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Offlinesunshine
Sin18DwireWuTang


Registered: 04/03/04
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Does anyone here have perma-ego death?
    #23965980 - 12/29/16 04:07 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I tried with high doses.  I found they make my ego stronger, because I am a lone gunman on the high plains and no one can rock my world.  I think the best way to achieve ego death would to take a lot of LSD over a long period of time.


--------------------
One Love True Indeed.  Have Good Trips.  Mike/sunshine's mom.


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OfflinePeyote Road
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: sunshine]
    #23966190 - 12/29/16 05:55 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

why would you want perma ego death? you need a little ego to function in the world. Just let it become transparent.


--------------------
The path of the herbalist is to open ourselves to nature in an innocent and pure way. SHe in turn will open her bounty and reward us with many valuable secrets. May the earth bless you. - Michael Tierra


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Offlinehealing
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: Peyote Road]
    #23966230 - 12/29/16 06:15 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

If anyone did, they wouldn't be on the site because they couldn't use a computer.


--------------------
Open mind, open heart, open book.



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Offlinepsychedelicliz
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: healing]
    #23966265 - 12/29/16 06:28 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

No, but I can act really, really boring if I need to fake it. :cool:


--------------------
Psychedelic Memes and articles.
http://www.acideffects.com



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InvisibleBill_Oreilly
ANIMALS (the RAINBOW SERPENT)


Registered: 11/12/11
Posts: 26,370
Loc: Boston
Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: psychedelicliz]
    #23966429 - 12/29/16 07:36 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

No such thing as ego death just as how there is no level 5 trip


--------------------
Something there is mysteriously formed,
Existing before Heaven and Earth,
Silent, still, standing alone, unchanging,
All-pervading, unfailing,
I do not know its name; I call it tao.
If forced to give it a name, I call it
Great (ta). Being great, it flows out;
Flowing out means far-reaching;
Being far-reaching, it is said to return.


It's just a shot away..


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Offlinesunshine
Sin18DwireWuTang


Registered: 04/03/04
Posts: 43,592
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: Bill_Oreilly]
    #23966450 - 12/29/16 07:45 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Level 5 trips backfire.  I'm telling you.


--------------------
One Love True Indeed.  Have Good Trips.  Mike/sunshine's mom.


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Invisiblenooneman
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: sunshine]
    #23966537 - 12/29/16 08:13 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Egodeath on mushrooms to me just refers to the point at which the effects are so strong that you no longer have any conscious control over your own mind and are so totally overrun by mindfuck that you in some sense cease to be as you lose all control over your own mind. A state of kindof mental whiteout. Obviously you wouldn't be able to function meaningfully in such a state any more than someone in a coma.


Edited by nooneman (12/29/16 08:17 PM)


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OfflineAuroraBorealis88
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: sunshine]
    #23966916 - 12/29/16 10:14 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

As long as you are living you are going to have an ego, psychedelics only temporarily decrease activity in the brain region responsible for sense of self.

The point of ego death isn't to rid yourself of the ego it's to show you/remind you that you HAVE one and that it's simply a mechanism put there for survival.


Edited by AuroraBorealis88 (12/29/16 10:16 PM)


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InvisibleThe Blind Ass
Bodhi
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: AuroraBorealis88] * 1
    #23967008 - 12/29/16 10:59 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

:micdrop:


--------------------
Give me Liberty caps -or- give me Death caps


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Offlinekrypto2000
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: The Blind Ass]
    #23967105 - 12/30/16 12:27 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Have you tried meditation? I could get in a similar state akin to psychedelics, but more at will and generally longer lasting. I don't want to say ego death because that has a lot of muksha around it, but that feeling of oneness, a merging with the other, a deep level of empathy and understanding, general insight, etc. It also came with the same set of downsides as psychedelics I found though and can take a lot of practice to get anywhere, but it can be well worth it.


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OfflinePlazmotech
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: krypto2000]
    #23967196 - 12/30/16 02:06 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Hey Krypto, glad to see you outside the chemistry forum :smile: what are your methods for meditating? I've tried but my mind is just so active it's very hard.


