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OfflinePaulWall
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: bodhisatta]
    #24663946 - 09/27/17 11:00 AM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Did the 4g and up plates ever get made and tested bod?

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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: PaulWall]
    #24663957 - 09/27/17 11:07 AM (6 years, 7 months ago)

No the highest percentages worked better in an obvious trend until it got too gloopy to work which was like 10g per 400ml

I think you meant 4% i used 4g plates in the OP
4g was 1% of my 400ml pours.

I would use 6-8 grams of brf per 400ml. To germinate spores
And 2-6 for growing out.

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OfflinePaulWall
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: bodhisatta]
    #24667245 - 09/28/17 02:22 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Yea my bad, I meant 4%, I went with 7g yesterday, and it turned out well. Thanks for the thread and the swift response

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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: bodhisatta] * 4
    #24667572 - 09/28/17 03:59 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
some updates.
the 1.5% is the clear winner

next time I'll probably do 6g 10g 14g or 1.5% 2.5% and 3.5%



Quote:

bodhisatta said:
No the highest percentages worked better in an obvious trend until it got too gloopy to work which was like 10g per 400ml

I think you meant 4% i used 4g plates in the OP
4g was 1% of my 400ml pours.

I would use 6-8 grams of brf per 400ml. To germinate spores
And 2-6 for growing out.




Your "highest percentage" isn't really that very high. Especially when you consider how well mycelium grow on whole grains, solid with starch.

The incentive behind limiting the grain agar recipes is to keep them clear of debris, unlike a number of other agar recipes where being too sweet is a significant concern.  I actually use a MUCH larger percentage of brown rice in my agar preparations, counting on a large amount of the weight to be settled out of the mixture.

My recipe for preparing 500mL of BRF agar is like 20 grams or more of brown rice flour and 750mL water.
20g is double the amount of, say, light malt extract that you'd want to use. But not only is much of the BRF starch going to be poured aside, but there's no concentration of nutrition in the water that could be undesired unless it messed with the media itself.

After mixing the water and BRF together in a container, I boil it in a microwave to hydrate & expand the brown rice particles, and hopefully boil as much of it into the water as I can.  I keep it around boiling temperatures for 10 or more minutes, stopping the microwave to stir before the media could boil over.



As the mixture cools it will also settle.  Wait until it has cooled enough to handle without burning. It will have been long enough for the first pour off.

Without greatly disturbing the media, pick up the container and gently, steadily, pour the liquid into another container, until you get close to pouring off the settled layer of stuff in the bottom.  Leave that behind and discard.



The liquids should look quite different. The thin one to be discarded should be thick and difficult to see through.  The liquid we poured away to use should be much clearer in smaller amounts but still opaque in the large amount.

Let the liquid settle again, and pour off one last time to get rid of all debris.  (Filters could be used but I never bother.)


If necessary, bring your water level back up to 500 just by adding the difference.  Mix in your agar-agar powder (boiling again if necessary, it is for mine) and remember to stir it between distributions.


I love the stuff for Cubensis, and grainwater in general works as well for any mushroom species as you'd expect them to do on grain spawn.  I use grainwater (rye, ryegrass, wheat or oats) for 100% of my agar and occasional LCs for a wide variety of species and all have done great so far.

Germination,


grow outs,


clones,


even growing actual mushrooms...


I've only found that stronger is better.  Only time I've bothered to dilute is when I want to be able to see through LCs a little more easily early on, agar goes full strength.


--------------------
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InvisibleMateja
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: Violet]
    #24667640 - 09/28/17 04:16 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Interesting


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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: Mateja]
    #24667692 - 09/28/17 04:30 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Add twice as much as useful decant a off a ridiculous amount of sediment :takingnotes:



These all eventually made mushrooms too. And pinned like mad.

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InvisibleJust_A_Noob
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: bodhisatta]
    #24667711 - 09/28/17 04:33 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

:takingnotes::cheers:


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InvisibleViolet
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: bodhisatta] * 3
    #24667953 - 09/28/17 06:04 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
Add twice as much as useful decant a off a ridiculous amount of sediment :takingnotes:




Wow... what an asinine response to someone offering input, someone with years and years of experience with grain agar media voluntarily shared with the board.
Meanwhile your recipe is so thin you're able to see clear differences between how well they do.  For all your pride, maybe you could use the advice.

The "ridiculous" amount of sediment is clearly seen in the photos I posted to be a small fraction of the liquid.  Dunno about you, personally I like my agar to be nice and clear.  Two-step pouring away from settled starch in any grain-in-water preparation is the easiest way to get and 'filter' the freest and best agar I've ever used with no tools except gravity.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts

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InvisibleJosex
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: Violet]
    #24668338 - 09/28/17 08:40 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

The general consensus in mush cult is: agar with sediment is ok and LC broth should be clear.
But Sonic walking on his balls likes clear agar and grain water LC made from ground grains aka flour, plenty of sediment plz and pour that bitch!

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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: Josex]
    #24668344 - 09/28/17 08:42 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

:mostinteresting:

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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: mushboy]
    #24668364 - 09/28/17 08:53 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Try it out yourselves you'll see the useful cutoff.
I know what gets it done for me that's all.

Quote:


your recipe is so thin you're able to see clear differences between how well they do.




Exactly.

