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OfflineMorel Guy
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More sanctions against Russia
    #23965565 - 12/29/16 01:25 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

In response to Russian interfering with the election via hack'ing.  Sanctions made public are closing a couple Russian compounds and kicking out a handful of Russian diplomats.  It was said that not all sanctions would be made public.  The public sanctions seem weak.


--------------------
"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found


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OfflineTipote
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23967393 - 12/30/16 07:02 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Not much point in Putin doing much in response, his bum-chum will be in office soon.


--------------------
War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery, Ignorance is Strength


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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Tipote]
    #23967508 - 12/30/16 08:46 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

And that's what he's doing, he's taking the high road and not expellingDips but looking for lil'dick to give a great blow job on 20Jan. The only problem is the senate will break with l'd.


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InvisibleLuddite
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23967667 - 12/30/16 10:01 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Wrong again!

Obama ignores evidence Russia didn't hack DNC, Podesta
http://www.wnd.com/2016/12/obama-ignores-evidence-russia-didnt-hack-dnc-podesta/


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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Luddite]
    #23968306 - 12/30/16 02:42 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

WND, REALLY? What rock did they crawl out from under

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/3248231/Report-on-Russian-Hacking.pdf


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Offlinetump
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23969968 - 12/31/16 05:45 AM (7 years, 30 days ago)

I once crawled out the rocks on the bottom mars oceans. Then the next time i crawled out of the room where you keep your grow lights and paper crains in the window. Your never safe sweeper54.

Hacking the dnc did nothing either way. Stop the bicthing


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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: tump]
    #23970020 - 12/31/16 06:28 AM (7 years, 30 days ago)

What about the Russian hack of Burlington Power in VT they just discovered.

"That hack could have spread thru out the entire US grid" said Malcolm Nance this morning.

How many more Russian viruses are sitting out there?


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Offlinetump
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23970041 - 12/31/16 06:49 AM (7 years, 30 days ago)

62 more viruses


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OfflineBeLove111
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: tump] * 1
    #23970370 - 12/31/16 10:21 AM (7 years, 30 days ago)

There has yet to be any evidence provided that Russia hacked the elections. Obama is really just looking like a complete imbecile with what he is doing. Putin of course stands by like a boss and gains even more peoples respect by not reacting. The e-mails were leaked, not hacked. Even if they were hacked who cares? It's exposing our "leaders" as frauds and pedophiles.


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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: BeLove111]
    #23970464 - 12/31/16 10:59 AM (7 years, 30 days ago)

Putin is playing O's game against him. "When they go low, We go high." So lil'dick will swoops in for his blow job of Putin.



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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23972781 - 01/01/17 11:36 AM (7 years, 29 days ago)



Our whiney little bitch of a CIC can throw his hissy fit all he wants, the fact he is so determined to undermine an incoming president speaks volumes about him. History will not be kind to this douchebag.


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com





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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23973233 - 01/01/17 02:46 PM (7 years, 29 days ago)

So if the US and Russia become allies, that means that Trump is blowing Putin's dick?  :wtf:

The establishment is really doing a good job with its propaganda campaign.


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23973293 - 01/01/17 03:15 PM (7 years, 29 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
So if the US and Russia become allies, that means that Trump is blowing Putin's dick?  :wtf:

The establishment is really doing a good job with its propaganda campaign.




Yep, you and your progressive cohorts and your fake news campaign have the idiots of America all in a tither


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com





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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23973323 - 01/01/17 03:25 PM (7 years, 29 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
So if the US and Russia become allies, that means that Trump is blowing Putin's dick?  :wtf:





You can't possibly think that Putin want to be our ally

Sig Pic 2 is correct


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23973476 - 01/01/17 04:31 PM (7 years, 29 days ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
You can't possibly think that Putin want to be our ally



Why can't I think that?  Because the establishment has done such a good job with its anti-Trump propaganda campaign?


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23973610 - 01/01/17 05:26 PM (7 years, 29 days ago)

You CAN NOT trust Putin.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23973738 - 01/01/17 06:02 PM (7 years, 29 days ago)

Because the establishment media says so?


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23973882 - 01/01/17 06:47 PM (7 years, 29 days ago)



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Invisibleelax420
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 3
    #23974281 - 01/01/17 09:34 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Lol every single source is some liberal bullshit.


You old boys have been trained so well by cold warriors they use a code word and flip y'all back to robots


CIA: fuck we lost control of the Middle East. Time to use our fallback plan, call the media


News:
"Russian hacker, Russian hacker, this is not a drill: Russian hacker"

You and nearly every person born before 1990:
"Must destroy Russia"




Let's talk about Obamas war crimes

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/world/middle_east/a-cluster-bomb-made-in-america-shattered-lives-in-yemens-capital/2016/07/08/e3b722cc-283d-11e6-8329-6104954928d2_story.html?client=safari

You know when the bullshit WP is running the story we really fucked up.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 1
    #23974320 - 01/01/17 09:49 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)



--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #23974325 - 01/01/17 09:51 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

The democrats lost a generation of voters with the bullshit they pulled in the primaries and general election

Obamas presidency failed on nearly every point
The dems desperately need a scapegoat and they found one that resonates with old, low information voters.


At least when bush fabricated a lie to start a war, the country he targeted wasn't a military superpower that has a larger nuclear stockpile than our own.


Dumbass obama armed Isis, bombed 7 countries and gave a 1.2 trillion bailout to the banks which are now richer and more powerful than ever. And y'all have the gall to wonder why you lost the election.


God the democrats are more cancerous than republicans, which is like saying ild rather get eaten by a shark than a bear.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420] * 3
    #23974358 - 01/01/17 10:00 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

I agree, so I'm not wondering why Hillary lost the election.  I didn't vote for her, nor did any of my family nor my wife's family.  And we live in California.  :shrug:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #23974407 - 01/01/17 10:15 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Nice

I always thought u were one of the more liberal posters on here. Glad to hear you can read through the bullshit.

I used to kinda like obama but man his 2nd term was a disaster. I think Syria/Libya may have been worse for world peace than Iraq. I get not like Russia but why would you ever try to engage them? It's a losing proposition for both sides.


I'm not optimistic about the incoming administration but normalization with Russia is a good idea, and I support trumps rationality on this matter.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420] * 1
    #23974467 - 01/01/17 10:35 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

I am very liberal, but also very anti-establishment.

I agree Obama's 2nd term was bad, and it's only going downhill with the new sanctions.

I love Putin's response:

Quote:

Russia has reasons to respond in kind. Although we have the right to retaliate, we will not resort to irresponsible ‘kitchen’ diplomacy but will plan our further steps to restore Russian-US relations




--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Invisibleelax420
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23974473 - 01/01/17 10:39 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

What is kitchen diplomacy?


Putin obviously got in obamas head very early into obamas presidency. Every time they engaged on an issue, putin came out as the unequivocal winner. Obama was fairly reminiscent of a neocon in action, imo.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #23974536 - 01/01/17 10:56 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

I don't know actually.  I'm trying to find Putin's original Russian video so I can translate it myself.

You're right.  Putin is killing Obama.  Even Hillary whined that we're losing the propaganda war:



--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


Edited by Falcon91Wolvrn03 (01/01/17 11:02 PM)


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OfflineWebster10
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23975109 - 01/02/17 06:06 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Because the establishment media says so?



http://time.com/putin-secret-agents/

http://euromaidanpress.com/2016/10/04/proof-of-putins-crime-within-a-crime-has-far-reaching-consequences-eidman-says/#arvlbdata

http://www.wsj.com/articles/a-deadly-russian-toll-1425155183

List of journalist kill

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_Russia

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/article/2016/jan/04/does-vladimir-putin-kill-journalists/

He a real fucking humanitarian.

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/article/2016/jan/04/does-vladimir-putin-kill-journalists/

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jan/19/alexander-litvinenko-the-man-who-solved-his-own-murder

Intelligence Expert Explains Why Donald Trump is the Perfect KGB Recruit

http://www.politicususa.com/2016/12/17/intelligence-expert-explains-donald-trump-perfect-kgb-recruit.html


And just today

http://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-putin-russia-icc-20161116-story.html



Yup, that what I thought.  Because the establishment media says so (elax just beat me to it).  :smirk:

Granted, Wikipedia isn't establishment, but they also keep a List of journalists killed in the United States.



I'm so glad you've reached the point of dismissing the liberal-leaning establishment media outright. It makes life so much easier, doesn't it?

I pity the morons that believe liberal-leaning establishment sources. Wake up, Sweeper.


--------------------
:leaf: :usa:


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OfflineWebster10
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23975125 - 01/02/17 06:14 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
WND, REALLY? What rock did they crawl out from under

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/3248231/Report-on-Russian-Hacking.pdf



Sweeper, what in that report proves that Russia was behind the election hacking? The report is a sham, you didn't read it and anyone who did would realize that it doesn't serve as evidence of Russia hacking Podesta.

Go and crawl back under your establishment media rock.

EDIT: apparently Sweeper hasn't heard that the attacks actually originated from the Ukraine. But I mean Ukraine is close to Russia so it was definitely Putin himself :flowstone:


--------------------
:leaf: :usa:


Edited by Webster10 (01/02/17 06:18 AM)


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OfflineWebster10
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 1
    #23975130 - 01/02/17 06:16 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
What about the Russian hack of Burlington Power in VT they just discovered.

"That hack could have spread thru out the entire US grid" said Malcolm Nance this morning.

How many more Russian viruses are sitting out there?



Now would you like to take the time and correct yourself? That computer wasn't connected to the grid. It couldn't have spread throughout the entire US. Stop making shit up and spreading your fake establishment news.


