|
sudly
Quasar Praiser
Registered: 01/05/15
Posts: 11,238
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: Middleman]
#23977975 - 01/03/17 04:29 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
You're more mystical than I am.
-------------------- I am whatever Darwin needs me to be.
|
zzripz
Stranger
Registered: 12/23/08
Posts: 8,292
Loc: Manchester, UK
Last seen: 4 years, 9 months
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: Middleman]
#23978019 - 01/03/17 05:56 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
As I understand it the 'letter' is just carry on patriarchal propaganda which idealizes the saviour as a male divine individual.
I choose to screw up letter and...throw it in the fire.
Done!
|
viktor
psychotechnician
Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand
Last seen: 1 year, 11 months
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: sudly]
#23978076 - 01/03/17 07:04 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
sudly said: Do you think humans are like biological computers? Because I do..
Autism level = overload
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
|
LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: zzripz]
#23978170 - 01/03/17 08:42 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
zzripz said: As I understand it the 'letter' is just carry on patriarchal propaganda which idealizes the saviour as a male divine individual.
I choose to screw up letter and...throw it in the fire.
Done!
The Letter
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
|
redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,061
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: LunarEclipse]
#23978246 - 01/03/17 09:33 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
letter rejected I guess.
-------------------- _ 🧠 _
|
LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: redgreenvines]
#23978298 - 01/03/17 09:52 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
redgreenvines said: letter rejected I guess.
maybe i'm a little old and not wanting to waste time, but into the second page of the letter i just gave up! it seemed to be heading into some argument for a new world order, which i freaking hate.
really though, if you/anyone obviously not you needs that many words, it's just not going to fly. why so many words? can't they make an argument without a wall of text? it gets be like some legal proceeding or something i don't get it.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
|
redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,061
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: LunarEclipse] 2
#23978364 - 01/03/17 10:20 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
philosophers play a glass bead game with "formal" argument, in which they are allowed to be repetitive, obtuse, vague, as long as the form is sensibly addressed - if well received, the argument may be inducted to the greater body of "well thought out arguments", although most seem to be closer to folk art, rough carvings with little merit.
If successful in the form of the medium, philosophers will be respected by their peers, and tolerated by the masses. some get great teaching posts or even their own institutes, and then they can spend their days writing arguments that seem to resolve no issues except for the pride of the institution that supports them.
-------------------- _ 🧠 _
|
LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: redgreenvines]
#23978419 - 01/03/17 10:43 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
redgreenvines said: philosophers play a glass bead game with "formal" argument, in which they are allowed to be repetitive, obtuse, vague, as long as the form is sensibly addressed - if well received, the argument may be inducted to the greater body of "well thought out arguments", although most seem to be closer to folk art, rough carvings with little merit.
If successful in the form of the medium, philosophers will be respected by their peers, and tolerated by the masses. some get great teaching posts or even their own institutes, and then they can spend their days writing arguments that seem to resolve no issues except for the pride of the institution that supports them.
So it's a 501c bunch of shit, in other words.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
|
LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: Middleman]
#23978479 - 01/03/17 11:04 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
proth said:
Quote:
redgreenvines said: philosophers play a glass bead game with "formal" argument, in which they are allowed to be repetitive, obtuse, vague, as long as the form is sensibly addressed - if well received, the argument may be inducted to the greater body of "well thought out arguments", although most seem to be closer to folk art, rough carvings with little merit.
If successful in the form of the medium, philosophers will be respected by their peers, and tolerated by the masses. some get great teaching posts or even their own institutes, and then they can spend their days writing arguments that seem to resolve no issues except for the pride of the institution that supports them.
Rockefeller Foundation grant recipient.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
|
Kurt
Thinker, blinker, writer, typer.
Registered: 11/26/14
Posts: 1,688
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: LunarEclipse]
#23978684 - 01/03/17 12:20 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
He is aligning more with recent narratives, and insinuating something ideological rather than making arguments about the world.
What is the actual statement of "individualism"? How do we come to a new identification with the individual? Is there an actual principle to what this new individualism is?
Just thought I would add something constructive. Fair consensus though.
Only one thing... Lunar Eclipse, since when do you either make or discuss arguments?
|
Middleman
Registered: 07/11/99
Posts: 8,399
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: Kurt]
#23978997 - 01/03/17 02:24 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Good questions. I'm really not interested in social justice. I just liked the last two paragraphs.
|
LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: Kurt]
#23979164 - 01/03/17 03:36 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Kurt said: He is aligning more with recent narratives, and insinuating something ideological rather than making arguments about the world.
What is the actual statement of "individualism"? How do we come to a new identification with the individual? Is there an actual principle to what this new individualism is?
Just thought I would add something constructive. Fair consensus though.
Only one thing... Lunar Eclipse, since when do you either make or discuss arguments?
Since forever. I just use a shit ton less words than you do.
