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PinPornProducer
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Registered: 08/23/14
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Cloning from a clone culture
#23936961 - 12/17/16 11:47 PM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I hear bad things about cloning from a clone but what's the downfall other than a shortened life span of the culture? If you have the original culture slanted, grow it out, clone from said tub and then slant that culture would you really see any negative effects if you always start the grow from a slant?
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r.lutece
gave Columbia her wings.


Registered: 09/06/15
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From what I've been told, it takes a handful of successively cloned grows to see a noticeable impact on the quality of the mycelium. My guess would be that a clone taken from a prior clone that wasn't isolated would show a smaller variety of strains than the previous clone, potentially reducing the number of desirable traits in the second generation. A clone taken from a grow started with an isolate that was developed from a cloned fruit, however, should produce a second grow that is genetically identical to the first.
-------------------- One goes into an experiment knowing one might fail. But one does not undertake an experiment knowing one HAS failed.
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Pastywhyte
Say hello to my little friend



Registered: 09/15/12
Posts: 37,810
Loc: Canada
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Quote:
PinPornProducer said: I hear bad things about cloning from a clone but what's the downfall other than a shortened life span of the culture? If you have the original culture slanted, grow it out, clone from said tub and then slant that culture would you really see any negative effects if you always start the grow from a slant?
Probably not. I tend to look at culture as "master culture" and "working culture". Master cultures are cared for carefully. Working cultures get taken out behind the woodshed. If it's your working culture go ahead and abuse it.
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
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Re: Cloning from a clone culture [Re: Pastywhyte] 1
#23937030 - 12/18/16 12:50 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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You can clone from a clone it just sounds silly...you should already have it on agar.
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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PinPornProducer
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Re: Cloning from a clone culture [Re: Pastywhyte]
#23937041 - 12/18/16 12:58 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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That's what I was thinking, have your original cultures and your whore cultures. Thanks for the input bro
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PinPornProducer
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Registered: 08/23/14
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Re: Cloning from a clone culture [Re: cronicr]
#23937049 - 12/18/16 01:09 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
cronicr said: You can clone from a clone it just sounds silly...you should already have it on agar.
A clone still has multiple genetics though, so wouldn't cloning a clone reduce those genetics even more? Kinda like isolating?
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
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It very well could
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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PinPornProducer
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Registered: 08/23/14
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Re: Cloning from a clone culture [Re: cronicr]
#23937101 - 12/18/16 02:01 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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This hobby is an open book...
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
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It certainly is.
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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PinPornProducer
Buy the ticket, take the ride



Registered: 08/23/14
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Re: Cloning from a clone culture [Re: cronicr]
#23937138 - 12/18/16 02:49 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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I think alot of ppl forget that mycology is in its infant stage and cling on to original knowledge way to much...
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,436
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Most grow for there scales not thw science or respect
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  It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn I'm tired do me a favor
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enlightenment
alchemist


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Re: Cloning from a clone culture [Re: cronicr]
#23937199 - 12/18/16 04:20 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
cronicr said: You can clone from a clone it just sounds silly...you should already have it on agar.
word. I like to isolate sectors from a clone and fruit each of them. Sometimes the result is very surprising and differs from the original clone. If you clone a clone you mostly just clone a gene pool again, so it's better to clone and isolate to get the best out of your clone IMO.
Quote:
cronicr said: Most grow for there scales not thw science or respect
The most grow for scales. Too bad. I grow for pleasure, science and respect. I am always excited to fruit different species or "strains". It's like art but more exciting because you don't know the result until you grow it (if it isn't an isolate).
Sry.. I am a little philosophic right now 
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van hatton
Still a noob



Registered: 11/23/14
Posts: 5,617
Loc: Michigan
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Quote:
PinPornProducer said: This hobby is an open book...
We are almost the leading frontier into research in mycology it seems at times.
At least in the actives department. I'm sure their are entire labs dedicated just novaly and edibles (also unfortunately just another contest of whose dick is bigger most the time)
Besides honestly if you grew tons of varieties and did the research the scale comes with it. Plus we would have all that knowledge collectively (hopefully).
I'm tired and just got off work sorry for rambling
 Van
-------------------- If I ever give out misinformation please inform me so I can have the correct information. Tmethyl said: Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked a monotub that wasn't pinning fast enough. The force of the kick rearranged the genetics of the mushrooms, we now call them Penis Envy. Caps McGee said:
Fun part is figuring out what works best for you
Edited by van hatton (12/18/16 04:42 AM)
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r.lutece
gave Columbia her wings.