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InvisibleViolet
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: Josex] * 1
    #24668377 - 09/28/17 08:59 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

A little sediment from sterilization is fine by me too (which I don't seem to get sterilizing individual containers) but fluffed-up sterilized starchy brown rice sediment isn't nice imo, or at least it's tougher to feel proud of lol.

I also don't mind sediment in my grainwater LC like you! It's an easy way early on to confirm a clean LC with quickly and healthy growing mycelium, they don't take long to snag those pieces around them in the bottom of the container.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
Violet's Teks and Posts

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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: Violet]
    #24668403 - 09/28/17 09:09 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

I used brf agar with sediment a lot not so long ago, I liked it and the plates usually pinned like crazy, but me prefers clear agar these days.
I'm not laying any judgement at all, different folks different strokes, that't a cool thing about this hobby.

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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: Josex]
    #24668408 - 09/28/17 09:11 PM (6 years, 7 months ago)

i like my agar clear as f


lc broth?? ooooooo i like its a secret :nono:

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InvisibleViolet
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: bodhisatta] * 3
    #24669189 - 09/29/17 08:09 AM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

bodhisatta said:
Quote:


your recipe is so thin you're able to see clear differences between how well they do.




Exactly.




"Exactly"?  So you are AIMING to get weak growth on media that is made too thin for no reason? I thought this was a "How to" thread not a "How Not to" one.
Or you just want it to look like you always know exactly what you're doing and couldn't possibly have offered up a poor recipe in a How-To post without some likely explanation?


In my first post I was offering information and help to be nice and supportive, offering only helpful information and holding back the uncalled for criticism, but if you're gonna be a self-assured jerk about it:

Your post is bad; ALL of your BRF agar recipes here are too thin, end of story.
You're hearing it right now from a grain agar champ that wrote a better BRF agar prep method over a year before you first made this post, and has been using it far, far longer too, since the days I posted the first of this forum's current no-pour agar teks... using grainwater, at that.  I've been making it my business to know about nutritive content of grainwater and how it works for many years.

If ~8g of *pure malt EXTRACT* is called for for 400mL, then it should be obvious that a mere six grams of whole brown rice with husk and fiber and all is well less than ideal, especially when there's no feasible amount of grain nutrition that is too much like there is with malt etc.
And especially when, unlike malt/karo/dextrose/etc., you're not gonna get 100% of the BRF's nutrition suspended in the water.

Only way for *you*, and people following this "How To", to keep close to the already deficient level of nutrition suggested in this tek is to actually leave your agar littered with the rice particles you fail to suspend into the liquid media itself.


Of course, if NOW all of a sudden the only thing you care about is that it 'works' then feel free to keep sharing third-tier agar recipes, just be a tad more mindful next time you want to trash people's proven working methods ;]

It never hurts to be able to learn from people.


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

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The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
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Edited by Violet (09/29/17 08:19 AM)

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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: Violet]
    #24669267 - 09/29/17 08:34 AM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Youre right...
They're way too thin and have a deficiency. Its so obvious.
:facepalm:


Mushrooms popped up just fine on even the 1% brf plates. Sorry i like my cultures to not look like shit.

Quote:

Violet said:

.





Brf is more nutritional than malt extract. 2% malt is about as high as you want to go before mycelium grows dense to tomentose. Unless you specifically desired slow ugly tomentose growth. Im not trying to grow a crop on a dish. Im trying to get a clean culture

*Your* posts use of * makes me want to
:suicide:

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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: bodhisatta]
    #24669307 - 09/29/17 08:44 AM (6 years, 7 months ago)

:popcorn:


over nute malt agar sucked balls.


i jacked the recipe. this was about 4-5%

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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: bodhisatta] * 3
    #24669310 - 09/29/17 08:45 AM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Mushrooms fruiting doesn't exactly signal anything special in your favor to say the least... If anything, the cultures will fruit more readily once nutrition is gone, which happens more quickly on dilute plates.  You can see it happen in advance with food coloring or grainwater color changes as the mycelium runs out.

What you should be paying more attention to in regards to the quality of your agar is the clearly and significantly stunted growth quality that's the direct result of media with as little as half or a quarter of the suggested nutrition.

No empty action mimicking what a turn-around on me might look like, and no snarky suicide joke, is gonna fix this bad recipe for which you provided your own evidence


--------------------
Intentionally or not, here in mushcult we are purveyors of love culture and enlightenment movement. Let's try to act like it!

PODS TEK - Growing Invitro with BRF/verm or Grass Seed containers
The simplest, quickest, safest tek!  For beginners, culturers, lazy people, stealth lovers, contam haters, and alternative seekers!
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InvisiblebodhisattaMDiscordReddit
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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: Violet]
    #24669333 - 09/29/17 08:52 AM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Now getting rhizomorphic growing cultures are stunted?
:epicfacepalm:

We dial back nutrition on purpose with agar until we get away from tomentose growth...

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Re: Bod's BRF AGAR how to and "test" results [Re: mushboy] * 2
    #24669349 - 09/29/17 08:58 AM (6 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

mushboy said:
:popcorn:


over nute malt agar sucked balls.


i jacked the recipe. this was about 4-5%





I think it depends on the nutes and what it is you're culturing.  Here are some side-by-sides of 2% and 4% MEA. 

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