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OfflineShinto Wanderer
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First time...probably less than ideal....**NEW PICS***
    #23967175 - 12/30/16 01:43 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I tried this whole thing around 2000...didnt get past getting the syringes in the mail...

Part 2

I'm following the Willy Myco videos on you tube.  Which is basically a PF tek.

I wanted to give this another go since I've got some time on my hands.  I got a B+ print from a supplier on here (I don't know how to give credit without issues...lets just say they're proud of their new name and webpage) earlier this month.  Everything arrived great and in great condition.  The new stealth worked/was unchecked.  About 20 days later I decided to start this process.  Gathered all my supplies and substitutes as needed.  I couldn't find brown rice flour so I made it in the vitamix (more on this later).  My vermiculite seems to be a bit courses than normal, but was the finer of the two they had.  I didn't have a pot big enough to do all my jars at once so I had one straggler that was done separately (more later).  I made my own syringe (more later) and shot up the jars a few minutes ago.

The GOOD:
Took the leap this time and got it rolling
Made a nice SAB (arm holes may be a little too big, but not much)
Practiced good sterile procedures throughout, lots of alcohol, wiping, and torching
Made my own syringe (way easier, but trickier than I thought...I have a better plan next time)

The NEUTRAL:
SAB arm holes a little big
Jars are short 250ml wide body
The needle seemed to clog when trying to 'noc the centre hole in my lids
I used one time use sterile swabs (individually packed) to make the syringe instead of a loop
Vermiculite is slightly courser than other pictures I've seen

The BAD:
During steaming, I let one of the pots run out of water for a short time.  It was the smaller of the two sets.
Couldn't steam all the jars at once (a pot that large in Japan will cost about 40-80usd, don't even ask about a PC that big)
2 Jars (the two where the water boiled off) were left on the counter to cool while a final jar steamed and cooled in the pot
Vermiculite is courser (this may not be a problem)
DIY BRF.  I don't think I got it at fine as a production stone mill would.  I think this affected the water absorption as my sub looks wetter than others, but doesn't drip when pressed.
When making the syringe I may have touched the bottom of the SAB with the swab (although everything was wiped several times with alcohol.
When using the syringe I may have backwashed and let needle contents into the reservoir.
I'm growing in central Japan and the house gets a little cool at night.  Right now the children are in the living room by the double pane windows.  As I understand it...this will just slow growth but may result in larger tougher fruits.

Next time...

I think I'll do the agar and tiger drop method.  No more messing with syringes and sterile water.  Also weeds out infected growth sooner.


Edited by Shinto Wanderer (03/14/17 05:29 AM)


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OfflineNDStepp84
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Shinto Wanderer]
    #23967530 - 12/30/16 08:58 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

SAB holes a little too big




No such thing:thumbup:


--------------------

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do.
-Robert A. Heinlein 

:takingnotes: Links and teks:takingnotes:
ND's grow log and discussion
Plant thread


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Invisibler.lutece
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: NDStepp84]
    #23967750 - 12/30/16 10:34 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

The verm probably isn't super coarse if it was the finer of the two grades, which means it's fine to use.

DIY BRF is actually preferable to store bought as it doesn't pack together so tightly because the particles aren't as fine. Some growers use 50/50 whole brown rice/BRF flour to get a mix of dense nutrition and aeration, since the BRF is actually on the cusp of being overly nutritious for the cubes. Much of its nutrition will go unused.

I wouldn't worry about the syringe swab touching the floor of the SAB; spores start out dirty already, so if you did add contams to the syringe, it was probably minutely more than what was already there.

As long as they don't have to deal with <65°F for long (more than a couple hours each night), they should be fine. Anything under 55-60°F and I would consider moving them away from the window.

Use your fuckups as learning experiences. What worked for you, what didn't, etc. All of this is good for how to proceed next time you do it.


--------------------
One goes into an experiment knowing one might fail.
But one does not undertake an experiment knowing one HAS failed.


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OfflineShinto Wanderer
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: r.lutece]
    #23969229 - 12/30/16 09:00 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

One more little test I ran on this project...

One the majority of the jars I used crystal geyser mineral water (it what they have in the vending machine).  On a couple I used tap water.  My thinking was that chlorinated, brominated, fluoridated, iodined, and ozone blasted water can't be good for trying to grow microorganisms.  I figured mineral water was closer to rain water than what comes out of the faucet.  Hmm...maybe I'll try collecting and boiling rain water one time....


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OfflineShinto Wanderer
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Shinto Wanderer]
    #23972043 - 12/31/16 11:07 PM (7 years, 30 days ago)

Is condensation normal on the inside of these jars?  I followed the BRF recipe or 2:1:1.


Edited by Shinto Wanderer (01/01/17 05:09 AM)


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OfflineShinto Wanderer
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Shinto Wanderer]
    #23993776 - 01/08/17 08:55 PM (7 years, 22 days ago)

10 days in, nothing interesting to report.  No ick is growing, I guess thats good.  Seems like the sub is kind of clumping together in there.  Don't think I see any growth.  I have a feeling its too cold on the floor.  I read B+ is slow.  When should I start worrying?  Are these still good even if too cold?  Can I just warm up the area and bring some life back into these jars?


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InvisiblemushboyMDiscord
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Shinto Wanderer]
    #23993781 - 01/08/17 08:57 PM (7 years, 22 days ago)

pic?