Registered: 09/06/15
Posts: 745
Loc: ∅
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Quote:
enlightenment said:
Quote:
cronicr said: You can clone from a clone it just sounds silly...you should already have it on agar.
word. I like to isolate sectors from a clone and fruit each of them. Sometimes the result is very surprising and differs from the original clone. If you clone a clone you mostly just clone a gene pool again, so it's better to clone and isolate to get the best out of your clone IMO.
Although it's a good idea to hang on to original clone when you isolate sectors since the resulting isolation could actually perform worse than a collection of particular strains working in synergy.
Here's a question: let's say I have this clone, taken from a non-isolated grow, so it's got a handful of strains working together to make one fruit. Let's say there are five strains, and four of them are beneficial for a nice-looking, strong-fruiting subvariety, but the fifth strain just produces twisted fruits and I prefer straight fruits. If I wanted to cultivate four out of five strains, would I be able to take a chunk of agar that includes all four of those strains, while isolating away from the undesirable strain? If that agar is used in a slurry or liquid culture, will it produce a grow with fruits that are close genetic relatives to the original clone, but with the exclusion of that one undesirable trait?
-------------------- One goes into an experiment knowing one might fail. But one does not undertake an experiment knowing one HAS failed.
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enlightenment
alchemist


Registered: 08/09/09
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Re: Cloning from a clone culture [Re: r.lutece]
#23937312 - 12/18/16 07:23 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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No. It might be theoretically possible but it is impractical. What you want is a mono culture that produces the fruits you want. It is some effort to get a nice isolate but the "strain selection / synergetic effect of different sectors" you described would be even more effort and is not neccessary and waste of time IMO.
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Th3Issu3
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Registered: 12/30/14
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isn't that how genetics are stabilized?
I think pastywhite is working on something like that with something...
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
Loc: Canada
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Re: Cloning from a clone culture [Re: Th3Issu3]
#23937491 - 12/18/16 09:16 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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When I do clones I take a clone, xfer once to ensure cleanliness, then store it as is. There's no point IMO in isolating a clone. Especially when it could hinder performance, and has done a full fruiting cycle. If you want an isolate start from spores when it'll be hella young. Test it out, and pray you get an epic isolate.
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enlightenment
alchemist


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Re: Cloning from a clone culture [Re: Mad Season]
#23937513 - 12/18/16 09:26 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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True. I hope nobody misunderstood my post where I wrote about mono culture / isolate. I usually isolated from MS. But I had some very bad isolates... (more bad than good) Working with isolates from clones did perform better for me for some reason. Before isolating from MS I recommend to use a clone for the "main projects" because all the time and effort an isolate takes could still give you a bad result.
//edit
I would say it is possible to get a good isolate from a clone but it is always better to isolate from spores and fruit it. The synergetic effect of the different genetics could be reduced/destroyed by isolating from a clone. Anyway I had success with both methods.
Edited by enlightenment (12/18/16 09:32 AM)
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r.lutece
gave Columbia her wings.


Registered: 09/06/15
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Mad: When you transfer your clones to clean them up, do you do so in a particular way so as to preserve the strain diversity (avoid unintentional isolations)?
-------------------- One goes into an experiment knowing one might fail. But one does not undertake an experiment knowing one HAS failed.
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Mad Season
hookers and blackjack



Registered: 09/16/12
Posts: 12,666
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Re: Cloning from a clone culture [Re: r.lutece]
#23937547 - 12/18/16 09:46 AM (7 years, 1 month ago) |
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Nah I just say fuck it and roll the dice to chance. I guarantee I'm isolating away from some strains. There's no way I could get all the strains in a fruit body when xferring for cleanliness.
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