--------------------
When a man lies, he murders some part of the world.
These are the pale deaths which men miscall there lives.
All this I cannot bear to witness any longer.
Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?
Plazmotech's Kratom Grow


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Offlinethelastoneleft
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: Bill_Oreilly]
    #23967254 - 12/30/16 03:08 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Bill_Oreilly said:
No such thing as ego death just as how there is no level 5 trip




agree


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Offlinethelastoneleft
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: krypto2000]
    #23967258 - 12/30/16 03:13 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

krypto2000 said:
Have you tried meditation? I could get in a similar state akin to psychedelics, but more at will and generally longer lasting. I don't want to say ego death because that has a lot of muksha around it, but that feeling of oneness, a merging with the other, a deep level of empathy and understanding, general insight, etc. It also came with the same set of downsides as psychedelics I found though and can take a lot of practice to get anywhere, but it can be well worth it.




I am very close to one of the few grand master in QI gong and meditation, just breathe, sounds easy, would be the first and only step.


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OfflineMushroomBilly
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: Plazmotech]
    #23967260 - 12/30/16 03:19 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I once took what i thought was a pretty average dose of fresh mushrooms and as the trip deepened, I completely forgot who i was - couldn't remember my name or anything else about myself. I sat on the edge of my bed asking over and over, 'Who am I? Who am I?? Where am I? What am i doing here? Who am I??'. I felt like the mushroom was playing with me tho - teaching me about my ego which perhaps wasn't completely dead as there was some concern over my state. If the ego died and the body went with then fair enough, but what we are doing here is killing the ego and leaving the body fully functioning which i believe causes a disharmony and some concern - if not from the ego then from the soul, which remains firmly planted in this 3D reality, unprotected by the ego. If anything, the experience reminded me of being a newborn. I've never experienced the same thing again neither on higher or lower doses. It's worth noting however, that there was no way i could function as a normal human being in that state. I've seen psychiatric patients in similar states too and it doesn't look good - they look very scared and confused.


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InvisibleDualWieldRake
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: MushroomBilly]
    #23967272 - 12/30/16 03:36 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

don't do drugs kids, you may get stuck in the trip forever


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OfflineMushroomBilly
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: MushroomBilly]
    #23967274 - 12/30/16 03:37 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Just thinking about this since my last post and it's got me wondering about what part the body plays in all of this. We know the body and mind are extrinsically linked, so when we take away the ego from the mind (hypothetically speaking, as we don't know if this is even possible) are there still nevertheless memories and emotions stored in the muscles, tissues and bones of the body? I hear about people having functional deep massages (Rolfing etc) and laughing out loud or crying uncontrollably when certain muscle are worked on. So this comes back to the same point - we may be able to shut down the ego to some extent with these drugs, but whilst the body is still functioning, there must still be some sense of self...


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OfflineMushroomBilly
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: DualWieldRake]
    #23967276 - 12/30/16 03:41 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

DualWieldRake said:
don't do drugs kids, you may get stuck in the trip forever




I know, i know. But the mushroom is just so enticing - it has so much to offer - it's like forbidden fruit.


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OfflinePlazmotech
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: MushroomBilly] * 1
    #23967288 - 12/30/16 04:07 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MushroomBilly said:
Quote:

DualWieldRake said:
don't do drugs kids, you may get stuck in the trip forever




I know, i know. But the mushroom is just so enticing - it has so much to offer - it's like forbidden fruit.




Pretty sure he's kidding. You cant get stuck in a trip. As your body metabolizes the psilocin the trip goes away.


--------------------
When a man lies, he murders some part of the world.
These are the pale deaths which men miscall there lives.
All this I cannot bear to witness any longer.
Cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home?
Plazmotech's Kratom Grow


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OfflineMushroomBilly
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: Plazmotech]
    #23967292 - 12/30/16 04:10 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Plazmotech said:
Quote:

MushroomBilly said:
Quote:

DualWieldRake said:
don't do drugs kids, you may get stuck in the trip forever




I know, i know. But the mushroom is just so enticing - it has so much to offer - it's like forbidden fruit.




Pretty sure he's kidding. You cant get stuck in a trip. As your body metabolizes the psilocin the trip goes away.




I was a little tongue in cheek myself there :thumbup:

Everyone's heard a rumour of some guy who never returned tho ... :eek:


Edited by MushroomBilly (12/30/16 04:11 AM)


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Offlinebeforethedawn
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: MushroomBilly] * 2
    #23967313 - 12/30/16 04:40 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

So there is ego self and Self. Self (capital) is absolute and is Who everything and everyone returns to when the egoic identity is forgotten, generally through constant attention to it (self-inquiry). Ultimately the egoic identity is not real so focusing on it means you begin to identify, instead, with the Witness of the non-existent ego.

Ha...

So I mean language fails us, but I tried.