--------------------
:leaf: :usa:


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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23975164 - 01/02/17 06:38 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Because the establishment media says so?



http://time.com/putin-secret-agents/

http://euromaidanpress.com/2016/10/04/proof-of-putins-crime-within-a-crime-has-far-reaching-consequences-eidman-says/#arvlbdata

http://www.wsj.com/articles/a-deadly-russian-toll-1425155183

List of journalist kill

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_Russia

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/article/2016/jan/04/does-vladimir-putin-kill-journalists/

He a real fucking humanitarian.

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/article/2016/jan/04/does-vladimir-putin-kill-journalists/


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jan/19/alexander-litvinenko-the-man-who-solved-his-own-murder

Intelligence Expert Explains Why Donald Trump is the Perfect KGB Recruit

http://www.politicususa.com/2016/12/17/intelligence-expert-explains-donald-trump-perfect-kgb-recruit.html


And just today

http://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-putin-russia-icc-20161116-story.html



Yup, that what I thought.  Because the establishment media says so (elax just beat me to it).  :smirk:

Granted, Wikipedia isn't establishment, but they also keep a List of journalists killed in the United States.




BUT WAIT there's a BIT of a difference. Only five (5) each have died while Putin-in-the-Donald's-mouth was in power.


Edited by sweeper54 (01/02/17 06:57 AM)


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Offlinehostileuniverse
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23975167 - 01/02/17 06:41 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Cites left wing blogs to verify left wing ideology...

:huxleyfacepalm:


--------------------
http://www.countdowntotrump.com





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Offlinesweeper54
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23975187 - 01/02/17 06:57 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
I am very liberal, but also very anti-establishment.

I agree Obama's 2nd term was bad, and it's only going downhill with the new sanctions.

I love Putin's response:

Quote:

Russia has reasons to respond in kind. Although we have the right to retaliate, we will not resort to irresponsible ‘kitchen’ diplomacy but will plan our further steps to restore Russian-US relations








That called BAIT and lil'dick has already swallowed it.


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OfflineWebster10
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23975189 - 01/02/17 06:57 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Because the establishment media says so?



http://time.com/putin-secret-agents/

http://euromaidanpress.com/2016/10/04/proof-of-putins-crime-within-a-crime-has-far-reaching-consequences-eidman-says/#arvlbdata

http://www.wsj.com/articles/a-deadly-russian-toll-1425155183

List of journalist kill

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_Russia

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/article/2016/jan/04/does-vladimir-putin-kill-journalists/

He a real fucking humanitarian.

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/article/2016/jan/04/does-vladimir-putin-kill-journalists/


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jan/19/alexander-litvinenko-the-man-who-solved-his-own-murder

Intelligence Expert Explains Why Donald Trump is the Perfect KGB Recruit

http://www.politicususa.com/2016/12/17/intelligence-expert-explains-donald-trump-perfect-kgb-recruit.html


And just today

http://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-putin-russia-icc-20161116-story.html



Yup, that what I thought.  Because the establishment media says so (elax just beat me to it).  :smirk:

Granted, Wikipedia isn't establishment, but they also keep a List of journalists killed in the United States.




BUT WAIT there's a BIT of a difference. Only five (5) each gave died while Putin-in-the-Donald's-mouth was in power.



Will you ever stop being a delusional partisan?


--------------------
:leaf: :usa:


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OfflineWebster10
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23975191 - 01/02/17 06:58 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
I am very liberal, but also very anti-establishment.

I agree Obama's 2nd term was bad, and it's only going downhill with the new sanctions.

I love Putin's response:

Quote:

Russia has reasons to respond in kind. Although we have the right to retaliate, we will not resort to irresponsible ‘kitchen’ diplomacy but will plan our further steps to restore Russian-US relations








That called BAIT and lil'dick has already swallowed it.



Only in the mind of a delusional partisan could Putins statement be interpreted as a secret wish for war.


--------------------
:leaf: :usa:


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OfflineMorel Guy
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Webster10] * 1
    #23975914 - 01/02/17 11:59 AM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Putin knows he would lose in a full engagement.  He'll just poke and stoke the fires from time to time. 

They only have 1 carrier.


--------------------
"in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur"

In filth it will be found in dung it will be found


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Webster10]
    #23976215 - 01/02/17 01:37 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

Webster10 said:
I'm so glad you've reached the point of dismissing the liberal-leaning establishment media outright. It makes life so much easier, doesn't it?

I pity the morons that believe liberal-leaning establishment sources. Wake up, Sweeper.



Establishment sources are not liberal leaning - they're establishment leaning (there have been many prior discussions on this).  Since Hillary was the establishment candidate, you are under the (false) impression the establishment media are liberal leaning.


--------------------
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Webster10]
    #23976221 - 01/02/17 01:39 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

Webster10 said:
What in that report proves that Russia was behind the election hacking? The report is a sham, you didn't read it and anyone who did would realize that it doesn't serve as evidence of Russia hacking Podesta.

Go and crawl back under your establishment media rock.

EDIT: the attacks actually originated from the Ukraine. But I mean Ukraine is close to Russia so it was definitely Putin himself :flowstone:



:thumbup:


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23976236 - 01/02/17 01:44 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
I love Putin's response:

Quote:

Russia has reasons to respond in kind. Although we have the right to retaliate, we will not resort to irresponsible ‘kitchen’ diplomacy but will plan our further steps to restore Russian-US relations








That called BAIT and lil'dick has already swallowed it.



So if Russia is nice, that means they're not to be trusted?
:dudewtf:


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23976566 - 01/02/17 03:46 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

I hope you boys are right, but I will never count on it.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23976580 - 01/02/17 03:51 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Intelligence agencies are like the mafia.  Putin is a big player in the Russian mob.  Why would you trust the mob?  That is just stupid.  They will use you and take advantage.  You will just be a tool to them.  A disposable tool like a lady's tampon.  Do you want to be a tampax?  Putin's tampax?


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23976686 - 01/02/17 04:37 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

They have drunk too much trump koolaid


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23976703 - 01/02/17 04:44 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Because the establishment media says so?



http://time.com/putin-secret-agents/

http://euromaidanpress.com/2016/10/04/proof-of-putins-crime-within-a-crime-has-far-reaching-consequences-eidman-says/#arvlbdata

http://www.wsj.com/articles/a-deadly-russian-toll-1425155183

List of journalist kill

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_Russia

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/article/2016/jan/04/does-vladimir-putin-kill-journalists/

He a real fucking humanitarian.

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/article/2016/jan/04/does-vladimir-putin-kill-journalists/


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/jan/19/alexander-litvinenko-the-man-who-solved-his-own-murder

Intelligence Expert Explains Why Donald Trump is the Perfect KGB Recruit

http://www.politicususa.com/2016/12/17/intelligence-expert-explains-donald-trump-perfect-kgb-recruit.html


And just today

http://www.latimes.com/world/la-fg-putin-russia-icc-20161116-story.html



Yup, that what I thought.  Because the establishment media says so (elax just beat me to it).  :smirk:

Granted, Wikipedia isn't establishment, but they also keep a List of journalists killed in the United States.




BUT WAIT there's a BIT of a difference. Only five (5) each have died while Putin-in-the-Donald's-mouth was in power.





Nah lil dick would be getting involved in a country that's literal translation is "on the border"


Ukraine is a proud and free state, durrr.

Ya bullshit. 1/3 of it was polish the rest is Russia.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #23976713 - 01/02/17 04:47 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

I'm sure the us would be stoked if their little puppet state Canada joined the csto though.


Edited by elax420 (01/02/17 04:49 PM)


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23976723 - 01/02/17 04:51 PM (7 years, 28 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

Webster10 said:
What in that report proves that Russia was behind the election hacking? The report is a sham, you didn't read it and anyone who did would realize that it doesn't serve as evidence of Russia hacking Podesta.

Go and crawl back under your establishment media rock.

EDIT: the attacks actually originated from the Ukraine. But I mean Ukraine is close to Russia so it was definitely Putin himself :flowstone:



:thumbup:





Doesn't this statement support the Russian (hell broader Slavic) claim that Ukraine isn't a real country?
Lol


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #23979502 - 01/03/17 05:42 PM (7 years, 27 days ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
I love Putin's response:

"Russia has reasons to respond in kind. Although we have the right to retaliate, we will not resort to irresponsible ‘kitchen’ diplomacy but will plan our further steps to restore Russian-US relations"



That called BAIT and lil'dick has already swallowed it.



So if Russia is nice, that means they're not to be trusted?
:dudewtf:



I hope you boys are right, but I will never count on it.



I'm not counting on it either.  We need to remain cautious.

All I'm saying is that just because Putin is behaving nicely doesn't automatically mean he's evil.  That's a ridiculous conclusion.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23979539 - 01/03/17 05:51 PM (7 years, 27 days ago)

Putin is not behaving nicely.  He's intelligently ornery.  Most subversive Russia has been ever.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23980019 - 01/03/17 09:02 PM (7 years, 27 days ago)

maybe we'll get lucky and putin will annex a few more former soviet states.  russia can't handle 3 or 4 more chechnyas with a syria to boot; they're almost broke already.  Then again,  if Russia collapses from strategic overreach, there will inevitably be a period of some lessened oversight over her nuclear arsenal which is dangerous for everyone.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23980121 - 01/03/17 09:55 PM (7 years, 26 days ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
Putin is not behaving nicely.  He's intelligently ornery.  Most subversive Russia has been ever.