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OfflineShinto Wanderer
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: mushboy]
    #23993903 - 01/08/17 09:47 PM (7 years, 22 days ago)

Heres 3 of 9



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OfflineShinto Wanderer
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Shinto Wanderer]
    #23993920 - 01/08/17 09:53 PM (7 years, 22 days ago)

My two worries at this point are temperature and making the syringe.  I KNOW spores are measured in microns and a spore print has bajillions of spores, but I worry if I got enough.  I used a surgical swab and gave the print a good scrub with it before swishing it in a new syringe filled with DI water.  There was a little color on the swab indicating I definitely got SOME spores.  I expected more of a powdery print....this was like it was actually printed on the foil.

Its winter and the room they're in can get down to the high 40s after we shut down the heat at about 11 pm or 12 am.


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InvisiblemushboyMDiscord
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Shinto Wanderer] * 1
    #23994029 - 01/08/17 10:54 PM (7 years, 22 days ago)

jars look decent.i prefer a chunkier pf jar(when i did pf) just be patient. growing mushrooms is a 'hurry up and wait' game. you try to inoculate as quick as possible and then nothing for weeks. use the time to read and learn.

and watch cat videos on youtube


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OfflineShinto Wanderer
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: mushboy]
    #23994050 - 01/08/17 11:07 PM (7 years, 22 days ago)

Cat videos....nice

I just worry about the variables I've outlined on this thread. Mostly the diy brf and the syringe. I expected a black floaty syringe like what you get when you buy from vendors.


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Offlinelovelaughlibs
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Shinto Wanderer]
    #23994060 - 01/08/17 11:12 PM (7 years, 22 days ago)

The tiniest visible speck of spores is probably hundreds of thousands, you definitely got enough. Patience, spores can take more than 2 weeks to germinate sometimes. Don't fiddle with your jars or you'll damage the dry verm layer which is the only real protection the substrate has vs contams. Turning my jars too much is what fucked my first grow after I waited so long for partial colonisation :sad:


--------------------
Ask and ye shall receive; Seek and ye shall find.


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OfflineShinto Wanderer
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: lovelaughlibs]
    #23994162 - 01/09/17 12:04 AM (7 years, 22 days ago)

They've had to be moved a couple tines for various reasons.  Always carefully and never tipped.  I also rotate them around while sitting flat to take a look at whats going on.  The dry layer never moved in any of them when I did anything.


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InvisibleAdden
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Shinto Wanderer]
    #23994268 - 01/09/17 01:44 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

The more you touch them or move them, the more chance you have of comprising your filter.


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OnlineLogicaL ChaosM
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Shinto Wanderer]
    #23994301 - 01/09/17 02:20 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

Your jars look kinda wet, but could be the vermiculite.

A lil drier cakes are better than too wet cakes.

And dont give up on syringes yet. It takes practice to get down, just like all techniques.


--------------------
"What you must understand is that your physical dimension affects everyone in the higher dimensions as well. All things are interconnected. All things are One. Therefore, if one dimension is broken or out of balance, then all other dimensions will experience repercussions." - Pleiadian Prophecy 2020 The New Golden Age by James Carwin

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InvisibleAdden
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Shinto Wanderer]
    #23994337 - 01/09/17 03:12 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

I PC a pasty plate of water, with paper towel and all over it, PC with plates and stuff, remove wet paper towel in SAB and let 2 layers of tape dry.. when I'm in there crack the lid gently, use a sterile swab to drop spores in it. I let it sit for awhile while I unwrap my PC'd syringes, wipe down, put into SAB, gear back up and stab a flaming hot needle in the micropore and withdraw. Repeat with others and use the same hole. Burning micropore stinks and you won't jostle it around sending contaminates everywhere. I have a 95% rate. I use the swab with leftover spores to streak plates. On a clean print it works great.

***
Oh and never rest something down on the towel at the bottom of your SAB. It's where all the dirty shit falls and sticks. Then you pick up a dirty tool and it's on everything else you touch.


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InvisibleAdden
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Adden]
    #23994339 - 01/09/17 03:15 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

Oh and that's probably the worst way to make them but it works out for me.


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OfflineShinto Wanderer
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: LogicaL Chaos]
    #23994349 - 01/09/17 03:33 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

There ARE water droplets on the inside of the glass.  I followed the recipe and used the kitchenaid mixer to make sure everything was mixed well.  I premixed the dry, mixed in the water slowly, and covered with foil during the steaming process.

I also am thinking...wetter may be a little better considering the dryness of winter and running dry heaters.  My humidifier/filter machine reads between 40-70% humidity in the house.


Edited by Shinto Wanderer (01/09/17 03:35 AM)


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Offlinelovelaughlibs
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: Shinto Wanderer] * 1
    #23994498 - 01/09/17 07:04 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

Quote:

Shinto Wanderer said:
There ARE water droplets on the inside of the glass.  I followed the recipe and used the kitchenaid mixer to make sure everything was mixed well.  I premixed the dry, mixed in the water slowly, and covered with foil during the steaming process.

I also am thinking...wetter may be a little better considering the dryness of winter and running dry heaters.  My humidifier/filter machine reads between 40-70% humidity in the house.



For future reference, you should mix the verm and water first, THEN add the BRF. Your goal is to coat the verm in a layer of BRF that's evenly distributed.


--------------------
Ask and ye shall receive; Seek and ye shall find.


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OfflineShinto Wanderer
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Re: First time...probably less than ideal.... [Re: lovelaughlibs]
    #23996603 - 01/09/17 08:59 PM (7 years, 21 days ago)

Very interesting. There's no mention of that method anywhere. Maybe I'll try that on the next lot.


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