Anyway ego loss is achievable and permanent, but I doubt God can be permanently realised by abusing your brain with a molecule, you might get other powers from that, such as heightened perception and interconnectedness in the brain leading to higher consciousness, but you won't permanently fall into God. I think this comes through Divine Grace after long austerities, though sometimes spontaneously. We are too abused as children by abused parents and an infantile society to just fall into God naturally. In this age...

The bliss can be lost by generating negativity but once the ego is revealed as an illusion, there is a subtle sense of nothingness. You encapsulate your experience of self/body/mind/world (all the same thing) as the Witness.

So yeah.

Have a nice day, you will. :yoda2:


--------------------
Hostile humankind
Can't you see you're fucking blind?


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OfflineWarrior_Monk
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: beforethedawn]
    #23967337 - 12/30/16 05:19 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

beforethedawn said:
So there is ego self and Self. Self (capital) is absolute and is Who everything and everyone returns to when the egoic identity is forgotten, generally through constant attention to it (self-inquiry). Ultimately the egoic identity is not real so focusing on it means you begin to identify, instead, with the Witness of the non-existent ego.

Ha...

So I mean language fails us, but I tried.

Anyway ego loss is achievable and permanent, but I doubt God can be permanently realised by abusing your brain with a molecule, you might get other powers from that, such as heightened perception and interconnectedness in the brain leading to higher consciousness, but you won't permanently fall into God. I think this comes through Divine Grace after long austerities, though sometimes spontaneously. We are too abused as children by abused parents and an infantile society to just fall into God naturally. In this age...

The bliss can be lost by generating negativity but once the ego is revealed as an illusion, there is a subtle sense of nothingness. You encapsulate your experience of self/body/mind/world (all the same thing) as the Witness.

So yeah.

Have a nice day, you will. :yoda2:



Beautifully explained, I had to say it :thumbup:


--------------------
This is how you know if I'm tripping:mushroom2::
"what?"
"hey hey hey you got to do this"
"what?"


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InvisibleSatya


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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: sunshine]
    #23967363 - 12/30/16 05:57 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I don't think it's possible to have permanent ego-loss from taking any amount of psychedelics.

Seeing ego-loss as an achievement may not be the best way to approach it, as who would be achieving it?

The ego is more of a mentally created illusion than a solid entity, apart from thoughts that associate consciousness with an individual form it doesn't really exist... trying to remove the ego can even just be another way to perpetuate egoic thinking. Instead of thinking this or that has to happen first, why not just be true to yourself here and now?


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Offlinesunshine
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: Satya]
    #23967557 - 12/30/16 09:13 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Let's look at Doc Timothy Leary.  He took over 1000 trips, mostly 300 mcg LSD trips.  If anyone could do it it's Doc Tim.


--------------------
One Love True Indeed.  Have Good Trips.  Mike/sunshine's mom.


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OfflineAuroraBorealis88
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: Plazmotech]
    #23967797 - 12/30/16 10:48 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Plazmotech said:
Hey Krypto, glad to see you outside the chemistry forum :smile: what are your methods for meditating? I've tried but my mind is just so active it's very hard.




Try the Sa Ta Ma Na method.

It takes a lot of practice to quiet the mind.


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Offlinekrypto2000
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: Plazmotech]
    #23967843 - 12/30/16 11:02 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Plazmotech said:
Hey Krypto, glad to see you outside the chemistry forum :smile: what are your methods for meditating? I've tried but my mind is just so active it's very hard.




I first learned about meditation through a couple of zen books so I do shikantaza ('just sitting) and walking meditation. I am Buddhist, but not zen, I just liked their simple approach to things. Shikantaza is just like the name says, just sitting, there is no real focus, you just sit and pay attention. In some ways it's more difficult because there is no set object to bring your attention to when your mind wonders, you just watch the mind wander, trying to be mindful of everything that is going on, but it's about as simple as you can get. I later started walking meditation to mix things up and because when I was meditating a lot my knees would swell and hurt.


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OfflineGRAVE
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: Bill_Oreilly]
    #23968199 - 12/30/16 01:46 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I have never thought of ego death as intended to be a perpetual state.  Ive always considered it to be more of a trial for the psychonaut and visionary mind.

To me ego death is simply the state where your sense of self dissolves so there is no longer a seperation between yourself and the universe around you.  The exploratory single minded consciousness of the psychonaut is replaced by the sea of consciousness pervading the universe.

The senses are so vastly overwhelmed by input that the human mind decides it's better to let go and experience that universal oneness outside of time then to feebly attempt to process the experience all by themselves.