Go on, defend what you just said...  :popcorn:


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #23980324 - 01/03/17 11:52 PM (7 years, 26 days ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
maybe we'll get lucky and putin will annex a few more former soviet states.  russia can't handle 3 or 4 more chechnyas with a syria to boot; they're almost broke already.  Then again,  if Russia collapses from strategic overreach, there will inevitably be a period of some lessened oversight over her nuclear arsenal which is dangerous for everyone.





and there it is.


The stupidest post in the thread.



Annexation of Chechnya was in like 1850 dude.....


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #23980486 - 01/04/17 02:18 AM (7 years, 26 days ago)

they're still fighting over it.  :shrug:
The chinese annexed Xinjiang in 1759.  Tell that to the Uyghurs.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xinjiang#Qing_dynasty
Quote:

The Qing then freed the Afaqi Khoja leader Burhan-ud-din and his brother Khoja Jihan from their imprisonment by the Dzungars, and appointed them to rule as Qing vassals over the Tarim Basin. The Khoja brothers decided to renege on this deal and declare themselves as independent leaders of the Tarim Basin. The Qing and the Turfan leader Emin Khoja crushed their revolt and China then took full control of both Dzungaria and the Tarim Basin by 1759.




Any given country can only withstand so much internal pressure.  The limit may be different for various governments, but there is a limit.  Russia is going broke, they are making budget cuts, and wars, liberations, police actions, or whatever the kids are calling them these days, cost money.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23981213 - 01/04/17 11:58 AM (7 years, 26 days ago)

No they actually aren't.

But facts don't matter


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #23981217 - 01/04/17 12:00 PM (7 years, 26 days ago)

Oh and please tell which part of Ukraine has a Sunni Muslim majority.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #23981371 - 01/04/17 12:53 PM (7 years, 26 days ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
Intelligence agencies are like the mafia.  Putin is a big player in the Russian mob.  Why would you trust the mob?  That is just stupid.  They will use you and take advantage.  You will just be a tool to them.  A disposable tool like a lady's tampon.  Do you want to be a tampax?  Putin's tampax?




you could very reasonably argue that the government is much like a mafia but even the mafia follow some rules. There is always the potential for enough trust for a particular function depending on the stakes and the balance of power.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #23981378 - 01/04/17 12:55 PM (7 years, 26 days ago)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chechen%E2%80%93Russian_conflict#Ongoing_Chechen_insurgency
Quote:

Since the end of the Second Chechen War in May 2000, low-level insurgency has continued, particularly in Chechnya, Ingushetia and Dagestan. Russian security forces have succeeded in eliminating some of their leaders, such as Shamil Basayev, who was killed on July 10, 2006.[34] After Basayev's death, Dokka Umarov took the leadership of the rebel forces in North Caucasus until his death owing to poisoning in 2013.[35]
Radical Islamists from Chechnya and other North Caucasian republics have been held responsible for a number of terrorist attacks throughout Russia,[36] most notably the Russian apartment bombings in 1999,[37] the Moscow theater hostage crisis in 2002,[38] the Beslan school hostage crisis in 2004, the 2010 Moscow Metro bombings[39] and the Domodedovo International Airport bombing in 2011.[40][41]




Quote:

elax420 said:
Oh and please tell which part of Ukraine has a Sunni Muslim majority.




No part? 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Ukraine#Ukrainian_Muslims_today
Quote:

Muslims make up only approximately 0.9% of the Ukrainian population, but as much as 12% in Crimea. According to the 2000 census Ukraine was home to 248,193 Crimean Tatars, 73,304 Volga Tatars, 45,176 Azeris, 12,353 Uzbeks, 8,844 Turks, 6,575 Arabs and 5,526 Kazakhs.[12]




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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse] * 4
    #23981409 - 01/04/17 01:06 PM (7 years, 26 days ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:


Our whiney little bitch of a CIC can throw his hissy fit all he wants, the fact he is so determined to undermine an incoming president speaks volumes about him. History will not be kind to this douchebag.



He is the highest rated outgoing President in recorded U.S. history. The opinions of right wingers on the Shroomery can not change history.

But you don't believe in academics so there is no point in arguing.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Brian Jones]
    #23981440 - 01/04/17 01:18 PM (7 years, 26 days ago)

We don't know what all covert actions have been taken.  I have heard that SOCOM has been very busy under Obama.  They don't exactly take out front page advertisements of what they are doing.

Trump wants war victory and he's going to find that difficult.  He may be the first President to lose massive amounts of civilians or the country itself.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy] * 3
    #23982055 - 01/04/17 05:31 PM (7 years, 26 days ago)

Covert actions are escalating. And it appears its not in our interest to have a "war victory," we like to draw these conflicts out.

There will be kids graduating high school next year who have never lived in a world where the US WASNT invading Afghanistan. Its normalized now. And "winning" isnt needed to keep the gears turning anymore.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: The Ecstatic] * 1
    #23982112 - 01/04/17 05:54 PM (7 years, 26 days ago)

Since Korea there have been wars impossible to win.  To really win there needs to be political victory.  The US doesn't exterminate people based on politics or ethnicity.  That's probably the easiest way to win, extermination.  They seem to have difficult winning peoples minds with western culture.  It's like trying to get every Amish (if they were armed and violent) to jump the fence.  It's improbably that's going to occur.  Shit, they can't even win over cultures in America!


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23982775 - 01/04/17 11:03 PM (7 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chechen%E2%80%93Russian_conflict#Ongoing_Chechen_insurgency
Quote:

Since the end of the Second Chechen War in May 2000, low-level insurgency has continued, particularly in Chechnya, Ingushetia and Dagestan. Russian security forces have succeeded in eliminating some of their leaders, such as Shamil Basayev, who was killed on July 10, 2006.[34] After Basayev's death, Dokka Umarov took the leadership of the rebel forces in North Caucasus until his death owing to poisoning in 2013.[35]
Radical Islamists from Chechnya and other North Caucasian republics have been held responsible for a number of terrorist attacks throughout Russia,[36] most notably the Russian apartment bombings in 1999,[37] the Moscow theater hostage crisis in 2002,[38] the Beslan school hostage crisis in 2004, the 2010 Moscow Metro bombings[39] and the Domodedovo International Airport bombing in 2011.[40][41]




Quote:

elax420 said:
Oh and please tell which part of Ukraine has a Sunni Muslim majority.




No part? 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_Ukraine#Ukrainian_Muslims_today
Quote:

Muslims make up only approximately 0.9% of the Ukrainian population, but as much as 12% in Crimea. According to the 2000 census Ukraine was home to 248,193 Crimean Tatars, 73,304 Volga Tatars, 45,176 Azeris, 12,353 Uzbeks, 8,844 Turks, 6,575 Arabs and 5,526 Kazakhs.[12]








Then why are you even mentioning Chechnya? There is literally no connection

They fought 2 wars. Their republic was completely and utterly destroyed over this. Moscow gave them billions to rebuild a modern glitzy capital. Kadyrov and putin are complete bros. end of story.

Dagestan is more of a probem but if history has taught us one thing Moscow will never let go of any of its land. Are you new?
Plus Dagestan has a shitload of oil.

Now stop talking about shit you know nothing about.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23982859 - 01/04/17 11:54 PM (7 years, 25 days ago)

i think that perhaps you completely misunderstood the point of my post.

I was using chechnya as a placeholder for any prolonged insurgency, or revolt, or pacification, or whatever.

If history has taught us anything, it is that is extremely expensive, difficult, and eventually exhausting to hold territory that doesn't want to be held.  It can be done, for various lengths of time, but too much resistance, for too long, over too large an area leads to an inevitable collapse. 

This brings me to my original point, which is that Russia isn't going to try to recapture a bunch of former soviet states overtly any time in the near future because it would lead to several prolonged insurgencies that Moscow can ill-afford, or conversely, that if such an attempt were made, it would be to the U.S. advantage in a hypothetical Russia vs. The West scenario. 

Hence:
Quote:

ballsalsa said:
maybe we'll get lucky and putin will annex a few more former soviet states.  russia can't handle 3 or 4 more chechnyas with a syria to boot; they're almost broke already.  Then again,  if Russia collapses from strategic overreach, there will inevitably be a period of some lessened oversight over her nuclear arsenal which is dangerous for everyone.




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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy] * 2
    #23983006 - 01/05/17 03:00 AM (7 years, 25 days ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
Since Korea there have been wars impossible to win.  To really win there needs to be political victory.  The US doesn't exterminate people based on politics or ethnicity.  That's probably the easiest way to win, extermination.  They seem to have difficult winning peoples minds with western culture.  It's like trying to get every Amish (if they were armed and violent) to jump the fence.  It's improbably that's going to occur.  Shit, they can't even win over cultures in America!




I guess my point is that the "winning over hearts and minds" isnt really our strategy, or goal. We just pretend it is because thats the only way to keep Western civilians on the military's side.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #23983037 - 01/05/17 03:29 AM (7 years, 25 days ago)

It's kinda pointless to wage war of hearts and minds.  Seems other cultures are perfectly content living in dark ages.  Of course different life styles vary from parts of the world.  They also block people from being able to read western media.  So it's hard to infiltrate their state run news agencies.

As much as we bitch about our media in the states.  It's gotta be far worse to never have a chance in a Government controlled land.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy] * 2
    #23984126 - 01/05/17 02:53 PM (7 years, 25 days ago)

Good points.

But I believe the culture is only one piece of the reason for the dark age existence. The nations furthest from the dark ages in the Middle East are the ones the farthest from war and regime change.

