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OfflineKulkulcan
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Registered: 05/04/16
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refrigerate to pause colonization anytime?
    #23968616 - 12/30/16 04:44 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I guess if you wanted to, you could go from PF jars to G2G to bulk substrate to casing.

But could you pause colonization anywhere you wanted to along that chain of events by putting everything in the fridge?

How about in the freezer? Would that kill the mycelium?


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OfflineHamHead
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: Kulkulcan]
    #23968710 - 12/30/16 05:29 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

:takingnotes:

I've got some jars I'd like to put off for a week until I can get to them, they're almost %100.

:popcorn:


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Invisibler.lutece
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: HamHead]
    #23968924 - 12/30/16 07:05 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

The freezer would severely stunt the mycelium. I don't think it would permanently kill it, but the ice crystals forming in the fungal cells would cause them to burst. It's the same reason we have a lot of trouble successfully reviving animals after putting them into cryogenic stasis. The whole organism must be frozen quickly enough to avoid the crystallization of water within the cells.

The fridge is another story. While growth won't be completely halted under refrigeration, it will be slowed dramatically. Think of it as slow-mo growing. So while you couldn't leave them there forever an expect them not to grow at all, you'll buy yourself quite a bit of time. Keep in mind that they will take a day or two to kick back into gear once brought back into the growing area.


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One goes into an experiment knowing one might fail.
But one does not undertake an experiment knowing one HAS failed.


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OfflineKulkulcan
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: r.lutece]
    #23969056 - 12/30/16 07:52 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

If they're only slowed down in the fridge, rather than completely dormant, then would fully colonized PF jars still be good after 2 to 4 months in the fridge?


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OfflinePinPornProducer
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: Kulkulcan]
    #23969088 - 12/30/16 08:03 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I don't know about pf jars but I've kept grain jar masters in the fridge for 6 months. I once found a 14 month old jar of spawn hiding in the fridge. I g2g it, spawned em and they fruited just fine


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InvisibleMunchauzen
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: PinPornProducer]
    #23969114 - 12/30/16 08:11 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I had several jars of KSS i kept in the back of my fridge for 6 months while I had an unexpected house guest. heres a pic of when I tried to use it.



the issue wasnt the spawn was contaminated, but rather just super weak. you can tell by the fruits that the culture itself wasn't contaminated. mold deforms fruits in a distinctive way. those fruits came out fine.


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OfflineKulkulcan
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: Munchauzen]
    #23971898 - 12/31/16 09:30 PM (7 years, 30 days ago)

If you say the spawn wasn't contaminated, fine, but doesn't that kind of look like Trichoderma?

But anyway, if spawn is weak just from being dormant for a long time, wouldn't it eventually recover its vitality once it was actively growing in a good environment again for a while?


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OfflinePinPornProducer
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: Kulkulcan]
    #23971910 - 12/31/16 09:36 PM (7 years, 30 days ago)



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InvisibleMunchauzen
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: Kulkulcan]
    #23972452 - 01/01/17 07:59 AM (7 years, 29 days ago)

Quote:

Kulkulcan said:
If you say the spawn wasn't contaminated, fine, but doesn't that kind of look like Trichoderma?

But anyway, if spawn is weak just from being dormant for a long time, wouldn't it eventually recover its vitality once it was actively growing in a good environment again for a while?



it is trichoderma. it colonized those tubs after i spawned them, not before.

cultures can be revived by giving them different nutritional mixes across several agar transfers, but in no way would i ever recommend using old spawn. culture can be revived, spawn you are best off not trying, imo.


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OfflineSloppyJoseph
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: Munchauzen]
    #23972572 - 01/01/17 09:27 AM (7 years, 29 days ago)

I wouldn't "pause" your colonization anytime before 100%. Just like food eventually goes bad in the fridge, throwing a jar in at 30% gives the grains a huge window for the endospores to take hold, potentially fucking your spawn. At 100% though you can toss that guy in the fridge and buy yourself a few weeks no problem. Of course, you risk weakening the spawn a little but it should be fine to most standards.


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OfflineKulkulcan
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: SloppyJoseph]
    #23973983 - 01/01/17 07:23 PM (7 years, 29 days ago)

Quote:

PinPornProducer said:
14 month old spawn



      Quite cool, but as bw86 observed:


Quote:

bw86 said:
i have found that grain jars last much longer than even petri dishes in the fridge.



      ...or much longer than PF jars as well, I guess...


Quote:

SloppyJoseph said:
At 100% though you can toss that guy in the fridge and buy yourself a few weeks no problem. Of course, you risk weakening the spawn a little but it should be fine to most standards.



      So, 100% colonized PF jars in the fridge for 2 to 4 months, it sounds like maybe that's too long? Maybe they should be thrown out.


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OfflineSloppyJoseph
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: Kulkulcan]
    #23974002 - 01/01/17 07:30 PM (7 years, 29 days ago)

Not sure what you are trying to figure out, but if you plan to keep a pftek jar in the fridge for 4 months yeah, maybe you should just wait until 3 months from now and then do another round of half pint jars.

But I thought you were asking hypothetical in terms of using a pf jar to inoculate grains for bulk application. If you did that with currently 100% jars, then waited the 2 weeks ~ until your grain jars colonized, then at 100% stuck them in the fridge for a month or 2 it would be a good way to save a couple good pf jars and be able to expand to bulk and get a good amount of mushrooms in a couple months.


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OfflineKulkulcan
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: SloppyJoseph]
    #23974052 - 01/01/17 07:49 PM (7 years, 29 days ago)

If you already had PF jars, that had first been 100% colonized, and then put in the fridge for 2 to 4 months, would the mycelium in those jars still be strong enough to use to inoculate loose grains for bulk application?


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OfflineFerather
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: Kulkulcan]
    #23975533 - 01/02/17 09:53 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Should still colonize at 2°C, and still be fully aggressive. Low temperature digestion does have benefits.
Freezing causes water to expand, weak mycelium and weak genetics "could" be destroyed.

Never seen cubensis fruit below 8°C, so you are safe to fridge store it.


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InvisiblemagicMerlin
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Re: refrigerate to pause colonization anytime? [Re: Ferather]
    #23976516 - 01/02/17 03:26 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

I haven't refrigerated grains, but I've had bad times refrigerating plates. Most were 3-6 months old, some older. All were healthy going in, and looked healthy before I used them. Super slow and weak recovery on grains. The ones that did end up colonizing were the biggest disappointments I've ever had, growing more mold than mushrooms.

Since then I haven't put a single thing in my fridge, but I've heard people recover/invigorate old refrigerated cultures by transferring them to another media first.

Quote:

Kulkulcan said:
If you already had PF jars, that had first been 100% colonized, and then put in the fridge for 2 to 4 months, would the mycelium in those jars still be strong enough to use to inoculate loose grains for bulk application?




I wouldn't


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