Once the trip ends, there is no enlightenment or blissful state that stretches to the end of your life, you simply have the knowledge and wisdom gained by being stripped down to a single drop of consciousness in a vast ocean. To me that is classical ego death.

This is possible and many people including myself have gone through it.

Quote:

Bill_Oreilly said:
No such thing as ego death just as how there is no level 5 trip




Care to explain?


--------------------


Journeys taken: Psilocybe cubensis, Psilocybe Cyanescens, MDMA, MDA, Methylone, San Pedro, Ketamine, Anesket, Peruvian torch, LSD, 25c, DMT, Float tank, Yerbamina.


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OfflineSonicTitan
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: GRAVE]
    #23968248 - 12/30/16 02:16 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Dead people have perma-ego death.

You cant lose an ego but maybe over time it can change? I dont know, I am still the same person I was as a teen but maybe the fact our thought processes change and inflections that we put on life change over the years maybe thast is a type of changing in personality.


--------------------
"We are a way for the cosmos to know itself."



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OfflineAuroraBorealis88
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: GRAVE]
    #23968252 - 12/30/16 02:19 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

GRAVE said:
Quote:

Bill_Oreilly said:
No such thing as ego death just as how there is no level 5 trip




Care to explain?




Yeah I'm curious as to why Bill thinks there's no such thing as a level 5 trip. It's just a way we categorize effects after the fact it isn't necessarily like "actual levels" per say.


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Offlinepsychedelicliz
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: krypto2000]
    #23968427 - 12/30/16 03:22 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Some modern teachers of meditation and qigong (like Mantak Chia) recommend sitting meditation preformed in a chair to avoid knee damage that is very common with full lotus posture. :heart: 

Some (like Dr. Glenn Morris) recommend half lotus or seiza (japanese style sitting on folded knees) for knee protection while retaining a more traditional "sitting on the ground" feel. :stoned:

Interesting insights on just sitting btw. :sun:


--------------------
Psychedelic Memes and articles.
http://www.acideffects.com



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OfflinePeyote Road
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: MushroomBilly]
    #23968463 - 12/30/16 03:35 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

MushroomBilly said:
Just thinking about this since my last post and it's got me wondering about what part the body plays in all of this. We know the body and mind are extrinsically linked, so when we take away the ego from the mind (hypothetically speaking, as we don't know if this is even possible) are there still nevertheless memories and emotions stored in the muscles, tissues and bones of the body? I hear about people having functional deep massages (Rolfing etc) and laughing out loud or crying uncontrollably when certain muscle are worked on. So this comes back to the same point - we may be able to shut down the ego to some extent with these drugs, but whilst the body is still functioning, there must still be some sense of self...




Yes, but I believe it is possible to see things properly so you see from your point of view that there is a sense of self in the body but you know "that is just the sense of self stuck in the body through memory". So basically, even though its there it doesnt cause trouble because you see it for what it is.

Ranana Maharshi spoke about the ego as the sense of self that causes trouble, not the sense of self. If it doesn't cause you trouble, there is nothing wrong with having an ego.


--------------------
The path of the herbalist is to open ourselves to nature in an innocent and pure way. SHe in turn will open her bounty and reward us with many valuable secrets. May the earth bless you. - Michael Tierra


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InvisibleAstralAndrew
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: nooneman]
    #23972966 - 01/01/17 12:56 PM (7 years, 29 days ago)

Quote:

nooneman said:
Egodeath on mushrooms to me just refers to the point at which the effects are so strong that you no longer have any conscious control over your own mind and are so totally overrun by mindfuck that you in some sense cease to be as you lose all control over your own mind. A state of kindof mental whiteout. Obviously you wouldn't be able to function meaningfully in such a state any more than someone in a coma.



Qft x50


--------------------
:dawerp::awepreciation::trippinbawelz::raveface::aweyeah::awecid:

"The opposite for courage is not cowardice, it is conformity. Even a dead fish can go with the flow." - Jim Hightower


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Offlinequagmire
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: AstralAndrew]
    #23974354 - 01/01/17 09:59 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

it would make this interaction impossible


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Offlineendogenous
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: quagmire]
    #23974879 - 01/02/17 02:19 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Everyone keeps talking about "ego-death", but it seems to elude them that the goal of Spiritual Enlighenment is to get beyond "death". "Nirvana" or "Eternal Life" is the state of no longer being subject to "death".

It is my belief that what most people are calling "ego-death" is actually not what is happening. How can you expect to be able to use the terms of a person who thought cocaine could cure people of opiate addiction when talking about Entheogens, which Freud knew nothing about?