I think the commonly held mentality that the Muslims made their beds by themselves, so they should sleep in it (and not mind when we belt them with pillows and rip up their sheets from time to time) is a big reason why Western interventions in the region get an apathetic response from the average Westerner.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa] * 1
    #23988209 - 01/06/17 11:47 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
i think that perhaps you completely misunderstood the point of my post.

I was using chechnya as a placeholder for any prolonged insurgency, or revolt, or pacification, or whatever.

If history has taught us anything, it is that is extremely expensive, difficult, and eventually exhausting to hold territory that doesn't want to be held.  It can be done, for various lengths of time, but too much resistance, for too long, over too large an area leads to an inevitable collapse. 

This brings me to my original point, which is that Russia isn't going to try to recapture a bunch of former soviet states overtly any time in the near future because it would lead to several prolonged insurgencies that Moscow can ill-afford, or conversely, that if such an attempt were made, it would be to the U.S. advantage in a hypothetical Russia vs. The West scenario. 

Hence:
Quote:

ballsalsa said:
maybe we'll get lucky and putin will annex a few more former soviet states.  russia can't handle 3 or 4 more chechnyas with a syria to boot; they're almost broke already.  Then again,  if Russia collapses from strategic overreach, there will inevitably be a period of some lessened oversight over her nuclear arsenal which is dangerous for everyone.








They completely won in Chechnya through and the Russian state is as strong today as it has ever been. Russian power in Caucasus is at an all time high outside of Georgia.


I guess I did misinterpret your original intention however


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: The Ecstatic] * 1
    #23988211 - 01/06/17 11:49 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Good points.

But I believe the culture is only one piece of the reason for the dark age existence. The nations furthest from the dark ages in the Middle East are the ones the farthest from war and regime change.

I think the commonly held mentality that the Muslims made their beds by themselves, so they should sleep in it (and not mind when we belt them with pillows and rip up their sheets from time to time) is a big reason why Western interventions in the region get an apathetic response from the average Westerner.






I tend to not be the most pro Islamic poster, but I don't know if I believe those in the ME made their bed and now they must rest in it.

Colonialism is still a dominant force in the world and that region in particular


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #23989754 - 01/07/17 02:53 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)



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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 3
    #23990549 - 01/07/17 07:16 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Lol

When liberals bitch about bush and his WMD shit then obama is literally just black bush replace WMD with "Russia"


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #23990592 - 01/07/17 07:28 PM (7 years, 23 days ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
Lol

When liberals bitch about bush and his WMD shit then obama is literally just black bush replace WMD with "Russia"




https://www.theguardian.com/world/2008/mar/25/barackobama1
Quote:

Barack Obama often makes a joke in his campaign speeches about a genealogical survey last year that found he is a distant cousin of Dick Cheney. Now there is double bad news for Obama: a new survey out today found he is related to George Bush as well.

Researchers at the New England Historic Genealogical Society, founded in 1845, said Obama, the son of a white woman from Kansas and a black man from Kenya, can call six US presidents his cousins: both Bushes, Ford, Johnson, Truman and James Madison.

The genealogical society, a non-profit organisation, found he is also related to Churchill.




Now you and i might not keep track of our distant relatives like 8th and 11th cousins...but royals and nobles do, if you catch my drift.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 2
    #23991261 - 01/07/17 11:01 PM (7 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:




So in other words (as elax420 already noted), there is no evidence of Russia doing anything wrong, just the establishment basically making the statement "I'll bet the Russians did it!" and hoping Americans believe it WITHOUT proof.  :shrug:


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23991497 - 01/08/17 01:48 AM (7 years, 22 days ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Quote:

elax420 said:
Lol

When liberals bitch about bush and his WMD shit then obama is literally just black bush replace WMD with "Russia"




https://www.theguardian.com/world/2008/mar/25/barackobama1
Quote:

Barack Obama often makes a joke in his campaign speeches about a genealogical survey last year that found he is a distant cousin of Dick Cheney. Now there is double bad news for Obama: a new survey out today found he is related to George Bush as well.

Researchers at the New England Historic Genealogical Society, founded in 1845, said Obama, the son of a white woman from Kansas and a black man from Kenya, can call six US presidents his cousins: both Bushes, Ford, Johnson, Truman and James Madison.

The genealogical society, a non-profit organisation, found he is also related to Churchill.




Now you and i might not keep track of our distant relatives like 8th and 11th cousins...but royals and nobles do, if you catch my drift.





Damn good find


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #23991546 - 01/08/17 02:50 AM (7 years, 22 days ago)

Some of these are quite distant, but still...
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/aug/07/obama-cousins-senate-family-tree
Quote:

Lamar Alexander (R-Tennessee) is Obama’s 14th cousin, thrice removed
Kelly Ayotte (R-New Hampshire) is Obama’s second cousin nine times removed’s husband’s third great nephew’s wife’s great niece’s husband’s first cousin twice removed’s second cousin’s wife
Mark Begich (D-Alaska) is Obama’s 11th cousin, once removed
Michael Bennet (D-Colorado) is Obama’s 13th cousin, twice removed
Richard Blumenthal (D-Connecticut) is Obama’s wife’s second cousin five times removed’s wife’s second cousin five times removed’s husband’s second cousin’s husband’s brother
Roy Blunt (R-Missouri) is Obama’s third cousin seven times removed’s wife’s first cousin, five times removed
Barbara Boxer (D-California) is Obama’s sixth cousin four times removed’s husband’s grandson’s ex-wife’s mother
Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio) is Obama’s fourth cousin four times removed’s husband’s sister’s husband’s aunt’s husband’s second great nephew
Benjamin Cardin (D-Maryland) is Obama’s ninth great aunt’s sister’s husband’s wife’s 9th great grandson’s wife’s uncle’s wife’s first cousin once removed’s husband’s nephew
Thomas Carper (D-Delaware) is Obama’s 17th cousin, twice removed
Robert Casey (D-PA) is Obama’s 17th cousin, once removed
Daniel Coates (R-Indiana) is Obama’s 11th cousin, thrice removed
Tom Coburn (R-Oklahoma) is Obama’s 15th cousin, once removed
Thad Cochran (Mississippi) is Obama’s 12th cousin, once removed
Michael Crapo (R-Idaho) Obama’s 16th cousin, once removed
Ted Cruz (R-Texas) is Obama’s 14th cousin once removed’s husband
Richard Durbin (D-Illinois) is Obama’s 18th cousin
Mike Enzi (R-Wyoming) is Obama’s third cousin nine times removed’s husband’s eighth great nephew
Jeff Flake (R-Arizona) is Obama’s eighth cousin, three times removed
Al Franken (D-Minnesota) is Obama’s second cousin eight times removed’s wife’s husband’s second cousin five times removed’s husband’s second cousin
Chuck Grassley (R-Iowa) is Obama’s 17th cousin
Kay Hagan (D-North Carolina) is Obama’s 15th cousin
Orrin Hatch (R-Utah) is Obama’s ninth cousin, thrice removed
Tim Kaine (D-Virginia) is Obama’s seventh cousin’s ex-wife’s third cousin’s husband
Angus King (I-Maine) is Obama’s ninth cousin twice removed’s wife’s first cousin once removed
Mary Landrieu (D-Louisiana) is Obama’s sixth cousin four times removed’s husband’s third great niece’s husband’s uncle’s granddaughter
Mike Lee (R-Utah) is Obama’s 10th cousin, once removed
John McCain (R-Arizona) is Obama’s 11th cousin, twice removed
Mitch McConnell (R-Kentucky) is Obama’s eighth great aunt’s first cousin thrice removed’s husband’s fifth great nephew
Barbara Mikulski (D-Maryland) is Obama’s 10th great aunt’s brother’s wife’s sixth great niece’s ex-husband’s aunt’s husband’s first cousin once removed’s wife’s niece’s husband’s first cousin
Bill Nelson (D-Florida) is Obama’s 14th cousin, once removed
Rand Paul (R-Kentucky) is Obama’s fifth cousin five times removed’s husband’s third cousin five times removed
Mark Pryor (D-Arkansas) is Obama’s 12th cousin
Harry Reid (D-Nevada) is Obama’s 15th cousin, once removed
James Risch (R-Idaho) is Obama’s eighth cousin once removed’s wife’s first cousin’s wife’s nephew
Pat Roberts (R-Kansas) is Obama’s 13th cousin, four times removed
Jay Rockefeller (D-West Virginia) is Obama’s 12th cousin
Jeff Sessions (R-Alabama) is Obama’s 12th cousin, thrice removed
Richard C Shelby (R-Alabama) is Obama’s 17th cousin, once removed
Mark Udall (D-Colorado) is Obama’s 10th cousin, once removed
Tom Udall (D-New Mexico) is Obama’s 11th cousin, once removed
David Vitter (R-Louisiana) is Obama’s first cousin seven times removed’s wife’s great niece’s husband’s second cousin thrice removed’s wife’s third cousin
Elizabeth Warren (D - Massachusetts) is Obama’s ninth great aunt’s third great nephew’s wife’s second great niece
Sheldon Whitehouse (D-Rhode Island) is Obama’s 14th cousin, five times removed




http://www.dailyyonder.com/presidency-obamas-genes/2008/08/20/1527/
Quote:

For example, Obama is closely related to at least six individuals who have resided in the White House: Jane Means Appleton Pierce, wife of President Franklin Pierce; Ronald Reagan; Elizabeth Virginia “Bess” Wallace Truman, wife of President Harry Truman; President Jimmy Carter and Angelica Van Buren, daughter-in-law of President Martin Van Buren who took over White House as hostess following the death of Van Buren’s wife.
A recent article in the Atlantic Monthly revealed that during the Democratic primary, Hillary Clinton was advised to attack Obama’s heritage, but she declined.
Maybe it’s because she wanted to take the moral high road. Or maybe it’s because she is Obama’s cousin. Obama’s shares a 10th great grandmother, Ann Sutton (1589-1654) with Clinton.
Obama’s political bona fides started with the Declaration of Independence. Francis Lightfoot Lee of Virginia, Caesar Rodney of Delaware, Pennsylvanian Robert Morris and Georgia’s Button Gwinnett were all signatories to the declaration and are all ancestors of Obama’s. He is related to at least three men who came to America on the Mayflower.
There is also a high probability that he is related to Queen Elizabeth of England, since they both descend from Dorothy Ann Tracy (1563-1612).





http://www.cbsnews.com/news/surprising-link-found-in-obamas-family-tree/
Quote:

It's already been learned that Mr. Obama is related, however distantly, to people as diverse as Warren Buffett, Sarah Palin, Rush Limbaugh and George W. Bush.