From The Beginning
Edited by LunarEclipse (01/03/17 03:39 PM)
|
Hippocampus
Registered: 04/01/15
Posts: 753
Last seen: 7 years, 16 days
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: Middleman]
#23979267 - 01/03/17 04:17 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
I skimmed over the OP
I have been saying that tribalism is one of the main problems with humanity for a while. Totally agree with that. I'm not sure about all his specific points about how it's worse than religion and using it to debate with new atheists. I'm a bit of a new atheist myself. I don't see the points as mutually exclusive. Religion sucks and tribalism sucks too. Maybe part of why religion sucks so much is because of how much tribalism has seeped into the fabric of theology. But there's the whole basing of worldview off of completely made up nonsense and believing based solely on faith of strange philosophical things that don't make logical sense. That sucks too.
I like that last part about calling each person to action to take on the problems of the world in the ways they can and to grow psychologically, not just stay like adult children wallowing in their little psychological hangups our whole lives.
|
Morel Guy
Stranger
Registered: 01/23/13
Posts: 15,577
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: LunarEclipse]
#23979274 - 01/03/17 04:19 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
I think a lot of it is religion. Religion makes or breaks the tribe. But honestly lot's of things can break a tribe and that is when religion is turned to. If not religion some other theme. Politics and religion get confused. Politics without religion tend to be overly strong.
I think a lot of us in the states have an 'it doesn't matter' theme. A we can't do much or it doesn't involve me. Even if it does matter or involve us there may be no solution.
I hardly see nations or states as tribes. Humans seem to blend wherever they go. We live a little of us and take a little of them. Maybe we aught to simply mix more. But there is so much hate and fear of mixing.
-------------------- "in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur" In filth it will be found in dung it will be found
|
LunarEclipse
Enlil's Official Story
Registered: 10/31/04
Posts: 21,407
Loc: Building 7
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: Morel Guy] 1
#23979282 - 01/03/17 04:23 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Morel Guy said: I think a lot of it is religion. Religion makes or breaks the tribe. But honestly lot's of things can break a tribe and that is when religion is turned to. If not religion some other theme. Politics and religion get confused. Politics without religion tend to be overly strong.
I think a lot of us in the states have an 'it doesn't matter' theme. A we can't do much or it doesn't involve me. Even if it does matter or involve us there may be no solution.
I hardly see nations or states as tribes. Humans seem to blend wherever they go. We live a little of us and take a little of them. Maybe we aught to simply mix more. But there is so much hate and fear of mixing.
Some other theme, indeed. The herd mentality is strong. Nowadays, you can be a part of a herd but be separated by geography. We hear of all the commonality of the internet.
I think there is fear of real intimacy real blending you think it would be easy but it's not.
-------------------- Anxiety is what you make it.
|
Rahz
Alive Again
Registered: 11/10/05
Posts: 9,297
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: Middleman]
#23980869 - 01/04/17 09:17 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
I very much agree with everything Peterson says except his conclusion. A person cannot take the world on their shoulders. It's an idea that stems from the notion that not everyone is going to try so therefore others must try harder. If he got his wish and everyone did try and learn to simply be the idealized individual there would be no need for taking the world on our shoulders.
-------------------- rahz comfort pleasure power love truth awareness peace "The object of opening the mind, as of opening the mouth, is to shut it again on something solid." - Gilbert Keith Chesterton
|
dodgem
Learner
Registered: 08/04/11
Posts: 2,683
Last seen: 8 months, 10 days
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: Rahz]
#23982991 - 01/05/17 02:34 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
--------------------
Walk where you like your steps
|
BlueCoyote
Beyond
Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 6,697
Loc: Between
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: dodgem]
#23984125 - 01/05/17 02:52 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Giving = Socialism
|
akira_akuma
Φύσις κρύπτεσθαι ὕψιστος φιλεῖ
Registered: 08/28/09
Posts: 82,455
Loc: Onypeirophóros
Last seen: 4 years, 2 months
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: BlueCoyote]
#23989238 - 01/07/17 11:20 AM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
this thread just shows how confused this "paradigm shift" is.
Peterson is anti-SJW...yet here he is...preaching like one. but then again, i like his message more...not entirely...just more...yet he thinks he is 100% spot-on with his "divinity". just sort of confused.
no one even knows if what their proposals are really are workable. they just assume it can be.
Quote:
Philosophy is a akin to a shovel at an archeological dig. Psychology is like a mallet. More coarser grained tools are in order sometimes to uncover understanding. Broaden your toolset.
oversimplification. you don't use one or the other, you use both.
|
redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,061
|
Re: Dr. Jordan B. Peterson's New Year’s Letter to the World [Re: akira_akuma]
#23989454 - 01/07/17 12:37 PM (7 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
get a leatherman if you need a good tool for an unspecified purpose.
-------------------- _ 🧠 _
|
|