"There is the Path of Wisdom and the path of ignorance. They are far apart and lead to different ends...
        Abiding in the midst of ignorance, thinking themselves wise and learned, fools go hither and thither, like blind led by the blind.
        What is beyond earthly life shines not to those who are childish, or careless, or deluded by wealth. 'This is the only world: there is no other', they say; and thus they go from death to death.
" --Katha Upanishad (Hindu)


--------------------
The Day of the Lord has come like a thief in the night. -- It is there but no one knows it.


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Offlineendogenous
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: MushroomBilly]
    #23974891 - 01/02/17 02:26 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

MushroomBilly said:
Quote:

DualWieldRake said:
don't do drugs kids, you may get stuck in the trip forever




I know, i know. But the mushroom is just so enticing - it has so much to offer - it's like forbidden fruit.



They ARE, in fact, the Forbidden Fruit.



--------------------
The Day of the Lord has come like a thief in the night. -- It is there but no one knows it.


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Offlinethelastoneleft
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: beforethedawn]
    #23980354 - 01/04/17 12:08 AM (7 years, 26 days ago)

Quote:

beforethedawn said:
So there is ego self and Self. Self (capital) is absolute and is Who everything and everyone returns to when the egoic identity is forgotten, generally through constant attention to it (self-inquiry). Ultimately the egoic identity is not real so focusing on it means you begin to identify, instead, with the Witness of the non-existent ego.

Ha...

So I mean language fails us, but I tried.

Anyway ego loss is achievable and permanent, but I doubt God can be permanently realised by abusing your brain with a molecule, you might get other powers from that, such as heightened perception and interconnectedness in the brain leading to higher consciousness, but you won't permanently fall into God. I think this comes through Divine Grace after long austerities, though sometimes spontaneously. We are too abused as children by abused parents and an infantile society to just fall into God naturally. In this age...

The bliss can be lost by generating negativity but once the ego is revealed as an illusion, there is a subtle sense of nothingness. You encapsulate your experience of self/body/mind/world (all the same thing) as the Witness.

So yeah.

Have a nice day, you will. :yoda2:




“People’s need to protect their own ego knows no bounds, they will lie, cheat, steal, kill, do whatever it takes to maintain what we call, ego boundaries.” -Andrew Samuels, Ph.D.


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Offlineles moore
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Registered: 07/12/11
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: AstralAndrew]
    #23980620 - 01/04/17 05:46 AM (7 years, 26 days ago)

From the material side, bodies, even bodies with brains, are machines that simply do what they do.  Ego is something like the assumption that you are more than that.  Ego-death is waking up from that assumption and seeing that everything is just happening, pretty much without "you", that the notion of a homunculus is an illusion.

From the other side, seeing that experience is consciousness, without boundaries, without self, without beginning or end, and again, everything is just happening.

Psychedelics help people see this, but it tends to be a temporary experience for most people.  Meditation increases the odds for a more permanent version.


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OfflineNoxLumina
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Registered: 02/06/17
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: endogenous] * 1
    #24096136 - 02/16/17 06:07 PM (6 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

endogenous said:
They ARE, in fact, the Forbidden Fruit.









I actually believe something like this from personal speculation.

Here is my take... the original story may have happened with some group of hunter/gatherers way, way before the people who even wrote the Bible.

Eve (maybe not one literal person who existed, but the person about whom the story was told), being a gatherer, may have known that plenty of mushrooms will kill you dead, so was warned not to pick them; this may have been common gatherer knowledge in that region. They were a "forbidden fruit" in that many mushrooms are *deadly poisonous.*

Many shamanistic cultures believe in the concept of a World Tree. So here you have both your "Tree of Life" and your "Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil."

Shamanism and animism is probably where people were at with religion at about the time of the origin of this story, and the cultures were probably pre-literate, and the story was re-written over the years to fit with peoples' changing beliefs. It may have started off as an oral tradition about shamanism, and about a woman gaining second sight (or something) from eating of a hallucinogenic "fruit."

By the time the story reached the ancestors of the Hebrews, the story had already been changed considerably, then of course it got a "retcon" to fit in with the new monotheistic way of doing things.


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Offlinesunshine
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Registered: 04/03/04
Posts: 43,592
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Re: Does anyone here have perma-ego death? [Re: NoxLumina]
    #24096313 - 02/16/17 07:29 PM (6 years, 11 months ago)

I'm trying not to become a hermit who laughs.


--------------------
One Love True Indeed.  Have Good Trips.  Mike/sunshine's mom.


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