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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23994325 - 01/09/17 02:51 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

Mary Landrieu (D-Louisiana) is Obama’s sixth cousin four times removed’s husband’s third great niece’s husband’s uncle’s granddaughter


yeah pretty distant dude


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sh4d0ws]
    #23994727 - 01/09/17 09:52 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

You can choose your friends, but you can't choose your relatives.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #23994763 - 01/09/17 10:19 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

Ya a lot of those are pretty god damn tenous.


Shit I bet I'm 16th cousins with obama


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #23994784 - 01/09/17 10:26 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

I'll bet you aren't.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23994812 - 01/09/17 10:40 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

Implying it makes a difference either way


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #23994823 - 01/09/17 10:43 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

why mention it then?


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa]
    #23994844 - 01/09/17 10:55 AM (7 years, 21 days ago)

Well he's related to Orin hatch


Hatch is utahs senator. Utah was founded by polygamists with 100s of wives. Hatch is an extremely common surname here.  Chances are I have some distant relation to hatch are pretty good.





I don't get your point of how this super distant relationship between powerful people means anything


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #24007137 - 01/13/17 01:10 PM (7 years, 17 days ago)

OK we're going to get to the bottom of this Russian threat now, lil'dick has 'HIS' people on it 'and we'll have an answer in 90 days.'


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #24008607 - 01/14/17 12:56 AM (7 years, 16 days ago)

Russians are mostly female and they are hot as fuuuuuuuck!


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Prem. Kissoff]
    #24008689 - 01/14/17 01:44 AM (7 years, 16 days ago)

Trump said he's gonna leave the sanctions in place "for at least awhile"

***libs run off to find something else to cry about


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Prem. Kissoff]
    #24008964 - 01/14/17 06:25 AM (7 years, 16 days ago)

Quote:

Prem. Kissoff said:
Russians are mostly female and they are hot as fuuuuuuuck!




Not as hot as the two in my sig


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24008967 - 01/14/17 06:27 AM (7 years, 16 days ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Trump said he's gonna leave the sanctions in place "for at least awhile"

***libs run off to find something else to cry about



I just like the fact he thinks his people are better then the people we have now.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #24024020 - 01/19/17 08:04 PM (7 years, 11 days ago)



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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 2
    #24024251 - 01/19/17 09:24 PM (7 years, 10 days ago)

It's funny how liberals bitched for 8 years about the obstructionism from the republicans and disrespect that obama got.


I guess you are just uncomfortable with a white man being president, you racist.


If he were black from Kenya with the middle name muhhamed you would have no problem with him


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #24024297 - 01/19/17 09:33 PM (7 years, 10 days ago)

:trollhide:


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #24024773 - 01/20/17 05:41 AM (7 years, 10 days ago)

The 'Angry White Male' is strong in this one.

If he wasn't sucking putin's dick and released his tax form that would be a start.


Edited by sweeper54 (01/20/17 06:05 AM)


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 1
    #24024836 - 01/20/17 07:05 AM (7 years, 10 days ago)

You're on another level of being brainwashed. It's sad. Wake the fuck up.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Webster10]
    #24025015 - 01/20/17 08:36 AM (7 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Webster10 said:
You're on another level of being brainwashed. It's sad. Wake the fuck up.




What the fuck are you talking about.  Republicans are the brain washed ones.  They think that God will save them.  Hahahaha like there is a God to give a fuck about your miserable existence?


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy] * 1
    #24025444 - 01/20/17 12:00 PM (7 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
Quote:

Webster10 said:
You're on another level of being brainwashed. It's sad. Wake the fuck up.




What the fuck are you talking about.  Republicans are the brain washed ones.  They think that God will save them.  Hahahaha like there is a God to give a fuck about your miserable existence?



Yeah I don't believe in God but at this point believing in god is a lot more rational than the bullshit you avidly believe in and post about here.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Webster10]
    #24025718 - 01/20/17 01:50 PM (7 years, 10 days ago)

Never posted a single belief God boy


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Webster10]
    #24025720 - 01/20/17 01:50 PM (7 years, 10 days ago)

Believing in god is in no way rational.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #24025724 - 01/20/17 01:52 PM (7 years, 10 days ago)

That's cool, liberal atheist.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Webster10] * 2
    #24025816 - 01/20/17 02:37 PM (7 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Webster10 said:
That's cool, liberal atheist.




And proud of it.

:lolsy:


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 3
    #24025885 - 01/20/17 03:05 PM (7 years, 10 days ago)

I prefer socialist to liberal but that seems to soil way too many panties around here


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #24026633 - 01/20/17 07:47 PM (7 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
Quote:

Webster10 said:
That's cool, liberal atheist.




And proud of it.

:lolsy:




And what are those obama supporters up to now?




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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24026660 - 01/20/17 08:02 PM (7 years, 10 days ago)

Laughing at lil'dick supporters.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 2
    #24027878 - 01/21/17 10:55 AM (7 years, 9 days ago)

Alright im taking HU off ignore, I miss the hysterics :lol:


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #24030779 - 01/22/17 02:49 PM (7 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
The 'Angry White Male' is strong in this one.

If he wasn't sucking putin's dick and released his tax form that would be a start.





Lol.

Old (white) man discovers Idpol, how cute.
Pretty soon you'll be telling people to check their white male privilege.


On a serious note:
keep discrediting working class whites, and undercutting the progressive wing of your party, thereby perpetuating the socio-economic conditions that create millions of underemployed and disgruntled workers with no positive outlets. Maybe then you may just create some real fascists.




You keep bringing up dick, and specifically "little dick" a lot
You got something you wanna let off of your chest there cowboy?


Edited by elax420 (01/22/17 02:50 PM)


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #24031820 - 01/22/17 08:24 PM (7 years, 8 days ago)

I think lil'dick is the most vile piece of shit there is, and watching his exchange with 'little Marko' I saw how much he hated the reference to his dinky hands and his little dick. As far as I can see that is THE lowest thing you can call this piece of shit.

All praise our president, Little Fuck'n Dick.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 3
    #24032528 - 01/23/17 05:29 AM (7 years, 7 days ago)

Whatsup man? Why are you so fixated with trump's penis? I've never really responded to it cause I figured you were just mad and it's fizzle out, but you're still obsessing over his dick. Is there something you'd like to tell us all?


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Webster10]
    #24036443 - 01/24/17 03:56 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

He obviously hates himself cuz he is a mediocre cishet white male.

Like duh,


DouevenTumblr, bro?








mod note: not a troll on the poster but rather a troll on SJW/ mainstream liberal culture


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420] * 2
    #24036737 - 01/24/17 05:46 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

Sjw =/= mainstream liberal culture


This sub has a real problem with sample size.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #24037259 - 01/24/17 08:50 PM (7 years, 6 days ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Sjw =/= mainstream liberal culture


This sub has a real problem with sample size.





Yes it 100% is.


Did you go to any of the protests, or listen to any of Hillary Clinton's speeches?
POC this, trans that, hands off my vagina, Love trumps hate, But white, christian, and male=evil. In my eyes this is just more classist bullshit to keep the people divided.



If you see how the marriage between SJW's and Neo-liberals creates a terrible undercurrent that manifests itself in the "alt-right" maybe you should stop being a liberal and finally radicalize. You keep sticking up for the liberal establishment like it is a positive positon for the working classes to take. You really think you can talk your way to a more equitable society?

Political power comes from the barrel of a gun my friend


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420] * 2
    #24037411 - 01/24/17 10:12 PM (7 years, 5 days ago)

I think you're too smart to be that shortsighted.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: The Ecstatic] * 1
    #24037447 - 01/24/17 10:25 PM (7 years, 5 days ago)

I guess we will wait and see how this presidency plays out. Everyone seems to think it's going to be catastrophic and result in massive unrest.


Maybe I'm just being a pussy, but I don't think it's wise to underestimate Nazi's and allure of far right rhetoric. The Dems do this nonstop, maybe not even intentionally. They are just so scared of leftist populism and preoccupied with destroying it, that they have lost touch with the people.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #24037901 - 01/25/17 07:08 AM (7 years, 5 days ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
He obviously hates himself cuz he is a mediocre cishet white male.

Like duh,


DouevenTumblr, bro?








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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #24037940 - 01/25/17 07:36 AM (7 years, 5 days ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
I guess we will wait and see how this presidency plays out. Everyone seems to think it's going to be catastrophic and result in massive unrest.


Maybe I'm just being a pussy, but I don't think it's wise to underestimate Nazi's and allure of far right rhetoric. The Dems do this nonstop, maybe not even intentionally. They are just so scared of leftist populism and preoccupied with destroying it, that they have lost touch with the people.




