, but can one say it's a common behaviour for cubensis? Also there are less but bigger mushrooms than I saw on the first flush.

Here are my questions:
1. Is the big mushroom worth to clone or is it still mutant mycelium that just works fine on the second flush?
2. Can I pick healthy spore prints of mutant mushrooms or will they also produce mutant spores?

I really want to have a healthy isolate of this strain and I am not sure which way to go. The problem is I only have 8 year old spore prints, maybe this was the reason for the mutant growth? It took about 2 weeks before they showed first signs of life on my petri dishes.

Here you can see some (mutant) trays I made from the same old print, but in this case I used liquid culture (different to the monotub where I inoculated directly with an agar wedge):



So rather use another 8 year old print and start from scratch than produce a clone or take a fresh print from the mutant genetics?


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InvisiblemushboyMDiscord
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Re: Whats going on in this mini monotub? [Re: Shrms]
    #24041022 - 01/26/17 11:33 AM (7 years, 4 days ago)

this side pins are from the better micro climate between the sub and liner.. the top of your sub should be glistening with moisture. IMO the surface looks way to dry. hence the more humid sides forming pins.

This write by CBK is tits for this.

prints from a mushroom are a genetic reset of sorts. mutant mushroom spores dont give you
mutant shrooms(minus ksss/pe)

if that were the case finding isolates would be easy as f. but it takes time. you basically
grow out a culture on media..do a zillion transfers grow one out.. repeat until you find a
good result... times like 25 times. a clone is a quick way to get 90% chance of roughly
the same results from each grow.

always take spore prints :wink:


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