Agreed.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: elax420]
    #24037946 - 01/25/17 07:40 AM (7 years, 5 days ago)

Quote:

elax420 said:
I guess we will wait and see how this presidency plays out. Everyone seems to think it's going to be catastrophic and result in massive unrest.


Maybe I'm just being a pussy, but I don't think it's wise to underestimate Nazi's and allure of far right rhetoric. The Dems do this nonstop, maybe not even intentionally. They are just so scared of leftist populism and preoccupied with destroying it, that they have lost touch with the people.





I think they (Dems) have realized that now that people are getting in touch with them.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: The Ecstatic] * 1
    #24208946 - 03/31/17 06:13 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
Covert actions are escalating. And it appears its not in our interest to have a "war victory," we like to draw these conflicts out.

There will be kids graduating high school next year who have never lived in a world where the US WASNT invading Afghanistan. Its normalized now. And "winning" isnt needed to keep the gears turning anymore.




    I just re-found your post from almost 3 months ago, and am intrigued by the 2nd sentence. I think you're right and it explains what has perplexed me for 40 years. Since Korea and certainly since Viet Nam we have not won wars. I don't think we could have won Viet Nam without the "bomb em into the stone age thesis" or complete defoliation but could have definitely negotiated a settlement many years earlier than when we pulled out.  Johnson starts out refusing to be the first President to lose a war, but war weariness took a big toll and he didn't run for his last term. I will never forget listening to that speech: "My fellow Americans, I come to you with a heavy heart". In retrospect Johnson expressed his true feelings at the beginning and the end. Dick Nixon was deceptive as hell. He won his 2nd term almost entirely by conning us that he had a secret plan to end the war, and after winning promptly re-escalated it. The jungles of Viet Nam were a hard place to fight but Iraq and nearby countries are not.

    So why do we not win wars. I always believed the usual litany of reasons.
 
Regardless of how many countries we invade we are the greatest humanitarian country on earth, and it is very important domestically and abroad to maintain that propaganda talking point, so apparently that's why we don't go in for the end game kill. We kill so many people but have no stomach for finishing the job. There are so many atrocities in any war, but we get squeamish about it at the end.

    Our military is the best at what they're supposed to do, but after that it becomes a police action, requiring political solutions which our soldiers cannot do, and also leaves them as sitting ducks getting killed for entirely no reason. It makes no difference how many thousand times the Generals try to tell this to the political leaders.

    And the obvious stated briefest by Country Joe and the Fish at Woodstock, "There's plenty good money to be made supplying the Army with the tools of the trade".

    As the years pass these reasons seem necessary but not sufficient. You must be right. We don't think it is in our interest to win wars.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Brian Jones]
    #24210656 - 04/01/17 11:41 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

There is a reason why the Vietnam war is known as South East Asia.  They were also limited targets in the North.  Afraid of getting the Russians more involved.

The thing about Iraq and afghanistan and all the wars is who wants to win more.  Americans are usually comfy and get tired of war news.  It was only 9-11 that inspired so many to war.  But the got bored and tired and now there is isis.

You really must win wars quickly if you are going to war, since Korea.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy] * 2
    #24212564 - 04/02/17 05:52 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

The problem is, we won the war in Iraq, we couldn't win the peace. Those people want to fight each other and they don't have a brutal dictator to hold the country together.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 1
    #24212684 - 04/02/17 07:42 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

I am not so sure the war was won.  Sure the regime changed then Isis formed.  Seems like it has a ways to go, but why would it not?

Saddam held the place together.  Isis probably wouldn't had such a strong hold.  Saddam would gas them.  It's hard to rebel under a dictator.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #24212788 - 04/02/17 09:06 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

We won, Isis formed in the vacuum of leadership and wouldn't have formed under Saddam until his sons took overs and it would have been different. I would have been a 3 way civil war Sunnis against Shiites against Kurds and no room for Isis.

And yes that is an oversimplification of the it.


Edited by sweeper54 (04/02/17 09:59 AM)


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 1
    #24212924 - 04/02/17 10:46 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
I am not so sure the war was won.  Sure the regime changed then Isis formed.  Seems like it has a ways to go, but why would it not?

Saddam held the place together.  Isis probably wouldn't had such a strong hold.  Saddam would gas them.  It's hard to rebel under a dictator.




Quote:

sweeper54 said:
We won, Isis formed in the vacuum of leadership and wouldn't have formed under Saddam until his sons took overs and it would have been different. I would have been a 3 way civil war Sunnis against Shiites against Kurds and no room for Isis.

And yes that is an oversimplification of the it.




You military guys may appreciate this

excerpted from Strategy second revised edition by Sir B.H. Liddel Hart pg. 357
Quote:

Victory in the true sense implies that the state of peace, and of one's people, is better after the war than before.  Victory in this sense is only possible if a quick result can be gained or if long effort can be economically proportioned to the national resources.  The end must be adjusted to the means.  Failing a fair prospect of such a victory, wise statesmanship will miss no opportunity for negotiating peace.  Peace through stalemate, based on a coincident recognition by each side of the opponent's strength, is at least preferable to peace through common exhaustion-- and has often provided a better foundation for lasting peace.
    It is wiser to run the risks of war for the sake of preserving peace than to run risks of exhaustion in war for the sake of finishing with victory--a conclusion that runs counter to custom but is supported by experience.  Perseverance in war is only justifiable if there is a good chance of a good end--the prospect of a peace that will balance the sum of human misery incurred in the struggle.  Indeed, deepening study of past experience leads to the conclusion that nations might often have come nearer to their object by taking advantage of a lull in the struggle to discuss a settlement than by pursuing the war with the aim of "victory".

The experience of history brings ample evidence that the downfall of civilized States tends to come not from the direct assaults of foes, but from internal decay, combined with the consequences of exhaustion in war.  A state of suspense is trying--it has often led nations as well as individuals to commit suicide because they were unable to bear it.  But suspense is better than to reach exhaustion in pursuit of the mirage of victory. Moreover, a truce to actual hostilities enables a recovery and development of strength, while the need for vigilance helpts to keep a nation "on its toes".
    Peaceful nations are apt, however, to court unnecessary danger, because once aroused they are more inclined to proceed to extremes than predatory nations.  For the latter, making war as a means of gain, are usually more ready to call it off when they find an opponent too strong to be easily overcome.  It is the reluctant fighter, impelled by emotion and not be calculation, who tends to press a fight to the bitter end.  Thereby he too often defeats his own end, even if he does not produce his own direct defeat.  For the spirit of barbarism can be weakened only during a cessation of hostilities;war strengthens it--pouring fuel on the flames.




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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa] * 2
    #24213228 - 04/02/17 01:05 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

We haven't won a war since wwii


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24213271 - 04/02/17 01:27 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

exactly.

Quote:


Victory in the true sense implies that the state of peace, and of one's people, is better after the war than before.  Victory in this sense is only possible if a quick result can be gained or if long effort can be economically proportioned to the national resources.




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OfflineBrian Jones
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24214240 - 04/02/17 10:02 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

sweeper54 said:
The problem is, we won the war in Iraq, we couldn't win the peace. Those people want to fight each other and they don't have a brutal dictator to hold the country together.



Quote:

Morel Guy said:
I am not so sure the war was won.  Sure the regime changed then Isis formed.  Seems like it has a ways to go, but why would it not?

Saddam held the place together.  Isis probably wouldn't had such a strong hold.  Saddam would gas them.  It's hard to rebel under a dictator.



Quote:

Enlil said:
We haven't won a war since wwii




I agree with all of you. Sweeper54 just used different semantics.
If you accept that definition it describes the situation in every conflict since at least post Viet Nam. (Unless we fought Russia or China with conventional weapons) our invasion would be successful against any country in the middle east, etc. Still not sure about jungles in S.E. Asia but not a factor now because we get along. We will win real battles. We can't win the peace because our military is not equipped to win political battles that our politicians are useless at.

    I agree with Morel Guy and the  bottom of Sweepers post. Eliminating Saddam had unforeseen consequences that cost us and the civilians over there greatly. The bad guy held things together. Reminds me of when Guiliani and the RICO act took down the NYC mafia and the power vacuum led to a multitude of ethnic gangs that killed many more civilians than the 5 families.

    And of course I agree with Enlil. We haven't WON a war since WWII. (But surely you've forgotten our tremendous victory in Grenada) There should be a public service announcement flooding media that just lists the length of the 2 World Wars and every war since. Fox News wouldn't do it but many others would, if funding to pay for it was there since it would say anything else.

    You probably all read it but in case you didn't, Yesterday The Ecstatic said It appears it's not in our interest to have a "war victory", we like to draw these conflicts out.

    If anybody in this forum disagrees, I would like to hear their reasoning.

Edit, my mistake the Ecstatic said that many months ago. I stumbled across it and quoted him and commented yesterday.


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Edited by Brian Jones (04/02/17 10:44 PM)


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Brian Jones]
    #24214659 - 04/03/17 06:46 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Both times the US went to war with Iraq we crushed them. They are in the win column, the shrub fucked it up afterwards does take away from the overall victory, but the demonstration of power was overwhelming. A country has to know that pushing the US into a fight they will lose, but we don't know how to or want to manage the peace, Russia/China not included.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 1
    #24214661 - 04/03/17 06:51 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

No one is questioning whether or not Iraq lost.  That's obvious.  We didn't win, though.  The fact that you think there is a "win column" says a lot about how the military trains people to think.

The bottom line is that the military isn't made up of our brightest and best.  It's made up of those who didn't have a lot of options when they graduated high school.  It's not a bad way to build a fighting force, but it's definitely not a good way to build a military that can effect the changes that need to happen without creating even bigger problems for us in the long run.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24214672 - 04/03/17 06:59 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
No one is questioning whether or not Iraq lost.  That's obvious.  We didn't win, though.  The fact that you think there is a "win column" says a lot about how the military trains people to think.

The bottom line is that the military isn't made up of our brightest and best.  It's made up of those who didn't have a lot of options when they graduated high school.  It's not a bad way to build a fighting force, but it's definitely not a good way to build a military that can effect the changes that need to happen without creating even bigger problems for us in the long run.





People who think the military is made up of "stupid people" tells a lot about how the left in this country "trains people how to think"


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse] * 4
    #24214675 - 04/03/17 07:04 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quotations are usually for quoting something...not just making up your own shit.  I guess that's what makes you the king, though.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24214680 - 04/03/17 07:07 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Your words speak for themselves,

You seem to think the military is a bunch of retards, alt least be honest in your assertions


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24214681 - 04/03/17 07:10 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Not retards.  Not the brightest and the best, though.

The student who gets offered a full ride to MIT isn't joining the military instead.  I'm sure it has happened, but that's definitely not typical.  More typically, the military picks up those who don't have solid plans after high school.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24214689 - 04/03/17 07:13 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

But that is NOT the military's fault.

If the civilian that send them there fuck it up, you can't blame the military for the bigger problems that they are not trained to manage.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54] * 2
    #24214693 - 04/03/17 07:16 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

I'm not blaming anyone.  I'm saying it wasn't a win.  A real win would have taken the military we have PLUS an equally effective force to manage the transition from one regime to another. 

My point is that our military is well-equipped to fight.  They're not equipped to win wars, however.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: sweeper54]
    #24214695 - 04/03/17 07:16 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Oh ok, everyone who's not college educated is stupid, got it

Thanks for the clarification :thumbup:


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse] * 2
    #24214699 - 04/03/17 07:18 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

It's hard to beat the king, I suppose.  Not everyone can build a strawman and destroy it that quickly.  Kudos.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24214701 - 04/03/17 07:19 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
It's hard to beat the king, I suppose.  Not everyone can build a strawman and destroy it that quickly.  Kudos.




Sucks being called out doesn't it?

The left just can't be honest, that's what I'm here for, to call you people out on your BS

Deal with it


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse] * 2
    #24214704 - 04/03/17 07:22 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

You're here to make shit up and then point out the absurdity of what you just made up.  It's really all you do, and this isn't a new phenomenon.  Rarely have I ever seen you try to improve your rhetoric.  It's always the same old pattern:  Assign an opponent a position he didn't take then attack that position.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24214710 - 04/03/17 07:29 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
You're here to make shit up and then point out the absurdity of what you just made up.  It's really all you do, and this isn't a new phenomenon.  Rarely have I ever seen you try to improve your rhetoric.  It's always the same old pattern:  Assign an opponent a position he didn't take then attack that position.




As hard as I try, I'll never understand the "if you're not like me, you're stupid" mentality that is so prevalent amongst leftists, it baffles me

Amd of course pointing it out is met with derision and insults

I'm not here to educate you, I'm just here to point out your lunacy, and judging by your reaction, I've hit quite the nerve:lol:


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24214712 - 04/03/17 07:30 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Lol, I don't have nerves to hit.  I'm way past the point of actually trying to help you understand what a strawman is and how to avoid it.  Now, it just makes me chuckle on a Monday morning as I get ready for court.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24214957 - 04/03/17 10:39 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

How does one object strawmen in court?

Is that leading?


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #24214960 - 04/03/17 10:41 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

"Misstates the Testimony"


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24214980 - 04/03/17 10:49 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

2 out of 3 people that I know that enlisted were drug dealers.  The other one was my cousin.  My cousin is pretty much the know it all type.  He thinks very highly of himself.

My Dad was in the Army and a brand of crazy.  Other people I knew were definitely brain washed.

It's like my Grandma going on and on about how great America is and how christian America is everything.  I just look away and don't say anything.  Just like when someone says something really crazy and you don't want to get involved.

Personally I have known the military to be a bunch of criminals.  They get away with a ton of stuff.  People think their beliefs are so supreme.  God this, America that, nobody even knows what goes on but they fully support their racist agenda.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24214983 - 04/03/17 10:50 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

do you have to pull that card often?


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24215059 - 04/03/17 11:24 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Your words speak for themselves,

You seem to think the military is a bunch of retards, alt least be honest in your assertions




During the Iraq war, the military was desperate for recruits and they had to scrape the bottom of the barrel to get them.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: koods]
    #24215086 - 04/03/17 11:35 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

I'd hate to see what the Military will be under Trump. 

Face it though.  They have always used the bottom of society.  They used to have an option for either prison or the military.  The draft scraped the crust from the bottom as well.

Crime families need to have enforcers.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy] * 1
    #24215135 - 04/03/17 11:55 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
I'd hate to see what the Military will be under Trump. 

Face it though.  They have always used the bottom of society.  They used to have an option for either prison or the military.  The draft scraped the crust from the bottom as well.



I think there's a wide range of how smart soldiers are.  But enlisted people don't make strategic decisions for the military, so it seems like a pointless argument.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #24215150 - 04/03/17 12:01 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

No, people like Michael Flynn do, which is even scarier.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: koods]
    #24215158 - 04/03/17 12:04 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

It starts with the administration and congress.  They give the thumbs up or down, go or no go.

All the other stuff is years and years of study.  Then yes even the enlisted play a roll in how things are carried out.  They make the final decisions and carry out the operations.

Sure it might be an officer that makes calls.  But only so much as the enlisted make smart choices with what they were given.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #24215185 - 04/03/17 12:19 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

Morel Guy said:
I'd hate to see what the Military will be under Trump. 

Face it though.  They have always used the bottom of society.  They used to have an option for either prison or the military.  The draft scraped the crust from the bottom as well.



I think there's a wide range of how smart soldiers are.  But enlisted people don't make strategic decisions for the military, so it seems like a pointless argument.




Seems about right, Wars are fought from offices in Washington, not the front lines, sad


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24215202 - 04/03/17 12:27 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Wars are fought on TV.  Public support is just about everything without a dictactorship.  Even dicators manipluate public opinion and the war fighters attitude.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #24215207 - 04/03/17 12:28 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Public support has got to be about the dumbest way to run a war

Thanks mainstream media


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24215217 - 04/03/17 12:31 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

It's absolutely necessary.

You need fighters
Gotta avoid a coup or have one
Still require an economy and trade even have allies
Gotta believe you are supperior and morally correct and have others convinced


Same shit goes down for law enforcement


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24215225 - 04/03/17 12:34 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

Morel Guy said:
I'd hate to see what the Military will be under Trump. 

Face it though.  They have always used the bottom of society.  They used to have an option for either prison or the military.  The draft scraped the crust from the bottom as well.



I think there's a wide range of how smart soldiers are.  But enlisted people don't make strategic decisions for the military, so it seems like a pointless argument.




Seems about right, Wars are fought from offices in Washington, not the front lines, sad




Of course.  War effort is determined by policy.
Are you saying that you think policy should be subservient to war?


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24215236 - 04/03/17 12:37 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Public support has got to be about the dumbest way to run a war

Thanks mainstream media




Public support is necessary for any war effort.
Even a Frederick or Napoleon is dependent upon public support for the maintenance of his armies.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa]
    #24215270 - 04/03/17 12:49 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Public support has got to be about the dumbest way to run a war

Thanks mainstream media




Public support is necessary for any war effort.
Even a Frederick or Napoleon is dependent upon public support for the maintenance of his armies.




Exactly, so when a media is determined to undermine a war effort, the only reasonable expectation is to lose the war.

Who the fuck fights war like that?


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse] * 1
    #24215275 - 04/03/17 12:51 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

That is not the point but kt could be.

The main fact is media goes after ratings and that tends to reflect the publics opinion.  If the public dowan't want the war, neither will the free media.  State media is different.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #24215301 - 04/03/17 12:59 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
That is not the point but kt could be.

The main fact is media goes after ratings and that tends to reflect the publics opinion.  If the public dowan't want the war, neither will the free media.  State media is different.




BS, have you not been paying attention? Media loves to shape public opinion to fall in line with their ideology, or are you still one of those "journalists are objective" holdouts?


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24215324 - 04/03/17 01:08 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Yes, trump is a competent, not mentally ill president, it's just the media shaping my impression of him:

Get a clue: you can tell he's a mental midget from his twitter feed alone.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24215353 - 04/03/17 01:21 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Maybe FOX news does that more.  But society has its opinions and society is the media.  Authors and editors will always put their opinion into their audience.  Prodcastrrs do this as well.  Bit sorry there ks no media donspiracy to misinform,and brainwash.  Aside fom FOX news and other conservatives.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24215471 - 04/03/17 02:19 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Public support has got to be about the dumbest way to run a war

Thanks mainstream media




Public support is necessary for any war effort.
Even a Frederick or Napoleon is dependent upon public support for the maintenance of his armies.




Exactly, so when a media is determined to undermine a war effort, the only reasonable expectation is to lose the war.

Who the fuck fights war like that?




The U.S. has always had to overcome this issue.
The public is reluctant to engage in foreign wars here, which is why a smoking gun and outwardly altruistic motives are almost always necessary.

USS Maine
Lusitania
Pearl Harbor
United Nations Security Council Resolution 83
Gulf of Tonkin incident
Invasion of Kuwait
Ethnic Cleansing
Al-Qaeda  Training Camps
Weapons of Mass Destruction

you get the idea


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa]
    #24215479 - 04/03/17 02:21 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Gotta get people blood thirsty and excited.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #24215504 - 04/03/17 02:28 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

right.  most people just want to be left in peace, so a seemingly good reason is necessary to motivate folks to go to war.

in absence of that, one should expect significant public opposition to war.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: koods]
    #24215557 - 04/03/17 02:48 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
No, people like Michael Flynn do, which is even scarier.



It is scary that a military general thought we might achieve peace with Russia.  Good thing the liberals are on him.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa]
    #24215574 - 04/03/17 02:56 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

ballsalsa said:
Quote:

hostileuniverse said:


Seems about right, Wars are fought from offices in Washington, not the front lines, sad




Of course.  War effort is determined by policy.
Are you saying that you think policy should be subservient to war?




we never heard back from you on this one, HU.
What say you? Should policy dictate war, or should war rule over policy?


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #24215577 - 04/03/17 02:58 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

koods said:
No, people like Michael Flynn do, which is even scarier.



It is scary that a military general thought we might achieve peace with Russia.  Good thing the liberals are on him.




How's that working out?

U.S.-Russia Relations Are 'Worse' Than During the Cold War, Kremlin Spokesman Says


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #24215584 - 04/03/17 03:01 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

koods said:
No, people like Michael Flynn do, which is even scarier.



It is scary that a military general thought we might achieve peace with Russia.  Good thing the liberals are on him.




I don't get why people have a hard time the idea that you can not care for someone (or nation as it were) and still coexist peacefully.

Quote:

Peace through stalemate, based on a coincident recognition by each side of the opponent's strength, is at least preferable to peace through common exhaustion-- and has often provided a better foundation for lasting peace.




In other words, if everyone just relaxes for a bit, and starts buying and selling shit to each other more, there may be less reason for hostilities in the future.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: koods]
    #24215597 - 04/03/17 03:06 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
It is scary that a military general thought we might achieve peace with Russia.  Good thing the liberals are on him.




How's that working out?

U.S.-Russia Relations Are 'Worse' Than During the Cold War, Kremlin Spokesman Says



According to your articles, the liberals are doing a pretty good job.  But also according to your article, Russia is still hoping to improve our relationship.

Maybe people like you can keep up your good work and force us to pay for another cold war.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: koods]
    #24215614 - 04/03/17 03:10 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Yes, trump is a competent, not mentally ill president, it's just the media shaping my impression of him:

Get a clue: you can tell he's a mental midget from his twitter feed alone.





But that's NOT what's playing on Fixed News, they fucking love him there and all his rabid minions. The news is shaping their easily corrupted minds.

Fuck News has been doing it to them for years. All they have to do is feed them a line and they bite on it, no hook needed.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: koods]
    #24215650 - 04/03/17 03:18 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Yes, trump is a competent, not mentally ill president, it's just the media shaping my impression of him:

Get a clue: you can tell he's a mental midget from his twitter feed alone.



He graduated from one of the top business schools in the country which doesn't accept 'mental midgets', and his twitter feeds helped get him where he is today.  I think I know who the mental midget is...


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #24215691 - 04/03/17 03:33 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Yes, the trump voter.

When it comes to being president, or even being a good leader, trump is a mental midget. Do you honestly believe he is up to the task? Have you listened to him speak extemporaneously? He's not a very bright person. He's got average intelligence at best, and his job isn't one where average intelligence will suffice.

As for getting into Wharton, who knows how that happened. Maybe coming from a wealthy family helped. He certainly did not finish at the top of his class as he likes to say.

Actually, if you watch videos of him speaking 20 years ago he is much more eloquent. I actually wonder if he is suffering from early stages of dementia.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: koods]
    #24215704 - 04/03/17 03:38 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Could Trump Be Suffering From Dementia?

So much for this being left wing propaganda. That article is from newsmax. You don't get more comservative than newsmax.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: koods]
    #24215747 - 04/03/17 03:52 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Yes, the trump voter.

When it comes to being president, or even being a good leader, trump is a mental midget. Do you honestly believe he is up to the task? Have you listened to him speak extemporaneously? He's not a very bright person. He's got average intelligence at best, and his job isn't one where average intelligence will suffice.

As for getting into Wharton, who knows how that happened. Maybe coming from a wealthy family helped. He certainly did not finish at the top of his class as he likes to say.

Actually, if you watch videos of him speaking 20 years ago he is much more eloquent. I actually wonder if he is suffering from early stages of dementia.




You're right, Trump was much more articulate 20 years ago, but he was not some stupid business man.

The Trump of today isn't quite has sharp as he once was, he loses focus and definitely needs a strong support system around him.

But even at 70 years old, he's no "mental midget". Obama never had even a fraction of the business and real world experiences of Trump, that's the truth.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: koods]
    #24215756 - 04/03/17 03:54 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Could Trump Be Suffering From Dementia?

So much for this being left wing propaganda. That article is from newsmax. You don't get more comservative than newsmax.




He's at the I'm 70 years old and a billionaire/I don't give a shit phrase of his life. :lol:


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #24217129 - 04/04/17 07:08 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
Maybe FOX news does that more.  But society has its opinions and society is the media.  Authors and editors will always put their opinion into their audience.  Prodcastrrs do this as well.  Bit sorry there ks no media donspiracy to misinform,and brainwash.  Aside fom FOX news and other conservatives.




Oh so fox news and other conservative outlets do it, but not the liberal ones?

:lolsy:


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24217188 - 04/04/17 07:59 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

The meet a marketable demand


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #24217199 - 04/04/17 08:12 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
The meet a marketable demand




Are you admitting that journalists aren't objective anymore? Or just talking in circles?

Everyone but the most ardent partisans know the news cycle has an agenda, and even they know but are just unwilling to admit is my guess


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24217329 - 04/04/17 09:13 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

hostileuniverse said:
Quote:

Morel Guy said:
The meet a marketable demand




Are you admitting that journalists aren't objective anymore? Or just talking in circles?

Everyone but the most ardent partisans know the news cycle has an agenda, and even they know but are just unwilling to admit is my guess




Nobody is objective.  Everyone is biased.  The most prevalent bias in journalism (or anywhere else in capitalist society) is the profit motive.  Journalists (and more importantly, their editors)are going to tend to be biased towards narratives and stories that sell papers.  The agenda is to make the most money.  This isn't something new.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: ballsalsa]
    #24217336 - 04/04/17 09:18 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

I'm not sure that "sell[ing] papers" is really a viable market strategy anymore.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24217340 - 04/04/17 09:19 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

I'm sure that it isn't, but whatever the format, the principle is the same.  It was a turn of phrase...but you knew that.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #24217346 - 04/04/17 09:24 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:

He graduated from one of the top business schools in the country which doesn't accept 'mental midgets',



This is a bit of a misleading statement.  He graduated from a school that has one of the top business programs in the country.  He didn't graduate from that MBA program, however.  He got a bachelors there after transferring as a junior from Fordham.  He also didn't graduate with honors. 

I think you're overstating the value of his educational accomplishments.


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: hostileuniverse]
    #24217406 - 04/04/17 09:56 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

It's there are different groups with opposing views.  Different news outlets cater to different demands.  There is no single media agenda.  There are thousands.

Cannabis magazines want legal cannabis business

Liberal media promotes liberal agenda

Conservative media promotes conservative agenda

Scientific media promotes science

Is it that difficult for you to adjust to?


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Enlil]
    #24217487 - 04/04/17 10:45 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:

He graduated from one of the top business schools in the country which doesn't accept 'mental midgets',



This is a bit of a misleading statement.  He graduated from a school that has one of the top business programs in the country.  He didn't graduate from that MBA program, however.  He got a bachelors there after transferring as a junior from Fordham.  He also didn't graduate with honors. 

I think you're overstating the value of his educational accomplishments.



I didn't realize that, I thought he got his MBA there.  Thanks for letting me know!


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Edited by Falcon91Wolvrn03 (04/04/17 11:15 AM)


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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Morel Guy]
    #24217506 - 04/04/17 10:53 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Morel Guy said:
It's there are different groups with opposing views.  Different news outlets cater to different demands.  There is no single media agenda.  There are thousands.

Cannabis magazines want legal cannabis business

Liberal media promotes liberal agenda

Conservative media promotes conservative agenda

Scientific media promotes science

Is it that difficult for you to adjust to?




The MSM is owned by a few very large corporations, their financial interests go outside of just plain viewership ratings.

The mainstream financial media always tries to paint a rosy picture of the economy regardless of who is US President, they even praise Trump's economic ideas as they bash him on every other issue.


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 32,557
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #25030705 - 03/01/18 01:09 AM (5 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Even Hillary whined that we're losing the propaganda war:





Now the US is stepping it up.

STATE DEPARTMENT GETS $40 MILLION TO FUND NEW PROPAGANDA TROLL FARM
Quote:

the US State Department announced that it had obtained $40 million from the Pentagon to fund a new propaganda and disinformation campaign




--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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Offlinekoods
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Registered: 05/26/11
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #25030709 - 03/01/18 01:17 AM (5 years, 10 months ago)

That article is fake news. They completely misrepresent the original article.

Quote:

The State Department is launching a $40 million initiative to crack down on foreign propaganda and disinformation amid widespread concerns about future Russian efforts to interfere in elections.




--------------------
NotSheekle said
“if I believed she was 16 I would become unattracted to her”


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: More sanctions against Russia [Re: koods]
    #25030722 - 03/01/18 01:56 AM (5 years, 10 months ago)



--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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